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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » The success of EQ advancement.

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142 posts found
  osiriszoran

Novice Member

Joined: 11/29/11
Posts: 87

3/31/13 11:55:28 PM#61
Is there an MMO out there where i can collect gear to get more gear so that i can get more gear in future patches that have slightly better stats and looks like a viking helmet?
  ragz45

Novice Member

Joined: 5/01/08
Posts: 482

4/01/13 12:41:37 AM#62
Originally posted by PhoenixC13
I can name more people I played EQ with 10 years ago then WoW a year ago......

LoL same boat.  I have people i've gone and visited in RL that I meet in EQ.  I can't even remember the names of anyone I've played other games with and since quit.

  Wickedjelly

Novice Member

Joined: 4/19/09
Posts: 5064

The Dude abides

4/01/13 12:43:07 AM#63

It was fun at the time but I have no desire to play that style of game again.

Really the only thing I miss from those days is the overall sense f community that existed (for the most part) in older mmos like EQ.

Can think of a hell of a lot more I don't miss...at all...

1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  Waterlily

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/08
Posts: 2885

4/01/13 12:54:37 AM#64

Really the only thing I miss from those days is the overall sense f community that existed

that's the only reason to play mmo

outside of community there is no reason to play mmo, you might as well play a multiplayer game then or solo game

  jonesing22

Novice Member

Joined: 9/01/10
Posts: 683

4/01/13 12:59:22 AM#65
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

Except it isn't midless at all, unless you would play it like a wow dungeon where no one speaks except to say hi and bye.

If you played mindlessly as some classes, your group died. Ex. Any healer, Enchanter, Wizard, Bard

Also, Mindless questing and returning with my 10 wolf furs? -No thank you. 

In EQ, you were never by yourself unless you were kiting and that could possibly take forever if you didn't know what you were doing. There was a community in-game other than just the loudmouths asking, "umad?"

I would take finding a good spot to pull enemies to and kill them with a bit of challenge over being able to solo my way to max level through fedex quests.

Now spawncamping, In EQ that was generally done in what today's mmogamers would call dungeons. Otherwise, out in the world of Norrath, enemies roamed. There wasn't a pack of wolves in the same place all the time waiting for some one to kill it. To me that is mindless AI.

 

  Mtibbs1989

Elite Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 2574

4/01/13 1:00:52 AM#66
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

 Becuase we all know that mindless grinding and spawncamping bosses didn't make MMO's what they were popular for.

 No one EVER fought over the spawn of a boss.

 It's always give me my own private spawn for my own private dungeon so I can kill and have all the loot to myself with never having to worry about loot stealing.

(All sarcasm aside) Jeez, what's with people these days?

 I know what's wrong. The true MMO gamer is 1/100,000 now and the mindless drone consumer has taken over the MMO market. This is how we end up with crap games that barely last 3-5 months before they're forced to go F2P.

 Give our worlds back you mindless drones!

 I'm all for games where I have to fight with the other guy even if it requires me bumping heads ingame until I finally win (or walk off with my tail between my legs in defeat). It promotes longevity and healthy competition. Which is good for the game. I     don't want themepark MMO's and the locust consume them faster than the standard developer can spit them out. There's no long term profit in them. So get your minds on the right path and make it for the true MMO gamer. If the carebears bellyache that the game's too hard. Tell them to toughen up or GTFO. That's what makes a game last for 10-13 years. Not this catering to their every will.

Giving handouts to every carebear child and their mother/father just promotes a game with a shortlife span. Games like this don't work and the only exception to this fact is WoW. Because WoW itself wasn't a carebear/hand holding game from the start. It took a good long time for people to earn their loot. There was blood shed on the open PvP worlds and there were open world bosses to be fought over. That's what established WoW as a great game in the beginning.

 Now we've got private dungeons and raid where we can simply beat our pinata's in peace with no threat of danger lurking over our shoulders to steal the kill from us and it sickens me to no end.

 

 


Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.

