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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » Foundational Principle #8 This should be a chaotic game

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34 posts found
  Tadder

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/13
Posts: 38

 
OP  2/26/13 2:34:21 PM#1
http://citystateentertainment.com/2013/02/foundational-principle-8/
  dkabib

Novice Member

Joined: 11/14/11
Posts: 6

2/26/13 2:43:20 PM#2

I really liked this one, randomized stuff is very interesting.

 

I'm really looking forward to see what the game will look like, i'm a Warhammer veteran (played for over 3 years) and really need to get into a RvR game again, one that will be all about grouping with your realm fellas and siege anything you want, wuthout needing to go for dungeon runs that only takes the fun away (at least for me, who loves RvR).

 

Curious about Kickstart, what are we going to see there? I'm ready to donate and make this game becomes reality! 

 

This isn't hype, this is fate.

Thx to MJ for bringing some fate to the heart of RvR players like me and my fellow War veterans.

  tlear

Novice Member

Joined: 12/15/07
Posts: 143

2/26/13 2:53:55 PM#3
I have big reservations about randomess in the combat system, world randomness is great but combat randomness.. not a fan at all.
  Ice-Queen

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/02/08
Posts: 2435

"Always borrow money from a pessimist. They won't expect it back."

2/26/13 3:01:14 PM#4
Another good one, I like where his ideas are going still. Wouldn't it be funny if you had a critical miss on someone and say you broke your sword, or your bow broke causing you to do half damage, heh. Would be an interesting fight after that.  Or perhaps you both have been fighting so long you get fatiqued and just go into a fist fight, lol.

What happens when you log off your characters????.....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GFQhfhnjYMk
Dark Age of Camelot

  Raagnarz

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/13/12
Posts: 232

2/26/13 3:07:18 PM#5
What makes a good fight memorable, is the thrill of not knowing the outcome beforehand. In most games when it comes to pvp I detest the fact that unless I go afk I'll kill a guy a level or two lower. The fact that a newer player has a "puncher's chance" is always good to hear. I don't want predetermined outcomes. I like randomness in combat since I don't like the expected to happen 100% of the time.
  Hycoo

Novice Member

Joined: 6/14/11
Posts: 208

2/26/13 3:10:50 PM#6
Originally posted by tlear
I have big reservations about randomess in the combat system, world randomness is great but combat randomness.. not a fan at all.

Yeah i agree. A part of skill in combat should imo be to know if you have the odds on your side, and to know what to do to win (who to target, how to position yourself).

Randomness in encounters and terrain i love tho.

On a side note: I would not mind for you to build your character towards randomness. A trait could be higher chance to critical hit, but also critical failure, and there could be other traits that serve a similar purpose. There could also be some skills that have more random damage than other skills. But imo making it for everyone just seems... pointless. It should rather be a way to build your character.

  Fearum

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/15/11
Posts: 1089

2/26/13 3:21:05 PM#7
I like the statement about the land will be affected by players actions. Sounds like there will be areas where magic is powerful and others where it will be almost useless, makes for a good mix for melee characters. Also anything random in a game is always great. If there is a very small chance of having something backfire or miss it always makes it a bit more interesting.  
  Hycoo

Novice Member

Joined: 6/14/11
Posts: 208

2/26/13 3:26:19 PM#8

I hope to see a lot of variations in terrains that gives different bonuses/disadvantages/challenges. Desert storms, pitch black forests, ice cold tundras etc. 

Also looking forward to the next blog post.

  Stiler

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

2/26/13 3:26:50 PM#9

THe idea of critical missing is nice, it reminds me of some great humorous moments I had playing the first Fallout game. Having a party member critical miss, hit himself, then flee from combat in the very first combat I got into with him in my party and I'm left to take on the enemy alone and barely won.

Hopefully the idea behind it stays in the game an dpeople don't complain too much about it/whine to the point it gets taken out.

  Tadder

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/13
Posts: 38

 
OP  2/26/13 3:30:33 PM#10
Originally posted by Fearum
I like the statement about the land will be affected by players actions. Sounds like there will be areas where magic is powerful and others where it will be almost useless, makes for a good mix for melee characters. Also anything random in a game is always great. If there is a very small chance of having something backfire or miss it always makes it a bit more interesting.  

Agreed, i thought this concept was really interesting. Terrain doesn't seem to impact most MMO PvP over the last few years as much as it once did. In SWG, going up hills considerably slowed your speed, and could be used as a strategic point. Now, basically anything short of an ocean or castle wall is treated the same.

Would be really cool to see deserts / wooded areas move around the map (as they do IRL), and have perhaps sand reduce movement speed or forests provide LOS issues.

Say you've been assaulting a keep for a week and then you wake up one morning and the flooded area that's been impeeding one of your approaches has suddenly dried up and become perfect to throw some ladders and battering rams on.

Also, if we get climatic effects we can all go around saying Winter is Coming.

  MightyPit

Novice Member

Joined: 11/21/02
Posts: 88

2/26/13 3:33:06 PM#11

whooohooo. Awesome principle. But this landscape forming thing, is this really doable with a small team and small budget? True changes of in the environment (like blowing away a hill or something like that) would be something brand new (in an mmo), if I understand it right.

