Trending Games | Elder Scrolls Online | Guild Wars 2 | Marvel Heroes | World of Warcraft

  Network:  FPSguru RTSguru
Login:  Password:   Remember?  
Show Quick Gamelist Jump to Random Game
Members:2,736,339 Users Online:0
Games:713  Posts:6,174,021
Recent forum postsRSS
Active threads
Cloud view
List all forums
General Forums
Developers Corner General Discussion
Popular Game Forums
Click a status to find game forum
Game Forums
Click a letter to find game forum
A-C
2029 Online 2112: Revolution 2Moons 4Story 8BitMMO 9 Dragons A Mystical Land A Tale in the Desert III A3 ACE Online ARGO Online Aberoth Absolute Force Online Absolute Terror Achaea Adellion Aerrevan Aetolia, the Midnight Age Age of Armor Age of Conan Age of Empires Online Age of Mourning Age of Wulin Age of Wushu Aida Arenas Aika Aion Albion Online Alganon All Points Bulletin (APB) Allods Online Altis Gates Amazing World Anarchy Online Ancients of Fasaria Andromeda 5 Angels Online Anime Trumps Anmynor Anno Online Applo Arcane Hearts Arcane Legends ArchLord ArcheAge Archeblade Archlord X Asda 2 Asda Story Ashen Empires Asheron's Call Asheron's Call 2 Astera Online Astonia III Astro Empires Astro Lords: Oort CLoud Asura Force Atlantica Online Atriarch Aura Kingdom Aurora Blade Auto Assault Avatar Star Battle Dawn Battle Dawn Galaxies Battle for Graxia Battle of 3 Kingdoms Battle of the Immortals Battlecruiser Online Battlestar Galactica Online Battlestar Reloaded Beyond Protocol Black Aftermath Black Desert Black Gold Black Prophecy Black Prophecy Tactics: Nexus Conflict Blacklight Retribution Blade & Soul Blade Hunter Blade Wars Blazing Throne Bless Blitz 1941 Blood and Jade Bloodlines Champions Bounty Bay Online Brain Storm Brawl Busters. Brick-Force Bright Shadow Bullet Run Business Tycoon Online CTRacer Cabal Online Caesary Call of Camelot Call of Gods Call of Thrones Camelot Unchained Canaan Online Cardmon Hero Cartoon Universe CasinoRPG Castle Empire Castlot Celtic Heroes Champions Online Champions of Regnum Chaos Online Chrono Tales Citadel of Sorcery CitiesXL Citizen Zero City of Decay City of Heroes City of Steam City of Transformers City of Villains Civilization Online Clan Lord Clash of Clans Cloud Nine Club Penguin Colony of War Command & Conquer: Tiberium Alliances Company of Heroes Online Conquer Online Conquer Online 3 Continent of the Ninth (C9) Core Blaze Core Exiles Corum Online Craft of Gods Crimecraft Crimelife 2 Cronous Crota II Crusaders of Solaris Cultures Online Cyber Monster 2 Céiron Wars
D-F
D&D Online DC Universe DK Online DOTA DOTA 2 DUST 514 DV8: Exile Dalethaan Dance Groove Online Dark Age of Camelot Dark Ages Dark Legends Dark Orbit Dark Relic: Prelude Dark Solstice Dark and Light DarkEden Online DarkSpace Darkblood Online Darkest Dungeon Darkfall Darkfall: Unholy Wars Darkwind: War on Wheels Das Tal Dawn of Fantasy Dawntide DayZ Dead Earth Dead Frontier Deco Online Deepworld Defiance Deicide Online Dekaron Demons at the Horizon Desert Operations Destiny Diablo 3 Diamonin Digimon Battle Dino Storm Disciple Divergence Divina Divine Souls Dofus Dominus Online Dragon Ball Online Dragon Born Online Dragon Crusade Dragon Empires Dragon Eternity Dragon Nest Dragon Oath Dragon Pals Dragon Raja Dragon's Call Dragon's Call II Dragon's Prophet DragonSky DragonSoul Dragona Dragonica Dragons and Titans Dream of Mirror Online Dreamland Online Dreamlords: The Reawakening Drift City Duels Dungeon Blitz Dungeon Fighter Online Dungeon Overlord Dungeon Party Dungeon Rampage Dungeon Runners Dynastica Dynasty Warriors Online Dynasty of the Magi EIN (Epicus Incognitus) EVE Online Earth Eternal Earth and Beyond Earthrise Eclipse War Ecol Tactics Online Eden Eternal Edge of Space Einherjar - The Viking's Blood Elder Scrolls Online Eldevin Elf Online Elite: Dangerous Embers of Caerus Emil Chronicle Online Empire Empire & State Empire Craft Empire Universe 3 EmpireQuest Empires of Galldon End of Nations Endless Ages Endless Blue Moon Online Endless Online Entropia Universe EpicDuel Erebus: Travia Reborn Eredan Eternal Blade Eternal Lands Eternal Saga Ether Fields Ether Saga Online Eudemons Online EuroGangster EverEmber Online EverQuest Next EverQuest Online Adventures Evernight Everquest Everquest II Evony Exarch Exorace F.E.A.R. Online Face of Mankind Fairyland Online Fall of Rome Fallen Earth Fallen Sword Fallout Online Family Guy Online Fantage Fantasy Earth Zero Fantasy Realm Online Fantasy Tales Online Fantasy Worlds: Rhynn Faunasphere Faxion Online Ferentus Ferion Fiesta Online Final Fantasy XI Final Fantasy XIV: A Realm Reborn Firefall Fists of Fu Florensia Flyff Football Manager Live Football Superstars Force of Arms Forge Forsaken World Fortnite Fortuna Forum for Discussion of Everlight Freaky Creatures Free Realms Freesky Online Freeworld Fung Wan Online Furcadia Fury Fusion Fall
