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Camelot Unchained

Camelot Unchained 

General Discussion  » This could make a good E-Sports title

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25 posts found
  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/15/13 7:27:29 PM#1

I believe calling this game an MMO would confuse people since it's only RvR (PvP).  I hope that Mark Jacobs understand that the world of PvP based games has changed drastically since DAoC.  People are used to PvE peanut butter in their PvP jelly, even if they don't mix well.  Guild Wars 2 had put a huge emphasis on competitive PvP, which I could say was fairly decent.  But the huge outcry is the lack of rewards for doing so, cosmetics is just not enough anymore, and usually most other rewards unbalance the game.

Enter E-Sports.  Having 3 faction PvP is great, but it's not exactly new, GW2 and Rift and other MMOs have 3 faction PvP now.  Let's go ahead and take it a step further into annual tournaments with huge cash prizes.  Spectator mode with built in stream channels for players can tune into the competitive guilds representing their factions.  Since the classes are specialized, it's important to have at least monthly balance changes.  Not just flavor of the month changes like other MMOs, really smart changes that brings the classes within 5% power difference of each other.  And it's not mandatory, but I feel that the game should lean more towards action combat then tab targetting combat as it's easier spectate.

Instead of a traditional class based system, you might want to switch to a weapon based system similiar to GW2 where all your class abilities are attached to the weapon.  It's important for E-Sports style games to be able to have highly specialized classes that function more like tactical units you can swap out between combat.  Compared to traditional MMOs where you pick a class and your stuck with it, and then people threaten to quit when that class gets nerfed in PvP.  This also allows developers to introduce new classes into the game through the weapons which keeps the PvP metagame fresh and interesting.

I don't see how this game can justify a sub in today's modern PvP world without constantly introducing new weapons and battlefield maps, and tournaments to keep the PvP interesting.  E-Sports is the way to go for this game.

Edit:  Also a good match making system so that people of a certain skill levels get grouped with people of their own level in PvP.  This could be tied into a ranking system.

  Slapshot1188

Elite Member

Joined: 5/06/07
Posts: 4082

2/15/13 7:31:21 PM#2

I don't think you understand the developer or the target audience of this game...

 

"I should point out that no other company has shipped out a beta on a disc before this." - Official Mortal Online Lead Community Moderator

Starvault's reponse to criticism related to having a handful of players as the official "test" team for a supposed MMO: "We've just have another 10ish folk kind enough to voulenteer added tot the test team" (SIC) This explains much about the state of the game :-)

  boxsnd

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/04/12
Posts: 376

2/15/13 7:33:04 PM#3

I don't think it can be an esport. But I believe it could be incredibly popular on twitch, especially if the 8v8 RvR is as competitive as DAoC's was. 

BTW Kripparian is a huge daoc-fan. He talked about it constantly when he tried GW2's PvP/WvW. I'm sure him and other famous competitive streamers will at least give CU a try.

DAoC - Excalibur & Camlann

  skyexile

Novice Member

Joined: 8/14/07
Posts: 701

2/15/13 7:41:25 PM#4

Im not sure what to make of your post...
you state: Its not an MMO, since its only RvR?

you then believe this game should enter the competitive esports market alongside everybody and their mother instead of perusing its already chosen 3R Market, where it would be competing against, as you say:

Rift, i didnt even know it had 3 faction pvp now...i dont think anybody really cares either since its a tack on. Same with GW2, the game is designed around arena since it wants to be the next big esport, and cares a little about WVW.

I think it would be better to go against game where the completion is lax myself.

SKYeXile
TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/15/13 8:57:07 PM#5

Well, I can tell you from my own experience that I have played more than my fair share of PvP games, from FPS, to MMOs, to MOBAs.  The only actual RvR game I played was Warhammer.  Mark Jacobs seems to be really passionate about this game, enough to toss 3 million of his own money into it, and I fully support his vision.  And I do encourage him to not rely too heavily on player feedback and make the game that he wants to make, because at least the game will revolve around one cohesive idea and not a patchwork of random game elements tossed together.  There's two questions that I didn't feel were adequately answered in the interview. 

1.)  What exactly are PvP players going to get from their monthly fee (every month)?

2.) How is progression in an R v R (PvP) game going to work?

As you know there's a lot of good competitive PvP games that are F2P right now, and if this game is coming out in 2015, it's going to be 3 years behind the other PvP games.  If I'm asked to pay a monthly fee for a game, I expect to get content made for me in a monthly basis.  Which why I thought that new battleground maps, new classes/weapons, and balance changes was a suggestion to justify a sub.

