Originally posted by DavisFlight

Wow, the meaning of MMO is well and truly dead if having an auction house and CRAFTING makes a game massively multiplayer...

personally

ever since Turbine marketed DDO as a mmorpg and ANET did not market GW1 as a mmorpg

both have similar game mechanics -- heavily instanced world, only see other players at outposts

the term lost its meaning to me

Originally posted by baphamet

---

If Diablo 3 has more build diversity than any other MMO out there, please shot me. Diablo 3 chooses the path for you, please... 

---

 

actually it does, more than a few mmo's. each class has multiple builds that are completely different from one another and viable.

there are more viable builds in D3 currently per class than vanilla wow.

i can think of many old skool mmo's that have no builds at all, just that class's core role.

Just an example.

Mage in Wiz has 3 specs .. that is pretty much it.

In Diablo, just wiz, here are a list of builds i have seen people use (from the most popular): CM SNS, Meteor, Archon, Hybrid Archon, Blizz kiting, Disintegration, Sleet storm .. and i am not even talking about variations on these builds.

And we are not even talking about gimmick builds like the WD zero dog one.

Originally posted by Nadia

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Wow, the meaning of MMO is well and truly dead if having an auction house and CRAFTING makes a game massively multiplayer...

personally

ever since Turbine marketed DDO as a mmorpg and ANET did not market GW1 as a mmorpg

both have similar game mechanics -- heavily instanced world, only see other players at outposts

 

the term lost its meaning to me

Don't be so serious .. MMO is just a label for a group of gmes. DDO is pretty fun .. i won't care if it is a MMO or not.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Deivos

No, they called them "MMO features"

 

Which means they are features MMOs commonly has, not that having them makes it an mmo.

YOu don't realize why that sounds moronic, do you?

Calling a feature "an MMO feature" implies that it is a key component of what makes an MMO an MMO. A lot of MMOs have graphics, but I wouldn't call it an MMO feature.

Incorrect. If you notice, you just ascribed a different definition to the commentary than what was provided.

You added the suggestion they are 'key components' which is never implied. They were referred to things thast an MMO commonly has, not that an MMO must have.

It is your own need to polarize what I and the original quoted person wrote that skews the reality of what was said. You are constructing straw man arguments as a result and ranting against absolutely nothing.

Still hands down the best ACTION rpg out there.  Yeah other games might have...well really non factor things like no AH, or itemization thats different, or a complex skill tree that really isnt complex once you realize its just fluff stats.

This game does action.  I find it odd that people hail other games that do combat and action worse, still dont have offline play which isnt a factor these days, and has bland itemization that consists of your main stat and resists..

People want a game to hate, when D3 wasnt the end all be all that they had hyped for 12 years...well emotions run high and people take it personally.

The only thing i really think D3 did wrong was make you beat the game 3times over to hit endgame.  Would have been a much better game if you went through the story once and hit endgame.  Then they could just buff the early level maps and allow you to farm them.

Also, the obession for what D2 was, mind you what it was years after launch and after an expansion...its crazy for a bunch of people who wouldnt touch D2 with a 10 foot pole.  Again...all emotions, no ration thoughts with a most of the hate.

When you stack up the real issues people have with D3, its non factor issues and they always miss the major things D3 does right.  Thats a fun fast paced action combat which makes farming loot so much more fun than its competition.  I think the RMAH complaints are the lowest grade complaints of them all.  Doesnt matter what other people do in a game like this, has zero effect on your game and your gameplay.  You dont need to use it, and its handy to have there if you want to see something and end up playing the game for profit.  Also, the D2 fans forget how rampant RMAH was in D2, just on 3rd party sites, and put the money into the hands of those who used offline play to bot...which for all i know are the only people who are acomplaining about either issue.

I roll my eyes at all these "what it should have been" people. We all know they will be back, money in hands for the expansion...and if we remember the expansion is what made an average game that was D2 the classic we all remember it as...though most remember D2 as way better than it actually was.

