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Defiance

Defiance 

General Discussion  » So its B2P except on Xbox....

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39 posts found
  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2805

I actually still like MMORPGs

 
OP  3/13/13 12:49:57 AM#1

I honestly LOLed when I heard you will need XBox live gold to play it online. I hope Microsoft is paying for their servers then or Trion is just getting bent over a barrel by Microsoft. I really didn't think they would require that, but I guess since theres no sub Trion couldn't avoid it like FFXI.

What a joke that gold account is.

  Onomas

Novice Member

Joined: 7/05/11
Posts: 1160

Sandbox is your only hope for a decent mmo ;)

3/13/13 1:39:18 AM#2

Get a pc ;)

It has its perks

  jbs4life

Novice Member

Joined: 4/18/07
Posts: 12

3/13/13 1:55:52 AM#3

Gold used to be justifiable because Miscrosoft really did have the best online network available, but Sony has really stepped their shit up.  Not only do you not have to pay, but if you did decided you want to - you get a hell of lot more stuff.. like FREE games.

Really thinking about switching back to Sony this upcoming generation, unless Microsoft has some amazing product.

  Gishgeron

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 1297

3/13/13 1:58:13 AM#4

  Ugh, this again?  Why not just start a thread about how you hate Live Gold and skip masking the troll under something else?  If you have an xbox, and want to play online, you have to have a gold sub.  Even for the, otherwise, totally free Happy Wars.  In what fantasy land would this game suddenly fall under a different set of circumstances?

  With that said, lets address how silly this REALLY is.  50$ a year.  $4.16 a month.  A cost which has, without question, gone to create the most successful of all the online and indie marketplaces for the consoles currently out.  A person COULD say that the PC is so much better because it is free, but its also a fat stack more expensive for the hardware.  Assume you get a full force 250 gig 360, thats about $300.  That much money won't even buy you the skeleton of a gaming PC.  You're going to approach, if not completely surpass, $1000 just to get a solid gaming rig and then you're going to have to maintain it. 

  Using the figures, loose as they are, that I just gave you it would take 14 years of a gold sub before what you paid for your xbox even catches up to what you spent on your PC.  14 YEARS for gods sake.  All the while you can be reasonably sure every game you ever buy will work on it.  PC gaming comes with massive headaches.  You can have a beast rig only to discover that your particular video card, for all of its awesome, has a conflict with the game you wanna play and ruins the experience.  Because the hardware used in consoles is set in stone, developers working with them can optimize MUCH better for more reliable and stable game experience.

  People who trash on MS for its live cost are either terrible at math or live in a dreamworld where PC gaming isn't a money sink of massive proportions.  Or the equally magical dreamworld where the other online services offered by current gen systems (I name current specifically because next gen is a great chance for new movement forward to happen and really redefine things for us) can even compare.  They can't.  I've used all current gen consoles.  None of them compare to XBL.  Especially not the Wii, ick....

  User Deleted
3/13/13 2:01:30 AM#5
Originally posted by jbs4life

Gold used to be justifiable because Miscrosoft really did have the best online network available, but Sony has really stepped their shit up.  Not only do you not have to pay, but if you did decided you want to - you get a hell of lot more stuff.. like FREE games.

Really thinking about switching back to Sony this upcoming generation, unless Microsoft has some amazing product.

Unless you're a big Halo fan, there's not a huge reason to stick to xBox right now (or in the future).  Sony gets pretty much everything Microsoft does, pluse they seem to have slightly better exclusive titles, especially from Naughty Dog.  I'm really excited about The Last of Us.

  Gishgeron

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 1297

3/13/13 2:03:32 AM#6
Originally posted by jbs4life

Gold used to be justifiable because Miscrosoft really did have the best online network available, but Sony has really stepped their shit up.  Not only do you not have to pay, but if you did decided you want to - you get a hell of lot more stuff.. like FREE games.

Really thinking about switching back to Sony this upcoming generation, unless Microsoft has some amazing product.

