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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » I think game should have unlimited free trial. Oh god plz read before shooting

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68 posts found
  Hokibukisa

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/06
Posts: 190

 
OP  2/23/13 8:11:13 PM#1

EDIT: I changed title from free to play, to having unlimited free trial because people can't be arsed to read.

NOT free to play, unlimited free trial.

 

The quickest way I can say it without you shooting me is that there are members and there are non-members, I'm not talking about a cash shop. Some pay, some don't. Oh god put the gun down Mark!

I know what you're thinking, pay to win. I know that feeling of thinking, maybe that guy has an advantage because he spends more money than me. Thats why I say subscriber based free to play. Same model that Mark already described, just with an extra range of free. No buying diamonds. No buying station cash. No buying boosters. You're either a subscriber, or your not.

 

Assuming I've calmed your fury, let me explain why the game should be free. As games age they lose customers, especially niche games. I currently play planetside and most people play it for free or are at least not members. I'm both a member and only play with a 50% boost up. I'm one of the whales that f2p's rely on, and let me point out that most of us here, assuming we will fund the kickstarter, are whales as well, we're just whales by a different premise.

 

In games where the entertainment is provided by other players, and if there isn't entertainment then people quit the game, then its worth allowing people to play the game for free, if for no other reason than to provide entertainment to your paying subscribers.

I know what would happen to PS2 if they made it no longer f2p, they'd lose most of the playerbase and that would provide the remaining customers to lose interest. A similar effect would happen if they changed it from f2p to pay2win, and they are very different and specific to the game at hand.

 

Lets take a game we're familiar with and apply f2p subcription funded. Daoc subscribers continue to get the same thing they do now, nothing changes. Though a free player would see inconveniences introduced.

Hell you could even put your free players to work for you and have them solve problems that you can't solve yourself. As a developer you can't tell you paying customers not to play on a realm and server thats too overpopulated, but you can tell your free players to go play a realm and server that needs them.

And of course don't progress as fast.

 

And get extremely limited access to the game until they get a sponcor. (just someone to vouch for them not being a gold farmer or cheater)

  Satarious

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/06/08
Posts: 1059

2/23/13 8:16:52 PM#2
Originally posted by Hokibukisa

The quickest way I can say it without you shooting me is that there are members and there are non-members, I'm not talking about a cash shop. Some pay, some don't. Oh god put the gun down Mark!

I know what you're thinking, pay to win. I know that feeling of thinking, maybe that guy has an advantage because he spends more money than me. Thats why I say subscriber based free to play. Same model that Mark already described, just with an extra range of free. No buying diamonds. No buying station cash. No buying boosters. You're either a subscriber, or your not.

 

Assuming I've calmed your fury, let me explain why the game should be free. As games age they lose customers, especially niche games. I currently play planetside and most people play it for free or are at least not members. I'm both a member and only play with a 50% boost up. I'm one of the whales that f2p's rely on, and let me point out that most of us here, assuming we will fund the kickstarter, are whales as well, we're just whales by a different premise.

 

In games where the entertainment is provided by other players, and if there isn't entertainment then people quit the game, then its worth allowing people to play the game for free, if for no other reason than to provide entertainment to your paying subscribers.

I know what would happen to PS2 if they made it no longer f2p, they'd lose most of the playerbase and that would provide the remaining customers to lose interest. A similar effect would happen if they changed it from f2p to pay2win, and they are very different and specific to the game at hand.

 

Lets take a game we're familiar with and apply f2p subcription funded. Daoc subscribers continue to get the same thing they do now, nothing changes. Though a free player would see inconveniences introduced.

Hell you could even put your free players to work for you and have them solve problems that you can't solve yourself. As a developer you can't tell you paying customers not to play on a realm and server thats too overpopulated, but you can tell your free players to go play a realm and server that needs them.

And of course don't progress as fast.