  Wickedjelly

Novice Member

Joined: 4/19/09
Posts: 5064

The Dude abides

4/01/13 1:45:22 AM#67
Originally posted by Waterlily

Really the only thing I miss from those days is the overall sense f community that existed

that's the only reason to play mmo

outside of community there is no reason to play mmo, you might as well play a multiplayer game then or solo game

No it isn't. There are other compelling elements least to some mmos that make them worthwhile.

...and there are still some that have a great community. Just not to the length and extent you used to find in older games like EQ.

1. For god's sake mmo gamers, enough with the analogies. They're unnecessary and your comparisons are terrible, dissimilar, and illogical.

2. To posters feeling the need to state how f2p really isn't f2p: Players understand the concept. You aren't privy to some secret the rest are missing. You're embarrassing yourself.

3. Yes, Cpt. Obvious, we're not industry experts. Now run along and let the big people use the forums for their purpose.

  Quirhid

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5512

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

4/01/13 6:06:42 AM#68
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

 Becuase we all know that mindless grinding and spawncamping bosses didn't make MMO's what they were popular for.

 No one EVER fought over the spawn of a boss.

 It's always give me my own private spawn for my own private dungeon so I can kill and have all the loot to myself with never having to worry about loot stealing.

(All sarcasm aside) Jeez, what's with people these days?

 I know what's wrong. The true MMO gamer is 1/100,000 now and the mindless drone consumer has taken over the MMO market. This is how we end up with crap games that barely last 3-5 months before they're forced to go F2P.

 Give our worlds back you mindless drones!

 I'm all for games where I have to fight with the other guy even if it requires me bumping heads ingame until I finally win (or walk off with my tail between my legs in defeat). It promotes longevity and healthy competition. Which is good for the game. I     don't want themepark MMO's and the locust consume them faster than the standard developer can spit them out. There's no long term profit in them. So get your minds on the right path and make it for the true MMO gamer. If the carebears bellyache that the game's too hard. Tell them to toughen up or GTFO. That's what makes a game last for 10-13 years. Not this catering to their every will.

Giving handouts to every carebear child and their mother/father just promotes a game with a shortlife span. Games like this don't work and the only exception to this fact is WoW. Because WoW itself wasn't a carebear/hand holding game from the start. It took a good long time for people to earn their loot. There was blood shed on the open PvP worlds and there were open world bosses to be fought over. That's what established WoW as a great game in the beginning.

 Now we've got private dungeons and raid where we can simply beat our pinata's in peace with no threat of danger lurking over our shoulders to steal the kill from us and it sickens me to no end.

Nice strawman you've built there.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Quirhid

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5512

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

4/01/13 6:11:35 AM#69
Originally posted by jonesing22
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

Except it isn't midless at all, unless you would play it like a wow dungeon where no one speaks except to say hi and bye.

If you played mindlessly as some classes, your group died. Ex. Any healer, Enchanter, Wizard, Bard

Also, Mindless questing and returning with my 10 wolf furs? -No thank you. 

In EQ, you were never by yourself unless you were kiting and that could possibly take forever if you didn't know what you were doing. There was a community in-game other than just the loudmouths asking, "umad?"

I would take finding a good spot to pull enemies to and kill them with a bit of challenge over being able to solo my way to max level through fedex quests.

Now spawncamping, In EQ that was generally done in what today's mmogamers would call dungeons. Otherwise, out in the world of Norrath, enemies roamed. There wasn't a pack of wolves in the same place all the time waiting for some one to kill it. To me that is mindless AI.

Trinity combat already implies mindless AI. I'd rather shave my face with a rusty nail than go back to hard trinity and grind. The amount of it. And the downtimes, the waiting for groups... That shit was horrible.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Aelious

Elite Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2393

World > Quest Progression

4/01/13 9:50:49 AM#70
I'm not sure what a trinity system has to do with AI intelligence. Even in GW2 the mobs use the same aggro system. I like a more open class system but there is something to be said about roles when you add harder content. The higher difficulty made a competent player more valuable and remembered.