 

  While I can agree with aspects of this sentiment, the main reason XBL wins this battle is due to much larger 3rd party support.  Simply put, more studios, both AAA and indie alike, are developing for that platform.  Part of that was its initial success and early player strength.  Part of that was Sony's blunders along the way and its large service failure a year or so back.  Part of it is funding helping to support it, some of which comes from the fee players pay for the service.  I mean, can people even buy the DLC for Skyrim on that system yet?  Maybe if Sony greased a few palms and helped pay for some of the porting (a choice that would probably help them gain some footing back) maybe it would have been sped up.  I would imagine that such a thing would be easier if they had the financial support of a paid service over a free one.

  Ballista

Novice Member

Joined: 2/23/10
Posts: 117

3/13/13 2:06:04 AM#7
Originally posted by Fendel84M

I honestly LOLed when I heard you will need XBox live gold to play it online. I hope Microsoft is paying for their servers then or Trion is just getting bent over a barrel by Microsoft. I really didn't think they would require that, but I guess since theres no sub Trion couldn't avoid it like FFXI.

What a joke that gold account is.

I'm pretty sure most people who own XBox's pay for gold, so it's not really a relavant/material cost. For the very tiny fraction of XBox users who don't pay for gold and want to buy and play Defiance on XBox, then it's a material cost and that population is likely so tiny no one cares.

  Gishgeron

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 1297

3/13/13 2:06:05 AM#8
Originally posted by asmkm22

Unless you're a big Halo fan, there's not a huge reason to stick to xBox right now (or in the future).  Sony gets pretty much everything Microsoft does, pluse they seem to have slightly better exclusive titles, especially from Naughty Dog.  I'm really excited about The Last of Us.

 

  I can agree that, in terms of major releases, Sony has come a long way in earning back solid exclusives and trying to carve a place back for itself. 

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2805

I actually still like MMORPGs

 
OP  3/13/13 2:27:08 AM#9

I actually don't own an Xbox anymore. I used to, but once I got my PS3 I stopped using my Xbox. I will be playing Defiance on PC myself because the controls will be better (for me) and the graphics.

I'll admit PS3 has its flaws, but PSN has been absolutely amazing. I have no problem playing online games, and funny enough sony does get my $50 a year but I get tons of free games for both my PS3 and Vita from it. I honestly don't know how they can do it on such a low price.

I've been kind of disgusted with Xbox Live ever since I tried to use Netflix on it and had to pay for gold to do it. I already pay for my own internet, I paid for the console, I pay for my Netflix access. Why should Microsoft get more money just to let me use all the stuff I already paid for? How does that make any sense? To top it off the actual Netflix app was incredibley inferior compared to the PS3 version. Though now my Apple TV one is better than both :-p

Final Fantasy XI doesn't require gold on Xbox, now I wonder if Microsoft gets a cut of the FFXI subscriptions.

  Etherignis

Novice Member

Joined: 6/28/12
Posts: 242

3/13/13 2:30:52 AM#10
PC is the way too go
  Kinchyle

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/20/10
Posts: 264

3/13/13 2:38:04 AM#11
Originally posted by Gishgeron

  Ugh, this again?  Why not just start a thread about how you hate Live Gold and skip masking the troll under something else?  If you have an xbox, and want to play online, you have to have a gold sub.  Even for the, otherwise, totally free Happy Wars.  In what fantasy land would this game suddenly fall under a different set of circumstances?

  With that said, lets address how silly this REALLY is.  50$ a year.  $4.16 a month.  A cost which has, without question, gone to create the most successful of all the online and indie marketplaces for the consoles currently out.  A person COULD say that the PC is so much better because it is free, but its also a fat stack more expensive for the hardware.  Assume you get a full force 250 gig 360, thats about $300.  That much money won't even buy you the skeleton of a gaming PC.  You're going to approach, if not completely surpass, $1000 just to get a solid gaming rig and then you're going to have to maintain it. 

  Using the figures, loose as they are, that I just gave you it would take 14 years of a gold sub before what you paid for your xbox even catches up to what you spent on your PC.  14 YEARS for gods sake.  All the while you can be reasonably sure every game you ever buy will work on it.  PC gaming comes with massive headaches.  You can have a beast rig only to discover that your particular video card, for all of its awesome, has a conflict with the game you wanna play and ruins the experience.  Because the hardware used in consoles is set in stone, developers working with them can optimize MUCH better for more reliable and stable game experience.

