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PvP  » WvW - Are Support Builds Worth It?

12 posts found
  User Deleted
 
OP  3/29/13 10:24:08 AM#1

Now that I'm getting settled back into GW2 with a renewed focus on WvW,  I have been trying to tweak my Necro build to attempt to be somewhat helpful to the group in WvW.

In WoW, I've really enjoyed healing in PvP.  I play a Disc Priest and love being able to help my team stay alive in crazy situations.

That being said, I decided to change my Necro build from Damage to Support but I'm finding that the number of helpful spells are minimal and they have fairly long cooldowns which utlimately make them quite useless when things get crazy.

So I guess my question is a two parter:  1) Are support builds even worth playing in WvW?   and 2) is there a particular class that has significantly better group support abilities than the Necromancer?

I'd be more than happy to roll another class if needed, my main goal is to have fun and be somewhat useful to my team in the process.

  Kuppa

Novice Member

Joined: 9/24/10
Posts: 3443

The problem with censorship is ********

3/29/13 10:26:05 AM#2
Guard or Ele might be better at support but like you mention I don't know how effective any of them can be in wvw.


  RizelStar

Novice Member

Joined: 8/12/11
Posts: 2823

We all breathe and we all die.

3/29/13 11:18:04 AM#3

My Guardian support build was when we took the middle keep in Eternal Battleground, forgot the name lol but it was fun happened yesterday in fact.

 

All my utilities where support based and traits, I also had the support elite skill, kept members in my guild and server team up and fighting for the most part.

Though it's all in what one wants to believe in, you can take my word from my literal experience or just take someone else, I'm not assuming which option you'll take, but it is what it is.

I might get banned for this. - Rizel Star.

I'm not afraid to tell trolls what they [need] to hear, even if that means for me to have an forced absence afterwards.

P2P LOGIC = If it's P2P it means longevity, overall better game, and THE BEST SUPPORT EVER!!!!!(Which has been rinsed and repeated about a thousand times)

Common Sense Logic = P2P logic is no better than F2P Logic.

  Toxia

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/25/09
Posts: 1308

3/29/13 11:30:54 AM#4

My supportish guardian build, try it out! Not in game atm, so going from memory.

Traits:

Zeal-0
Radiance-5 (for the blind trait which is incredible)
Valor-30 Altruistic healing/Purity/Retributive armour. (Crit chance is very important in this build.)
Honor-30 Superior aria/battle presence or writ exaltation depending on group./Dont remember the name offhand but the one that gives might on crit hits.
Virtue-5 For all the extra boons you can give your party.

Armour:

All knights except for 2 cleric earings and cleric back peice.


Weapon:

Hammer main (gain might on crit sigil). Scepter/sheild secondary.

Consumables:

Food-Bowl of orrian truffle and meat stew.
Potion-What ever dungeon variaty you are in or one of the oils that give precison.

Runes:

-2 Monk/2 hoelbrak/2water (Gives +50% might duration and +30% boon duration)

Skill Bar:

-Save yourselves/Retreat/Stand your ground. Save yourselves gets you up when your knocked down aswell as takes all the conditions of the party onto yourself, plus the buffs are nice. Retreat gives a second way to add a party wide aegis aswell as 20+ seconds of swiftness for skipping. Stand your ground gives retal and stabilty for the party.

 

You'll be buffing people around you constantly and pissing off enemies alot. Tinker as you like, there is no right build.

The Deep Web is sca-ry.

  User Deleted
 
OP  3/29/13 11:38:25 AM#5

Thanks for the feedback and recommendations.  The thing I'm coming to appreciate more during my second experience with GW2 is the amount of build options.  

Everyone likes to knock the fact that you only get 5 weapon skills but it's the trait system and utility skills that really make things interesting (in my opinion).

I have a Guardian so I may give him another shot this weekend.

 

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

3/29/13 11:43:02 AM#6

Best advice I can give is to stop thinking "support" "dps" "control", slow down and take a good look at your skills. You'll notice most of the skills have multiple aspects... doing damage and control, damage and support, all three, etc. Then, with your chosen weapons ready and utilities picked, look well at your traits and how you can find synergies that enhance your playstyle. Maybe you're fairly active, so a trait that leaves a trap/clone/ etc. when you dodge will come in handy. Things of that nature.

 

You are damage, control and support all at the same time. Don't pigeon hole yourself. Learn the skills, learn the traits then things will really begin flowing.