I really don't blame anyone that wouldn't want to go back to the EQ style of play. It does have a certain charm though and it's rewarding aspect goes far beyond quest rewards. I hope some newer game brings that feeling back even though EQ is still going strong.
  Oberholzer

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/25/06
Posts: 495

4/01/13 10:23:30 AM#71
I'd like a mixture. Quests if you want, mobs to grind if you don't but aren't there mobs to be killed even in quest based games? I do wish quests seemed more epic though. Longer, more involved with real challenges. I played EQ1 so I'm certainly familiar with camping and grinding mobs and after the novelty wore off it did get boring. Dungeons and caves were more fun and being in the open world did add to the danger. Some of my favorite grinds were actually mobile ones, not staying at a camp but keeping the group moving across Norrath, trying to kill whatever you happened upon. Don't really miss camping placeholders though, killing a mob over and over hoping for the rare one to pop was tedious. 
  psiic

Hard Core Member

Joined: 6/03/09
Posts: 584

4/01/13 10:24:03 AM#72

Honestly what set EQ apart was a total sense of a real community. 

 

People needed to group to advance, so to those ends you would meet and interact POSITIVELY with the other players around you. 

 

This in turn allowed you to get to know a larger segment of the server populations. Thereby giving you a larger sense of a real " virtual " community. 

 

As a result servers felt alive. We as a community depended on each other, as a result we got to know each other.

 

Some of the best friends of my life I met playing everquest, and it grew from there.

 

Many of my EQ friends I still talk to at least 3 times a week.  We trade birthday and xmas cards/presents, and have now and then even traded our kids. 

We live close to Disney, so one summer we had everyone across the country send us their kids for a month.

Was really fun but kinda crazy, we had 14 kids here mostly from the north and midwest who had never seen the ocean ( we live on the beach ) or been to Disney.

Lemme tell ya that is not the kind of need or trust you form with people playing modern

Massive Solo Online Role Play Games. 

 

 

 

 

  Psycospank

Novice Member

Joined: 7/10/03
Posts: 36

Creativity is the reason for Humanity

4/01/13 10:39:58 AM#73
Originally posted by Waterlily
Originally posted by Quirhid

No. Grinding has never been fun

It was fun for people who played EQ.

If grinding has never been fun then why could people tolerate taking a year to get to max level, doing hell levels at lvl 54 that lasted weeks just to get one level.

That's only possilbe if they are enjoying themselves. Imagine if in Guild Wars 2,  it took a year to get to max level, loooooooooool, people would have QQ'd the forums with buckets of tears about the grind. However, in Everquest, no one cared.

In GW2 the first max level was seen before the game was even launched, in Everquest the first max level took 9 months. I mean players of Everquest were way more hardcore, but not that hardcore that you can explain the difference without attributing some to the game mechanics which made grinding enjoyable with the right people.

I agree, grinding in escence was the whole point. The investment that you needed even to get to lvl 10 was huge. Nothing was really given to you back then. Sure I dont want to go back to that grind, for a number of reason (mainly time constraints). 

For me most games these days are so easy and casual in nature that there isnt really the investment in your characters. Its there behind the scenes like the traits in LOTRO and legacy in SWTOR (sort of) but its more an optional investment. If you want to play a few hours a week no problem (which works for me)

In EQ I remember leaving my character swimming over night to get the swimming skill up, and creating macros where my character was casting continuously.  and dont get me started on selling stuff before the bizarre. It was a true investment. I miss that aspect of EQ more than anything else, even though I dont want to do it again anytime soon :).

  Tyvolus4

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/25/12
Posts: 163

4/01/13 10:42:39 AM#74
Originally posted by Lord.Bachus
Originally posted by Lonzo

Why all these Quest games? With leveling by questing you are limited to just ONE way of leveling. Back in the days with EQ there where leveling groups everywhere in every dungeon and in every zone. It was just good old dungeon crawling. And the few quests seem very important and meaningful....

 

I miss those days...

Games evolve, most people need directions thats how life works these days. 

 

The best part of EQ and EQ2 in current days is still their AA system.