  People who trash on MS for its live cost are either terrible at math or live in a dreamworld where PC gaming isn't a money sink of massive proportions.  Or the equally magical dreamworld where the other online services offered by current gen systems (I name current specifically because next gen is a great chance for new movement forward to happen and really redefine things for us) can even compare.  They can't.  I've used all current gen consoles.  None of them compare to XBL.  Especially not the Wii, ick....

PC games are also cheaper and most have a longer life of playing IMO. We buy less of them a year than the consoles. A TON of people who play mostly consoles have at least two systems. On each system, they own 10 to 20 games at around $60 a pop. Even if they get them cheaper, so do PC users...a LOT cheaper.

PCs last a minimum (realistically) of 5 years (for me at least...I aint rich) before any considerable upgrade. IPCs also perform better and can be built to do so at around $500 not including the monitor. Oh yeah...how much does the TV you run your cosoles on cost? I bet more than my rig. Even if only half that, still more than my monitor.

Oh..and I can play mine while watching TV. You can too if you have a second set. But that's not part of this calculation you made up. All said and done, your console, if you go by the standard that you have to be up to today's standards, you actually paid $300 (per machine), plus in the $50 range per game, add in at least $500 for a medium sized flat screen, another $300-$500 for the second TV so you or anyone else can actually watch TV while you are on your console, and I'd say you paid more than the rest of us PC gamers.

:P

It's really a kinda of silly argument though right? I don't think either choice is much cheaper. Depends on the person. Most own both too...

  SlickShoes

Novice Member

Joined: 3/01/06
Posts: 1040

3/13/13 5:16:47 AM#12
Originally posted by Kinchyle
Originally posted by Gishgeron

  Ugh, this again?  Why not just start a thread about how you hate Live Gold and skip masking the troll under something else?  If you have an xbox, and want to play online, you have to have a gold sub.  Even for the, otherwise, totally free Happy Wars.  In what fantasy land would this game suddenly fall under a different set of circumstances?

  With that said, lets address how silly this REALLY is.  50$ a year.  $4.16 a month.  A cost which has, without question, gone to create the most successful of all the online and indie marketplaces for the consoles currently out.  A person COULD say that the PC is so much better because it is free, but its also a fat stack more expensive for the hardware.  Assume you get a full force 250 gig 360, thats about $300.  That much money won't even buy you the skeleton of a gaming PC.  You're going to approach, if not completely surpass, $1000 just to get a solid gaming rig and then you're going to have to maintain it. 

  Using the figures, loose as they are, that I just gave you it would take 14 years of a gold sub before what you paid for your xbox even catches up to what you spent on your PC.  14 YEARS for gods sake.  All the while you can be reasonably sure every game you ever buy will work on it.  PC gaming comes with massive headaches.  You can have a beast rig only to discover that your particular video card, for all of its awesome, has a conflict with the game you wanna play and ruins the experience.  Because the hardware used in consoles is set in stone, developers working with them can optimize MUCH better for more reliable and stable game experience.

  People who trash on MS for its live cost are either terrible at math or live in a dreamworld where PC gaming isn't a money sink of massive proportions.  Or the equally magical dreamworld where the other online services offered by current gen systems (I name current specifically because next gen is a great chance for new movement forward to happen and really redefine things for us) can even compare.  They can't.  I've used all current gen consoles.  None of them compare to XBL.  Especially not the Wii, ick....

PC games are also cheaper and most have a longer life of playing IMO. We buy less of them a year than the consoles. A TON of people who play mostly consoles have at least two systems. On each system, they own 10 to 20 games at around $60 a pop. Even if they get them cheaper, so do PC users...a LOT cheaper.

PCs last a minimum (realistically) of 5 years (for me at least...I aint rich) before any considerable upgrade. IPCs also perform better and can be built to do so at around $500 not including the monitor. Oh yeah...how much does the TV you run your cosoles on cost? I bet more than my rig. Even if only half that, still more than my monitor.

