Originally posted by Kinh021

Originally posted by Waiwan

Originally posted by NaMeNaMe
Buy to Play or Free to Play. Pay to Play yea no, a lot of people wiill be turned off by this and a lot already are the many people giving the game a go are the people who played 1.0, who get a month's free.

 

Many players have no problem with Pay to play. I could easyly pay up to 100 euro per month if its worth it, and I think it will be :)

Final Fantasy XIV: ARR is pay to pay. Thats the fact. So whoever dont like this and dont want to pay monthly sub, dont post here anymore and just move to another game :) Thank you

 

It is because of this kind of opinion they sell founder package $ 200.00

Originally posted by ClockworkSmiles

Instead of wanting more casual and F2P MMO's in a sea of casual MMO's, how about you stick to the already casual and F2P MMO's?

 

There is nothing good about the F2P  fad unless you are someone who doesn't plan on actually playing the game more than a few weeks or less.

 

The whole F2P fad is killing the genre and I'm sick and tired of you casuals demanding everything be ruined because you have no time to play or are too cheap to pay money.

 

They have already turned FFXIV into a WoW clone frrom what I keep hearing from the people in beta, so I think you guys have done enough damage to the game.

 

What about us real MMO players that want an immersive and hardcore MMORPG? Why do you casuals get to demand everything be free and easy and we get n-o-t-h-i-n-g?

 

IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD TO SPEND THE TIME OR MONEY ON MMO'S THEN DON'T PLAY MMO'S! GO PLAY A SINGLE PLAYER GAME!

 

Also, since you think MMO's are "unproductive" and just "entertainment" and the people who play them are irrisponsoble people with no lives, I'll leave you this quote to hopefully enlignten you.

"A reader lives a thousand lives, the man who never reads lives only one."

Originally posted by DarknessReign
The people who bought the game via Digital download or from the store , the people who invest money to play the game to support the game/company , those people are the ones who get upset and pissed off because a fame ends up F2P. The F2P player did jot give a hilloof beans for insert any subscription game that went F2P here now its free and now they think that the game is equally there's more so then the player who invested real money to the game That's why F2P games are lame. It's that player base and that mentality. Everyone who plays a sub based game that went Free will agree with me

Yep .. totally agreed. I played every mmorpg that was released in past 10 years and there is almost nothing worse than company change their decision/promises they had before release.

Most P2P players who are strictly against F2P are against it for good and important reasons. F2P brings and lure more trolls, kids, casuals, bots,etc. than P2P model. F2P model require developers to focus in some point on vanity/cash shopt/boost items. These reasons are a damn big reason NOT to want F2P in any good game.

If you need to try the game out before buying it or paying sub, its easy. Just go play in open beta, get trial or find someone who is willing to send you buddy key. And we also live in internet world. Use youtube.com and read something about it. Its not that hard.

Originally posted by Kinh021
You do not understand what people are trying to show. Just come to read the posts with the "head made" with its ideas already formed. I understand when some talked about leaving and try other things but the game(mmorpg) is a pleasure for me as it is movies for some peoples. For years I get games and do some signing. Ex: Tibia, UO, WoW, GW and others. What I have tried is going on here: Not because we defend free to play we are children 12 years and have no job and able to finance games. yes we must question some points as consumers. Years in the gaming industry and do not like the direction that is being taken. We have reached the point that we pay to test a game in Closed Beta. Companies sell their games before they finish them and then sell again. Not because I'm a fan and I love games that accept pay anything and any value. Remember the initial subject of the topic and just try to understand the other side of the coin as we try to do when looking for the P2P mode.

The other side of the coin is easily understandable. People who want to play for free because they don't have the means to pay monthly, people who don't feel the product is worthy of a sub yet for some reason still want to play it anyway, or people are just too cheap and want to get as much for free as possible. There are plenty of other options for you out there, so leave the few remaining games that are P2P for the actual people who prefer P2P.

