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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » Armor and Equipment design style (Horned helmets, spikey pauldrons, etc).

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29 posts found
  Speely

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/13
Posts: 864

4/04/13 7:41:37 PM#21

Loving then concept art. I hope that whatever the aesthetic of the actual models, that some of this dark menace makes it's way into the game. Absolutely loving the TDD concepts so far and I can't wait to see more.

The whole idea of a bit more of a "dark fae"/Unseelie look to the TDD is reassuring. I hope the Vikings and Arthurians are equally stylized (in their own ways, of course.) In light of this engine being ostensibly geared toward performance rather than flash, art direction is going to go a long way, and creativity in this vein will be paramount.

Can't wait for the 3d model!!

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt

  Stiler

Novice Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

 
OP  4/04/13 7:42:39 PM#22
Originally posted by MarkJacobs

Originally posted by kappenwiz

One thing to remember about concept art is it's, well, conceptual and emotive. Usually, very little, if any makes it to the final product. They're trying to get a feel for races, classes, etc and discover directions for characters and stuff. So, it usually starts out pretty far out, like concept cars, to spark ideas and free up imagination,  but ends up toned down.

Also, in that top pic, the horns look like they're on the character, not necessarily the helm...lol, not trying to scare you any more.

The overall direction seems to be pointing to the dragons holding sway. The cloaks and helms seem to evoke the wings and talons a lot, so maybe after the veil is pierced, the dragons are the ultimate gods for each realm. Who knows.

 

On the character.... :)

Ah, my bad then, I thought the horns were part of helms/circlets or such from the art, my mistake on that part (I do not have hte best eyesight anymore lol).

I can tell the concept artist are drawing from nature for them, lot of horns/crests look like Deer/Elk antlers and such and can help make that realm more unique with it's races.

 

 

 

It's a perfectly fine opinion, no attack detected by me. 

It is of course concept art and we have tons of it, the vast majority of it won't ever see the light of day other than in updates like these. I gave our artists a few basic concepts and then I let them have fun with them for quite a while before I'll even look at them again. Sometimes they go off in directions that work out well, sometimes they don't but I always want them to try different style/ideas/etc. before I have any additional input. 

FYI, I hate spikey, WoW-like armor too but as per above, I think that artists need room to express themselves creatively and come up with lots of different ideas early on without me or anyone else saying "This must be the path we follow!" at this stage of a game's development.

Edit: There will be no Viking helmets of the type you mentioned in an earlier post. 

Mark

P.S. Sorry I have been here in a bit, it's been quite a few interesting days.

Yea, I wasn't attacking it or anything, just offering my opinion and hope that we'll have lots of good options to make our own personal character look similar in style to how we would like through cusotmization/crafter armours and such. Everyone has different options on what they'd like and I resepct that and agree that for concet art it's always good to let people run with idea's (you never know whent hey might think of something just completely different then what you might "imagine" you want and it turns out to be something great you simply didn't think of and changes things).

 

  Rusque

Elite Member

Joined: 6/08/10
Posts: 1876

4/04/13 7:45:43 PM#23

Vikings were generally nomadic farmers and no more warlike than any other group of people's at that time. They were labeled as savages and barbarians because they were fairly illiterate, followed pagain beliefs, and due to their smaller nomadic lifestyle didn't have as much of a standing military type system.

It is correct that they didn't have horns and whatnot, but honestly reality is quite boring in comparison to the fantasy genre we all know and love.

While I enjoy a variety of armor deigns in games, a personal peeve of mine is when people pick and choose where they want their realism. You want realism, maybe you should play a game in which your character develops gangrene after wallowing through feces filled pond water while hunting for fish and has to have a leg lopped off leaving you unfit for battle, and then later dies due to infection.

Or maybe enjoy some imaginative armor design and stab some dragons in the face while shooting fireballs.

 

"Ahh this armor isn't realistic! I don't want spikes, and also, I shouldn't be able to run all day in full plate!"

  taurak

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/01/04
Posts: 174

4/04/13 7:46:32 PM#24

Ok ok,

But which would you fear more on a battlefield?

A knight in shiny armor that looks brand new and polished,

OR

A warrior with spikes and or skulls on the tops of his shoulder pads, polished with some fresh blood?

 

I would choose option 2! It just looks cooler and more appealing to me I guess. But then again I always pick the "darkest" race.

♥ Midgard!

  Stiler

Novice Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

 
OP  4/04/13 7:53:10 PM#25
Originally posted by tinuelle
Originally posted by jmcdermottuk

I hate spikey armour, it's idiotic. I really hope it has a more realistic look. Armour is designed to guide strikes away from vulnerable points and protect the wearer. It's meant to deflect a strike, not help it hit with full force.

All spikes do is trap a weapon and guide it into the armour, possibly at some very vulnerable areas. Exactly the opposite of what it's meant to be doing.

And all those horned Viking helmets.. myth. They weren't that different in design to the Saxon ones. Also in the time frame we're looking at there was no plate armour. That didn't arrive until the late middle ages, 13th century.

I know it's a game and it's all a bit of fun but please, at least try and be semi realistic.

Unless the spiked armor is the weapon.

"You below out your challenges as you charge towards your cravenly foe.