G-L
GalaXseeds Galactic Command Online Game of Thrones: Seven Kingdoms Gameglobe Gate To Heavens Gates of Andaron Gatheryn Gauntlet Gekkeiju Online Ghost Online Ghost Recon Online Gladiatus Glitch Global Agenda Global Soccer Gloria Victis Glory of Gods GoGoRacer Goal Line Blitz Gods and Heroes GodsWar Online Golemizer Golf Star GoonZu Online Graal Kingdoms Granado Espada Online Grand Chase Grand Fantasia Grepolis Grimlands Guild Wars Guild Wars 2 Guild Wars Factions Guild Wars Nightfall H1Z1 Habbo Hotel Hailan Rising HaloSphere2 Haven & Hearth Hawken Hearthstone: Heroes of Warcraft Helbreath Hellgate Hellgate: London Hello Kitty Online Hero Online Hero Zero Hero's Journey Hero: 108 Online HeroSmash Heroes & Generals Heroes in the Sky Heroes of Bestia Heroes of Gaia Heroes of Might and Magic Online Heroes of Thessalonica Heroes of Three Kingdoms Heroes of the Storm Hex Holic Online Hostile Space Hunter Blade Huxley Illutia Illyriad Immortals USA Imperator Imperian Inferno Legend Infestation: Survivor Stories Infinite Crisis Infinity Infinity Iris Online Iron Grip: Marauders Irth Worlds Island Forge Islands of War Istaria: Chronicles of the Gifted Jade Dynasty Jagged Alliance Online Juggernaut Jumpgate Jumpgate Evolution KAL Online Kakele Online Kaos War Karos Online Kartuga Kicks Online King of Kings 3 Kingdom Heroes Kingdom Under Fire II Kingdom of Drakkar Kingory Kings and Legends Kings of the Realm KingsRoad Kitsu Saga Kiwarriors Knight Age Knight Online Knights of Dream City Kothuria Kung Foo! Kunlun Online L.A.W. LEGO Universe La Tale Land of Chaos Online Landmark Lands of Hope: Phoenix Edition LastChaos League of Angels League of Legends - Clash of Fates Legend of Edda: Vengeance Legend of Golden Plume Legend of Katha Legend of Mir 2 Legend of Mir 3 Legendary Champions Lego Minifigures Online Life is Feudal Light of Nova Lime Odyssey Line of Defense Lineage Lineage Eternal: Twilight Resistance Lineage II Linkrealms Loong Online Lord of the Rings Online Lords Online Lost Saga Lucent Heart Lunia Lusternia: Age of Ascension Luvinia World
M-Q
MU Online Mabinogi Maestia: Rise of Keledus MagiKnights Magic Barrage Magic World Online Manga Fighter MapleStory Martial Heroes Marvel Heroes Marvel Super Hero Squad Online Marvel: Avengers Alliance MechWarrior Online Megaten Meridian 59 : Evolution Merlin MetalMercs Metaplace Metin 2 MicroVolts Midkemia Online Might & Magic Heroes: Kingdoms MilMo Minecraft Mini Fighter Minions of Mirth Ministry of War Monato Esprit Monkey King Online Monkey Quest Monster & Me Monster Madness Online MonsterMMORPG Moonlight Online: Tales of Eternal Blood Mordavia Mortal Online Mourning My Lands Myst Online: URU Live Myth Angels Online Myth War Myth War 2 Mytheon Mythic Saga Mythos N.E.O Online NIDA Online Nadirim Naviage: The Power of Capital Navy Field Need for Speed World Nemexia Neo's Land NeoSteam Neocron Nether Neverwinter Nexus: The Kingdom Of The Winds NinjaTrick NosTale Novus Aeterno Oberin Odin Quest Odyssey RPG Ogre Island Omerta 3 Online Boxing Manager Onverse Order & Chaos Online Order of Magic Original Blood Origins Return Origins of Malu Orion's Belt Otherland Forums OverSoul Overkings Oz Online Oz World Pandora Saga Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen Panzar Parabellum Parallel Kingdom Parfait Station Path of Exile Pathfinder Online Perfect World Perpetuum Online Phantasy Star Online 2 Phantasy Star Universe Phoenix Dynasty Online Phylon Pi Story Picaroon Pirate Galaxy Pirate Storm Pirate101 PirateKing Online Pirates of the Burning Sea Pirates of the Caribbean Online Pixie Hollow Planeshift Planet Arkadia Planet Calypso PlanetSide 2 Planetside Planets³ Playboy Manager Pocket Legends Pockie Ninja Pockie Pirates Pockie Saints PoxNora Prime World Prime: Battle for Dominus Priston Tale Priston Tale II Prius Online Project Blackout Project Powder Project Titan Forums Project Wiki Puzzle Pirates Quickhit Football
