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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » Do not understand why you call Raiding against TES IP, but they are making a PVP Focused Game.

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111 posts found
  Neherun

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/07
Posts: 240

4/10/13 8:47:19 AM#101
Originally posted by nightsong89
Originally posted by Margulis
Originally posted by nerovipus32
The common argument i see coming up here is wow players wanting TESO to be wow.

Really?  The common argument I have seen is fans of the series wanting it to be similar and true to the series - which it isn't even close to being.

Pretty much this.

 

Open world exploration: gone, in place a convuluted system where you can visit the other faction territorities but not group with anyone from those factions, thus cutting you off from friends who play that faction

 

Play whatever race you want: gone, faction locked. say you and a friend want to play an Altmer and a Breton. well guess what? you're shit out of luck in PvE'ing together.

 

Basically the open endedness in playing whatever race/class you want as well as full world exploration is gone in TESO and sacraficed to make way for the three way PvP, which by the way, doesn't have a large enough community left to sustain an AAA MMO anymore, there is far too much competition from other MMO's.

 

So wait, what would be sustainable then? A PvE game? A game that's focused on dungeon crawling? FFA PvP with consequences half of gaming population cannot handle? Another instanced arena PvP focused game or a lackcluster 3-way PvP?

What you fail to comply with is the actual market size of the MMORPG genre, and how half of its potential is wasted by attempting to familiarize with the mechanics of previous titles. People want something new, they grave for something new. DAoC's model is still inexperienced by most of the population, and if done correctly, and offer satisfable end-game to all parties, except for those who refuse to PvP; and Mythic being Mythic, they also share the idea of "There is no real point going to play online if it ain't against players". AI is always superior in single-player - Co-op enviroment, it can never be done to a intelligent level on MMO world.

 

  SirBalin

Warmonger

Joined: 11/22/06
Posts: 1107

4/10/13 8:51:04 AM#102
Originally posted by BigHatLogan
Originally posted by kidas52
How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

There is no point in making TES an MMORPG at all unless it involves PVP.  Otherwise why not just make another single player game?  Or a cooperative mode option in a single player game or something if people want to explore with friends.  MMORPGs only make sense if PVP is involved.

Exactly, they have made great pve games already and now they want to make an mmo.  They can now target a whole new crowd with pvp, a community that is sad because recent games have not satisfied the pvp community.  This is a great idea for them, doesn't mean they can't make another pve game for those fans...but this is very smart on their part.

Incognito
www.incognito-gaming.us
"You're either with us or against us"

  Livnthedream

Novice Member

Joined: 3/20/13
Posts: 582

I like this planet, YOU get off!

4/10/13 9:14:21 AM#103
Originally posted by SirBalin
Originally posted by BigHatLogan
Originally posted by kidas52
How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

There is no point in making TES an MMORPG at all unless it involves PVP.  Otherwise why not just make another single player game?  Or a cooperative mode option in a single player game or something if people want to explore with friends.  MMORPGs only make sense if PVP is involved.

Exactly, they have made great pve games already and now they want to make an mmo.  They can now target a whole new crowd with pvp, a community that is sad because recent games have not satisfied the pvp community.  This is a great idea for them, doesn't mean they can't make another pve game for those fans...but this is very smart on their part.

So wait, because they have made some pve stuff its now pvper's turn? Seriously? The levels of entitlement are hilarious.

http://chroniclesofthenerds.com/nerdfight/

Y U NO FLIP TABLE?!?!?!

  Neherun

Elite Member

Joined: 9/06/07
Posts: 240

4/10/13 11:17:34 AM#104
Originally posted by Livnthedream
Originally posted by SirBalin
Originally posted by BigHatLogan
Originally posted by kidas52
How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

There is no point in making TES an MMORPG at all unless it involves PVP.  Otherwise why not just make another single player game?  Or a cooperative mode option in a single player game or something if people want to explore with friends.  MMORPGs only make sense if PVP is involved.

Exactly, they have made great pve games already and now they want to make an mmo.  They can now target a whole new crowd with pvp, a community that is sad because recent games have not satisfied the pvp community.  This is a great idea for them, doesn't mean they can't make another pve game for those fans...but this is very smart on their part.

So wait, because they have made some pve stuff its now pvper's turn? Seriously? The levels of entitlement are hilarious.

 

Its rather steering clear from already saturated market, which are PvE games with shallow PvP systems, such as instanced capture the flags or other mini-PvP games.

 

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

4/10/13 4:39:58 PM#105
Originally posted by Rthuth434
as if rehashing DAoC needed explaining. it's what mythic people do.

Ah that's funny (non-sarcasm here - it is funny...)

I guess TES fans were hoping Mythic had grown a little and were capable of a little more...

  Vorthanion

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1966

4/10/13 4:45:18 PM#106
Originally posted by BigHatLogan
Originally posted by kidas52
How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

There is no point in making TES an MMORPG at all unless it involves PVP.  Otherwise why not just make another single player game?  Or a cooperative mode option in a single player game or something if people want to explore with friends.  MMORPGs only make sense if PVP is involved.