Oderint, dum metuant.

  FlawSGI

Elite Member

Joined: 8/14/10
Posts: 1419

All of history is a lie. The truth depends on who does the listening, and who does the telling...

3/29/13 12:51:04 PM#7
Originally posted by Toxia

My supportish guardian build, try it out! Not in game atm, so going from memory.

Traits:

Zeal-0
Radiance-5 (for the blind trait which is incredible)
Valor-30 Altruistic healing/Purity/Retributive armour. (Crit chance is very important in this build.)
Honor-30 Superior aria/battle presence or writ exaltation depending on group./Dont remember the name offhand but the one that gives might on crit hits.
Virtue-5 For all the extra boons you can give your party.

Armour:

All knights except for 2 cleric earings and cleric back peice.


Weapon:

Hammer main (gain might on crit sigil). Scepter/sheild secondary.

Consumables:

Food-Bowl of orrian truffle and meat stew.
Potion-What ever dungeon variaty you are in or one of the oils that give precison.

Runes:

-2 Monk/2 hoelbrak/2water (Gives +50% might duration and +30% boon duration)

Skill Bar:

-Save yourselves/Retreat/Stand your ground. Save yourselves gets you up when your knocked down aswell as takes all the conditions of the party onto yourself, plus the buffs are nice. Retreat gives a second way to add a party wide aegis aswell as 20+ seconds of swiftness for skipping. Stand your ground gives retal and stabilty for the party.

 

You'll be buffing people around you constantly and pissing off enemies alot. Tinker as you like, there is no right build.

+1 on this. This is the exact same build I have been running. Although I am sure the traits are different, I like this traitpoint layout and the skill selection. I haven't made a decision on the gear I want to run with quite yet but I have to say that I enjoy buffing those around me and making the enemy work really hard. The damage isnt as great as the burn damage build I was running but I find I do more damage alive than I did when I was constantly on my ass. Are they worth it? I'd say so.

RIP Jimmy "The Rev" Sullivan and Paul Gray.

  cronius77

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/26/12
Posts: 1309

3/29/13 12:58:20 PM#8
support builds especially guardian work very very well if you are roaming the maps and avoiding the zerges looking for meaningful pvp instead of just zerging keeps and objectives. Guardians utility skills like 5 points in the bottom traits for example that give bonuses like regain , vigor , aegis , burning etc can make or break a good even fight . If you have a couple of good team mates you can work with well or meet up with and you roam and communicate in vent you can easily take out full groups of players running a support guardian or banner warrior.  If you want a true support class that takes 100% more skill to play though , try out a elementalist swapping attunements in small skirmish fighting , that takes a ton of skill to be good at it but is one of the most rewarding pvp classes if you have a good team of players.
  HoiPoloi

Novice Member

Joined: 2/26/12
Posts: 86

3/29/13 2:01:06 PM#9

After the Guardian, the most important WvW support class is the Mesmer.

Mesmer is totally unique to GW2 though, so you can't really compare it to anything in WoW.  It has skills that allow you to port zergs across the map with Portal and mass stealth zergs.  They can also cause enemy zergs to totally kill themselves with reflecting skills like Feedback, and the condition Confusion.

Mesmer is a caster class that wears light armour.  Guards where heavy and are melee.  So it depends what playstyle you like best.

Thrumdi of the TTC

  Maephisto

Novice Member

Joined: 2/15/12
Posts: 653

3/29/13 2:15:28 PM#10

I think the necro is one of the better support classes. 

Maybe not support in the classic sense, but you can survive inside a group of enemies well and lock them down with chills/cripples and poisons.   These conditions are the bane of players, IMO. 

You dark path into a group, pop Plague form with cripple/weakness.  Then the hammer train follows right behind you.  Use well of power shortly afterwards, then run down the rest who havent fled the battlefield yet.

This is my necro build I have a lot of success with.  Necro Build.   It isnt cookie cutter, but it provides balance and great survivability in a coordinated group. 

Another great synergy is to trait Terror (curses VI)  and reaper's protection (death magic VIII).  Terror scales with condition damage (iirc) and hits surprisingly hard. Depending on who you are fighting, you can cause a good amount of damage and cause a group of enemies to put thier heal on CD.  All of this before the rest of your team arrives.

---------------------------------------------------------

To answer your question though.  I think the staff ele is great if the team you support knows how to use combo finishers (on demand) and can stay grouped well.  Ultimately, the strength of support classes comes from overall group coordination and not the ability of the individual support class.