R-S
R2 Online RAN Online RF Online ROSE Online Rage of 3 Kingdoms Ragnarok Online Ragnarok Online II RaiderZ Rakion Rappelz RappelzSEA Ravenmarch Realm Fighter Realm of the Mad God Realm of the Titans Realms Online Reclamation Red Stone Red War: Edem's Curse Regnum Online Remnant Knights Renaissance Repulse Requiem: Memento Mori Rift RiotZone Rise Rise of Dragonian Era Rise of Empire Rise of the Tycoon Rising of King Risk Your Life Rivality Rockfree Rohan: Blood Feud Role Play Worlds Roll n Rock Roma Victor Romadoria Rosh Online Roto X Rubies of Eventide Ruin Online Rumble Fighter Runes of Magic Runescape Rust Rusty Hearts Ryzom S4 League SAGA SD Gundam Capsule Fighter Online SMITE SUN Sagramore Salem SaySayGirls Scarlet Blade Scions of Fate Seal Online: Evolution Second Life Secret of the Solstice Seed Serenia Fantasy Seven Seas Saga Seven Souls Online Sevencore Shadow of Legend Shadowbane Shadowrun Online Shaiya Shards Online Shattered Galaxy Sho Online Shot Online Shroud of the Avatar SideQuest Siege on Stars Sigonyth: Desert Eternity Silkroad Online Skyblade Skyforge SmashMuck Champions Smoo Online Soldier Front Soul Master Soul Order Online Soul of Guardian Space Heroes Universe Sparta: War of Empires Spellcasters Sphere Spiral Knights Spirit Tales Splash Fighters Squad Wars Star Citizen Star Sonata 2 Star Stable Star Supremacy Star Trek Online Star Trek: Infinite Space Star Wars Galaxies Star Wars: Clone Wars Adventures Star Wars: The Old Republic StarQuest Online Stargate Worlds Starlight Story Starpires State of Decay SteelWar Online Stone Age 2 Stormfall: Age of War Storybricks Stronghold Kingdoms Sudden Attack Supremacy 1914 Supreme Destiny Sword Girls Sword of Destiny: Rise of Aions SwordX Swords of Heavens Swordsman
T-Z
TERA TS Online Tabula Rasa Tactica Online Tales Runner Tales of Fantasy Tales of Pirates Tales of Pirates II Tales of Solaris Talisman Online Tamer Saga Tank Ace Tantra Online Tatsumaki: Land at War Terra Militaris TerraWorld Online Thang Online The 4th Coming The Agency The Aurora World The Black Watchmen The Chronicle The Chronicles of Spellborn The Crew The Division The Hammers End The Legend of Ares The Lost Titans The Matrix Online The Mighty Quest for Epic Loot The Missing Ink The Mummy Online The Myth of Soma The Pride of Taern The Realm Online The Repopulation The Secret World The Sims Online The Strategems The West Theralon There Therian Saga Thrones of Chaos Tibia Tibia Micro Edition Tiger Knight Titan Siege Titans of Time Toontown Online Top Speed Topia Online Torchlight Total Domination Transformers Universe Traveller AR Travia Online Travian Trials of Ascension Tribal Hero Tribal Wars Tribes Universe Trickster Online Trove Troy Online True Fantasy Live Online Turf Battles Twelve Sky Twelve Sky 2 Twilight War Tynon U.B. Funkeys UFO Online URDEAD Online Ultima Forever: Quest for the Avatar Ultima Online Ultima X: Odyssey Ultimate Naruto Ultimate Soccer Boss Uncharted Waters Online Undercover 2: Merc Wars Underlight Unification Wars Universe Online Utopia Valkyrie Sky Vampire Lord Online Vanguard: Saga of Heroes Vanquish Space Vector City Racers Vendetta Online Victory - Age of Racing Vindictus Virtonomics Vis Gladius Visions of Zosimos VoidExpanse Voyage Century Online W.E.L.L. Online WAR (Warhammer Online) WAR2 Glory WYD Global Wakfu War Thunder War of 2012 War of Angels War of Legends War of Mercenaries War of Thrones War of the Immortals WarFlow Waren Story Wargame1942 Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium Online Warhammer Online: Wrath of Heroes Warkeepers Warrior Epic Wartune WebLords Wild West Online WildStar Wind of Luck WindSlayer 2 Wings of Destiny Wish Wizard101 Wizardry Online Wizards and Champions Wonder King Wonderland Online World Golf Tour World of Battles World of Darkness World of Heroes World of Kung Fu World of Pirates World of Speed World of Tanks World of Tanks Generals World of Warcraft World of Warplanes World of Warships World of the Living Dead WorldAlpha Wurm Online Xenocell Xiah Xsyon Xulu YS Online Yitien ZU Online Zentia Zero Online Zero Online: The Andromeda Crisis Zodiac Online Zombies Ate My Pizza eRepublik

MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's?

4 Pages « 1 2 3 4 » Search
76 posts found
  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3443

The problem with censorship is ********

4/12/13 12:02:38 PM#41
Originally posted by Tuktz

- 2 faction instead of 3

- keep trading where you never see enemy players (or rarely)

- no CC (only way for a small group to stand any chance against larger force)

- culling ala GW2

- poor performance with large number of players in same area

- buffbots

- jack of all trades classes rather than specific roles (even if class has choice between specific roles  thats better than being able to do everything)

- instant respawn / back into fight - endless tug of war between spawn points because you get back into fight too fast

- instanced PVP - areas or bgs, hate instanced pvp - I want it to feel real and a part of the real game world, not some fake/arbitrary area

- group sizes too small - mmmmmm I miss 8 person groups... now games go for 3, 4, or 5 meh

- no meaningful benefits to greater world from pvp/rvr - need some incentives to fight

- gear creep where gear becomes more important than skill in pvp/rvr

- mirrored classes - same classes just reskinned to look different between realms... I know it helps with balance, but still.... brings no "flavor" to the realms

- too easy to respec to FOTM specs - you should pick one, and get good at it, and get noteriety from your foes and allies for it...

-no sting from death - need some kind of penalty, even if its just time wasted traveling back... don't want it to be too harsh, but other games theres literally NO penalty, and you don't care if you die

 

- not sure how I feel about collision detection, but some people are diehard for it, others are diehard against it

- stealthers - same as above, I know some are diehard for, and some diehard against

 

Why only 3? maybe go above that? Is there any mmo that has attempted more than 3?


  Niix_Ozek

Novice Member

Joined: 2/26/13
Posts: 404

4/12/13 12:06:28 PM#42

Not sure if anyone has attempted more than 3, however 3 adds a major benefit of controlling the over powered realms, with 4 theres just more options to isolate the low pop because you don't have to partner with them to take on the big guy, you can partner with the other mid realm.

I dunno I think 3 is the best, controls a lot.

Ozek - DAOC
Niix - Other games that sucked

  Lokberg

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/24/05
Posts: 271

4/12/13 12:10:41 PM#43
Originally posted by Kuppa
Originally posted by Lokberg
Originally posted by Kuppa
Originally posted by Hjamnr
Originally posted by Kuppa
OP why is casting while moving a problem???

Because it encourages kiting, and thus minimizes or eliminates the usefulness of non-ranged classes.

You say it like it's always the case. When well executed this is not a problem and offers skill play and more fun(to some), instead of static gameplay based on looking at your skillbar.

Oh i would probabely look less on my skill bar if i had to stand still i mean i have to see if anyone is coming at me from any angle,

if i can just run around i would just spam lesser skills and keep kiting that way were i see its cleared while looking at skillbar to see when i can use the better skills.

You know that made no sense. If you stand still it means movement and position is not really imporant you are the target of an attack and will be hit no matter what. It turns into WoW, just wait for cooldown and attack.

 

With movement you HAVE to look at your surroundings otherwise feel the sweet release of death...

yes becouse the enemy can only come from infront of you  when standing still, if mages are allowed to run around and cast their spells how do you catch them as a melee char?

if you solve that riddle maybe it can be in game, that or lets say the spells only take 1% hp each attack. ( but who the hell would want that ^_^ )

  Melloz

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/13
Posts: 26

4/12/13 12:12:07 PM#44
Originally posted by Niix_Ozek

Not sure if anyone has attempted more than 3, however 3 adds a major benefit of controlling the over powered realms, with 4 theres just more options to isolate the low pop because you don't have to partner with them to take on the big guy, you can partner with the other mid realm.

I dunno I think 3 is the best, controls a lot.

 

I'm not sure about that. I think more than 3 realms could help balance things even further. The main problem is that it adds more work to develop classes and artwork for more realms. If classes aren't mirrored, balance becomes an even trickier issue with more realms.
  BeansnBread

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/19/06
Posts: 5540

4/12/13 12:16:13 PM#45
Originally posted by Kuppa
Originally posted by Tuktz

- 2 faction instead of 3

- keep trading where you never see enemy players (or rarely)

- no CC (only way for a small group to stand any chance against larger force)

- culling ala GW2

- poor performance with large number of players in same area

- buffbots

- jack of all trades classes rather than specific roles (even if class has choice between specific roles  thats better than being able to do everything)

- instant respawn / back into fight - endless tug of war between spawn points because you get back into fight too fast

- instanced PVP - areas or bgs, hate instanced pvp - I want it to feel real and a part of the real game world, not some fake/arbitrary area

- group sizes too small - mmmmmm I miss 8 person groups... now games go for 3, 4, or 5 meh

- no meaningful benefits to greater world from pvp/rvr - need some incentives to fight

- gear creep where gear becomes more important than skill in pvp/rvr

- mirrored classes - same classes just reskinned to look different between realms... I know it helps with balance, but still.... brings no "flavor" to the realms

- too easy to respec to FOTM specs - you should pick one, and get good at it, and get noteriety from your foes and allies for it...