 

And get extremely limited access to the game until they get a sponcor. (just someone to vouch for them not being a gold farmer or cheater)

I don't agree with this.  F2P is just a recipe for eventual pay-to-win.  If anything, a subscription model will weed out all the anti-social kiddie element that destroys community in all the other mmos.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c

  waynejr2

Elite Member

Joined: 4/12/11
Posts: 4315

RIP City of Heroes!

2/23/13 8:31:20 PM#3
Originally posted by Hokibukisa

The quickest way I can say it without you shooting me is that there are members and there are non-members, I'm not talking about a cash shop. Some pay, some don't. Oh god put the gun down Mark!

I know what you're thinking, pay to win. I know that feeling of thinking, maybe that guy has an advantage because he spends more money than me. Thats why I say subscriber based free to play. Same model that Mark already described, just with an extra range of free. No buying diamonds. No buying station cash. No buying boosters. You're either a subscriber, or your not.

 

Assuming I've calmed your fury, let me explain why the game should be free. As games age they lose customers, especially niche games. I currently play planetside and most people play it for free or are at least not members. I'm both a member and only play with a 50% boost up. I'm one of the whales that f2p's rely on, and let me point out that most of us here, assuming we will fund the kickstarter, are whales as well, we're just whales by a different premise.

 

In games where the entertainment is provided by other players, and if there isn't entertainment then people quit the game, then its worth allowing people to play the game for free, if for no other reason than to provide entertainment to your paying subscribers.

I know what would happen to PS2 if they made it no longer f2p, they'd lose most of the playerbase and that would provide the remaining customers to lose interest. A similar effect would happen if they changed it from f2p to pay2win, and they are very different and specific to the game at hand.

 

Lets take a game we're familiar with and apply f2p subcription funded. Daoc subscribers continue to get the same thing they do now, nothing changes. Though a free player would see inconveniences introduced.

Hell you could even put your free players to work for you and have them solve problems that you can't solve yourself. As a developer you can't tell you paying customers not to play on a realm and server thats too overpopulated, but you can tell your free players to go play a realm and server that needs them.

And of course don't progress as fast.

 

And get extremely limited access to the game until they get a sponcor. (just someone to vouch for them not being a gold farmer or cheater)

 So what you want us to know is that you are a BIGSHOT WHALE who is begging for this game to be free to play?  Am I correct about this?

http://www.youhaventlived.com/qblog/2010/QBlog190810A.html

  Yizle

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/24/10
Posts: 531

2/23/13 8:40:01 PM#4
So far none of that post makes me want this game F2P. If it was not a pvp title then sure go for the cash shop. But too many companies like the P2W formula and that is not what I want in a pvp game.
  Stiler

Novice Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

2/23/13 8:47:34 PM#5

Personally, I think a F2p has it's advantages, and in the ver changing market I see mor eand more mmo's moving toward the F2p model, or at the least a buy once and pay nothing else (a la Guild Wars 2).

There's a reason that the big mmo's recently that used the old subscriber method have switched over (SW:TOR, The Secret World, Tera, Aion, etc).

Having ai game be free to play, ensures that ...well people play it, if it costs them nothing, or only a one-time fee they'll mor elikely to play, and keep playing even if they might have "cancelled" if they were using a subscription mehtod.

Plus it brings in more new members then if it requires a subscription, more people to try it out, etc.

If it were to be F2p though, it would have to f2p and not PAY TO WIn, huge difference. F2p games should be built around costmetic items and other thing slike that, nothing that affects gameplay in any way shape or form.

  Satarious

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/06/08
Posts: 1059

2/23/13 8:52:45 PM#6
Originally posted by Stiler

Personally, I think a F2p has it's advantages, and in the ver changing market I see mor eand more mmo's moving toward the F2p model, or at the least a buy once and pay nothing else (a la Guild Wars 2).

There's a reason that the big mmo's recently that used the old subscriber method have switched over (SW:TOR, The Secret World, Tera, Aion, etc).