The value of money and the value of a game varies from one person to the next. Decide where you stand, make a decision to bite the bullet or not, and move on.

There's really nothing else that needs to be said about it.

Originally posted by Ghavrigg

The other side of the coin is easily understandable. People who want to play for free because they don't have the means to pay monthly, people who don't feel the product is worthy of a sub yet for some reason still want to play it anyway, or people are just too cheap and want to get as much for free as possible. There are plenty of other options for you out there, so leave the few remaining games that are P2P for the actual people who prefer P2P.

The value of money and the value of a game varies from one person to the next. Decide where you stand, make a decision to bite the bullet or not, and move on.

There's really nothing else that needs to be said about it.

 

Sadly they wont understand this .. They will say ''why not f2p, it wont hurt your game.'' bla bla bla ..

They dont understand demanding game to become F2P is something like going to gym asking for free acess to the gym, but only for restricted equipment or time. THIS IS NOT how world works.

They just have to understand that its only THEIR DECISION. Everyone must make his own decision .. so you decided to have family, kid, work? Good for you, stop begging for free acess to the game. There are hundered of thousands of players with families, work and kids who are willing to pay sub, without any problem. You are not one of them? Its your decision, and if its not your decision, then blame your parents or wife :D

Originally posted by Waiwan

Originally posted by Ghavrigg

The other side of the coin is easily understandable. People who want to play for free because they don't have the means to pay monthly, people who don't feel the product is worthy of a sub yet for some reason still want to play it anyway, or people are just too cheap and want to get as much for free as possible. There are plenty of other options for you out there, so leave the few remaining games that are P2P for the actual people who prefer P2P.

The value of money and the value of a game varies from one person to the next. Decide where you stand, make a decision to bite the bullet or not, and move on.

There's really nothing else that needs to be said about it.

 

Sadly they wont understand this .. They will say ''why not f2p, it wont hurt your game.'' bla bla bla ..

They dont understand demanding game to become F2P is something like going to gym asking for free acess to the gym, but only for restricted equipment or time. THIS IS NOT how world works.

They just have to understand that its only THEIR DECISION. Everyone must make his own decision .. so you decided to have family, kid, work? Good for you, stop begging for free acess to the game. Because there are hundered of thousands of players with families, work and kids who are willing to pay sub, without any problem. You are not one of them? TOO BAD :)

People with this mentality honestly sicken me sometimes... F2P > P2P, end of story, because if you want to continue subbing you can, hell a decently converted P2P game will give you the same sub you always had, oh what cause now they spend maybe a month throwing together the items and scripting required to get F2P working you're gonna moan that "THIS IS NOT HOW THE WORLD WORKS?" so? if your world works in such a crappy fashion change it, plenty of good games offer you choice and you stand there and proclaim superiority because you have a better job than someone? news flash: luck of the draw don't make you any better than anyone else, if one person enjoys games and can afford paying a monthly sub while another one enjoys them just as much but can't, the right, the ethically good thing to do is to give the right of way to the person who can't afford it.

A good company will make good F2P games or good P2P games, in either case there's no strife as the P2P game will be alive and kicking keeping its head above the water, the good F2P game will flourish.

A crap company will make games destined to all be F2P and if you're lucky some will have a decent system, if not they'll be SWTOR level of bad.

Originally posted by Btk306
Its 15 dollars a month... Jesus christ. Spend less time argueing about it on forums and more time working. Final Fantasy has always been pay to play. Thats the way it is, and those of us who play it prefer it that way.

agree 100% with you . If you break down 15$ a month its 50 cents a day . If you can not afford 50 cents a day , you have far more life issues to deal with then playing a MMO. Simple 

Originally posted by Treabhair

No one has yet to say they can't afford $15 a month.

No one has yet to say they want everything an optional subscriber would get.

No one has said they want a p2w model where people who pay more money get more of an advantage.

Myself and others have on multiple occasions, explained the difference between spending money on F2P vs P2P

Gonna bump part of my previous post since the majority seem to have missed it.