You crash into your foe with a magnificent crunch of bones and armor."

 

Now that is what a spiked armor is all about. Its not fancy, its just nasty and scary, and should be avoided if heading your way.

Historically spiked armour was never really a thing people wore into battle.

Mainly because spikes are more of a hinderance then help.

It allows blows on your armour to be direction toward your armour, rather then deflected away. As well the spikes also give people hand holds to grab you and pull /push you around.

You do not want to do this in real combat, a lot of historical middle ages combat is based around grappling (which many movies and things seem to ignore), a good trip/knockdown and it can be lights out for you.

That's why historically speaking many armours over the years were made to defelct blows and be smooth, not allowing for things to "catch" on it or people to grasp at things on your armour.

 

Now I am speaking of western style armour mainly.  In Eastern cutlure with Japan for example they could wear crests on their helms and things.

 

Originally posted by Rusque

Vikings were generally nomadic farmers and no more warlike than any other group of people's at that time. They were labeled as savages and barbarians because they were fairly illiterate, followed pagain beliefs, and due to their smaller nomadic lifestyle didn't have as much of a standing military type system.

It is correct that they didn't have horns and whatnot, but honestly reality is quite boring in comparison to the fantasy genre we all know and love.

While I enjoy a variety of armor deigns in games, a personal peeve of mine is when people pick and choose where they want their realism. You want realism, maybe you should play a game in which your character develops gangrene after wallowing through feces filled pond water while hunting for fish and has to have a leg lopped off leaving you unfit for battle, and then later dies due to infection.

Or maybe enjoy some imaginative armor design and stab some dragons in the face while shooting fireballs.

 

"Ahh this armor isn't realistic! I don't want spikes, and also, I shouldn't be able to run all day in full plate!"

I was in no way saying, "I don't think this, it must be changed!" or saying it wasn't realistic so it shouldn't be in. Was merely posting my personal preference for preferring more non-spikey/realisitc armour designs to be available  to allow players to make their own choice.
 

With the game relying on player crafters to get equipment a good customization system for armour can help allow people to develop their own look/style of armour. Being able to mix/match armour pieces and depending on how far it goes other things as well. This can allow for both more "fantasy/mythological" style armour and a more realistic armour design.

A lot of real armour for example was quite beautiful, and many could be painted/decorated on top of the base design. Then you throw in things such as inlays, rivetting, embossing, armor coloring (Armour could come from the smith blue, black, steel/polished, etc).

Movies and things have made armour look quite barren compared to what it "could" look like, there are some few rare surving examples of armour that had paintings on them as well as places where soldiers could put decorations on them.

Here is an example, A "Black" sallet from around 1490 that was painted:

http://www.myarmoury.com/talk/viewtopic.php?t=2700

 

 

  Kryptonite_Hilo

Novice Member

Joined: 2/15/13
Posts: 48

4/04/13 7:54:45 PM#26
I hate WoW style spikey armor as much as anyone, but I love the concept art so far. It's nicely done. A functioning style of spiked armor rather than some ridiculous Legion of Doom type spiked armor. As long as the armor doesn't look like you took the turtle shells from Mario, shove 10 inch spike through them and attach them "floatingly" to a shoulder then I'll be happy. I think I described WoW's shoulder pads exactly.
  Tierless

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2118

joie de vivre

4/04/13 8:02:23 PM#27

Love the color palette I've seen in all the art so far.

I like my armor realistic, gritty, and lethal. I think of armor like a motorcycle. If it doesn't make it go faster or run better, rip it off and forget it.

For strolling about the city I LOVE ornate over the top stuff. That above is a bit too ornate for me but they are the elveish folk, so they tend to be the most over the top of most races (in most games no idea for sure here). Point is, if the other races use similar stuff but toned down I think it's headed in a good direction.

If anyone has read Berserk, Gut's armor is a good example of what I like.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  aRtFuLThinG

Novice Member

Joined: 4/30/09
Posts: 1116

4/04/13 8:49:46 PM#28
Originally posted by Rusque

Vikings were generally nomadic farmers and no more warlike than any other group of people's at that time. They were labeled as savages and barbarians because they were fairly illiterate, followed pagain beliefs, and due to their smaller nomadic lifestyle didn't have as much of a standing military type system.

 Mostly true except Vikings were NOT nomadic, in any way.

Viking lands and holdings were hereditary and static, and they don't rely on herding as a way of life (they are mostly hunters and farmers).

They raid in summer months to stock up supplies for the rest of the year. The usually returns to their homeland and holdings - that is, unless they migrate to other areas or they hire themselves out as mercenaries. Some even went as far as Byzantine Empire to hire themselves out as bodyguards of the nobility.

Nomadic would be more like Mongols where they don't farm and totally relies on cattle to survive.

  aRtFuLThinG

Novice Member

Joined: 4/30/09
Posts: 1116

4/04/13 8:54:55 PM#29
Originally posted by Stiler

Now I am speaking of western style armour mainly.  In Eastern cutlure with Japan for example they could wear crests on their helms and things.

 Only cavalry armors do. Infantry armors are in fact pretty similar to the West (with the exception that Chinese and Japanese tends to prefer banded or scale mail, probably because the weapons types that the soldier will be facing are different from the West).

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