Having ai game be free to play, ensures that ...well people play it, if it costs them nothing, or only a one-time fee they'll mor elikely to play, and keep playing even if they might have "cancelled" if they were using a subscription mehtod.

 

Plus it brings in more new members then if it requires a subscription, more people to try it out, etc.

You know which game hasn't (and probably never will) switched over to f2p?  World of Warcraft.  F2p just smacks of desperation to get people to play a very flawed game.   And those cash shops just rub me the wrong way.  If the game is fun to play and polished, people will play it no matter if it's f2p, b2p, subscription, etc.  Subscription just seems more natural in terms of immersion because you're not using real world cash to purchase advantages in the game.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c

  ThomasN7

Novice Member

Joined: 3/17/07
Posts: 6685

"Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” - Mordin Solus

2/23/13 9:06:44 PM#7
No thanks I'll pass on f2p. We do not need this game tainted by a pay to win philosophy. We're going old school with a monthly fee and the game will be skill based. Thank you! :D
  Grunch

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/05
Posts: 520

2/23/13 9:18:05 PM#8
Pay to Win is a big turn off for me. I have played games like WoT and the new Mechwarrior Online and though being fun games, the whole pay to win aspect makes me not log in anymore. I would rather pay a monthly fee for unlimited game time/experience and have to work hard IN GAME to obtain my advantages and not rely on my wallet in order to win.

"I'm sorry but your mmo has been diagnosed with EA and only has X number of days to live."

  Raagnarz

Novice Member

Joined: 7/13/12
Posts: 273

2/23/13 9:35:19 PM#9

No just No. I don't mind a buy to play model but there has only been 1 game ever that has been free to play with a model I support and that is the recently released Path Of Exile. F2P in general is a pox on the gamming community. It forces dev's to try to milk a small % of customers to support themselves. This eventually leads to pay to win to get those same small % of customers continually paying.

 

Not to mention F2P destroying the realm pride community building this game is trying to attract. The majority of people interested in this game are because it smacks of old school tight knit community. The older school mmo crowd have the disposable income available and would be more than happy to pay monthly for this. If it bars entry from "freeloader" type players I'm all for it.

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7681

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

2/23/13 9:40:53 PM#10
[mod edit]
  Stiler

Novice Member

Joined: 10/19/05
Posts: 599

2/23/13 9:44:50 PM#11
Originally posted by Satarious
Originally posted by Stiler

Personally, I think a F2p has it's advantages, and in the ver changing market I see mor eand more mmo's moving toward the F2p model, or at the least a buy once and pay nothing else (a la Guild Wars 2).

There's a reason that the big mmo's recently that used the old subscriber method have switched over (SW:TOR, The Secret World, Tera, Aion, etc).

Having ai game be free to play, ensures that ...well people play it, if it costs them nothing, or only a one-time fee they'll mor elikely to play, and keep playing even if they might have "cancelled" if they were using a subscription mehtod.

 

Plus it brings in more new members then if it requires a subscription, more people to try it out, etc.

You know which game hasn't (and probably never will) switched over to f2p?  World of Warcraft.  F2p just smacks of desperation to get people to play a very flawed game.   And those cash shops just rub me the wrong way.  If the game is fun to play and polished, people will play it no matter if it's f2p, b2p, subscription, etc.  Subscription just seems more natural in terms of immersion because you're not using real world cash to purchase advantages in the game.

World of Warcraft has a free trial (play up to level 20 bascially),

WoW is not an "average" mmo, in terms of it's success, this is the mindset that has led to so many downfalls of mmo's that have tried to chase that big pie in the sky, thinking they'll get 10million people playing.

WoW bascially took the standard mmo formula set foruth by EQ (as far as 3d mmo's go) and polished it, while cherry picking a few things here and there fromother mmo's. Blizzard themeslves has a HUGE fanbase, and unlike many game developers, they have a foothold in both the western market as well as the eastern market. Most game companies would be lucky to have a good market in one or the other.