It sounds like Mark Jacobs doesn't want to go into the direction of EvE PvP where the game economy revolves around everybody's awesome stuff being constantly destroyed and rebuilt on a daily basis.  He also doesn't want to go the opposite direction of a traditional MMO PvP, where Pvpers are rewarded with PvP ranks and PvP gear that unbalances the game after a while.  I'm not going to pay a monthly fee for realm pride, I can get realm pride for free playing Guild Wars 2 or Planet Side 2.  So why not make it interesting and offer huge cash prizes for the top players in each faction, and have them compete in a 8 vs 8 RvR tournament for the grand prize?  Even if I don't win myself, I feel that the goal of being good enough to actually play the game for free, or even make money off playing the game will keep me invested.

What I'm suggesting is not extreme and he doesn't have to change the nature of the RvR game itself, just add that special E-sports layer on top of it for the really competitive guilds/clans to keep playing.  I should also mention that E-Sports is already growing aspect of the gaming industry, and other MMOs want a piece of the action like Planet Side 2 and Guild Wars 2.

  MarkJacobs

CEO City State Entertainment

Joined: 12/18/12
Posts: 405

2/15/13 9:17:49 PM#6
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

Well, I can tell you from my own experience that I have played more than my fair share of PvP games, from FPS, to MMOs, to MOBAs.  The only actual RvR game I played was Warhammer.  Mark Jacobs seems to be really passionate about this game, enough to toss 3 million of his own money into it, and I fully support his vision.  And I do encourage him to not rely too heavily on player feedback and make the game that he wants to make, because at least the game will revolve around one cohesive idea and not a patchwork of random game elements tossed together.  There's two questions that I didn't feel were adequately answered in the interview. 

1.)  What exactly are PvP players going to get from their monthly fee (every month)?

2.) How is progression in an R v R (PvP) game going to work?

As you know there's a lot of good competitive PvP games that are F2P right now, and if this game is coming out in 2015, it's going to be 3 years behind the other PvP games.  If I'm asked to pay a monthly fee for a game, I expect to get content made for me in a monthly basis.  Which why I thought that new battleground maps, new classes/weapons, and balance changes was a suggestion to justify a sub.

It sounds like Mark Jacobs doesn't want to go into the direction of EvE PvP where the game economy revolves around everybody's awesome stuff being constantly destroyed and rebuilt on a daily basis.  He also doesn't want to go the opposite direction of a traditional MMO PvP, where Pvpers are rewarded with PvP ranks and PvP gear that unbalances the game after a while.  I'm not going to pay a monthly fee for realm pride, I can get realm pride for free playing Guild Wars 2 or Planet Side 2.  So why not make it interesting and offer huge cash prizes for the top players in each faction, and have them compete in a 8 vs 8 RvR tournament for the grand prize?  Even if I don't win myself, I feel that the goal of being good enough to actually play the game for free, or even make money off playing the game will keep me invested.

What I'm suggesting is not extreme and he doesn't have to change the nature of the RvR game itself, just add that special E-sports layer on top of it for the really competitive guilds/clans to keep playing.  I should also mention that E-Sports is already growing aspect of the gaming industry, and other MMOs want a piece of the action like Planet Side 2 and Guild Wars 2.

Hey, thanks for the kind words and support BBW. I'm very interested in the E-sports stuff (even talked about doing another game that would have been a nice fit) but I need to get the basic RvR MMO down first and then see if it is either fun enough or could be made into a derivative work as an E-Sport. Believe me, I would love to see that happen in the future, it'll be great though I would prefer to find another team to work with who had lots of experience in that regard.

As to your questions, both will be answered in the coming weeks but the one thing I will say now is that the plan is to treat the RvR-portion of the game in the same manner we treated the PvE portion of my other MMO (okay, you can stop snickering now guys) and update it in the same manner with lots of new content, upgrades, updates, etc. and maybe some other interesting stuff depending on how successful the game is. It's really important for us to get it right and then keep earning the players subscription fees just as we tried to do with Dark Age of Camelot.

Mark

Mark Jacobs
CEO, City State Entertainment

  Satarious

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/08
Posts: 1045

2/15/13 9:34:46 PM#7
Originally posted by MarkJacobs
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

 

Hey, thanks for the kind words and support BBW. I'm very interested in the E-sports stuff (even talked about doing another game that would have been a nice fit) but I need to get the basic RvR MMO down first and then see if it is either fun enough or could be made into a derivative work as an E-Sport. Believe me, I would love to see that happen in the future, it'll be great though I would prefer to find another team to work with who had lots of experience in that regard.