Gonna add that this isn't about the cost of the game, it's about the restrictiveness of it's model and the psychological differences between b2p / f2p and p2p in the feeling of choice that they offer. I prefer to choose how much I reward a developer, rather than being forced to pay a monthly fee for access to a game that might not deserve quite that much support, or may deserve much more. To me it's a way we the players can better support a good practice vs a poor one.

Also adding that this thread wasn't made to try and change a game that will be released P2P, but rather to discuss the idea of a model that could potentially cater to a wider audience by bringing two demographics together.

Also @ Ghavrigg   As mentioned in my opening post, I agree that there should be limitations in how non subscribers can contribute to the community. Something like a world/area chat channel or even servers that are only accessible to subscribers is one of a few things that I believe would work to create seperate communities within a game. One of FFXI's strengths was the communities and relationships between those communities that it created. I find it fairly hilarious that at the release of Rising, En Masse had to add a prompt explaining how to turn off global chat in Tera.

Also to many others, I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees the irony in so many of these posts.

Originally posted by Treabhair

Originally posted by Treabhair

No one has yet to say they can't afford $15 a month.

No one has yet to say they want everything an optional subscriber would get.

No one has said they want a p2w model where people who pay more money get more of an advantage.

Myself and others have on multiple occasions, explained the difference between spending money on F2P vs P2P

 

Gonna bump part of my previous post since the majority seem to have missed it.

 

Gonna add that this isn't about the cost of the game, it's about the restrictiveness of it's model and the psychological differences between b2p / f2p and p2p in the feeling of choice that they offer. I prefer to choose how much I reward a developer, rather than being forced to pay a monthly fee for access to a game that might not deserve quite that much support, or may deserve much more. To me it's a way we the players can better support a good practice vs a poor one.

 

Also adding that this thread wasn't made to try and change a game that will be released P2P, but rather to discuss the idea of a model that could potentially cater to a wider audience by bringing two demographics together.

 

Also @ Ghavrigg   As mentioned in my opening post, I agree that there should be limitations in how non subscribers can contribute to the community. Something like a world/area chat channel or even servers that are only accessible to subscribers is one of a few things that I believe would work to create seperate communities within a game. One of FFXI's strengths was the communities and relationships between those communities that it created. I find it fairly hilarious that at the release of Rising, En Masse had to add a prompt explaining how to turn off global chat in Tera.

 

Also to many others, I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees the irony in so many of these posts.

What irony, you have your opinions and they have theirs.  You prefer it one way for your reasons and they prefer it another way for their reasons.  What's the irony in that?

Originally posted by vandal5627

Originally posted by Treabhair

Originally posted by Treabhair

No one has yet to say they can't afford $15 a month.

No one has yet to say they want everything an optional subscriber would get.

No one has said they want a p2w model where people who pay more money get more of an advantage.

Myself and others have on multiple occasions, explained the difference between spending money on F2P vs P2P

 

Gonna bump part of my previous post since the majority seem to have missed it.

 

Gonna add that this isn't about the cost of the game, it's about the restrictiveness of it's model and the psychological differences between b2p / f2p and p2p in the feeling of choice that they offer. I prefer to choose how much I reward a developer, rather than being forced to pay a monthly fee for access to a game that might not deserve quite that much support, or may deserve much more. To me it's a way we the players can better support a good practice vs a poor one.

 

Also adding that this thread wasn't made to try and change a game that will be released P2P, but rather to discuss the idea of a model that could potentially cater to a wider audience by bringing two demographics together.

 

Also @ Ghavrigg   As mentioned in my opening post, I agree that there should be limitations in how non subscribers can contribute to the community. Something like a world/area chat channel or even servers that are only accessible to subscribers is one of a few things that I believe would work to create seperate communities within a game. One of FFXI's strengths was the communities and relationships between those communities that it created. I find it fairly hilarious that at the release of Rising, En Masse had to add a prompt explaining how to turn off global chat in Tera.

