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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Definitely another bad year for MMORPGs.

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164 posts found
  sportsfan

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/20/12
Posts: 382

2/19/13 5:28:11 PM#121

I compare 2012 with 2008.

Huge expectations, hardly any delivery. AoC and WAR back then, SW TOR and GW2 now.

If GW2 had a sub, it would hardly be played.

2012 was the year of the Rat: everything drowned unless they went free to play. (well except WoW and EVE and a few stranded symbolic preachers in 15% of the initial Rift servers).

The subscription market ended for any would be's.

Even this guy ended his activity: http://mmodata.blogspot.be/

  Yamota

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/05/03
Posts: 6521

"I fight so you don't have to."

2/19/13 5:31:42 PM#122

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

  snapfusion

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/17/11
Posts: 976

2/19/13 7:00:51 PM#123
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5620

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

2/19/13 9:04:39 PM#124
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  taus01

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/12/06
Posts: 1419

 
OP  2/19/13 9:40:28 PM#125
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

 

Care to share your sources for all this research, because the sources i read say different. If you just spend 5 minutes on google you find that your statement is completely false. You can't just come here and make stuff up to fit your agenda. You are going to be called out on it, thats how forums work, buddy.

 

"The 'high-level thinking' skills of 14-year-olds are now on a par with those of 12-year-olds in 1976."

"Previous research by Professor Shayer has shown that 11-year-olds' grasp of concepts such as volume, density, quantity and weight appears to have declined over the last 30 years."

"The study reviewed test scores of 800 thirteen- and fourteen-year-olds and compared them with similar tests of teens from 1976, a generation ago. The results? In one test, only one in ten of the current teens tested with top scores, down from one in four twenty years ago. In another, only one in twenty reached the top score compared to one in five from the 1976 batch. Professor Michael Shayer, who lead the study, believes the educational focus on testing (rather than learning) is at least partially to blame."

Here's some more data:

  • The Oklahoma Council of Public Affairs commissioned a civic education poll among public school students. A surprising 77% didn't know that George Washington was the first President; couldn't name Thomas Jefferson as the author of the Declaration of Independence, and only 2.8% of the students actually passed the citizenship test. Along similar lines, the Goldwater Institute of Phoenix did the same survey and only 3.5% of students passed the civics test.
  • On the eve of the Iraq War, 69% of American's thought Saddam Hussein was involved in the 9/11 attacks; four years later, even though proof had been provided that he was not, 34% still believe he was.
  • 18% of Americans still believe that the sun revolves around the earth, according to a Gallup poll.
  • According to another poll, the average American voter believes that U.S. foreign aid consumes 24% of the Federal budget, when it is only 1%.
  • The American Association of State Colleges and Universities report on education shows that the U.S. ranks second among all nations in the proportion of the population aged 35-64 with a college degree, but 19th in the percentage of those aged 25-34 with an associates or high school diploma, which means that for the first time, the educational attainment of young people will be lower than their parents'.
  • In a Newsweek poll, of U.S. citizens, 29% couldn't identify Joe Biden as the Vice President, and 44% couldn't describe the Bill of Rights.
  • In a 2009 survey of a number of European countries and the U.S. on international affairs, a significant majority of Europeans could identify the Taliban, and just over 50% of Americans could, despite the heavy presence of the U.S. in Afghanistan.
  • Researcher Kyung Hee Kim at the College of William & Mary analyzed 300,00 Torrance Creativity Test scores of children and adults in the US. Kim found creativity and IQ scores rose steadily until 1990, and were in decline thereafter, and the most serious decline occurring for the youngest children.
  • In 1966-67, approximately 1.4 million students who took the verbal portion of the S.A.T and a score of 700 or more was achieved by 33,000 students. In 1986-87 over 1.8 million students took the test and a score of 700 or higher was attained by fewer than 14,000.
  • A new global study of educational systems in major nations ranks U.S. 15 year olds 14th in the world in reading skills, 17th in science and 25th (below average) in math.
  • According the 2009 National Assessment of Educational Progress, 68% of public school children in the U.S. do not read proficiently by the time they finish third grade. And the U.S. News & World reported that barely 50% of students are ready for college level reading.
  • Of the 21 countries participating in the Third International Mathematics and Science Study, American high school seniors did better than only 2 countries--Cyprus and South Africa.
  • According to the National Endowment for the Arts report in 1982, 82% of college graduates read novels or poems for pleasure; two decades later only 67% did. And more than 40% of Americans under 44 did not read a single book--fiction or nonfiction--over the course of a year. The proportion of 17 year olds who read nothing (unless required by school ) has doubled between 1984-2004.
  • Renowned T.V. producer Jerry Bruckheimer, who has produced many successful T.V. shows, was once quoted as saying, "it is getting harder and harder to underestimate the intelligence of the American public. It now averages well below the previous 6th grade level."

