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Elder Scrolls Online

Elder Scrolls Online 

General Discussion  » Why do they have race limited factions?

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228 posts found
  User Deleted
4/08/13 4:29:12 PM#201
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Iselin
 

Ah good. We've gotten past the "ESO is making it impossible for me to play with my friends" exaggeration and are back to "What I always expected ESO would be like." That would be an honest opinion. That is just so close to "What ESO is." You're almost there. Once you get there then only one thing remains: you either like it and stay here to discuss all the news and details or you don't.

Actually there are other options, it's true. You could not like it but stay anyway and troll or stay and whine. Those are also possibilities.

Well, it is making it impossible for me to play because as I am primarily a social oriented player and I enjoy playing with the same friends I have played in various MMOs now, so if they don't play I have not much desire to get invested in the game myself. Also I do share their disappointment about these design choices, so yes, in the end we either like what will be released and play it or we won't.

Oh, and I plan to stay and discuss this game and voice my concerns until it releases. If that is trolling or whining to you, so be it, but so far I think I haven't done that. I also gave examples of how I thought both camps could enjoy the game, but as you may have noticed, most people here have an "all or nothing" or "either OR" attitude, whereas I am more for a "Why not have both" approach.

So if you have friends spread over 3 factions you would rather not play then pick who you wanted to play with? Heck in WoW i have friends and family spread over 5 or 6 servers. But if you dont pick a faction you wont be playing with any of your friends.

True, I would rather not play then. And I don't have to really. There are a few games out there I can enjoy and my life doesn't depend on playing ESO. If it doesn't meet my expectations at launch I`ll wait and pick it up later on to give it a try or maybe they'll offer a trial period. It would have been nice though to finally be able to co-op play in an Elder Scrolls game, but I think we will live if it does not happen ;)

Sorry baby, the bathwater needs to go!! MMOing for about 14 years and I think only once or twice me and my friends picked a faction I wanted to play. 90% of the time I end up on a faction playing a race that was my 3rd option. In the end I had so much fun playing I never regreated it. Well other then SWToR. Can I get that time back pls?

o.O...O.o... that's just troll baiting.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3709

4/08/13 4:33:00 PM#202
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Iselin
 

Ah good. We've gotten past the "ESO is making it impossible for me to play with my friends" exaggeration and are back to "What I always expected ESO would be like." That would be an honest opinion. That is just so close to "What ESO is." You're almost there. Once you get there then only one thing remains: you either like it and stay here to discuss all the news and details or you don't.

Actually there are other options, it's true. You could not like it but stay anyway and troll or stay and whine. Those are also possibilities.

Well, it is making it impossible for me to play because as I am primarily a social oriented player and I enjoy playing with the same friends I have played in various MMOs now, so if they don't play I have not much desire to get invested in the game myself. Also I do share their disappointment about these design choices, so yes, in the end we either like what will be released and play it or we won't.

Oh, and I plan to stay and discuss this game and voice my concerns until it releases. If that is trolling or whining to you, so be it, but so far I think I haven't done that. I also gave examples of how I thought both camps could enjoy the game, but as you may have noticed, most people here have an "all or nothing" or "either OR" attitude, whereas I am more for a "Why not have both" approach.

So if you have friends spread over 3 factions you would rather not play then pick who you wanted to play with? Heck in WoW i have friends and family spread over 5 or 6 servers. But if you dont pick a faction you wont be playing with any of your friends.

True, I would rather not play then. And I don't have to really. There are a few games out there I can enjoy and my life doesn't depend on playing ESO. If it doesn't meet my expectations at launch I`ll wait and pick it up later on to give it a try or maybe they'll offer a trial period. It would have been nice though to finally be able to co-op play in an Elder Scrolls game, but I think we will live if it does not happen ;)

Sorry baby, the bathwater needs to go!! MMOing for about 14 years and I think only once or twice me and my friends picked a faction I wanted to play. 90% of the time I end up on a faction playing a race that was my 3rd option. In the end I had so much fun playing I never regreated it. Well other then SWToR. Can I get that time back pls?

o.O...O.o... that's just troll baiting.

How so?

  faxnadu

Novice Member

Joined: 3/28/08
Posts: 956

4/08/13 4:39:19 PM#203
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Iselin
 

Ah good. We've gotten past the "ESO is making it impossible for me to play with my friends" exaggeration and are back to "What I always expected ESO would be like." That would be an honest opinion. That is just so close to "What ESO is." You're almost there. Once you get there then only one thing remains: you either like it and stay here to discuss all the news and details or you don't.

Actually there are other options, it's true. You could not like it but stay anyway and troll or stay and whine. Those are also possibilities.

Well, it is making it impossible for me to play because as I am primarily a social oriented player and I enjoy playing with the same friends I have played in various MMOs now, so if they don't play I have not much desire to get invested in the game myself. Also I do share their disappointment about these design choices, so yes, in the end we either like what will be released and play it or we won't.