As to your questions, both will be answered in the coming weeks but the one thing I will say now is that the plan is to treat the RvR-portion of the game in the same manner we treated the PvE portion of my other MMO (okay, you can stop snickering now guys) and update it in the same manner with lots of new content, upgrades, updates, etc. and maybe some other interesting stuff depending on how successful the game is. It's really important for us to get it right and then keep earning the players subscription fees just as we tried to do with Dark Age of Camelot.

Mark

Yikes!  I really hope you don't go the E-Sports route with this game, Mark.  E-Sports kills immersion, imho.  I realize there's a market for the whole competitive sports thing out there, but I think there's also a yearning to just lose oneself into the fantasy setting and really feel like you're a part of a war effort (within a fantasy/medieval setting) rather than Football with fantasy clothes.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c

  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/16/13 3:38:00 AM#8
Originally posted by MarkJacobs

Hey, thanks for the kind words and support BBW. I'm very interested in the E-sports stuff (even talked about doing another game that would have been a nice fit) but I need to get the basic RvR MMO down first and then see if it is either fun enough or could be made into a derivative work as an E-Sport. Believe me, I would love to see that happen in the future, it'll be great though I would prefer to find another team to work with who had lots of experience in that regard.

As to your questions, both will be answered in the coming weeks but the one thing I will say now is that the plan is to treat the RvR-portion of the game in the same manner we treated the PvE portion of my other MMO (okay, you can stop snickering now guys) and update it in the same manner with lots of new content, upgrades, updates, etc. and maybe some other interesting stuff depending on how successful the game is. It's really important for us to get it right and then keep earning the players subscription fees just as we tried to do with Dark Age of Camelot.

Mark

Wow, I never expected the Mark Jacobs to replay to my thread (>'.')>!

Assuming the game was built as a PvP game (RvR), adding an E-Sports layer on top of it doesn't detract anything from the original game.  It's just another bonus incentive for top level competitive guilds that want to compete in a tournament format and make some money from being good at the game.  Since it's an additional system, it doesn't needed to be launched with the game and can be added at a later date.  But it the game itself does need to be developed with E-Sports in mind so that it can be supported later.

The only real downside to marketing your game as an E-Sports title is that you got a swarm of theory crafters breaking down your game mechanics finding out how to squeeze that 1% extra dps for each class.  They also have a tendency to break PvP mechanics, but Mark said that was fine, he wanted people in his beta that knew how to break stuff, and these types of players really are the best at that.

On a personal level, I myself am an older gamer, and as much as I love PvP, I'm simply not going to be able to compete time wise with other people in the game.  I don't have a lot of time, but I do have money, and I would feel better if part of monthly fee is going into a huge Super Bowl like tournament where the best players from my realm are facing off against other strong competitors.  And even if I can't directly participate, I can still spectate and cheer my guild on and feel connected to my realm, without having to be there myself.  If you think about it, it doesn't sound my different from what an RvR community would be doing anyway, which is why I suggested Camelot would make a good E-Sports game in the first place.

  Zinzan

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/03/06
Posts: 1368

2/16/13 4:17:24 AM#9
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

I believe calling this game an MMO would confuse people since it's only RvR (PvP).  I hope that Mark Jacobs understand that the world of PvP based games has changed drastically since DAoC.  People are used to PvE peanut butter in their PvP jelly, even if they don't mix well.  Guild Wars 2 had put a huge emphasis on competitive PvP, which I could say was fairly decent.  But the huge outcry is the lack of rewards for doing so, cosmetics is just not enough anymore, and usually most other rewards unbalance the game.

Enter E-Sports.  Having 3 faction PvP is great, but it's not exactly new, GW2 and Rift and other MMOs have 3 faction PvP now.  Let's go ahead and take it a step further into annual tournaments with huge cash prizes.  Spectator mode with built in stream channels for players can tune into the competitive guilds representing their factions.  Since the classes are specialized, it's important to have at least monthly balance changes.  Not just flavor of the month changes like other MMOs, really smart changes that brings the classes within 5% power difference of each other.  And it's not mandatory, but I feel that the game should lean more towards action combat then tab targetting combat as it's easier spectate.