 

 

MMO's played so far:
UO,EQ,DAOC,EQ2,GW,ROM,WOW,WAR,AOC,LOTRO,RIFT,TSW,GW2,POE
Looking forward to: Camelot Unchained, Star Citizen

  meddyck

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/18/08
Posts: 1132

2/26/13 3:49:12 PM#12
There are some interesting ideas there. I am fine with a bit of variance in how much damage spells do. I'm not so sure about stuff like (to use Mark's example) a spell backfiring and turning you into a horned rabbit (well unless it's a really dangerous and powerful horned rabbit). If that happened to me at a critical moment in a fight causing me and/or my group to lose, that sounds like it would be a rage quit/cancel situation. Dynamic zone changes... sure that could be fun.

Camelot Unchained Founder
DAOC [retired]: R11 Cleric R11 Druid R11 Minstrel R9 Eldritch R6 Sorc R6 Scout R5 Healer

  Stiler

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

2/26/13 4:00:41 PM#13
Originally posted by MightyPit

whooohooo. Awesome principle. But this landscape forming thing, is this really doable with a small team and small budget? True changes of in the environment (like blowing away a hill or something like that) would be something brand new (in an mmo), if I understand it right.

 

 

 

Asherons Calll changed it's enviornment with monthly updates from time to time, adding seasons (snow in area's where it was previously bare/green, where snow had depth, etc) among story element changes to the enviornment and such.

 

It can be done, it's just a matter of them developing the tools and a good way to do it without it being a huge undertaking everytime they want to change or alter the landscape in some way.

 

  tokesh

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 43

2/26/13 4:05:37 PM#14
Game is progressively sounding dumber
  Tierless

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2111

joie de vivre

2/26/13 4:06:36 PM#15

I love it. This is lacking from so many games now days. I was a guy that always played for the rare surprise. I have 1 good example.

In fire pro wrestling you can KO and opponent, but it's very rare. My friend and I had numerous matches and we always played 15-30 minute matches and we had never seen a ko. In an especially intense match he and I battled for 38 minutes, we hit one another with everything numerous times but for some reason (randomness) we kept kicking out. He went to his me with his finisher for the umteenth time (a running jumping big boot). I saw it coming, hit the ropes and came off with a flying overhand right which landed on him just as he was in mid air and KOd him. We both jumped up in excitement and shock.

On the other end, I went into a match against the computer once, about 3 minutes in I go to tie up and he gets his DDT off first and I got KOd. I'm the kinda guy that appreciates the moment so I was almsot just as excited and even more shocked. It's the stuff of gamer legend that we talk about at e-parties amongst other gamers.

In the end thats really what its about right? Random things that you can't predict, that aren't scripted, than give you a story to tell. No matter how good a scripted dungeon is, it's the same experience everyone else is having which takes it from being an experience into being a movie you went to see. I don't like going to movies, I like making movies as I fight my way through a pvp mmo.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  OgreRaper

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/11
Posts: 381

2/26/13 4:10:05 PM#16

I love unpredictability in games <3

One of the reasons MMO's get stale is because you do in fact know what's gonna happen all the time. I embrace the chaos!

  PerfArt

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/13
Posts: 864

2/26/13 4:16:35 PM#17
I like it, just like I have liked every Foundation Principle up until now. Everyone should feel some element of danger when going into combat (imo).

However, these are all just principles. Grand ideas. I really hope they are manifest in the final product, especially since this will be the first Kickstarter I will be funding for more than $20.

Totally in, balls-deep.

http://www.mmorpg.com/blogs/PerfArt

  Odaman

Novice Member

Joined: 2/17/13
Posts: 195

2/26/13 4:27:13 PM#18

This one has me a bit worried. He's right though, randomness can create epic moments. I remember killing a fairly balanced (all melee+healers) hib group solo on my savage because of a massive amount of evades.... at the same time I remember taking my r10 sb and getting wrecked by a r3 saracen s/s pally because he blocked/parried 20+ times in a row without using engage. Either way it's not make or break since many mmos are random.... gw2 is random in the worst way (7+ effects to choose from on some abilities QQ).

The terrain stuff sounds great. 

  waynejr2

Elite Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 3732

RIP City of Heroes!

2/26/13 4:30:15 PM#19
Originally posted by Hycoo
Originally posted by tlear
I have big reservations about randomess in the combat system, world randomness is great but combat randomness.. not a fan at all.

Yeah i agree. A part of skill in combat should imo be to know if you have the odds on your side, and to know what to do to win (who to target, how to position yourself).

Randomness in encounters and terrain i love tho.

On a side note: I would not mind for you to build your character towards randomness. A trait could be higher chance to critical hit, but also critical failure, and there could be other traits that serve a similar purpose. There could also be some skills that have more random damage than other skills. But imo making it for everyone just seems... pointless. It should rather be a way to build your character.

 I understand you really only want to get into a fight where you are certain of winning.  That is why zerg is popular.

  Father_Jack

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/15/13
Posts: 84

2/26/13 4:30:43 PM#20

I personally like a bit of randomness. I remember in Daoc running into a random purple mob in a bunch of blues and how forever after it kept me on my toes.

I don't mind random crits, I like the unpredictability of it. But most people I know hate random crits, thier argument is it masks over a players skill. If you can't count on a certain dps it makes strats really hard. I don't agree but it's an argument I've heard.

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