Oh, and I plan to stay and discuss this game and voice my concerns until it releases. If that is trolling or whining to you, so be it, but so far I think I haven't done that. I also gave examples of how I thought both camps could enjoy the game, but as you may have noticed, most people here have an "all or nothing" or "either OR" attitude, whereas I am more for a "Why not have both" approach.

So if you have friends spread over 3 factions you would rather not play then pick who you wanted to play with? Heck in WoW i have friends and family spread over 5 or 6 servers. But if you dont pick a faction you wont be playing with any of your friends.

Hence why these days most MMOs aren't really MMOs, they're SP's with a big fucking world, always on DRM and drop in CO-OP.  In EVE-Online, one of the few games I'd still lable as a true MMO, you do not have to choose, christ you can be 10 years older in the game than your friend and still bring him along in PVP and PVE and have him not be target practice.

world is busy and stressful today, most people work whole day from waking up with minute schedule. now these people also love gaming and online gaming. but tell me if we go back to old day mmos where you need to stand anda wait and talk hours to form a party and group not even talking about raid to even get started. how can one pay and do all the other stuff that requires these minute shedules in life? now you say dont work if you like gaming but heck. if you dont want to be lifetime befefiter and have none to look after than yourself then you got allthetime in the world for wait ingame aslong as you like.

 

thats why today mmos are more arcade than ever, so that people who have limited time can also enjoy playing them.

  User Deleted
4/08/13 4:47:19 PM#204
Originally posted by m0lly
Originally posted by Dihoru
Originally posted by Nanfoodle
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Iselin
 

Ah good. We've gotten past the "ESO is making it impossible for me to play with my friends" exaggeration and are back to "What I always expected ESO would be like." That would be an honest opinion. That is just so close to "What ESO is." You're almost there. Once you get there then only one thing remains: you either like it and stay here to discuss all the news and details or you don't.

Actually there are other options, it's true. You could not like it but stay anyway and troll or stay and whine. Those are also possibilities.

Well, it is making it impossible for me to play because as I am primarily a social oriented player and I enjoy playing with the same friends I have played in various MMOs now, so if they don't play I have not much desire to get invested in the game myself. Also I do share their disappointment about these design choices, so yes, in the end we either like what will be released and play it or we won't.

Oh, and I plan to stay and discuss this game and voice my concerns until it releases. If that is trolling or whining to you, so be it, but so far I think I haven't done that. I also gave examples of how I thought both camps could enjoy the game, but as you may have noticed, most people here have an "all or nothing" or "either OR" attitude, whereas I am more for a "Why not have both" approach.

So if you have friends spread over 3 factions you would rather not play then pick who you wanted to play with? Heck in WoW i have friends and family spread over 5 or 6 servers. But if you dont pick a faction you wont be playing with any of your friends.

Hence why these days most MMOs aren't really MMOs, they're SP's with a big fucking world, always on DRM and drop in CO-OP.  In EVE-Online, one of the few games I'd still lable as a true MMO, you do not have to choose, christ you can be 10 years older in the game than your friend and still bring him along in PVP and PVE and have him not be target practice.

world is busy and stressful today, most people work whole day from waking up with minute schedule. now these people also love gaming and online gaming. but tell me if we go back to old day mmos where you need to stand anda wait and talk hours to form a party and group not even talking about raid to even get started. how can one pay and do all the other stuff that requires these minute shedules in life? now you say dont work if you like gaming but heck. if you dont want to be lifetime befefiter and have none to look after than yourself then you got allthetime in the world for wait ingame aslong as you like.

 

thats why today mmos are more arcade than ever, so that people who have limited time can also enjoy playing them.

I understand where you're coming from but... in EVE-Online at least that's very,very easily fixed: we schedual things so that the greatest amount of people can get in on roams, sleeper ops, etc,etc, so while no one in my corp, and I do mean no one, has a free schedual (my best friend within the corp works 4 am ti'll 16 pm for example and spends a few hours every night on, another guy who's got a massive family comes on every couple of days to catch up and jump in on activities, one of the corp founders has a job and very active social life, he usually shows up 2-3 hours before I head off for the day and he's only one hour behind me in timezones) we're never really stuck doing stuff we dislike on a constant basis (sure there are bad days but they're rarer than you'd think) . So your excuse that life is stressful and busy would work if you did not want to play the game but if you did it wouldn't matter if it is Dark Souls Online or Hello Kitty Online you would find the way and the time needed to play it.