I think you are confusing evolve with regress.  think about it for a second or two.

  qombi

Novice Member

Joined: 7/09/04
Posts: 1187

4/01/13 10:48:27 AM#75
The possibility remains of just an exciting cool terrific game, you just have to search like it's 1999!
  Mtibbs1989

Elite Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 2574

4/01/13 11:13:54 AM#76
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

 Becuase we all know that mindless grinding and spawncamping bosses didn't make MMO's what they were popular for.

 No one EVER fought over the spawn of a boss.

 It's always give me my own private spawn for my own private dungeon so I can kill and have all the loot to myself with never having to worry about loot stealing.

(All sarcasm aside) Jeez, what's with people these days?

 I know what's wrong. The true MMO gamer is 1/100,000 now and the mindless drone consumer has taken over the MMO market. This is how we end up with crap games that barely last 3-5 months before they're forced to go F2P.

 Give our worlds back you mindless drones!

 I'm all for games where I have to fight with the other guy even if it requires me bumping heads ingame until I finally win (or walk off with my tail between my legs in defeat). It promotes longevity and healthy competition. Which is good for the game. I     don't want themepark MMO's and the locust consume them faster than the standard developer can spit them out. There's no long term profit in them. So get your minds on the right path and make it for the true MMO gamer. If the carebears bellyache that the game's too hard. Tell them to toughen up or GTFO. That's what makes a game last for 10-13 years. Not this catering to their every will.

Giving handouts to every carebear child and their mother/father just promotes a game with a shortlife span. Games like this don't work and the only exception to this fact is WoW. Because WoW itself wasn't a carebear/hand holding game from the start. It took a good long time for people to earn their loot. There was blood shed on the open PvP worlds and there were open world bosses to be fought over. That's what established WoW as a great game in the beginning.

 Now we've got private dungeons and raid where we can simply beat our pinata's in peace with no threat of danger lurking over our shoulders to steal the kill from us and it sickens me to no end.

Nice strawman you've built there.

 I'm still right, carebears and the mindless drone consumers have destroyed the mmo market.


Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.

  BadSpock

Elite Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7699

Logic be damned!

4/01/13 11:22:59 AM#77
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

Nice strawman you've built there.

 I'm still right, carebears and the mindless drone consumers have destroyed the mmo market.

No, the mmo market is larger and more profitable than ever and more gamers are enjoying the MMORPG genre than ever before.

Your particular niche in the greater MMO market may not be popular or as successful, but it still exists (which you should be thankful for).

This is all just yet another "waaa I hate that other people have nice things that they like and I don't!" post.

#34287634781 I've seen on this website.

Now Playing:
Looking Towards: Destiny

  Phelcher

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/01/09
Posts: 1133

4/01/13 11:34:32 AM#78
Originally posted by Oberholzer
I'd like a mixture. Quests if you want, mobs to grind if you don't but aren't there mobs to be killed even in quest based games? I do wish quests seemed more epic though. Longer, more involved with real challenges. I played EQ1 so I'm certainly familiar with camping and grinding mobs and after the novelty wore off it did get boring. Dungeons and caves were more fun and being in the open world did add to the danger. Some of my favorite grinds were actually mobile ones, not staying at a camp but keeping the group moving across Norrath, trying to kill whatever you happened upon. Don't really miss camping placeholders though, killing a mob over and over hoping for the rare one to pop was tedious. 

 

In Everquest...  you could have 10 buddies online and ALL being doing something diffrent. Most of the time, my friends were so busy (solo) tracking down a quest items, crafting component, crafting, looking for a crafter, or looking for a particular vendor that sells a rare spell, etc..

...Than being able to form up a group with me, as I logged in^^.

So I was left with nearly unlimited choices...  do i go quad-kite raptors..  Help a friend get part of his key qest for Sibilis, go find my newewr spells.. go sell the rares I have in my bag... go to town and arrange my bank..

Or, go off into a dungeon and find a pick-up-group myself...

 

 

So.. 

Who was telling you to grind in EQ..?

Who kept you from only doing short easy quests & not the long hard ones that took months to solve..?

Who forced you to camp a placeholder..?