The reason the combo finishers on demand is important, is the commander can call for healing on him.  The ele or ranger knows to place a field down and everyone else uses finshers in the healing field.  This heals up the frontline in a matter of seconds. 

 

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4779

3/29/13 2:31:50 PM#11
Originally posted by fat_taddler

Now that I'm getting settled back into GW2 with a renewed focus on WvW,  I have been trying to tweak my Necro build to attempt to be somewhat helpful to the group in WvW.

In WoW, I've really enjoyed healing in PvP.  I play a Disc Priest and love being able to help my team stay alive in crazy situations.

That being said, I decided to change my Necro build from Damage to Support but I'm finding that the number of helpful spells are minimal and they have fairly long cooldowns which utlimately make them quite useless when things get crazy.

So I guess my question is a two parter:  1) Are support builds even worth playing in WvW?   and 2) is there a particular class that has significantly better group support abilities than the Necromancer?

I'd be more than happy to roll another class if needed, my main goal is to have fun and be somewhat useful to my team in the process.

I can't speak for all tiers of gameplay, but at the top tiers of WvW support is ABSOLUTELY important. However, you may need to re-think your definition of 'support' to include more than just direct healing.

When it comes to necros.. the current meta has a lot of them running more support-heavy builds. Usually running Plague Form (elite) with the #3 trait in curses (chilling darkness) to basically spam AoE blind, chill, and cripple. When that's on cooldown / other situations, Running Marks & wells (well of suffering / corruption for offensive support, well of blood / darkness for defensive support) is ridiculously effective. Depending on who you're running with, you may need signet of the locust, for the run speed boost, though.

When it comes to necros, I'd just say this. DON'T GET DISCOURAGED. Necros atm are arguably the hardest class in the game to play atm. There's a lot of micromanagement involved, and you need to keep track of your cooldowns to be effective. Once you do get that rythm down, though, necromancers are one of the deadliest classes in the game atm.

#2) As far as group support, Eles offer a lot of boons and are generally easier to play than necros. I'd argue that necros have the best group support, but it's the hardest to use effectively. Eles & guardians have some really good group support as well, but it's much MUCH easier to use.

Eles tend to offer support in 1 of 2 ways. Either A) Combo fields & area CC (staff ele), or B) aura sharing - boon spamming (dagger ele). Staff eles are basically backend support, daggers are more for supporting your heavy fighters.

Guardians basically spam boons & condition removal, with lots of small heals. They're your 'tanks', basically supporting all the front end melee that's leading the charge. They're also the only class that can literally spam stability, which is pretty amazing.

  aesperus

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4779

3/29/13 2:41:58 PM#12
Originally posted by Maephisto

---------------------------------------------------------

To answer your question though.  I think the staff ele is great if the team you support knows how to use combo finishers (on demand) and can stay grouped well.  Ultimately, the strength of support classes comes from overall group coordination and not the ability of the individual support class.

The reason the combo finishers on demand is important, is the commander can call for healing on him.  The ele or ranger knows to place a field down and everyone else uses finshers in the healing field.  This heals up the frontline in a matter of seconds. 

This ^ 100%.

Support builds are critical for organized group play. If you're trying to support a disorganized zerg, you're better off playing a solo-pvp build, tbh. Even if you play your role perfectly, the randoms will be too disorganized to utilize it properly, and that gets very frustrating (especially on classes like necro / mesmer).

Other support builds, in addition to the standard necro / ele guardian:

Thief: Venomsharing (still very very handy, if not a bit boring) **still a fairly common support build**

Ranger: Trapper (i've been doing this a lot to scout for my server, setting up traps / muddy terrain / hail of arrows to AoE cripple / chill / immobilize enemy groups trying to flank our team). It works surprisingly well for a class I thought would be awful.

Engineer: Heal bombing (with the right traits an engineer can just blow up heals all over the place for your team. Good damage, and lots of AoE healing). Not very conventional, though.

Mesmer: Glamour builds (portals, swiftness, AoE reflection / confusion / condi removal). Very handy to have on your team

Warrior: Banners / Shouts. Not very common, but you can still get a good amount of AoE healing / condi removal for your team. Furthermore, you have the elite res banner which is VERY useful for getting up players quickly to keep fighting / retreat.

-- Sorry if I'm being a bit vague. I could make an entire thread on builds, but that would take forever. If you have any questions lemme know.