All these haters...well I believe that SC will be a success! If not I lost some $, who cares? Kickstarter is a good way to bring back a genre that is not mainstream. But seems that ppl dont like to try out new ways and still believe the world is flat.

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by ishist

The entire point of these kickstarters is to give someone THE CHANCE to do something.

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Read my post again.

Everyone has equal chance to raise funds via established funding methods. However, if someone is seeking to raise their funds through unorthodox, controversial methods such as crowdfunding, there is either something wrong with their business or they treat you like stupid.

No. As a matter of FACT they do not.  In all too many cases its a matter of WHO you know, within the VC and other such systems. Not only that, but such systems tend to be very restrictive in terms of who gets what, and thats NOT good for people just starting out.

Kickstarter sides steps that, and thats one of the reasons such types will ultimately set their bought and paid for politicians on it. Just to "protect" the public, of course...

Sure there are risks. But its up to each individual to make the choice of what to back, and how much to back it.  As I've mentioned in terms of games, I can always get more money. But I what I can't get is good, entertaining games to play.

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Originally posted by Wraithone

We need MANY more such "loop holes".  Contrary to the belief of many, in all too many situations, government (and its regulations/laws) are a PROBLEM, not a solution. 

Yes, yes I know its all to "protect" us poor ignorant/stupid people, from ourslves, and the E-vile Capitalist Pig Dogs that are lurking everywhere in the shadows, waiting to pounce and run off with our life savings...<Cue voice over "Save me! Save me!">... ^^

I've been over all VERY pleased with my backing of various Kickstarter projects.  I'm the one responsible for doing my own research, and making the *choice* to back any given project, and how much I will back it for.  I certainly don't want or need any pompus government stuffed shirt, taking it upon themselves to make my choices for me.

 

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Originally posted by Wraithone

No. As a matter of FACT they do not.  In all too many cases its a matter of WHO you know, within the VC and other such systems. Not only that, but such systems tend to be very restrictive in terms of who gets what, and thats NOT good for people just starting out.

Kickstarter sides steps that, and thats one of the reasons such types will ultimately set their bought and paid for politicians on it. Just to "protect" the public, of course...

Sure there are risks. But its up to each individual to make the choice of what to back, and how much to back it.  As I've mentioned in terms of games, I can always get more money. But I what I can't get is good, entertaining games to play.

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Not sure why you quoted me...nothing you said in your emotional, irrelevant rant is even remotely addressing anything I said.

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by Wraithone

We need MANY more such "loop holes".  Contrary to the belief of many, in all too many situations, government (and its regulations/laws) are a PROBLEM, not a solution. 

 

Yes, yes I know its all to "protect" us poor ignorant/stupid people, from ourslves, and the E-vile Capitalist Pig Dogs that are lurking everywhere in the shadows, waiting to pounce and run off with our life savings...... ^^

I've been over all VERY pleased with my backing of various Kickstarter projects.  I'm the one responsible for doing my own research, and making the *choice* to back any given project, and how much I will back it for.  I certainly don't want or need any pompus government stuffed shirt, taking it upon themselves to make my choices for me.

 

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Originally posted by Wraithone

No. As a matter of FACT they do not.  In all too many cases its a matter of WHO you know, within the VC and other such systems. Not only that, but such systems tend to be very restrictive in terms of who gets what, and thats NOT good for people just starting out.

 

Kickstarter sides steps that, and thats one of the reasons such types will ultimately set their bought and paid for politicians on it. Just to "protect" the public, of course...

Sure there are risks. But its up to each individual to make the choice of what to back, and how much to back it.  As I've mentioned in terms of games, I can always get more money. But I what I can't get is good, entertaining games to play.

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Not sure why you quoted me...nothing you said in your emotional, irrelevant rant is even remotely addressing anything I said.

besides the part where he addresses your initial statement that everyone has a fair shot with a publisher? um... i really didn't want to get involved, but you might want to review who's getting emotional and off topic. "i know you are but what am i?"

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Originally posted by atticusbc

besides the part where he addresses your initial statement that everyone has a fair shot with a publisher?

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I never said anything like that...

All I said is that everyone has equal chance to start their own business(to do something), which is true.

Originally posted by Gdemami

Usually you get to pay AFTER the job is done.

 

People are weird and funny tho and can throw money on about anything...or in fact in exchange for nothing..

