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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » After GW2 do you want the holy trio back?

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421 posts found
  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3346

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

2/10/13 6:51:35 AM#201


Originally posted by cybertrucker
After GW2 do you want the holy trio back?

It never went anywhere...


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  Omnifish

Novice Member

Joined: 2/16/11
Posts: 615

I'll kick your a**e so hard, you could build a swimming pool in the footprint!

2/10/13 11:03:33 AM#202
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by Aodhan

For all you ppl that want the heal/tank class back including myself, Stop supporting the games that are released without.

Simple money speaks.

look at the numbers in this poll a pretty good example that we are not in the minority as some would like you to beleave.

Sticking with Vanguard till something better comes along.

if my time at mmorpg.com has taught me anything the "majority" here is generally never what the general masses wants or feels in terms of pretty much anything

Wowsers I agree with Aerowyn.  Hell has frozen over ;)

This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!

  Rohn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/08
Posts: 3754

2/10/13 11:10:48 AM#203

The "trinity" is just a method, one that's evolved in the genre because it's effective and understandable, and fits well into a roleplaying game.  There's nothing inherently wrong or evil about it.

"Anything would be better than the trinity" is not a true statement.  To me, GW2 has proven that there are much worse systems with the one they implemented.  Different isn't always better, and change for the sake of change can result in something worse than the original.

If a game is going to replace the trinity with "something else", they should probably ensure that it's better.

Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  Eir_S

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

2/10/13 11:11:59 AM#204
Originally posted by observer
It would have worked in GW2, except there wasn't a threat mechanic, and if there was, it wasn't implemented well.  That's why it felt chaotic, instead of a controlled environment.

Wasn't implimented well = I didn't understand it. 

The aggro mechanic is just complicated compared to a trinity game, that's the precise reason most people don't get it.  They're used to having their mobs do exactly what they want.

  MightyChasm

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/03/13
Posts: 311

2/10/13 11:12:47 AM#205
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by observer
It would have worked in GW2, except there wasn't a threat mechanic, and if there was, it wasn't implemented well.  That's why it felt chaotic, instead of a controlled environment.

Wasn't implimented well = I didn't understand it. 

The aggro mechanic is just complicated compared to a trinity game, that's the precise reason most people don't get it.  They're used to having their mobs do exactly what they want.

Sigh, the same tired response whenever someone levels valid criticism at the game.  

  Eir_S

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

2/10/13 11:16:02 AM#206
Originally posted by MightyChasm
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by observer
It would have worked in GW2, except there wasn't a threat mechanic, and if there was, it wasn't implemented well.  That's why it felt chaotic, instead of a controlled environment.

Wasn't implimented well = I didn't understand it. 

The aggro mechanic is just complicated compared to a trinity game, that's the precise reason most people don't get it.  They're used to having their mobs do exactly what they want.

Sigh, the same tired response whenever someone levels valid criticism at the game.  

Irony at its finest.

The aggro mechanic is still having to be explained to people to this day.  My post is valid.  Yours?  Well yeah, not really necessary or constructive.

  MightyChasm

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/03/13
Posts: 311

2/10/13 11:17:46 AM#207
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by MightyChasm
Originally posted by Eir_S
Originally posted by observer
It would have worked in GW2, except there wasn't a threat mechanic, and if there was, it wasn't implemented well.  That's why it felt chaotic, instead of a controlled environment.

Wasn't implimented well = I didn't understand it. 

The aggro mechanic is just complicated compared to a trinity game, that's the precise reason most people don't get it.  They're used to having their mobs do exactly what they want.

Sigh, the same tired response whenever someone levels valid criticism at the game.  

Irony at its finest.

The aggro mechanic is still having to be explained to people to this day.  My post is valid.  Yours?  Well yeah, not really necessary or constructive.

I assume you are using the Alanis Morissette definition of irony? 

  Bojman

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/15/06
Posts: 5

2/10/13 11:20:47 AM#208
Originally posted by Icewhite

Please lord, let us have another game that understands additional roles, some day.

Tank, healer, dps is all right, but so limiting. I'm sure if you asked gamers, we may remember a few other roles...

OTOH, too many roles and pugs do get confused..

The op could only conceive of two possible outcomes, it seems.

Yeah what happened to the support/buffer role? Or the hybrid?

  dimnikar

Novice Member

Joined: 11/06/12
Posts: 277

2/10/13 11:23:28 AM#209

Looks like the majority in this poll was not impressed with GW2s class role system.