...and many many more.

"Give players systems and tools instead of rails and rules"

  Zorgo

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/05/05
Posts: 2216

Who did wrong? The advertiser hired to sell the game or the consumer who put faith in advertising?

2/19/13 9:40:39 PM#126
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

I think that warrants at least one link.

And I'd personally remove the word 'forward' from that last line. 

 

  drivendawn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/17/11
Posts: 968

2/19/13 9:53:46 PM#127
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

Love the dig at console players...sigh PC elitests. Other than that have to agree somewhat.

  craftseeker

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/11/09
Posts: 636

2/19/13 10:05:30 PM#128
Originally posted by Zorgo
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

I think that warrants at least one link.

And I'd personally remove the word 'forward' from that last line. 

 

Well IQ scores certainly move up from generation to generation, it is called the Flynn effect.  In general, countries have seen generational increases between 5 and 25 IQ points. However it is debatable as to what IQ score actually measures.

As to the post I have certainly noticed that younger players in general have:

  • less patience
  • less interest in problem solving in MMORPGs
  • a lof of experience in console games and a desire to move features from console games to MMORPGs
  • a desire to avoid playing low level content and move straight to MOBA style end game play
  • a more abusive attitude and a higher tolerance for bad language and intolerent behaviour
  xAPOCx

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/25/12
Posts: 893

2/19/13 10:13:28 PM#129
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/15/research-suggests-humans-are-evolving-to-be-dumber/

 

Just sayin...

  Goatgod76

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/06
Posts: 1226

2/19/13 10:15:31 PM#130
Originally posted by jtcgs

Sorry OP, it will never work.

There are far far too many people that are either consumer whores, consumers who feel they have no power or outright fanboys.

Those are the people most companies target anyway.

I mean, just look at Apple, they became the largest company on the planet via fanboys and consumer whores willing to pay insane prices for slightly above average products that for the most part, are not bringing anything new over the previous iteration they overpaid for last year!

So true....sadly.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

2/19/13 10:17:31 PM#131
Originally posted by xAPOCx
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

http://newsfeed.time.com/2012/11/15/research-suggests-humans-are-evolving-to-be-dumber/

 

Just sayin...

always knew this is where we were headed :P

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=icmRCixQrx8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U8rhIZJAdd0

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  Goatgod76

Novice Member

Joined: 6/24/06
Posts: 1226

2/19/13 10:19:35 PM#132
Originally posted by craftseeker
Originally posted by Zorgo
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by snapfusion
Originally posted by Yamota

Gaming has been on the decline for years. Technically they have become more advanced but the game play has become more and more shallow and less complex. The entire gaming industry has been progressively dumbing down titles.

Why? Well to appeal to the (younger) masses which in general have a short attention span and pretty stupid.

So yeah, this year will be a bad year and every other year until developers start creating better and richer games and have that as a priority instead of just making more and more money.

To further extrapolate on this,

No patience

No problem solving skills

Raised on console gameplay

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

You know who you are? -You are the MMORPG elderly living in a home, gawking out the window and wondering aloud "Where the world has come to?".

The world keeps on moving forward with or without you.

I think that warrants at least one link.

And I'd personally remove the word 'forward' from that last line. 

 

Well IQ scores certainly move up from generation to generation, it is called the Flynn effect.  In general, countries have seen generational increases between 5 and 25 IQ points. However it is debatable as to what IQ score actually measures.

As to the post I have certainly noticed that younger players in general have:

  • less patience
  • less interest in problem solving in MMORPGs
  • a lof of experience in console games and a desire to move features from console games to MMORPGs
  • a desire to avoid playing low level content and move straight to MOBA style end game play
  • a more abusive attitude and a higher tolerance for bad language and intolerent behaviour

Yep. Seems the more technology thrown at people, the less they think for themselves, or do themselves if it can be done for them"conveniently". The more technology, the dumber people get when thinking for themselves is not required in other words.

 

But now you've opened a can or worms.

  azzamasin

Elite Member

Joined: 6/06/12
Posts: 2804

We live in a fantasy world, a world of illusion. The great task in life is to find reality.

2/19/13 10:27:18 PM#133
2012 was an amazing time for MMO's and 2013 will be even better.  Now 2014 on you might have a case but then again theres no other games coming out I am looking forward to, especially titan.  Will never touch a Blizzard product again.

If your idea of a Sandbox is open FFA Full Loot PvP, full crafted world with minimal support for anything combat then your sandbox ideas are bad! Sandbox means open world, non-linear gaming PERIOD!