Oh..and I can play mine while watching TV. You can too if you have a second set. But that's not part of this calculation you made up. All said and done, your console, if you go by the standard that you have to be up to today's standards, you actually paid $300 (per machine), plus in the $50 range per game, add in at least $500 for a medium sized flat screen, another $300-$500 for the second TV so you or anyone else can actually watch TV while you are on your console, and I'd say you paid more than the rest of us PC gamers.

:P

It's really a kinda of silly argument though right? I don't think either choice is much cheaper. Depends on the person. Most own both too...

I have my consoles and my PC connected to my TV. I have no issues sharing my TV with my wife and letting her watch TV when something is on. The assumption that people NEED a second TV in any scenario is a bit weird.

"i can play mine while watching TV" seems a bit of a crap argument, if I am gaming I don't want to be watching TV, if I am watching TV I don't want to be gaming. If someone is playing on a console they could also be watching TV or doing a myriad of other things on any other device they own.

I just paid £700 to build my PC and there is no way it will still be running as good as it is now in 5 years time without some serious upgrades. i5 3570k, 8GB ram, AMD 7950 3GB, 120GB SSD, 500GB HDD.

Building a good PC is more expensive than buying a console + TV but most people have a TV already so to factor a TV in to the cost of a console is a bit odd. For that extra money you can do a lot more with that device though and it will play any game better than the consoles in most situations.

The advantage the console has is that other than buying the games you don't need to engage your brain at all, it just works, no installing drivers, changing hardware, it just sits there and plays games until it either dies or you put it in the bin.

  Gishgeron

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 1297

3/13/13 11:50:13 AM#13
Originally posted by SlickShoes.

I have my consoles and my PC connected to my TV. I have no issues sharing my TV with my wife and letting her watch TV when something is on. The assumption that people NEED a second TV in any scenario is a bit weird.

"i can play mine while watching TV" seems a bit of a crap argument, if I am gaming I don't want to be watching TV, if I am watching TV I don't want to be gaming. If someone is playing on a console they could also be watching TV or doing a myriad of other things on any other device they own.

I just paid £700 to build my PC and there is no way it will still be running as good as it is now in 5 years time without some serious upgrades. i5 3570k, 8GB ram, AMD 7950 3GB, 120GB SSD, 500GB HDD.

Building a good PC is more expensive than buying a console + TV but most people have a TV already so to factor a TV in to the cost of a console is a bit odd. For that extra money you can do a lot more with that device though and it will play any game better than the consoles in most situations.

The advantage the console has is that other than buying the games you don't need to engage your brain at all, it just works, no installing drivers, changing hardware, it just sits there and plays games until it either dies or you put it in the bin.

  Thank you, I've been through all possible gaming devices and PC gaming is just the most expensive by far.  IF we can ever figure out how to increase our wireless potential (we're getting close to capping its use and killing pushing data use technology further) then Tablet/Mobile gaming is going to absolutely destroy both console AND PC markets.  A company can purchase obscenely powerful hardware that runs any game you want to stream and converts the end result to video so the tablet or phone can process the visuals for any game you want.  One day we'll just buy a tablet, pay a monthly fee, and play whatever we want without having to so much as download a game or purchase a disc ever again.  The hardware will be pretty cost effective and, due to the video rendering done by the service providers powerhouse machines, wont need upgrades to play new games.

 

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7683

Logic be damned!

3/13/13 11:59:59 AM#14

I pay ~4$ a month and have never, ever had any service outage effect me.

XBL has been a more reliable gaming service than... everything but LAN haha

 

Now Playing: D3:RoS, Watch Dogs
Looking Towards: Destiny

  Heafstagg

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/02/06
Posts: 165

3/13/13 12:01:54 PM#15
It's still B2P on the xbox, saying it's not is misinforming people. It's common knowledge if you have an xbox and you want to play online, you need xbox live. I don't like it either but that's just the way it is. If you want to blame someone, blame microsoft, not trion. They have nothing to do with it and if you get "fooled" by it it's your own problem. As I said, if you have an xbox you KNOW that you need xbox live to play online.