 

 

People that use the word "grind"...  are just sheeple who followed someone else and did what they were all doing. They call it a grind, bcuz they are looking back on their choices they took, (to stay competetively lvl's to their friends... so they were always min/maxing exp...) it was these so-called Grinder's choice...  to play this/that way... always under the gun to get max level. Always in a hurry for not whats in front of them, but end game. Always "grinding away" at max level..

I played for weeks not gaining exp, but building assets and future for my character. When I found an very effecient method of gaining exp (ie meaning most exp in least amount of time) I would exploit those areas & groups as long as I could... sometimes 8h~12h strait, because the EXP was so good. I've even called off of work!

 

Many like to call that "a grind" because to them, it is just something they are doing until they reach max level. While other don't see it as a grind, because they are eraning experience through combat for their character & themselves. Forging new friendships. Some of my best OL friends came as we helped each other out of impossible situations, etc. Chemistry has alot to do with EQ guilds.

Again, as your character earns experience in the game world, you..yourself learn to play that character. Those who try to avoid the "EQ grinds" and bought $3k Wizards... soon lost friend on their servers, because they didn't know how to play them..!! If you find yourself grinding in a game and physically cannot do anythng other in the game, put it down. But if you are grinding because you've placed an artificial limit to what you can do in a game..  then try having phun not earning exp.

 

The social interaction to overcome some of the creatures in Everquest... even a lone Griffon disturbing all the harvesters in the plains. They eventually had to group up and kill the roaming Griffon, then go back to their merry way.

 

 

"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."


-Nariusseldon

  Phelcher

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/01/09
Posts: 1133

4/01/13 12:05:42 PM#79
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

Nice strawman you've built there.

 I'm still right, carebears and the mindless drone consumers have destroyed the mmo market.

No, the mmo market is larger and more profitable than ever and more gamers are enjoying the MMORPG genre than ever before.

Your particular niche in the greater MMO market may not be popular or as successful, but it still exists (which you should be thankful for).

This is all just yet another "waaa I hate that other people have nice things that they like and I don't!" post.

#34287634781 I've seen on this website.

 

Dude, the ONLINE market has expanded..   not just MMO's.

ANd.. MMORPG's only make a modest part of the piechart compared to total (ie: minecraft, farmville, etc..)  We here @ MMORPG.com and specifically withint this forum are only concerned with those few games that fall withing the MMORPG banner...  all other games have their own genra now.

 

You are confusing marketing data and segment data with MMORPG. It doesn't work that way.. this is not Bloomberg, but MMORPG.com... where roleplaying games are fornt & foremost.

So he is 100% correct.. in saying most of these recent games aimed at MMORPG players were nothing but cash grabs at the 5% of WoW refugee's that are impatient and want moAr, so will collectively dump $400+ million into any stupid WoW-clone that comes along. That is why in the last 5 years we've seen marketing ramped up... because even 5% of WoW's base is 600,000 subs.

That is what is getting purpetuated ovr and ovr...   and with criticle mass, too many cheap gmes exploded on the market & dumping their business model in favor of free to play....  these cheap pretend MMORPG's are failing and will not compete up against the newer open worlds coming out.

 

Call of Duty and Battlfeield 3 are not MMO's, but they are online games listed in revenue source...

 

"No they are not charity. That is where the whales come in. (I play for free. Whales pays.) Devs get a business. That is how it works."


-Nariusseldon

  nariusseldon

Elite Member

Joined: 12/21/07
Posts: 19498

4/01/13 1:29:34 PM#80
Originally posted by BadSpock
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by Mtibbs1989
Originally posted by Quirhid
Mindless grind and spawncamping? -No thank you.

 Absolutely not!  We'd never want to hinder your "me me me" mindset now would we?

Nice strawman you've built there.

 I'm still right, carebears and the mindless drone consumers have destroyed the mmo market.

No, the mmo market is larger and more profitable than ever and more gamers are enjoying the MMORPG genre than ever before.

Your particular niche in the greater MMO market may not be popular or as successful, but it still exists (which you should be thankful for).

This is all just yet another "waaa I hate that other people have nice things that they like and I don't!" post.

#34287634781 I've seen on this website.

yeah .. if the MMO market is "destroyed" .. then what was i having fun with last night? A zombie?

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