There's a reason peolpe don't leave WoW to play other mmo's, if those mmo's are just bascialyl like WoW (basic gameplay/design) why would they leave WoW, where they've sunk in 100's of hours, have friends/guild, etc to play antoher mmo? Most people might try a new one for a month, see that it's "basically like WoW" then either stop playing because they are bored of that style of mmo (like I am) or go back to WoW, where they've already worked hard to get to the top and have friends that play it.

Blizzard has no need to go free to play because of their current market share in the mmo genre, you can bet your pants though if their sub numbers drop years from now, they'll go that route.

F2P has it's place (it's especialyl popular in the eastern marketplace) and growing more and more popular in the west. League of Legends is a prime example of this, one of the most played online games and it's f2p, with them making a killing on costmetic items. Anything else (like heroes) you can get by simply playing the game without spending a single cent. There's no "pay to win" advantage.

Originally posted by Normandy7
No thanks I'll pass on f2p. We do not need this game tainted by a pay to win philosophy. We're going old school with a monthly fee and the game will be skill based. Thank you! :D
Originally posted by Grunch
Pay to Win is a big turn off for me. I have played games like WoT and the new Mechwarrior Online and though being fun games, the whole pay to win aspect makes me not log in anymore. I would rather pay a monthly fee for unlimited game time/experience and have to work hard IN GAME to obtain my advantages and not rely on my wallet in order to win.

 

Op is talking about free to play, this does not mean it has to be "pay to win" and infact pay to win is usualyl a big turn off for  a lot of free to play people. There are other ways f2p games can make money (costmetic items, etc) or offering things that you can purchase but still get in-game, that just take more time to get.

IE - In league of legends for example you can buy heroes with real money (called riot points, or rp) or you can simply play games, which earn you influence points, which you can use to purchase the same heroes. so bascially people can choose to skip that time investment and buy a hero instead of playing the game and earning the ip to do so.

 

 

 

  Tierless

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/08
Posts: 2150

joie de vivre

2/23/13 10:07:30 PM#12

It should be free to purchase...as long as you donate $60 to KS. I prefer paying a monthly to a smaller company since I know it goes to good places.

mmorpg.com/blogs/Xobdnas

  Vannor

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/11/03
Posts: 3035

2/23/13 10:17:19 PM#13
Doesn't the name "Unchained" suggest it will be free to play?
  Qallidexz

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/12
Posts: 269

2/23/13 11:19:58 PM#14
Originally posted by Hokibukisa

The quickest way I can say it without you shooting me is that there are members and there are non-members, I'm not talking about a cash shop. Some pay, some don't. Oh god put the gun down Mark!

I know what you're thinking, pay to win. I know that feeling of thinking, maybe that guy has an advantage because he spends more money than me. Thats why I say subscriber based free to play. Same model that Mark already described, just with an extra range of free. No buying diamonds. No buying station cash. No buying boosters. You're either a subscriber, or your not.

 

Assuming I've calmed your fury, let me explain why the game should be free. As games age they lose customers, especially niche games. I currently play planetside and most people play it for free or are at least not members. I'm both a member and only play with a 50% boost up. I'm one of the whales that f2p's rely on, and let me point out that most of us here, assuming we will fund the kickstarter, are whales as well, we're just whales by a different premise.

 

In games where the entertainment is provided by other players, and if there isn't entertainment then people quit the game, then its worth allowing people to play the game for free, if for no other reason than to provide entertainment to your paying subscribers.

I know what would happen to PS2 if they made it no longer f2p, they'd lose most of the playerbase and that would provide the remaining customers to lose interest. A similar effect would happen if they changed it from f2p to pay2win, and they are very different and specific to the game at hand.

 

Lets take a game we're familiar with and apply f2p subcription funded. Daoc subscribers continue to get the same thing they do now, nothing changes. Though a free player would see inconveniences introduced.