For you that may be true, but for a lot and I mean a lot of other players this is absolutely false.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17601

4/10/13 4:48:42 PM#107
Originally posted by kidas52

How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

"Your first hours in TESO, at least, will be PvE focused before the option to transition into competitive play. "Yeah we don't know exactly when that point is," says Firor. "Right now it's on level 10, which is about 15 hours of gameplay. Our thinking is at least a few hours of PvE to get the controls and how combat works – we don't want to throw 'em out there too soon, but we always want it all to be up to the player to choose."

All well and good, because for many prospective players the focus is overwhelmingly on PvP" - Mark Firor TESO Game Director

 

Oh looks like you get atleast your first few hours in the RPG immersion everyone has come to associate with The Elder Scrolls Franchise.  Then you better put your troll hats on and get ready to for all chat "pwnt you noob!"

I think one could make an argument for raiding and pvp in a TES mmo provided they just take what is already in the game and expand upon it.

Heck, the Oblvion Gates in "Oblvion" could be construed as a raid. Since this game has Molag Bal as a central protagonist I don't see why gates to his world can't be opened up and "raids" into his territory for various things (heck, even large group quests) can't be done.

There is so much in the world that talk about various groups fighting other groups. So pvp can fit.

It's not whether it's added it's how it's added that's an issue.

 

 

  Purutzil

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/02/11
Posts: 2908

The Critical Hit Pretzel!

4/10/13 4:49:27 PM#108

Its funny what does and does not work going against the IP. Rather poor excuse against something instead of giving a good valid reason. If its 'we want to deliver story focused content' then sure maybe could work or 'we want an end game that is sandbox focused not involving some raid' or some kind of good reasoning though it seems to lack in that explination.

 

Its fine if you don't do something, I just don't agree with using the 'IP' excuse when theres already plenty of compremsies and changes on it already that go against it to begin with.

  Vorthanion

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1966

4/10/13 4:53:14 PM#109
Originally posted by nerovipus32
Originally posted by GreenHell
Originally posted by nerovipus32
I'm not even a big DAOC fanboi, my first mmo was swg and since then every mmo has been shit and the communities have been shit and i don't even want to play with any of you. That is how the genre makes me feel today. There is no community in mmo's these days it's all about how can i use these people to progress my character.

I loved SWG but to say that community was something great is a lie. There were just as many a**holes, elitists, and people using other people for progression ( gear is not the only form of progression) as there is in any modern MMO.

The more I play MMOs the more obvious it becomes that a lot of people do not play them to escape reality or for enjoyment. Instead they bring all of their problems, mental issues and lonliness in to the game with them. Maybe these are just my experiences. It's possible. I have seen people do some weird sh*t in MMOs.

As far as communities go I don't think any game has ever had a nicer, more helpful community than Ryzom. Yet another game that no one ever played.

I agree swg did have it's asshole but there was a sense of interdependancy, nowadays you only have to press a button and you're in a dungeon with 4 other strangers. SWg made you interact on a personal level reardless if the person was a douchebag or not, Today you're just playing with souless avatars. Remember waiting for 10 minutes for a shuttle in swg? todays gamer would freak out over that instead of taking the oppertunity to be social.

Why do you want or need interdependency in order to foster community?  Is it an issue of shyness or lack of social skills that keeps people from playing nice and friendly with others unless it's forced through interdependent mechanics?  EQ was the eptiome of interdependent gameplay and that game had all the same social and anti-social issues of today's games.  In fact, it was a result of past incidences such as the PKing in UO and the guild hostage taking of spawns and raids that brought about all of the 'carebear' changes we see in the genre today.

  Vorthanion

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/11
Posts: 1966

4/10/13 4:55:47 PM#110
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by kidas52

How is that more like TES IP exactly?? Don't quite remember TES being famous for its PvP content.

 

"Your first hours in TESO, at least, will be PvE focused before the option to transition into competitive play. "Yeah we don't know exactly when that point is," says Firor. "Right now it's on level 10, which is about 15 hours of gameplay. Our thinking is at least a few hours of PvE to get the controls and how combat works – we don't want to throw 'em out there too soon, but we always want it all to be up to the player to choose."

All well and good, because for many prospective players the focus is overwhelmingly on PvP" - Mark Firor TESO Game Director

 

Oh looks like you get atleast your first few hours in the RPG immersion everyone has come to associate with The Elder Scrolls Franchise.  Then you better put your troll hats on and get ready to for all chat "pwnt you noob!"

I think one could make an argument for raiding and pvp in a TES mmo provided they just take what is already in the game and expand upon it.

Heck, the Oblvion Gates in "Oblvion" could be construed as a raid. Since this game has Molag Bal as a central protagonist I don't see why gates to his world can't be opened up and "raids" into his territory for various things (heck, even large group quests) can't be done.

There is so much in the world that talk about various groups fighting other groups. So pvp can fit.

It's not whether it's added it's how it's added that's an issue.

 

 

Raiding and PvP wouldn't be an issue if they weren't or weren't likely to become central to the game's experience.  It is labeled as an Elder Scrolls game after all and I find it amusing and alarming when I see all of the blowback from some in the community when we ask to see more ES and less of the PvP / Raid baggage that comes from MMOs in general.

  doodphace

Elite Member

Joined: 6/19/12
Posts: 1719

4/10/13 4:59:48 PM#111
Originally posted by nerovipus32
I wish the genre could split into two different genres of gaming so we could get rid these blizzard bots. Just have blizzard based mmo's and mmorpg's.

Because WoW was the first MMO to have raids, right?

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