 

 

 

Problem is with that statement, people have been throwing money at nothing for the last 8 years and getting nothing in return much less a decent game or MMORPG, and still even AFTER the job is done the game is unplayable buggy and boring, Id rather helped finance games thru Kickstarter I actually want to play not what some market analyst or investor would think I want to play another WoW clone or another COD ripoff.

Originally posted by morbuskabis

All these haters...well I believe that SC will be a success! If not I lost some $, who cares? Kickstarter is a good way to bring back a genre that is not mainstream. But seems that ppl dont like to try out new ways and still believe the world is flat.

Agree with your post there. People piss and throw away money at bigger things than video games, gambling, alcohol, and crappy video games, but people wont throw a few dollars at a game that promises real enterainment and potential? People these days...

Originally posted by Obidom

wait wait... Showrun Returns? oh please please please!!! I loved the nintendo version but the one they brought out the other year was a mess!!!

 

 

This site REALLY needs a Kickstarter section!!!!

Shadowrun Returns harkens back to the old SNES -Genesis days and the project is coming along very well atm and it will be nothing like the XBOX version which they had nothing to do with thankfully and they made that very clear in their videos :P your in for a treat :)

Originally posted by Astropuyo

The game hasn't even hit a proper dev cycle, it's all about getting capital investment with giving no returns and you guys are endorsing this?

 

You are investing in a company and getting nothing save SWAG in return.

You are getting conned, you may not think you are, but who thinks they are getting conned while giving hard money for items and a "promise" the game will be developed.

 

Lets just keep rewarding bad business with more business! There is a reason venture didn't touch this guy. There is a big reason.

Guess the same can be said of people that keep buying COD games and WoW clones and getting nothing in return thats new or innovative, in a way their being conned by buying the same game with a few new maps or MMOs with watered down mechanics a a few twists to the same ol vanilla designs that keep appearing in games only for the new "shiny" MMO to die 1-3 months after release.

People keep rewarding bad business with more business (EA-Activistion-NC Soft) with more rehashes, ripoffs, and poorly made games and MMOs, really its gamers who are getting nothing in return by continuing to keep giving publishers money for garbage.

The door swings both ways my friend, at least with crowdfunding people CAN choose to research and invest in games that will bring fresh IPs to a stagnant industry , new , fresh, innovative, even resurrecting old genres that the publishers won't touch cause it isn't Call of Duty 15.

In my planet, people don't put the wagen in front of the bulls.

If you want to start a business and don't have funds and are pretty good at what you do, you start from the bottom without fear.

You create a small inovative game with small budget, make it cheap and people will buy and have fun playing it.

The company create an identity and trust... use the profits for bigger/expanding your IP... keep delivering a good product and eventually you will have a good loyal community on their backs.

Before they all start buying Mercedes, use that money to develop a big game... again, deliver a good product.

Cheers!!! Profit for them and fun for all of us.

Now companys want to start "crafting" MMO's before anything else and ask money from the bunch of no lifers addicteds around the web.

I'm sad at the community overall. People keep buying collectors editions for 150 euros and etcs... and keep throwing cash at this people with their eyes closed. AND NEVER LEARN.

Sad sad days we are living.

Originally posted by Anthara

The company create an identity and trust...

And in that case, wouldn't you say that the some of people/companies that are commanding these large kickstarter results hvae already created an identity and engendered trust?

How many times have people indicated that they loved the work that this person has done and because of that work they believe they can pull it off?

Here, right on the front of this forum thread:

Aerowyn:

i pledged $60 i LOVED the wing commander games..

And Aeorwyn is not the first person to make that statement. Looks like this guy has already done good work and has earned their trust. Time will tell if that trust was fairly earned.

Originally posted by Vorthanion

Originally posted by Astropuyo

The game hasn't even hit a proper dev cycle, it's all about getting capital investment with giving no returns and you guys are endorsing this?

 

You are investing in a company and getting nothing save SWAG in return.

You are getting conned, you may not think you are, but who thinks they are getting conned while giving hard money for items and a "promise" the game will be developed.

 

Lets just keep rewarding bad business with more business! There is a reason venture didn't touch this guy. There is a big reason.

The venture people's reasoning was that gamers don't want a space simulation MMO and it would appear they were dead wrong.  The business professionals don't always know what is right, god knows these are the very same people that crash markets, speculate commodities into inflationary prices and they have invested into and created as many failed games as successful ones.

 

I think the word the should that should be used is " infested" ;)

Originally posted by Anthara

In my planet, people don't put the wagen in front of the bulls.