People seem pretty confused about this. Blizzard, actually Vivendi, didn't fire the people from Blizzard North. Some quit to pursue other projects. Some stayed with Blizzard.The big four resigned and Vivendi accepted.  There just wasn't any way they could pursue their own goals and stay with Blizzard.  Vivendi had just dropped a huge chunk of money buying half a dozen companies in a wide variety of fields. The financial future of Blizzard was very unclear.They didn't know if they would be sold off, closed, or what.  Vivendi didn't actually settle the issue of what they were doing with Blizzard until they merged them with  Activision. To Vivendi Blizzard has always been this weird company that they owned that made money but they had on idea how or why.

Originally posted by Deivos

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Deivos

No, they called them "MMO features"

 

Which means they are features MMOs commonly has, not that having them makes it an mmo.

YOu don't realize why that sounds moronic, do you?

Calling a feature "an MMO feature" implies that it is a key component of what makes an MMO an MMO. A lot of MMOs have graphics, but I wouldn't call it an MMO feature.

Incorrect. If you notice, you just ascribed a different definition to the commentary than what was provided.

 

You added the suggestion they are 'key components' which is never implied. They were referred to things thast an MMO commonly has, not that an MMO must have.

 

It is your own need to polarize what I and the original quoted person wrote that skews the reality of what was said. You are constructing straw man arguments as a result and ranting against absolutely nothing.

Narius called crafting a common MMO feature. That implies that is linked with what it means to be an MMO. It is not. And I called him out on it.

Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol. Diablo 3 = watered down Diablo 2 with better graphics and slower paced gameplay. It does have a RMAH though (which I really like) but the whole game and item system is centered around it, and it shows. Diablo 2 had a very interesting item system, whereas Diablo 3 is all about stacking stats, like WoW.

Thank god for GGG and Path of Exile. Life savers for the isometric ARPG crowd.

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water. Blizzard are going downhill, their hearts just aren't in the right place anymore. The last good game they produced was vanilla WoW imo, and look at the state of WoW now.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by nariusseldon

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by nariusseldon

Originally posted by DavisFlight
There is already little to no difference between WoW and Diablo. Why would they make a Diablo MMO.

There is ..

Diablo is much better at action combat.

Diablo 3 is much better build diversity.

But i do agree that Diablo should not be made into a MMO. It adds little fun to be a true MMO. It has enough MMO features already (AH, crafting ...).

Wow, the meaning of MMO is well and truly dead if having an auction house and CRAFTING makes a game massively multiplayer...

AH is pretty massive .. and certainly multiplayer. But i didn't say D3 is a MMO, did i? I only say it does not need to be.

You claimed that having crafting is a feature that signifies whether or not something is massively multiplayer. Ah, but I should have noticed, it's narius. You spew foolish things constantly.

  Speeking of spewing foolish things constantly wasn't it you who said Aventurine would never miss their second release date for DFUW, and that Darkfall had eve-like success? Hahaha pot meet kettle.

it would be similar to this:

http://www.pathofexile.com/

Originally posted by DancingQueen

If Blizzard North had been allowed to make their Diablo MMORPG and not been fired because of their dreams would that have been better than the current Diablo 3?

 

Fired because of their dreams?  What?  

Originally posted by Adam1902

Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol. Diablo 3 = watered down Diablo 2 with better graphics and slower paced gameplay. It does have a RMAH though (which I really like) but the whole game and item system is centered around it, and it shows. Diablo 2 had a very interesting item system, whereas Diablo 3 is all about stacking stats, like WoW.

Thank god for GGG and Path of Exile. Life savers for the isometric ARPG crowd.

 

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water. Blizzard are going downhill, their hearts just aren't in the right place anymore. The last good game they produced was vanilla WoW imo, and look at the state of WoW now.

I don't think blizzard are the evil horror show most people like to make out, i'd like to have seen how any other company handled the insane success of WoW.

In general terms the current state of WoW is fine. Starcraft 2 was great, I will be buying HoTS next month.

The only franchise that is heading to bin without some severe work is Diablo, I enjoyed playing through Diablo3 once and got about 80 hours from it but I won't ever play it again.

Originally posted by Niburu

it would be similar to this:

 

http://www.pathofexile.com/

If Blizzard North were to of made a Diablo MMO, I would hope it would be very different to PoE. PoE is not an MMO, the only "massive" content in the game is the towns which are simply replacing the boring menu's used by most games for finding a group.