Instead of a traditional class based system, you might want to switch to a weapon based system similiar to GW2 where all your class abilities are attached to the weapon.  It's important for E-Sports style games to be able to have highly specialized classes that function more like tactical units you can swap out between combat.  Compared to traditional MMOs where you pick a class and your stuck with it, and then people threaten to quit when that class gets nerfed in PvP.  This also allows developers to introduce new classes into the game through the weapons which keeps the PvP metagame fresh and interesting.

I don't see how this game can justify a sub in today's modern PvP world without constantly introducing new weapons and battlefield maps, and tournaments to keep the PvP interesting.  E-Sports is the way to go for this game.

Edit:  Also a good match making system so that people of a certain skill levels get grouped with people of their own level in PvP.  This could be tied into a ranking system.

You can't do E-Sports in open-world RvR, it's simply not possible. E-Sports relies on even footing, i.e. instanced player limited pvp. It might be it's possible in large instances, say 50v50, but it's still instanced.

CU is an mmo in the same way Planetside and Planetside 2 are mmo's, calling it an mmo is not confusing at all. People who assume MMO means MMORPG have only themselves to blame. Besides, MJ has put quite a bit of emphasis into this being an RPG, not sure how he plans on achieving this as of yet, but it might be interresting to see what they come up with.

 

Expresso gave me a Hearthstone beta key.....I'm so happy :)

  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/16/13 5:43:17 AM#10
Originally posted by Zinzan

You can't do E-Sports in open-world RvR, it's simply not possible. E-Sports relies on even footing, i.e. instanced player limited pvp. It might be it's possible in large instances, say 50v50, but it's still instanced.

CU is an mmo in the same way Planetside and Planetside 2 are mmo's, calling it an mmo is not confusing at all. People who assume MMO means MMORPG have only themselves to blame. Besides, MJ has put quite a bit of emphasis into this being an RPG, not sure how he plans on achieving this as of yet, but it might be interresting to see what they come up with.

You see, this is poisoning the conversation.  People never seen E-sports implemented in an open-world RvR game, that means that it's impossible?  Anything is possible if your game is designed to support the feature.  Also killing ideas that can improve the fun of the game because you've never seen it done before in another MMO is just all kinds of bad.

Also E-Sports has been implemented already with varying degrees in all kinds of MMOs. From World of Warcraft, FFXI (they held a Ballista tournament one year), EvE Online, Guild Wars 2, and now Planet Side 2.  It's not impossible for Camelot to have it also.

I should clarify in my earlier statement in that when people hear that Camelot is a subscription RvR fantasy MMO, that's going to confuse people.  I assumed like most people that this game would have some form of PvE progression in it. And after hearing the interview, the game might not even have a leveling system, let alone a PvE content.  It'd be safer from a marketing stand point to not call it a MMO at all, and call it a PvP game with subscription.  Maybe that description isn't entirely accurate either but it's definitely a lot less confusing then calling it an MMO.

 

 

  skyexile

Novice Member

Joined: 8/14/07
Posts: 701

2/16/13 5:51:45 AM#11


Originally posted by Bigbadwlf


I should clarify in my earlier statement in that when people hear that Camelot is a subscription RvR fantasy MMO, that's going to confuse people.  I assumed like most people that this game would have some form of PvE progression in it. And after hearing the interview, the game might not even have a leveling system, let alone a PvE content.  It'd be safer from a marketing stand point to not call it a MMO at all, and call it a PvP game with subscription.  Maybe that description isn't entirely accurate either but it's definitely a lot less confusing then calling it an MMO.

 

 


you know MMO stands for "massively multiplyer online" right? PVE isnt a requirement for calling something an MMO, been massively multiplayer and online is(though it doesn't seem to stop people calling their virtual lobby games MMO's), given the game is all about large scale open world pvp, not calling it an MMO would be confusing....for most people anyway...

SKYeXile
TRF - GM - GW2, PS2, WAR, AION, Rift, WoW, WOT....etc...
Future Crew - High Council. Planetside 1 & 2.

  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/16/13 6:33:58 AM#12
Yes, I know what an MMO is, but the fact that you have to explain to explain to people what exactly Camelot is, can be problematic marketing the game.  I was only making a suggestion anyway.  It doesn't have to be PvP with sub, it can be MMORvR or something like that.
  Satarious

Novice Member

Joined: 1/06/08
Posts: 1045

2/16/13 6:45:13 AM#13
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

I don't see how this game can justify a sub in today's modern PvP world without constantly introducing new weapons and battlefield maps, and tournaments to keep the PvP interesting.  E-Sports is the way to go for this game.

Edit:  Also a good match making system so that people of a certain skill levels get grouped with people of their own level in PvP.  This could be tied into a ranking system.