  User Deleted
3/13/13 12:24:44 PM#16
Originally posted by Gishgeron

  Ugh, this again?  Why not just start a thread about how you hate Live Gold and skip masking the troll under something else?  If you have an xbox, and want to play online, you have to have a gold sub.  Even for the, otherwise, totally free Happy Wars.  In what fantasy land would this game suddenly fall under a different set of circumstances?

  With that said, lets address how silly this REALLY is.  50$ a year.  $4.16 a month.  A cost which has, without question, gone to create the most successful of all the online and indie marketplaces for the consoles currently out.  A person COULD say that the PC is so much better because it is free, but its also a fat stack more expensive for the hardware.  Assume you get a full force 250 gig 360, thats about $300.  That much money won't even buy you the skeleton of a gaming PC.  You're going to approach, if not completely surpass, $1000 just to get a solid gaming rig and then you're going to have to maintain it. 

  Using the figures, loose as they are, that I just gave you it would take 14 years of a gold sub before what you paid for your xbox even catches up to what you spent on your PC.  14 YEARS for gods sake.  All the while you can be reasonably sure every game you ever buy will work on it.  PC gaming comes with massive headaches.  You can have a beast rig only to discover that your particular video card, for all of its awesome, has a conflict with the game you wanna play and ruins the experience.  Because the hardware used in consoles is set in stone, developers working with them can optimize MUCH better for more reliable and stable game experience.

  People who trash on MS for its live cost are either terrible at math or live in a dreamworld where PC gaming isn't a money sink of massive proportions.  Or the equally magical dreamworld where the other online services offered by current gen systems (I name current specifically because next gen is a great chance for new movement forward to happen and really redefine things for us) can even compare.  They can't.  I've used all current gen consoles.  None of them compare to XBL.  Especially not the Wii, ick....

I disagree about the cost. A well built gaming pc will last you for 5 years and practically the only thing you would need to upgrade, if you chose to do so, is your graphics card. I guess that would cost about the same as 5 years of xbox live. And there's really no need to go over 800 dollar range for your PC unless you want top end, which is unecessary for most people. Now let's look at it this way. You buy an xbox for $300. Ok that's fine, but you still need a computer don't you? For school, work, etc. Unless you're buying a bottom of the barrell PC for $200 - $300, you'll more likely need to spend $400 - $500. So instead of getting an xbox and a low end PC, why not just build a higher end PC for the price of both? So I don't think that it's fare to say PC gaming is much more expensive. Now most people probably already have some kind of PC so a console really is the cheaper alternative. But, I also think most people would buy a console for the particular games and features available to it such as xbox live rather than just because its cheaper. I don't think it be would too difficult for someone to save money for a few months to buy a PC rather than a console.

Regarding the OP, it is kind of silly that you would expect Defiance to be completely free to play on xbox live. That's just how it has always been on xbox. No matter what game you want to play, you have to pay the xbox live fee to play it online. 

  SlickShoes

Novice Member

Joined: 3/01/06
Posts: 1040

3/13/13 1:07:40 PM#17
Originally posted by fayknaym
Originally posted by Gishgeron

  Ugh, this again?  Why not just start a thread about how you hate Live Gold and skip masking the troll under something else?  If you have an xbox, and want to play online, you have to have a gold sub.  Even for the, otherwise, totally free Happy Wars.  In what fantasy land would this game suddenly fall under a different set of circumstances?

  With that said, lets address how silly this REALLY is.  50$ a year.  $4.16 a month.  A cost which has, without question, gone to create the most successful of all the online and indie marketplaces for the consoles currently out.  A person COULD say that the PC is so much better because it is free, but its also a fat stack more expensive for the hardware.  Assume you get a full force 250 gig 360, thats about $300.  That much money won't even buy you the skeleton of a gaming PC.  You're going to approach, if not completely surpass, $1000 just to get a solid gaming rig and then you're going to have to maintain it. 

  Using the figures, loose as they are, that I just gave you it would take 14 years of a gold sub before what you paid for your xbox even catches up to what you spent on your PC.  14 YEARS for gods sake.  All the while you can be reasonably sure every game you ever buy will work on it.  PC gaming comes with massive headaches.  You can have a beast rig only to discover that your particular video card, for all of its awesome, has a conflict with the game you wanna play and ruins the experience.  Because the hardware used in consoles is set in stone, developers working with them can optimize MUCH better for more reliable and stable game experience.

