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News & Features Discussion  » [Column] General: Tingle's Touchy Subjects: MMORPGs

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53 posts found
  SBFord

Associate Editor - News Manager

Joined: 6/28/10
Posts: 14019

 
OP  2/14/13 1:45:26 PM#1

In a new column debuting today at MMORPG.com, Adam Tingle takes on some of the genre's most over-discussed or completely avoided topics and dissects them in front of a live audience. See what he's got to say in his inaugural column and then head to the comments to continue the discussion.

So why are we here? Well, in lieu of starting this piece by urinating on a World of Warcraft Battle Chest, this is a place where I will air my online gripes, groans, and grumbles; it is a veritable soapbox where I, King of the Snark, will say and do the bad thing: if said bad thing is about level caps, PvP, and swords of +112 strength.

What I'm saying is: I'm the making the words that really count.

Read more of Adam Tingle's Tingle's Touchy Subjects: MMORPGs.

Associate Editor: MMORPG.com
Follow me on Twitter: @MMORPGMom

  NoizMchn

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/05/04
Posts: 28

2/15/13 3:13:40 PM#2
Yep
  Aeonblades

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

2/15/13 3:25:27 PM#3
The MMORPG of yesteryear is dead and gone my friends.

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  Nyadach

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/09/11
Posts: 7

2/15/13 3:25:50 PM#4

Very true. Ultima Online was awsome, and the mechanics are things which even today the big MMO companies haven't copied. True freedom, painful death (yes these days everyone is a pansy in this reguard unless you look at Eve who's possibly the closest but that's a pretty old MMO itself now), and the freedom for the player to shape the world to them. Anarchy Online was a close attempt but without the complexities of UO. But since then the MMO landscape has been sadly bland.

Can still remember my first guild leader in UO stealing my boat which I was living off since at the time couldn't afford a house and had saved up for ages for...but in those days, the world was cruel, no care bear nature. It was shaped by the people around you.

  RefMinor

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/16/11
Posts: 3545

Hipster

2/15/13 3:27:29 PM#5
Lets hope the genre moves in that direction, indications are vaguely hopeful.
  BitterClinger

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/19/12
Posts: 209

2014 Watch List: World of Warships, ArcheAge

2/15/13 3:42:41 PM#6

Ok, while I agree with the general sentiment; I have to say we REALLY need to stop with the rose-colored remembrances of some of the old games.

Ultima Online was fantastic.  I really liked many things about it.  The reason I quit playing was:

  • Blue healers
  • Gameplay-killing interface problems (e.g. two guys attack your friend and spam a wall of text while doing so - you can't target your friend through the text)
  • Play-crushing lag around houses, which were everywhere
  • Stupid bugs (e.g. enter another player's house as ghost, get friend or wandering healer to rez you through wall, open door from inside house, steal everything from house)
  • Macroing
  • Entirely hackable client-server communications
So, no.  I don't want to return to those days.

Top Games Played JAN 2014: World of Warplanes, Guild Wars 2, World of Tanks

  RefMinor

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/16/11
Posts: 3545

Hipster

2/15/13 3:44:55 PM#7
Originally posted by BitterClinger

Ok, while I agree with the general sentiment; I have to say we REALLY need to stop with the rose-colored remembrances of some of the old games.

Ultima Online was fantastic.  I really liked many things about it.  The reason I quit playing was:

  • Blue healers
  • Gameplay-killing interface problems (e.g. two guys attack your friend and spam a wall of text while doing so - you can't target your friend through the text)
  • Play-crushing lag around houses, which were everywhere
  • Stupid bugs (e.g. enter another player's house as ghost, get friend or wandering healer to rez you through wall, open door from inside house, steal everything from house)
  • Macroing
  • Entirely hackable client-server communications
So, no.  I don't want to return to those days.

I don't think people are calling for old bugs to be re-introduced just some of the old concepts.

  nuttob

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/25/11
Posts: 243

2/15/13 3:51:29 PM#8
I would have to agree with you on some titles like SWTOR and Tera, but GW2 in particular is nothing but exploring and immersion for me.  Beyond your level limit in GW2 you can go anywhere you want.  Yes, it's formulated to a certain extent, but much more open ended than most MMORPG's.  I played EQ1 for years, and yes it's extremely open ended, but I just found myself grinding monsters over an over again just to get to the next area to grind some more.  Secret World is somewhere in between on this, but the ambience, suspense in certain areas, and the mysteries you have to solve really make that game unique and imaginative to me.  I don't think lack of imagination applies at all to Secret World.
  BigHatLogan

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/09/06
Posts: 695

2/15/13 4:08:15 PM#9

I agree with the article.  I hate grinding quests.  I hate grinding mobs.  Those tasks are invariably boring as hell.  I could care less what kind of reward I get it will only make me angry when i realize that I have been tricked into doing all this boring gameplay in order to get some virtual advancement.  Then I will quit.  If people like these type of games then I guess good for them.  I won't be playing themepark games ever again.

There are titles that do not follow the quest grinder/dungeon raider/gear treadmill design, though they don't seem to be as popular as the AAA Pavlovian nightmares.  I'd suggest that those dissatisfied with the genre expand their horizons and check out some of the titles out there that are doing something different.