*cringe* This sounds suspiciously like a Guild Wars 2 type system.  You talk about "today's modern PvP" world as if it's a GOOD thing.  It's not.  Lol!  To me, the only really decent pvp/rvr type system has only really been daoc.  All this sports/modern crap has sucked the life out of anything resembling immersion in a fantasy setting and has destroyed a sense of stability and ownership (like the resetting every two weeks spiel that you see in Guild Wars 2).  Which is not to say that the pvp system should be EXACTLY like daoc's, I just think that when you design a system, you should at least consider the effect it has on RPG and the epic, massive feel of it.  None of the "modern"  MMOs do that these days.  Which is why I don't play any right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pWdd6_ZxX8c

  Storm_Fireblade

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/13
Posts: 156

2/16/13 8:24:04 AM#14
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

You see, this is poisoning the conversation.  People never seen E-sports implemented in an open-world RvR game, that means that it's impossible?

No, it isn´t impossible. Speaking only for myself - its just something I don´t want to see. I´ve played other games competitive, even things like CounterStrike for years. E-Sport - whether you think about games like CS or Arena PvP in WoW or...is a whole different world. You really have to support that 100%.

Camelot Unchained is going towards an incredible depth not only in RvR but also Crafting and Housing. That alone makes it unfit to become a truly E-Sports game in my humble opinion. Immersion is key here and that is something E-Sport never will offer.

It´s not that I´m against E-Sport, but regarding CU thats just plain wrong. Despite of that, people really seem to forget, that PvP is not the same as RvR. Yeah I know, in RvR you fight against other players. Still - the whole dynamics behind it are different and in fact also cater to a different targetgroup. It does overlap of course, but not every PvPler likes RvR and vice versa.

Camelot Unchained Fanpage
https://simply-gaming.com/camelot/

  Bigbadwlf

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 4/21/12
Posts: 107

 
OP  2/16/13 8:31:13 AM#15

That's fine if the developers don't want to go the direction of modern PvP games.  But at the same time, I can't imagine a sub game releasing in 2015 with 15 year old game mechanics selling well.  I'm sure everybody can agree that Camelot shouldn't just be a DAoC rehash with updated graphics. It should incorporate some modern features that takes the RvR experience to the next level.

I completely understand that Camelot is designed to appeal to old school DAoC players, and probably think that RvR is fine the way it is, and adding new features is completely unnecessary.  But adding an E-Sports element to the game doesn't take away anything from old school DAoC open world PvP.  It takes away absolutely nothing from the game, it's an added feature, that doesn't even need to be released at launch, it's just another feature designed to attract even more players.

There's a lot of money in E-Sport, a lot, and it's only going to get bigger.  Why would anybody have a problem with adding a feature to the game that doesn't detract from the core design, and makes the game more money?

Well I already said everything I had to say on the subject, and I already got a developer response.  This is a perfect example why I mentioned Mark Jacobs should avoid listening to people on the forums and do his own thing with the game.  It's his 3 million on the line, and I hope he works towards developing a game with features that makes the RvR PvP more inclusive and not exclusive.

  dumpcat

Novice Member

Joined: 3/06/12
Posts: 232

2/16/13 10:21:40 AM#16

If it goes "e-sports" then the game is already dead to me.

I want an MMO that is focused on massive RvR, Crafting, and a player driven economy.

That's what I have heard so far about the vision of this game, and that is great.

"E-sports" are for people who care about leader boards rather than epic territorial battles and all out war. The hell with "e-sports".

 

 

 

  Scilly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/13
Posts: 69

2/16/13 10:52:47 AM#17
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

That's fine if the developers don't want to go the direction of modern PvP games.  But at the same time, I can't imagine a sub game releasing in 2015 with 15 year old game mechanics selling well.  I'm sure everybody can agree that Camelot shouldn't just be a DAoC rehash with updated graphics. It should incorporate some modern features that takes the RvR experience to the next level.

I completely understand that Camelot is designed to appeal to old school DAoC players, and probably think that RvR is fine the way it is, and adding new features is completely unnecessary.  But adding an E-Sports element to the game doesn't take away anything from old school DAoC open world PvP.  It takes away absolutely nothing from the game, it's an added feature, that doesn't even need to be released at launch, it's just another feature designed to attract even more players.

There's a lot of money in E-Sport, a lot, and it's only going to get bigger.  Why would anybody have a problem with adding a feature to the game that doesn't detract from the core design, and makes the game more money?