If you want to start a business and don't have funds and are pretty good at what you do, you start from the bottom without fear.

You create a small inovative game with small budget, make it cheap and people will buy and have fun playing it.

The company create an identity and trust... use the profits for bigger/expanding your IP... keep delivering a good product and eventually you will have a good loyal community on their backs.

Before they all start buying Mercedes, use that money to develop a big game... again, deliver a good product.

Cheers!!! Profit for them and fun for all of us.

Now companys want to start "crafting" MMO's before anything else and ask money from the bunch of no lifers addicteds around the web.

I'm sad at the community overall. People keep buying collectors editions for 150 euros and etcs... and keep throwing cash at this people with their eyes closed. AND NEVER LEARN.

Sad sad days we are living.

I dont know what planet your from, but here on earth people put their wagon's in front of the bull's constantly. It's called the "Stock Market"

What I dont agree with when it comes to kickstarter is the donation thing. Thats bullshit. It should be an investment, you shuld recieve a share and a payback on investment if the product is successful.

Funding software like a charity is bullshit.

Originally posted by laserit

Originally posted by Anthara

In my planet, people don't put the wagen in front of the bulls.

If you want to start a business and don't have funds and are pretty good at what you do, you start from the bottom without fear.

You create a small inovative game with small budget, make it cheap and people will buy and have fun playing it.

The company create an identity and trust... use the profits for bigger/expanding your IP... keep delivering a good product and eventually you will have a good loyal community on their backs.

Before they all start buying Mercedes, use that money to develop a big game... again, deliver a good product.

Cheers!!! Profit for them and fun for all of us.

Now companys want to start "crafting" MMO's before anything else and ask money from the bunch of no lifers addicteds around the web.

I'm sad at the community overall. People keep buying collectors editions for 150 euros and etcs... and keep throwing cash at this people with their eyes closed. AND NEVER LEARN.

Sad sad days we are living.

I dont know what planet your from, but here on earth people put their wagon's in front of the bull's constantly. It's called the "Stock Market"

 

What I dont agree with when it comes to kickstarter is the donation thing. Thats bullshit. It should be an investment, you shuld recieve a share and a payback on investment if the product is successful.

Funding software like a charity is bullshit.

To the first of you: Chris Roberts, the man who created the Kickstarter that this article is about, pretty much CREATED the space sim genre. If the man didn't have indentity and trust, he wouldn't have raked in $8m 2 years before his game is set to release.

To the second of you: You believe that if you give a project on kickstarter $30 you should get profit sharing and stock options? That is bullshit. If you wanna pretend you're a big shot investor, go put real money into a project that wants it. You donate on kickstarter, you get whatever reward is listed for the amount you pledged. Almost as if it was A RETURN ON YOUR INVESTMENT. If you choose to refuse the reward that's your perogotive. If the project fails and you don't get a reward, then you made a stupid investment.

Or as an alternative, if the idea of risking your money on something not labeled an "investment" is so distasteful, you can always throw your money into the blackhole that is EA and they'll begrudgingly deficate out a battlefield or medal of whatever for you. I'm sure that would be more to your taste.

Originally posted by ishist

Originally posted by laserit

Originally posted by Anthara

In my planet, people don't put the wagen in front of the bulls.

If you want to start a business and don't have funds and are pretty good at what you do, you start from the bottom without fear.

You create a small inovative game with small budget, make it cheap and people will buy and have fun playing it.

The company create an identity and trust... use the profits for bigger/expanding your IP... keep delivering a good product and eventually you will have a good loyal community on their backs.

Before they all start buying Mercedes, use that money to develop a big game... again, deliver a good product.

Cheers!!! Profit for them and fun for all of us.

Now companys want to start "crafting" MMO's before anything else and ask money from the bunch of no lifers addicteds around the web.

I'm sad at the community overall. People keep buying collectors editions for 150 euros and etcs... and keep throwing cash at this people with their eyes closed. AND NEVER LEARN.

Sad sad days we are living.

I dont know what planet your from, but here on earth people put their wagon's in front of the bull's constantly. It's called the "Stock Market"

 

What I dont agree with when it comes to kickstarter is the donation thing. Thats bullshit. It should be an investment, you shuld recieve a share and a payback on investment if the product is successful.

Funding software like a charity is bullshit.

To the first of you: Chris Roberts, the man who created the Kickstarter that this article is about, pretty much CREATED the space sim genre. If the man didn't have indentity and trust, he wouldn't have raked in $8m 2 years before his game is set to release.