EVE

Age of Wushu

Wizardry Online

Salem

Wurm

Minecraft

Day Z

and more...

Are you a Pavlovian Fish Biscuit Addict? Get Help Now!

I will play no more MMORPGs until somethign good comes out!

  FromHell

Novice Member

Joined: 11/10/12
Posts: 1338

2/15/13 5:07:24 PM#10

The market is WAY over saturated.

Seriously. No new MMOs should come out for at least 5 years. Attention span has decreased to an absolute minimum.

The MMO hopping needs to stop.

Secrets of Dragon´s Spine Trailer.. ! :D
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fwT9cFVQCMw

Best MMOs ever played: Ultima, EvE, SW Galaxies, Age of Conan, The Secret World
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc&t=21s
.


.
The Return of ELITE !

  remyburke

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/03/04
Posts: 3044

I liked MMOs better when gamers didn't play them, and just geeks did.

2/15/13 5:18:17 PM#11
Your prose is like trying to read sentences written upon broken glass, but after suffering through your first few paragraphs, I agree with much of what you said.

MMORPG.com member: 10th Year Anniversary. Where has the time gone...?


Played: AA, AC1, AC2, Aion, AO, AoC, CO, CoX, DAoC, DCUO, DN, EVE, EQ1, EQ2,
ESO, FE, FFXI, FFXIV, FF, GW1, GW2, Istaria, L2, LoTRO, MO, MxO, NW, Rift, RoE,
Ryzom, SB, SWG, SWTOR, TERA, TSW, WAR, WoW, WURM...

  erictlewis

Novice Member

Joined: 11/08/08
Posts: 3058

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over while expecting different results.

2/15/13 5:26:34 PM#12

Yes the good old days of everquest, and eq2 are gone.  Most of the games we get now days are wow with a different candy wrapper on.  A lot of games tote inovation, while it is the same old thing with just a tad bit diferent ui and or tree alignment chart for specials. 

I not seen anything thats has inovation, not even swtor was inovative.  

I don't know how we are goign to get devs to get out of the rut, they are still copy/paste games from 5 years ago and give it to us again.

 

  Zooce

Novice Member

Joined: 1/24/11
Posts: 588

2/15/13 5:27:54 PM#13

I enjoyed this article.  It was well-written, held my attention, and caused numerous smirks.

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17516

2/15/13 5:34:27 PM#14
[mod edit]

I sort of agree.

It was the "genitals" remark that got me thinking "do any adults write mmo articles?" I would love mmorpg.com to have more serious and insightful articles. I don't mind if they are opinion pieces but I would really love to read something that didn't include remarks that feel like they came from "kids" all "tee-heeing" in the corner.

sorry Adam, I really don't mean to insult you but it just seems so crass. You have a soapbox where you can really shine. Urinating and genitals jokes seem like they come from kids instead of a burgeoning game journalist.

 
  Squeak69

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/21/13
Posts: 972

cheese cheese wheres da bloody cheese

2/15/13 5:34:35 PM#15

*APPLAUDS*

 

i agree completly

F2P may be the way of the future, but ya know they dont make them like they used to
Proper Grammer & spelling are extra, corrections will be LOL at.

  Lobotomist

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/20/07
Posts: 4859

I got so much trouble on my mind Refuse to lose.

2/15/13 5:40:30 PM#16
Excellent article. Unfortunately I think its to late for MMORPG genre

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

2/15/13 8:28:08 PM#17

we didnt lose the trust of the developers, most developers today came in listening to one big ego (Raph Koster) tell them players dont know what they want and that Developers are supposed to tell them.

You cant lose something you never had and the only way players can get that trust is to STOP BUYING AND PAYING for thier games. Consumers drive the market, stop consuming and force a change...it can be done, its been done in the past, just look at EQ2. Koster got fired and was replaced and the company pushed out two quick expansions to give the players what they were demanding and it saved the game.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  shakermaker0

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 198

2/15/13 8:28:18 PM#18

Tingle here.

 

I thought those remarks were funny. : [ Message received, less of the toilet humour. 

  BCuse

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/12/05
Posts: 140

2/15/13 8:44:41 PM#19
loved the article!  what we need is to build on the sucessful things from the old games not run away from them. i havnt found an mmorpg to play since swg shut down. 
  Aeolyn

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/23/08
Posts: 139

2/15/13 11:43:35 PM#20

I agree that most mmorpgs seem to have lost that immersive feeling, that thing that kept many of us playing and paying monthly subs for our first games(virtual homes) for upwards of ten years or longer. 

 

I personally blame the cash stores for much of that(it's very hard to get attached to something you don't have to work for) and in the few games left that still haven't resorted to those, the need to satisfy the never ending greediness of shareholders by releasing beta products and catering to only endgame players, thus driving away any new blood as well as the subscribers that are willing to pay for years for the journey instead of rushing to endgame in a few weeks/months and then crying boredom before quitting and moving their sub to a new game.

 

What I have recently done to combat that sense of loss is return to my first virtual home as a newbie, no gold, no friends, a clean slate.  It's been a real breath of fresh air and although the mechanics of the ui is quite challenging(i need to relearn how to do macros so i can use my wasd keys instead of just my mouse) I have been enjoying it so much that I have resubbed.  Who says you can't go home!? :)

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