Well I already said everything I had to say on the subject, and I already got a developer response.  This is a perfect example why I mentioned Mark Jacobs should avoid listening to people on the forums and do his own thing with the game.  It's his 3 million on the line, and I hope he works towards developing a game with features that makes the RvR PvP more inclusive and not exclusive.

GW2 focused on esports as its main spvp goal, and it tanked. GW2 spvp was also instanced and MJ said there wont be any rvr instances (except maybe special events).

  Voiidiin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/13/11
Posts: 826

Soylent green is made from PEOPLE

2/16/13 11:05:17 AM#18

Umm i for sure can tell you that if CU even hints towards e-sports i will for sure pull my support from it, i am not even remotely interested in an e-sport game. 

CU should be about RvR and thats it, there can in no way be a mish mash of e-sports and RvR, it does not fit into the same type of gameplay. 

If a MOBA is what players want then there a tons of those to choose from, i am not sure why we can't have the RvR title Mark is talking about, why does everyone seem to want to add to and change from that original vision.... PVE, MOBA, E-Sport, next we will have players saying this game needs more First Person Hummingbird Shooter aspects.

It just smacks of all those who keep making endless threads about how GW2 needs to have the trinity to make it more appealing, why ? Go play a Trinity game if you want that, there are literally hundreds to choose from.

Dammit, now i am gonna be a bad mood today at work, thinking about stupid dillution of the vision for CU. The Kickstarter has not even begun and i fear wavering on set ideas.

Lolipops !

  Scilly

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/13
Posts: 69

2/16/13 11:11:38 AM#19
Originally posted by Voiidiin

Umm i for sure can tell you that if CU even hints towards e-sports i will for sure pull my support from it, i am not even remotely interested in an e-sport game. 

CU should be about RvR and thats it, there can in no way be a mish mash of e-sports and RvR, it does not fit into the same type of gameplay. 

If a MOBA is what players want then there a tons of those to choose from, i am not sure why we can't have the RvR title Mark is talking about, why does everyone seem to want to add to and change from that original vision.... PVE, MOBA, E-Sport, next we will have players saying this game needs more First Person Hummingbird Shooter aspects.

It just smacks of all those who keep making endless threads about how GW2 needs to have the trinity to make it more appealing, why ? Go play a Trinity game if you want that, there are literally hundreds to choose from.

Dammit, now i am gonna be a bad mood today at work, thinking about stupid dillution of the vision for CU. The Kickstarter has not even begun and i fear wavering on set ideas.

dont be in a bad moood <3

 

MJ said he is considering making another esports style game with a seperate team after CU is launched, you cant have esports in a open world, to many variables.. simples

  alexisevic

Novice Member

Joined: 3/24/11
Posts: 41

2/16/13 11:16:33 AM#20
Originally posted by Bigbadwlf

That's fine if the developers don't want to go the direction of modern PvP games.  But at the same time, I can't imagine a sub game releasing in 2015 with 15 year old game mechanics selling well.  I'm sure everybody can agree that Camelot shouldn't just be a DAoC rehash with updated graphics. It should incorporate some modern features that takes the RvR experience to the next level.

I completely understand that Camelot is designed to appeal to old school DAoC players, and probably think that RvR is fine the way it is, and adding new features is completely unnecessary.  But adding an E-Sports element to the game doesn't take away anything from old school DAoC open world PvP.  It takes away absolutely nothing from the game, it's an added feature, that doesn't even need to be released at launch, it's just another feature designed to attract even more players.

There's a lot of money in E-Sport, a lot, and it's only going to get bigger.  Why would anybody have a problem with adding a feature to the game that doesn't detract from the core design, and makes the game more money?

Well I already said everything I had to say on the subject, and I already got a developer response.  This is a perfect example why I mentioned Mark Jacobs should avoid listening to people on the forums and do his own thing with the game.  It's his 3 million on the line, and I hope he works towards developing a game with features that makes the RvR PvP more inclusive and not exclusive.

 

If you listen to MJ's latest interview... he is delibertly not trying to make a game that sells well.  He is trying to make a game that caters to a niche audiance.  I don't mean to be antagonistic, but what 'modern RvR' features are you talking about?  IMO to make somthing 'modern' is often to dumb it down, and I don't think is the kind of title he is trying to make.   That said, no one is saying he should copy paste DAoC RvR.   As for E-sports, its a feature that IMHO should be placed very low on the list of priorities.  But if it was done, an EVE online like implamentation awouldn't be the worst thing. 

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