Hell you could even put your free players to work for you and have them solve problems that you can't solve yourself. As a developer you can't tell you paying customers not to play on a realm and server thats too overpopulated, but you can tell your free players to go play a realm and server that needs them.

And of course don't progress as fast.

 

And get extremely limited access to the game until they get a sponcor. (just someone to vouch for them not being a gold farmer or cheater)

If you can't afford $15 a month, you really shouldn't be investing your time in an MMO. People working at McDonalds can come up with $15 a month, grow up...

  Qallidexz

Novice Member

Joined: 5/24/12
Posts: 269

2/23/13 11:22:32 PM#15
Originally posted by Vannor
Doesn't the name "Unchained" suggest it will be free to play?

Nope.

  JimmyYO

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/11
Posts: 541

2/23/13 11:25:13 PM#16
F2P is an illusion that draws developer attention off the game and on to toys.
  Smorak

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 62

What man is a man that does not make the world better?

2/23/13 11:31:20 PM#17

To be completely honest, the League of Legends F2P is probably the best one around.  Riot points primarily are used for access to skins and champions.  It's not a pay to win system.  It's merely a pay to look the best system.

 

However, unless CU is going to release new classes and races on a bi-weekly basis, the Riot system cannot be implemented into your typical mmo.

  Hokibukisa

Novice Member

Joined: 3/25/06
Posts: 190

 
OP  2/23/13 11:31:38 PM#18
I'm getting the impression that exactly 1 person read the post since everyone is referencing pay to win.

  Baramos79

Novice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 69

2/23/13 11:32:54 PM#19

Well MJ disagrees with that sub model.

 

/thread

  Smorak

Novice Member

Joined: 2/01/07
Posts: 62

What man is a man that does not make the world better?

2/23/13 11:35:46 PM#20
Originally posted by Qallidexz
Originally posted by Hokibukisa

The quickest way I can say it without you shooting me is that there are members and there are non-members, I'm not talking about a cash shop. Some pay, some don't. Oh god put the gun down Mark!

I know what you're thinking, pay to win. I know that feeling of thinking, maybe that guy has an advantage because he spends more money than me. Thats why I say subscriber based free to play. Same model that Mark already described, just with an extra range of free. No buying diamonds. No buying station cash. No buying boosters. You're either a subscriber, or your not.

 

Assuming I've calmed your fury, let me explain why the game should be free. As games age they lose customers, especially niche games. I currently play planetside and most people play it for free or are at least not members. I'm both a member and only play with a 50% boost up. I'm one of the whales that f2p's rely on, and let me point out that most of us here, assuming we will fund the kickstarter, are whales as well, we're just whales by a different premise.

 

In games where the entertainment is provided by other players, and if there isn't entertainment then people quit the game, then its worth allowing people to play the game for free, if for no other reason than to provide entertainment to your paying subscribers.

I know what would happen to PS2 if they made it no longer f2p, they'd lose most of the playerbase and that would provide the remaining customers to lose interest. A similar effect would happen if they changed it from f2p to pay2win, and they are very different and specific to the game at hand.

 

Lets take a game we're familiar with and apply f2p subcription funded. Daoc subscribers continue to get the same thing they do now, nothing changes. Though a free player would see inconveniences introduced.

Hell you could even put your free players to work for you and have them solve problems that you can't solve yourself. As a developer you can't tell you paying customers not to play on a realm and server thats too overpopulated, but you can tell your free players to go play a realm and server that needs them.

And of course don't progress as fast.

 

And get extremely limited access to the game until they get a sponcor. (just someone to vouch for them not being a gold farmer or cheater)

If you can't afford $15 a month, you really shouldn't be investing your time in an MMO. People working at McDonalds can come up with $15 a month, grow up...

Cut grass, shovel a driveway, give out HJ's at the bus station... $15 a month is nothing.

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