 

Also to many others, I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees the irony in so many of these posts.

 

What irony, you have your opinions and they have theirs.  You prefer it one way for your reasons and they prefer it another way for their reasons.  What's the irony in that?

Irony in their posts being: Some of the posts cite F2P communities as being crap or F2Pers as being freeloading no-gooders or something like that, the problem is most P2Per posts do not countradict that minority, Hell in some cases they back it up tacitly which in turn shows that the P2P community is no better than the F2P community most are trying to discredit because while F2Pers openly admit they have some pretty annoying, aggravating, childish people in their midst the P2P community enables those with discriminatory tendencies based purely on cultural biases. Some people live off of 1-2 $ per day yet they have net access, electricity and a ancient PC which could barely run 2008 era games graphics (which basically means it can run most current mmos somewhat), are you gonna tell that person that they can't enjoy a game because they can't give between 1/4 of the money they'd need for the entire month? Christ people these days with horse vision and biases really need to stop and think beyond they're own selves.

Originally posted by Dihoru

Originally posted by vandal5627

Originally posted by Treabhair

Originally posted by Treabhair

No one has yet to say they can't afford $15 a month.

No one has yet to say they want everything an optional subscriber would get.

No one has said they want a p2w model where people who pay more money get more of an advantage.

Myself and others have on multiple occasions, explained the difference between spending money on F2P vs P2P

 

Gonna bump part of my previous post since the majority seem to have missed it.

 

Gonna add that this isn't about the cost of the game, it's about the restrictiveness of it's model and the psychological differences between b2p / f2p and p2p in the feeling of choice that they offer. I prefer to choose how much I reward a developer, rather than being forced to pay a monthly fee for access to a game that might not deserve quite that much support, or may deserve much more. To me it's a way we the players can better support a good practice vs a poor one.

 

Also adding that this thread wasn't made to try and change a game that will be released P2P, but rather to discuss the idea of a model that could potentially cater to a wider audience by bringing two demographics together.

 

Also @ Ghavrigg   As mentioned in my opening post, I agree that there should be limitations in how non subscribers can contribute to the community. Something like a world/area chat channel or even servers that are only accessible to subscribers is one of a few things that I believe would work to create seperate communities within a game. One of FFXI's strengths was the communities and relationships between those communities that it created. I find it fairly hilarious that at the release of Rising, En Masse had to add a prompt explaining how to turn off global chat in Tera.

 

Also to many others, I'm glad I'm not the only one who sees the irony in so many of these posts.

 

What irony, you have your opinions and they have theirs.  You prefer it one way for your reasons and they prefer it another way for their reasons.  What's the irony in that?

Irony in their posts being: Some of the posts cite F2P communities as being crap or F2Pers as being freeloading no-gooders or something like that, the problem is most P2Per posts do not countradict that minority, Hell in some cases they back it up tacitly which in turn shows that the P2P community is no better than the F2P community most are trying to discredit because while F2Pers openly admit they have some pretty annoying, aggravating, childish people in their midst the P2P community enables those with discriminatory tendencies based purely on cultural biases. Some people live off of 1-2 $ per day yet they have net access, electricity and a ancient PC which could barely run 2008 era games graphics (which basically means it can run most current mmos somewhat), are you gonna tell that person that they can't enjoy a game because they can't give between 1/4 of the money they'd need for the entire month? Christ people these days with horse vision and biases really need to stop and think beyond they're own selves.

 Huh?  That's not irony bro, it's still just a difference in opinions.  You prefer your FTP games for your reasons, they have their reasons to prefer a PTP model.

If people are living off of 1-2 dollars per day they might want to set their priorities straight.  You mean to tell me companies should waste all that money making their games so these people can play?  I get it, you prefer FTP games, nothing wrong with that but don't descredit other peoples opinions just because they don't aggree with you.

Looks like you're the one with horse vision and bias towards your own opionion.