-no sting from death - need some kind of penalty, even if its just time wasted traveling back... don't want it to be too harsh, but other games theres literally NO penalty, and you don't care if you die

 

- not sure how I feel about collision detection, but some people are diehard for it, others are diehard against it

- stealthers - same as above, I know some are diehard for, and some diehard against

 

Why only 3? maybe go above that? Is there any mmo that has attempted more than 3?

I even like the more player driven faction system like in EVE far more than a 3 faction system. The amount of things that can happen... the politics, the betrayal, the amount of things that arise from alliances is one of the most interesting things I've ever experienced in an MMORPG. 3 faction systems are oversimplified and feel artificial to me. 

 

If you want to feel "realm" pride in something you are a part of, try helping to build and/or be part of a player driven faction/alliance. Developer driven factions remove the intrigue and variance. It's always "us vs. them" instead of the more subtle, intricate relationships that can and should exist in my opinion.

 

We are all alike because we picked an option!

vs.

We are all alike because we chose to accept each other and have common goals!

SWTOR is the greatest mmo ever!

  Theodwulf

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/01/12
Posts: 201

4/12/13 12:47:54 PM#46
any positive feedback, losers walk mentality mechanics.  If winning enables you to more easily win, what happens? Somebody wins! Then what? The winners are left to flip keeps and gang-bang solos who are fool enough to wander out in the battlefield! Accept that as a truth. In a MMO it's no simple feat to jump on another side to keep the game going. You cannot design a game that is not supposed to end like a game that ends and starts over. Three factions will not change this, this is something that must be dealt with in the raw mechanics....it won't be but one can hope.
  Tierless

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2087

joie de vivre

4/12/13 1:08:34 PM#47

Lack of consequences
No real goals
No effect on the game or game world
Not seeing the enemy players names! I like my fights personal!

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Bahz

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/21/06
Posts: 172

4/12/13 1:10:28 PM#48
battlegrounds / instanced
  Hrotha

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/25/08
Posts: 840

4/12/13 1:15:51 PM#49

What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's?

 

As a Veteran-MMO gamer (boast boast) it's very easy to say:

  1. Repetitive maps - Auto-generated PvP-Maps, how awesome would that be? Bring it
  2. Gear grind - no gear with stats works best, see GW2 or other PvP-Games
  3. Rock, Paper, Scissor no doubt - pure PvP-titles dont have such a feature. Every class can beat every class. Done
  4. Pure Healer classes - "Are you serious, Healing is fun!" No doubt, but we are here to meet ourselves at fairness when it comes to sports. So? We dont want unfair match-makins where one side has no healer. Everyone can heal himself.
  5. No consequences - vary Age of Conan's Crime System to add more spice!
  6. No impact on the overall world - ArcheAge will bring a brilliant example with court and prisons
  7. Make it not too unforgiving as AoC is. The abusive PvP in AoC scared so many players away, it's insane.
  8. and Most important: Make it possible to beat multiple opponents at once by how well you manage to play your class. Having the feeling of being able to beat only one Player at a time feels very restricted. I know this is very hard to implement, especially when every class can beat every class. That being said, burst and clever CD-usage has to be a key factor.

Now, bring this into an MMO and you really have an outstanding Game. If you like the idea and want more detail? Feel free to contact me and offer me a well-paid job, with enough creative freedom.

We, appreciate it.

  Troianman

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/13
Posts: 83

4/12/13 1:40:47 PM#50

In addition to the many items brought up I would like to add the dumbing down (general dumbing down of MMOs would be a much longer post) of stats and classes in general. The EVE learning curve image that is still floating around the internet is a great illustration of this. Basically if you think about the huge amount of depth that game has in terms of ship types, fittings, mods, weapon types, skill reqs, balancing your power and cpu usage, etc you have something that creates an enormous amount of possiblities and allows people to completely shoot themselves in the foot if they fail to get it. Look at DAoC and you originallly had resists that mattered, resists to magical types of damage as well as to types of physical damage. Additionally I don't remember there being any cursor that told you what class they were, you had to figure that out by what race they were, what armor/weapons they had, what abilities they used, etc. It even helped to figure out what spec they were as there was not simply one spec to rule them, this allowed for the emergence of sub-classes rather than the relatively cookie cutter X class system most games have now. The skill point system and broader skill set in general made this possible but the notion of 3 or 4 "trees" in other games only per class killed this and in many cases only made 1 or 2 viable options. Damage types have been reduced to either physical or maybe 4ish types of magical, as opposed to say 5 or 6 magical types and at least 3 physical types. Useful stats have been reduced to number 4 (con/str/dex/int) rather than 6 (str/dex/con/int/wis/char) and once again this detracts from the many possiblities of what could have been. 