  Eir_S

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

2/20/13 1:57:44 AM#134
Originally posted by Quirhid

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

haha..... no.  They simply have more information at their fingertips.  Common sense, however, is out the window.

  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5620

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

2/20/13 2:49:09 AM#135
Originally posted by craftseeker
 

Well IQ scores certainly move up from generation to generation, it is called the Flynn effect.  In general, countries have seen generational increases between 5 and 25 IQ points. However it is debatable as to what IQ score actually measures.

As to the post I have certainly noticed that younger players in general have:

  • less patience
  • less interest in problem solving in MMORPGs
  • a lof of experience in console games and a desire to move features from console games to MMORPGs
  • a desire to avoid playing low level content and move straight to MOBA style end game play
  • a more abusive attitude and a higher tolerance for bad language and intolerent behaviour

Yes, what IQ scores measures is debatable, but in the last half a century the improved nutrition has been thought to be atleast the part cause of height increase and intelligence increase. So to some extent, the average height has predicted average intelligence. Then again, I doubt that has had a significant effect for decades now.

All this is, is just oldschoolers trying to feel superior / lashing out. Despite what you say you're quite immature.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5620

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

2/20/13 2:50:09 AM#136
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by Quirhid

And yet all research shows that "kids these days" are smarter than ever...

haha..... no.  They simply have more information at their fingertips.  Common sense, however, is out the window.

From what I read and see from the Internet, its the adults who need a heavy dose of commong sense.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  rafalex007

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/20/13
Posts: 225

2/20/13 2:57:01 AM#137
Originally posted by sportsfan

I compare 2012 with 2008.

Huge expectations, hardly any delivery. AoC and WAR back then, SW TOR and GW2 now.

If GW2 had a sub, it would hardly be played.

2012 was the year of the Rat: everything drowned unless they went free to play. (well except WoW and EVE and a few stranded symbolic preachers in 15% of the initial Rift servers).

The subscription market ended for any would be's.

Even this guy ended his activity: http://mmodata.blogspot.be/

i wounder were did you get this kind of assumbshion

remmber if you dont like dosent mean it bad

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

2/20/13 3:38:14 AM#138
Originally posted by Quirhid
From what I read and see from the Internet, its the adults who need a heavy dose of commong sense.
 

This calls for some Infographics for the attention impaired:

Fundamentally different. Really. Us old folks are vastly superior in every possible way, clearly.

It is interesting that we choose to blame anyone (except ourselves) for how the very first (and then next) computer-literate generation turned out.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

2/20/13 3:52:38 AM#139
Originally posted by Eir_S
Er... not to be pedantic here, but there is no "Massive" in MMORPG, it is "massively" and it goes in tandem with the word mutiplayer, meaning massive amounts of people.. it has nothing to do with world size.  In PoE, do you encounter dozens or hundreds of other players in a zone?

So, every MUD ever marketed is an MMO then?

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  austriacus

Novice Member

Joined: 8/28/07
Posts: 626

2/20/13 4:22:58 AM#140
Originally posted by taus01
Originally posted by Panthien

Since you calling their advertisement flat out lies, I would love to hear some excamples.

Ok, i play your game. Let's take the most recent released big title, Guildwars 2. Just to name a few promises.

1. Server Guesting, has been touted as the big feature multiple times over 5 years. Not in the game at release and still to this day not in the game.

2. The strict no grind philosophy they been spreading for years and reality is that the end game they call "Fractals" is probably the grindiest end game system ever invented.

In fact, ANet admitted to these and other misleading facts they have spread and are giving everyone a refund if he asks for one. 

 

 

Originally posted by Panthien
Originally posted by BlackcatZero

yes an I agree on something is going wrong when game companies expect $200 or $300 for a beta (it may be as simple as they ran out of money for there project and can or need help funding the project to make they're game) mmoprg cost tons to make and if it's funding they need to up frfont and say we would like to give u our product but it cost more money then we have please help and we make the choise to help or not.  your saying it isn't right or we should not spend money on games or what we like and spend money on. hint I supposted Darkfall:unholy war and dislike it so I just canceled and said after this no more money. I spent money on age of wushu and have not regreed it same goes for Defiance and Neverwinter. but in the end it's my choise and anyone else that decided to suppost them. 

Im curious, which games charge that kind of money  just a beta?

Plenty of Kickstarter had exclusive BETA access at $100+ Levels. Currently Neverwinter MMO wants $199 for a founders pack. (to be fair there is also a mroe limited $60 package).

Just an fyi. Guesting is already in and there are alternative ways to get ascended gear. You dont even have to do fractals anymore. In fact fractals are now taken as just a challenge of ability and a good way to earn money since they have made it extremely easy to get ascended gear

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