  Tierless

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2117

joie de vivre

4/08/13 4:56:31 PM#205

I would have preferred if they let it all be open, but once you decided to get into PVP you pick a side. Seems simple enough doesn't it? It would also be more true to TES that way. Choices.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Shadanwolf

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/13/10
Posts: 1900

4/08/13 5:07:00 PM#206
(umm how can I criticize Elder Scrolls Online with out appearing to criticize it ? ) I got it.....I'll ask a question in a way that criticizies the game developers decision on race/faction with out openly criticizing it....."why do they have race limited factions" ?
  Anakami

Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/12
Posts: 101

4/09/13 4:45:22 AM#207

I just watched/listened to their Alliances at War video on the official website andnoticed a few interesting things.

It seems that the Alliances already existed before and already had plans to go for the throne prior to the threat of Molag bal supporting the Imperials. And he does support the Imperials, because the current ruler felt threatened by the Alliances gathering around Cyrodill and asked him for help.

Secondly, the motivation and agenda of the three aliances is mostly based around their leader's point of view. While the explanation of why they want the throne for themselves is kind of understandable, there was no reason given why it had to be a race exclusive campaign.

Why would the respective leaders deny other races to take up their banner and support their agenda? Especially if some of the pairings they chose are -and they said it themselves- unlikely to happen. I mean, naturally the Redguard who are highly suspicious of magic would flock to the Bretons, the most magically gifted people among the humans. Right?

They should make factions a choice. I want to decide which agenda I support and which races I consider my allies.

  sapphen

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/07
Posts: 920

 
OP  4/09/13 1:22:50 PM#208
Originally posted by Anakami

I just watched/listened to their Alliances at War video on the official website andnoticed a few interesting things.

It seems that the Alliances already existed before and already had plans to go for the throne prior to the threat of Molag bal supporting the Imperials. And he does support the Imperials, because the current ruler felt threatened by the Alliances gathering around Cyrodill and asked him for help.

Secondly, the motivation and agenda of the three aliances is mostly based around their leader's point of view. While the explanation of why they want the throne for themselves is kind of understandable, there was no reason given why it had to be a race exclusive campaign.

Why would the respective leaders deny other races to take up their banner and support their agenda? Especially if some of the pairings they chose are -and they said it themselves- unlikely to happen. I mean, naturally the Redguard who are highly suspicious of magic would flock to the Bretons, the most magically gifted people among the humans. Right?

They should make factions a choice. I want to decide which agenda I support and which races I consider my allies.

I agree with you, imho races locked into factions serves no purpose in an Elder Scrolls game.   Most characters are going to look similar,  all races have humanoid forms and will be wearing armor.  Players may or may not have pride for their faction but locking races to a faction does not create that pride for all players.  If this game was like DAoC and had 3 distinct cultures separate from each other then race locked factions would be fine, but this is an Elder Scrolls game and each culture has complex relationships that are not just black and white.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3709

4/09/13 1:36:54 PM#209
Originally posted by Shadanwolf
(umm how can I criticize Elder Scrolls Online with out appearing to criticize it ? ) I got it.....I'll ask a question in a way that criticizies the game developers decision on race/faction with out openly criticizing it....."why do they have race limited factions" ?

My guess, is first off to give each faction a face. Something to look at and say I hate them. Red is dead is the common theme in faction wars. I also think, this of corse is just IMO, that the devs will be adding more races to each faction but with micro transactions or by earning them in game. So its rare and something to show off. Its common in MMOs now. Neverwinter and the darkelf is from the founders park to start. SWToR you can earn other races so you could see a Pure blood Sith Jide in the game. I am sure we will have to wait to get more info. 

As for how many races they have in each faction now? Most MMOs launch with 6-10 races and thats a lot of work for the art dept. ESO is starting with 9 and not a bad start. I have yet to see a MMO not expand on the amount they have so I am not sure why this is such a big deal.

  sketocafe

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/19/11
Posts: 679

4/09/13 9:00:22 PM#210

Doesn't make any sense to me. It's a game where RvRvR is the big draw, and I'm not even going to be able to pick which R I'll be in. 

I'm going to be a Wood Elf. Why? Because that's what I do in TES games, I play Bosmers. This means that my faction choice is already decided.

I actually don't even know which faction it is, but that doesn't really matter to me because my objection isn't lore based in that I wouldn't think that Bosmers shouldn't actually team up with Y or Z. It is, again, that this decision was made for me. This actually limits realm pride I may have.

Give me three options and I'll find a reason to pick one. It doesn't even need to be a good reason. I went with the Merovingian in MxO because he had cake and because merv had cake, screw the machines and the morpheus fanboys too. I don't think it would have led to the same faction loyalty if I didn't choose merv, but instead wound up with him because I chose to wear a red jacket.

So I'd much prefer to select my race and then my faction, whether at character creation or some later point. I think I'd even be smart enough to tell friend from foe in such a situation, if I were a member of a species which was able to differentiate at least three colors, and the genre of the game I was playing had a history of floating names above heads.