In short, I want to see depth make a comeback in MMOs, or at the very least in MMOs I hope to play.

  chrissreef

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/11/05
Posts: 24

4/12/13 1:46:39 PM#51

cc+cc+cc then dead

arenas = repetition

no realm ranks WITH rewards... killing = no reward

Nothing for the realm to defend or gain collectively

 

  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/12/13 1:49:41 PM#52

Wow... I feel out of place here. I'm an old school PvP'er and my views seem to be completely different. 

 

What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's? 

1) The Holy Trinity - For me this has ruined PvP in more MMO's than any other mechanic is the histroy of gaming. The first issue it has caused is the whole rock, paper, scissor balancing act crap. Every class has to be weak to another class to balance things out. This creates a situation where PvP is largely decided by what class or classes you are facing rather than whom. It completely ruins 1 vs. 1 dueling, 2 vs. 2 and 3 vs. 3 matches. Its all about the classes you are facing rather than whom and their skill level. Next is the fact that the trinity drags combat out beyond what it needs to be. If you are doing 5 vs. 5 the rule is focus down the healer then engage in combat. Both sides are doing this repeatedly. 

Whats the point of PvP if my class simply beats yours regardless of our skill differences or vice versa? If I or you win simply because my or your class can't compete with the other, what is the victory worth? If I or you lose simply because we didn't have a healer that match, what is the victory worth? 

 

2) Levels - This has always been asinine to me. I would have played many games for the Open world PvP servers if levels didn't exist. Essentially you are a wipping boy until you get to cap, then you can finally be on par with others and simply wtfpwn anyone 5 or more levels below you. Thats asinine and again I must ask, what is the victory against lower level players worth? 

 

3) Gear - This little mechanic likes to come into play after the level mechanics just to screw with you some more. Alright, finally I'm level 50! So now I'm on par and can compete with other capped level players! Wrong, because they obtained their rank 1337 PvP prestiege gear of noob slaying already and you have to go through this asinine grind to get it before you can compete. When you are decimating others simply because you have better gear, again I must ask... what is the victory worth?

 

4) Stealth - Don't get me wrong here, I actually like stealth. The problem I have is how its used. Thanks to the god awful existance of the holy trinity rock paper scissor crap stealth is used as a means of allowing squishy rouges to compete with their scissor, rock or paper (Which ever they are meant to counter at the time). So yeah, I have a problem with the backstab stun insta kill crap that has become of stealthed in trinity. 

 

Thats my short list. These are the top 4 things that have ruined PvP in other MMO's for me. I could easily give you 20 more, but these are the main ones. 

  OgreRaper

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/11
Posts: 381

4/12/13 1:53:58 PM#53

For me:

Instances - I hate everything about them

Lack of territory control - DAOC was good in this area, but I think it can be improved upon.

Lack of rewards - I think DAOC was pretty good in this regard too. You had personal progression through realm points and bonuses to your entire realm with relics.

Cross Realm - I don't want to fight against a bunch of random people. I like getting to know my realm mates, and enemies.

  Lawtoween

Novice Member

Joined: 3/05/13
Posts: 104

4/12/13 2:11:20 PM#54
Originally posted by 4bsolute

What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's?

As a Veteran-MMO gamer (boast boast) it's very easy to say:

  1. Repetitive maps - Auto-generated PvP-Maps, how awesome would that be? Bring it
  2. Gear grind - no gear with stats works best, see GW2 or other PvP-Games
  3. Rock, Paper, Scissor no doubt - pure PvP-titles dont have such a feature. Every class can beat every class. Done
  4. Pure Healer classes - "Are you serious, Healing is fun!" No doubt, but we are here to meet ourselves at fairness when it comes to sports. So? Everyone can heal himself.
  5. No consequences - vary Age of Conan's Crime System to add more spice!
  6. No impact on the overall world - ArcheAge will bring a brilliant example with court and prisons
  7. Make it not too unforgiving as AoC is. The abusive PvP in AoC scared so many players away, it's insane.
  8. and Most important: Make it possible to beat multiple opponents at once by how well you manage to play your class. Having the feeling of being able to beat only one Player at a time feels very restricted. I know this is very hard to implement, especially when every class can beat every class. That being said, burst and clever CD-usage has to be a key factor.

Now, bring this into an MMO and you really have an outstanding Game. If you like the idea and want more detail? Feel free to contact me and offer me a well-paid job, with enough creative freedom.

We, appreciate it.

I think the OP was looking more for what has ruined an RvR type game.  What you list is important if the majority of fights are going to be 1v1, so if that is what your interpretation of PvP meant, then well done. 

Unfortunately, an RvR game is less interesting if the focus is on 1v1 fights, or short duration mini-games (like a CoD, or instanced PvP in some MMOs).  And the vision for CU is ope- field, persistant combat.  Since this board is dedicated to CU I think we can assume the OP was looking for what has killed RvR.  I could be wrong though.