  People who trash on MS for its live cost are either terrible at math or live in a dreamworld where PC gaming isn't a money sink of massive proportions.  Or the equally magical dreamworld where the other online services offered by current gen systems (I name current specifically because next gen is a great chance for new movement forward to happen and really redefine things for us) can even compare.  They can't.  I've used all current gen consoles.  None of them compare to XBL.  Especially not the Wii, ick....

I disagree about the cost. A well built gaming pc will last you for 5 years and practically the only thing you would need to upgrade, if you chose to do so, is your graphics card. I guess that would cost about the same as 5 years of xbox live. And there's really no need to go over 800 dollar range for your PC unless you want top end, which is unecessary for most people. Now let's look at it this way. You buy an xbox for $300. Ok that's fine, but you still need a computer don't you? For school, work, etc. Unless you're buying a bottom of the barrell PC for $200 - $300, you'll more likely need to spend $400 - $500. So instead of getting an xbox and a low end PC, why not just build a higher end PC for the price of both? So I don't think that it's fare to say PC gaming is much more expensive. Now most people probably already have some kind of PC so a console really is the cheaper alternative. But, I also think most people would buy a console for the particular games and features available to it such as xbox live rather than just because its cheaper. I don't think it be would too difficult for someone to save money for a few months to buy a PC rather than a console.

Regarding the OP, it is kind of silly that you would expect Defiance to be completely free to play on xbox live. That's just how it has always been on xbox. No matter what game you want to play, you have to pay the xbox live fee to play it online. 

Can you tell me the specs of this $800 PC that will easily last 5 years?

The biggest negative about a PC is it getting bogged down with other stuff because you will use it for other stuff not just gaming.

If you are doing no gaming at all on your PC you can very easily get something that is not horrible for around 300-400.

Building a good quality PC is more expensive, there is more you need to do to keep it in good condition too, lots of people do not want to invest that much in an entertainment device, they want to get home and turn it on and play. Consoles are for those people. A gaming PC is for enthusiasts.

The average joe doesn't even know what makes a PC good or not, these are the people buying computers at PC world and Walmart.

  bestever

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/26/11
Posts: 571

3/13/13 3:44:08 PM#18
Originally posted by Fendel84M

I honestly LOLed when I heard you will need XBox live gold to play it online. I hope Microsoft is paying for their servers then or Trion is just getting bent over a barrel by Microsoft. I really didn't think they would require that, but I guess since theres no sub Trion couldn't avoid it like FFXI.

What a joke that gold account is.

LOL where have you been? When I did play xbox I was able to get a year for 30$.

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2805

I actually still like MMORPGs

 
OP  3/13/13 4:29:14 PM#19
Originally posted by bestever
Originally posted by Fendel84M

I honestly LOLed when I heard you will need XBox live gold to play it online. I hope Microsoft is paying for their servers then or Trion is just getting bent over a barrel by Microsoft. I really didn't think they would require that, but I guess since theres no sub Trion couldn't avoid it like FFXI.

What a joke that gold account is.

LOL where have you been? When I did play xbox I was able to get a year for 30$.

I think they raised the price

  Mtibbs1989

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/17/10
Posts: 2501

3/13/13 4:34:48 PM#20
Originally posted by Fendel84M

I honestly LOLed when I heard you will need XBox live gold to play it online. I hope Microsoft is paying for their servers then or Trion is just getting bent over a barrel by Microsoft. I really didn't think they would require that, but I guess since theres no sub Trion couldn't avoid it like FFXI.

What a joke that gold account is.

Defiance is B2P either way. You're paying a subscription fee for the game, you're paying for the subscription for the Xbox Live Pass. There's a big difference between the two. However, one of the main reason people choose PS3 over Xbox 360 is because of the fact that you don't have to pay.


Somebody, somewhere has better skills as you have, more experience as you have, is smarter than you, has more friends as you do and can stay online longer. Just pray he's not out to get you.

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