 

To the second of you: You believe that if you give a project on kickstarter $30 you should get profit sharing and stock options? That is bullshit. If you wanna pretend you're a big shot investor, go put real money into a project that wants it. You donate on kickstarter, you get whatever reward is listed for the amount you pledged. Almost as if it was A RETURN ON YOUR INVESTMENT. If you choose to refuse the reward that's your perogotive. If the project fails and you don't get a reward, then you made a stupid investment.

Or as an alternative, if the idea of risking your money on something not labeled an "investment" is so distasteful, you can always throw your money into the blackhole that is EA and they'll begrudgingly deficate out a battlefield or medal of whatever for you. I'm sure that would be more to your taste.

I just beleive a business venture (video game production is a business venture) should not be run as a charity or a telethon. It has absolutley nothing to do with Chris Robert's and everything to do with the whole concept of Kickstarter.

Now if these were not for profit venture's...  I would have a different opinion. 

Originally posted by Wraithone

Originally posted by Gdemami

 

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Originally posted by Royalkin

I'm really sick of the anti-kickstarter crowd. Look, it's a very simply situation. If you like a game well enough, and believe in the designers' vision, support it. If you don't, walk away. How some choose to spend their own money is none of your concern. Stop trying to be the wise sage and herd them away from their own decisions to support something.

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You are missing the point.

The problem with Kickstarter isn't the backers but those who are trying to raise their funds.

Crowdfunding currently, despite in a way looking like legal investment method, has several legal issues - accounting, disclosing responsibility, etc. It does not process legally same way as other investment methods.

It is a loophole in legal system at the moment and in fact it allows you legally scam people - you can accept payment for future service or goods but never deliver.

 

We need MANY more such "loop holes".  Contrary to the belief of many, in all too many situations, government (and its regulations/laws) are a PROBLEM, not a solution. 

Yes, yes I know its all to "protect" us poor ignorant/stupid people, from ourslves, and the E-vile Capitalist Pig Dogs that are lurking everywhere in the shadows, waiting to pounce and run off with our life savings...... ^^

I've been over all VERY pleased with my backing of various Kickstarter projects.  I'm the one responsible for doing my own research, and making the *choice* to back any given project, and how much I will back it for.  I certainly don't want or need any pompus government stuffed shirt, taking it upon themselves to make my choices for me.

 

Quoted for Truth! Amen!

Originally posted by Gdemami

Usually you get to pay AFTER the job is done.

 People are weird and funny tho and can throw money on about anything...or in fact in exchange for nothing..

So i suppose you never go to Concerts or Movies and never ever taking Vacations with Hotels and trips :) Otherwise that would mean that even you get to pay for something before having it ! Oh and by the way, don't ever by a House on plans ;) 

We are investing in a future games, by trusting Christ Roberts who said he wanted to create a game that we never saw before because no-one belived it would interest anyone in the gamer community. 

Fact is, as of Today, Star Citizen the most Pledged game ever in the Crowdfunding History ! Why ? because that game is a Space Simulation ! ONLY on PC ! and because it will be Realistic ! 

Originally posted by laserit I just beleive a business venture (video game production is a business venture) should not be run as a charity or a telethon. It has absolutley nothing to do with Chris Robert's and everything to do with the whole concept of Kickstarter.

Now if these were not for profit venture's...  I would have a different opinion. 

I just think people should not think what is better for others, road to Hell being paved with good intentions and all and this Hell is ruled by suits dictating the creation of CoD: Modern Warfare 29, Fifa 2342, Mass Effect 20, etc.

Originally posted by laserit

I just beleive a business venture (video game production is a business venture) should not be run as a charity or a telethon. It has absolutley nothing to do with Chris Robert's and everything to do with the whole concept of Kickstarter. Now if these were not for profit venture's...  I would have a different opinion. 

You are missing the point... Star Citizen's Crowdfunding was not run like a Telethon !

The deal was simple : if you like the game and the fact that we want to do it without having to involve an Editor, then buy the game in advance to show that you want to play it. 

Chris Roberts could simply have done another Wing Commander as EA was asking him ! but he prefered to turn to the people who played his games and ask them if they wanted to play the game every kid ever dreamed to play, now that technology is mature enough ! 

This is someone assuming his passion and willing to make it come true. he almost invented the space sim and now he wants to make an epic game, without having an editor messing with his vision ! Kinda like what some producers do with their movies to avoid having a Studio messing with their vision ;) George Lucas would agree ;)