Point 1 would add to long term interest.  Hopefully CU's inclusion of building will alter the battlefield enough to keep it different over time. 

Point 2 is valid in terms of combat balance, but I can't see how being a crafter will be interesting at all if every item you can make is always the same.

Point 3 is only true where 1v1 is the norm.  The whole purpose of RPS is to encourage **cough** force **cough** teamwork.  If you know there is a class out there that is going to own you every time 1v1, you will be less likely to venture out without a friend of the class that can own that other class every time 1v1.  RvR is about group and larger combat, so RPS is just a way to add to your choices (that matter).

Point 4 is mostly a style choice I'd say.  Once you've accepted RPS, then healers become a viable option, but only if they are pure healers and no one else can heal.  Healers that can dps (especially at the same time a la DoKs in WAR) are always going to be unbalanced.  Unless everyone is a DoK, but how boring would that be?

Point 5 A crime system I can't comment on, as I've never played AoC, so I can not speak to the system.  As far as no consequences, I think you are referring to murder vs. war-fighting given the crime angle.  Sounds interesting, but it seems unnecessary unless the game is FFA PvP.  For RvR, the consequences need to be realm-wide, and occur because of inaction, rather than due to an action.  Standing around while your realm loses a keep (if you are a combat class) should lose a combat character something (maybe even XP). 

Point 6 we agree on and in addition to what I say in point 5, one way might be when a realm loses a control point (that start out under that realm's control) would create a combat debuff that only goes away when that control point is recaptured.  To keep it from overwhelming a realm, for each combat debuff, there could be a corresponding crafter time buff (nothing gets you to work hard like making something to defend your realm when an army is marching on your house).  You can't increase the odds of a special or the bonuses on the items because they would outlast the debuff and then a realm will start to intentionally lose keeps to get buffed gear.

Point 7 I again have no experience with, although I agree with the general sentiment.  You can't have one class or one side too powerful, or people will stop playing.

Point 8 would be tough to implement with a "balanced" classes approach, with RPS where the small group is all one class it would be easy if the soloer is the class that rocks the other.  On the other hand, this would be more of a mistake on the part of the group than any skill of the soloer (aside from recognizing an opportunity).  Skill in an RvR game will be largely about group tactics, at least as much as "burst and clever CD-usage." 

Again, great points for a 1v1 FFA PvP game.

Lawt

 

  naezgul

Novice Member

Joined: 3/15/13
Posts: 389

4/12/13 2:14:42 PM#55
Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Wow... I feel out of place here. I'm an old school PvP'er and my views seem to be completely different. 

 

What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's? 

1) The Holy Trinity - For me this has ruined PvP in more MMO's than any other mechanic is the histroy of gaming. The first issue it has caused is the whole rock, paper, scissor balancing act crap. Every class has to be weak to another class to balance things out. This creates a situation where PvP is largely decided by what class or classes you are facing rather than whom. It completely ruins 1 vs. 1 dueling, 2 vs. 2 and 3 vs. 3 matches. Its all about the classes you are facing rather than whom and their skill level. Next is the fact that the trinity drags combat out beyond what it needs to be. If you are doing 5 vs. 5 the rule is focus down the healer then engage in combat. Both sides are doing this repeatedly. 

Whats the point of PvP if my class simply beats yours regardless of our skill differences or vice versa? If I or you win simply because my or your class can't compete with the other, what is the victory worth? If I or you lose simply because we didn't have a healer that match, what is the victory worth? 

 

2) Levels - This has always been asinine to me. I would have played many games for the Open world PvP servers if levels didn't exist. Essentially you are a wipping boy until you get to cap, then you can finally be on par with others and simply wtfpwn anyone 5 or more levels below you. Thats asinine and again I must ask, what is the victory against lower level players worth? 

 

3) Gear - This little mechanic likes to come into play after the level mechanics just to screw with you some more. Alright, finally I'm level 50! So now I'm on par and can compete with other capped level players! Wrong, because they obtained their rank 1337 PvP prestiege gear of noob slaying already and you have to go through this asinine grind to get it before you can compete. When you are decimating others simply because you have better gear, again I must ask... what is the victory worth?

 

4) Stealth - Don't get me wrong here, I actually like stealth. The problem I have is how its used. Thanks to the god awful existance of the holy trinity rock paper scissor crap stealth is used as a means of allowing squishy rouges to compete with their scissor, rock or paper (Which ever they are meant to counter at the time). So yeah, I have a problem with the backstab stun insta kill crap that has become of stealthed in trinity. 

 

Thats my short list. These are the top 4 things that have ruined PvP in other MMO's for me. I could easily give you 20 more, but these are the main ones. 

Sounds to me like you are focused on 1v1/dueling........my opinion rock,paper, scissor brings the most out of games.....sometimes you just need to let the enemy pass......

  GrayGhost79

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/08
Posts: 4888

4/13/13 12:57:45 AM#56
Originally posted by naezgul
Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Wow... I feel out of place here. I'm an old school PvP'er and my views seem to be completely different. 

 

What game mechanics have ruined PvP in other MMO's? 