I love PoE, and it is an amazing ARPG, it's the only game I log in to daily currently - But it isn't an MMO and isn't trying to be one.

If the actual content (the maps you play through) were persistant (which would mean they'd have to be much larger and be built very differently) only then would it be an MMO. :P

Just trying to end any confusion.

---

Originally posted by Adam1902
Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol.

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water.

---

Blizzard North did try to make an MMO, it was called Hellgate London. It sucked.

Originally posted by Xiaoki

 

---

Originally posted by Adam1902
Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol.

 

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water.

---

Anything? Even Hellgate London?

 

Blizzard North did try to make an MMO, it was called Hellgate London. It sucked.

Ok, ok. Maybe I am a little too harsh towards the game as it fell so short of my expectations as a Diablo 2 player, but you know what I mean.

EDIT: Maybe the upcoming Lineage Eternal could satisfy our needs for an isometric MMOARPG? It's Korean developed and I'm unsure at this stage if it is using the word "MMO" loosely and it only has persistant town hubs, or whether the actual game content will be MMO. We'll see.

Originally posted by SlickShoes

 

I don't think blizzard are the evil horror show most people like to make out, i'd like to have seen how any other company handled the insane success of WoW.

In general terms the current state of WoW is fine. Starcraft 2 was great, I will be buying HoTS next month.

The only franchise that is heading to bin without some severe work is Diablo, I enjoyed playing through Diablo3 once and got about 80 hours from it but I won't ever play it again.

Wait ... you spend 80 hours on a game and you think it is not a good game? 99% of the single player games won't even last 20 hours.

Originally posted by Adam1902

Originally posted by Xiaoki

 

---

Originally posted by Adam1902
Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol.

 

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water.

---

Anything? Even Hellgate London?

 

Blizzard North did try to make an MMO, it was called Hellgate London. It sucked.

Ok, ok. Maybe I am a little too harsh towards the game as it fell so short of my expectations as a Diablo 2 player, but you know what I mean.

EDIT: Maybe the upcoming Lineage Eternal could satisfy our needs for an isometric MMOARPG? It's Korean developed and I'm unsure at this stage if it is using the word "MMO" loosely and it only has persistant town hubs, or whether the actual game content will be MMO. We'll see.

The upcoming LIneage Eternal looks good.

However, there is no need to choose. I doubt anyone would limit their gaming to only ONE ARPG. I play D3, PoE and most likely LE when it comes out.

PoE is a fun game .. but that does not mean that D3 is not a fun game. They are just different. D3 is much better in combat, and build experimentation, and polish. PoE has this nice chart idea, and a interesting skill gem system.

I like both.

---

Originally posted by Adam1902
Anything is better than Diablo 3, lol. Diablo 3 = watered down Diablo 2 with better graphics and slower paced gameplay. It does have a RMAH though (which I really like) but the whole game and item system is centered around it, and it shows. Diablo 2 had a very interesting item system, whereas Diablo 3 is all about stacking stats, like WoW.

Thank god for GGG and Path of Exile. Life savers for the isometric ARPG crowd.

 

I think a Diablo MMO produced by Blizzard North would've blown the current game out of the water. Blizzard are going downhill, their hearts just aren't in the right place anymore. The last good game they produced was vanilla WoW imo, and look at the state of WoW now.

---

have you played diablo 3? i kind of doubt it judging by this post.

i have played both diablo 3 and POE extensively, D3's combat is superior in every way.

its more fluid, has better animations, and i honestly don't see how its slower? you mean because of cool downs? i don't see how D3's combat is slower than D2's or POE's, it seems faster to me actually, definitely less clunky than both of them.

there is also more viable build diversity in D3 than there is in POE and even D2 for the most part.

i am a fan of the genre in general and like all three of those games. but as far as combat is concerned, D3 is far superior to both of them IMO.

Originally posted by DancingQueen

If Blizzard North had been allowed to make their Diablo MMORPG and not been fired because of their dreams would that have been better than the current Diablo 3?

 

Impossible to know, I would say no because a team that makes arpg is entirely different than what it takes to make a MMO. 

Completely different mindset as far as game design, engine design, server code... So yeah probably not.

Teams that are good are arpgs should stick to making what they are good at.