 

  Fearum

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/15/11
Posts: 1092

4/09/13 9:04:31 PM#211
Could always cry more, they already have shown they will change the game to keep people happy. Just keep going on every forum and they will cave.
  Anakami

Novice Member

Joined: 2/28/12
Posts: 101

4/10/13 3:16:55 AM#212
Originally posted by Fearum
Could always cry more, they already have shown they will change the game to keep people happy. Just keep going on every forum and they will cave.

Actually it's called constructive feedback, as most people who voice their disappointment with the game also give detailed reasons why that is and how they think a solution could look like that may give more people a game they can enjoy.

TBH the only crying I see here is people who attack other's for their opinion and who apparently can't stand someone having a different view on things without calling that person a hater, his opinion wrong, and some more colorful attributes. Goes for both camps of course :)

  someforumguy

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/07
Posts: 3517

4/20/13 8:09:36 AM#213

I think that it is a silly restriction. It is as if the devs read How to create a MMO for dummies. Chapter : How to gate content for players.

Very unlike the TES games. Which are all about freedom of choice.

  Nanfoodle

Elite Member

Joined: 5/23/06
Posts: 3709

4/20/13 2:03:24 PM#214
Originally posted by Anakami
Originally posted by Fearum
Could always cry more, they already have shown they will change the game to keep people happy. Just keep going on every forum and they will cave.

Actually it's called constructive feedback, as most people who voice their disappointment with the game also give detailed reasons why that is and how they think a solution could look like that may give more people a game they can enjoy.

TBH the only crying I see here is people who attack other's for their opinion and who apparently can't stand someone having a different view on things without calling that person a hater, his opinion wrong, and some more colorful attributes. Goes for both camps of course :)

Made my reply its own thread...

 

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/821/view/forums/newTopic/1326/postAction/newTopic

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

4/20/13 2:53:57 PM#215
Originally posted by sapphen

Is it me or isn't that a little archaic?  I can't wrap my brain around it - I don't understand why they wanted to limit players like this.  I know it's too late to change it now but it looks like they would've designed the storyline so we could pick one of the 3 major factions after the inital 'starting' zone.

This unneeded restriction diverts away from one of the iconic freedoms of TES... are you happy with this decision or is it just me?

because wow does

  Delavega86

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/06
Posts: 114

5/22/13 1:02:36 PM#216

at first i was very surprised that a TES game has race restrictions.

but i really dont mind, as long as they dont result in imbalanced populations, which would hurt RvR.

i would much rather they had 3 different factions that any race could join though.

i mean, why cant an orc and an argonian explore a dungeon together? they wont even see each other lol.

  Soara

Novice Member

Joined: 5/12/07
Posts: 84

You are special

5/23/13 11:02:05 PM#217
Doesn't really bother me at all
  Distaste

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 668

5/29/13 2:46:47 PM#218
Originally posted by Delavega86

at first i was very surprised that a TES game has race restrictions.

but i really dont mind, as long as they dont result in imbalanced populations, which would hurt RvR.

i would much rather they had 3 different factions that any race could join though.

i mean, why cant an orc and an argonian explore a dungeon together? they wont even see each other lol.

There is a 100% chance that factions will be imbalanced and it will ruin RvR. I think the devs believe that by having 3 factions it will solve the population imbalance issues and that's simply not true. Having a 3rd faction helps but  doesn't solve the issues. In fact it can end up making things worse if the system is setup incorrectly. Take GW2 for example, the #1 server beats on the #2 server to widen the points gap and the # 3 server attacks the #2 server because they are an easier target. It needs to be setup that the #2 and #3 server/faction lose equally so they have motivation to stop the #1.  The other major problem is what they plan to do with night capping/non-prime time. People from different countries tend to group up with players from their region. This ends up leaving 1 server/faction grossly imbalanced at certain parts of the day. if one faction can steamroll with zero resistance during the day the RvR will not last long.

Faction locking races/classes is a rookie mistake when you're trying to add RvR. It just adds one more thing to try and balance and no MMO has EVER balanced it. At least GW2 had the right idea with each side having the same races/classes, just messed up on the gameplay mechanics. ESO is going to end up with faction imbalances that ruin RvR, I also imagine that a lot of players will also be resentful towards the game when they want to play an Argonian but their guild picks DF. The game is basically setting up hurdles in front of itself, I hope they have plans to clear those hurdles.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

5/29/13 3:03:03 PM#219
I'm not that arsed about "balance", balance in a mmo is a mythical pink elephant anyway.

Name a mmo that is balanced.
  Abimor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/09/05
Posts: 288

5/29/13 3:05:59 PM#220
I am not thrilled with this system it is going to be hard to get all your friends to decide on one faction and be satisfied with it, heck I have always played an imperial starting as far back as Morrowind so I don't know what race I would even play.
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