1) The Holy Trinity - For me this has ruined PvP in more MMO's than any other mechanic is the histroy of gaming. The first issue it has caused is the whole rock, paper, scissor balancing act crap. Every class has to be weak to another class to balance things out. This creates a situation where PvP is largely decided by what class or classes you are facing rather than whom. It completely ruins 1 vs. 1 dueling, 2 vs. 2 and 3 vs. 3 matches. Its all about the classes you are facing rather than whom and their skill level. Next is the fact that the trinity drags combat out beyond what it needs to be. If you are doing 5 vs. 5 the rule is focus down the healer then engage in combat. Both sides are doing this repeatedly. 

Whats the point of PvP if my class simply beats yours regardless of our skill differences or vice versa? If I or you win simply because my or your class can't compete with the other, what is the victory worth? If I or you lose simply because we didn't have a healer that match, what is the victory worth? 

 

2) Levels - This has always been asinine to me. I would have played many games for the Open world PvP servers if levels didn't exist. Essentially you are a wipping boy until you get to cap, then you can finally be on par with others and simply wtfpwn anyone 5 or more levels below you. Thats asinine and again I must ask, what is the victory against lower level players worth? 

 

3) Gear - This little mechanic likes to come into play after the level mechanics just to screw with you some more. Alright, finally I'm level 50! So now I'm on par and can compete with other capped level players! Wrong, because they obtained their rank 1337 PvP prestiege gear of noob slaying already and you have to go through this asinine grind to get it before you can compete. When you are decimating others simply because you have better gear, again I must ask... what is the victory worth?

 

4) Stealth - Don't get me wrong here, I actually like stealth. The problem I have is how its used. Thanks to the god awful existance of the holy trinity rock paper scissor crap stealth is used as a means of allowing squishy rouges to compete with their scissor, rock or paper (Which ever they are meant to counter at the time). So yeah, I have a problem with the backstab stun insta kill crap that has become of stealthed in trinity. 

 

Thats my short list. These are the top 4 things that have ruined PvP in other MMO's for me. I could easily give you 20 more, but these are the main ones. 

Sounds to me like you are focused on 1v1/dueling........my opinion rock,paper, scissor brings the most out of games.....sometimes you just need to let the enemy pass......

Sorry, I was speaking about PvP as a whole. I mainly prefer open world PvP games and FFA PvP games. I do enjoy arena type PvP every so often but that bubble type of PvP isn't my prefered experience. Its just my opinion and we are all going to have different ones. I was just shocked that many in this thread wanted artificial advantages over others when it comes to PvP. 

 

 

  znaiika

Novice Member

Joined: 1/31/12
Posts: 202

4/13/13 4:11:55 AM#57
Originally posted by rounner
Slow moving for casting spells is one thing but if moving breaks casting I wont play the game.

Same should be for archers and all two hand weapons.

  morfidon

Novice Member

Joined: 2/19/13
Posts: 245

 
OP  4/13/13 5:59:27 AM#58
Originally posted by Kuppa
Originally posted by Hjamnr
Originally posted by Kuppa
Originally posted by Hjamnr
Originally posted by Kuppa
OP why is casting while moving a problem???

Because it encourages kiting, and thus minimizes or eliminates the usefulness of non-ranged classes.

You say it like it's always the case. When well executed this is not a problem and offers skill play and more fun(to some), instead of static gameplay based on looking at your skillbar.

It is always the case.  All casting while moving does is turn PvP into a festival of rabbits, as everyone is jumping all over the place casting their spells.   This = silly and no fun.

If you're looking at your skill-bar... you're doing it wrong.

Lol nope it doesn't. You saying it doesn't make it a reality. You can have pvp with movement that does not eliminate the usefulness of non-ranged classes. If you play it that way doesn't mean everyone does.

 

The other option is like WoW, look at skill bar and wait for cooldowns. Only move when target is out of reach or to go out of reach...

What cooldowns wtf? Look at daoc, you can't cast while moving you have to stand and you don't have almost any spells on cooldown.

I don't want everyone jumping and playing like rabbits like somebody said, it's just stupid. 

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

4/16/13 7:56:35 PM#59

1 instancing

2 instancing

3 instancing

 

you get the picture

  dcoy68

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/17/13
Posts: 31

4/16/13 10:35:34 PM#60

Steath,  excessive CC,   short TTD - it should be a fight not a gank or a helpless beating.

 

Small scale fights - IE  WOW arena.  The bigger the fight (that doesn't turn into a lagfest)  the better.

 

Balance - Some classes (usually tanks) being near useless while others (usually healers) are ultra powerful.   Having 5-6 healers on a 15 person team shouldn't make you unbeatable it should weaken you.  A balanced team of classes should always be strongest with all class/role  having a nearly equal place in that.

 

PVP with no point -  Make winning in some way important to the side with an effect on the game world.  Make it less an instant respawn slayfest and more of a strategic battle.  Don't reward selfish play.   Give a sense of progression and development of both your toon and your guild/team/side for our efforts.

 

4 Pages « 1 2 3 4 » Search