Personally, I can't envision having fun in any cooperative game without at least loosely defined roles.

http://lyrics.iztok.org/verse/Lynyrd_Skynyrd/Simple_Man/80615

  Skuall

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/20/05
Posts: 849

2/10/13 11:27:10 AM#210

the idea was cool , no trinity ....but ingame , was just chaos and not that fun :S

if mmo devs need to implement something do it like rift  every class/archetype is a hybrid , no X role only class.

or FFXI 1 character can be all the classes, so u dont feel like losing everything if u want to reroll , (achivements , mounts ect)

 

Tanking as rogue in rift was fun (now is more simple less buffs tracking and thats not bad was a bit insane)

but tanking as Nin in FFXI ? nothing can beat that :P

 

and yeah i miss the the support/CC archetype ,howerver u are gonna be forced to have 1 and thats why WoW gave buffs/auras to other classes "bring the player not the class "

 

 

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3415

2/10/13 11:29:09 AM#211
     I hate the holdy trinity.. You end up with a 3 class game..  DPS, Tank and Heals....... I want to see something similar to the original EQ..  I want to see more roles and hybrids, but that isnt' going to happen unless you throw "PvP" and "Raid" balance out the window..  I want a PURE PvE game with a variety of classes to play.. The more the better :)
  Avarix

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/22/12
Posts: 297

2/10/13 11:29:36 AM#212
Yes and no. I really disliked GW2 dungeons. I mean REALLY disliked them. They made me want to sit on a knife... However, I don't like the "trinity" much better since my favorite class type, controller, has disappeared with it. I haven't seen one properly implemented in a game in ages. If it takes the trinity to bring back the control role, then I will welcome it.
  Rohn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/02/08
Posts: 3754

2/10/13 11:30:01 AM#213
Originally posted by Skuall

the idea was cool , no trinity ....but ingame , was just chaos and not that fun :S

if mmo devs need to implement something do it like rift  every class/archetype is a hybrid , no X role only class.

or FFXI 1 character can be all the classes, so u dont feel like losing everything if u want to reroll , (achivements , mounts ect)

 

Tanking as rogue in rift was fun (now is more simple less buffs tracking and thats not bad was a bit insane)

but tanking as Nin in FFXI ? nothing can beat that :P

 

 

 

Same thing with TSW, every character can eventually have every skill, and fill every role.

Agree that the GW2 system sounded good on paper, but is an unenjoyable mess in reality.  It's a lot worse than a trinity-based system.

Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  Serelisk

Novice Member

Joined: 8/02/11
Posts: 845

2/10/13 11:36:46 AM#214
Originally posted by SavageHorizon

I'm glad you love GW2's system, you can play GW2 and we who like the trinity can play games like TESO.

 

Everyone is happy, right?

I wish it was like that... Sigh. Then again, people can justly express their opinions. But there's a clear spread misinformation still on how GW2's system actually works. (6 months in, amazing right? lol) I guess it's okay to just say we're immune to valid criticism whenever we try to explain it. I still like GW2's system because I can play the class I like to play based on the style of play, not the pigeonhole it's ascribed to. So soft trinities are the way to go methinks. 

Please note: The Holy Trinity only refers to concrete and non-flexible systems like WoW where there's a dedicated tank, a dedicated healer, and the rest pew pew with no in between. 

 

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

2/10/13 11:40:18 AM#215
Originally posted by Serelisk
Originally posted by SavageHorizon

I'm glad you love GW2's system, you can play GW2 and we who like the trinity can play games like TESO.

 

Everyone is happy, right?

I wish it was like that... Sigh. Then again, people can justly express their opinions. But there's a clear spread misinformation still on how GW2's system actually works. (6 months in, amazing right? lol) I guess it's okay to just say we're immune to valid criticism whenever we try to explain it. I still like GW2's system because I can play the class I like to play based on the style of play, not the pigeonhole it's ascribed to. So soft trinities are the way to go methinks. 

Please note: The Holy Trinity only refers to concrete and non-flexible systems like WoW where there's a dedicated tank, a dedicated healer, and the rest pew pew with no in between. 

 

yea it is funny was doing CM last night and had some guy rage quit because he kept getting one shot by the bomber guy towards the end.. he left we got a replacement and finished it no problem... most of the issues i have seen with people on gw2 dungeons are people who just can't adapt to changes or just don't care to.

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  moosecatlol

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/25/10
Posts: 1178

2/10/13 11:41:01 AM#216

There is no best, there is only how a game is designed. For instance, would you say that TF2 would be better if everyone was homogenized? How about Forge(lulshamannerfs)?

At the same time, how would you feel if Marauders from Path of Exile could only tank, and Witches could only fill dps roles?

But what I am more curious about, is the fact that people actually think that there are not tanks nor healers in Guild Wars 2. I can safely say that if you've played Guild Wars 2 up to this day, and still don't understand the aggro mechanic intricacies, then you definitely did not make it passed FL50, and probably never will seeing as FL51 is walled off.

  ThomasN7

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/17/07
Posts: 6671

"Had to be me. Someone else might have gotten it wrong.” - Mordin Solus

2/10/13 11:45:42 AM#217
The masses love knowing their roles in mmos. Removing the holy trinity confuses people. Some can adapt most can't or choose not to.  I prefer the holy trinity because it gives my character a purpose.
  Eir_S

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/07/11
Posts: 4703

GW2 socialist.

2/10/13 11:46:22 AM#218
Originally posted by Serelisk
there's a clear spread misinformation still on how GW2's system actually works. (6 months in, amazing right? lol)

Ha, yeah right.  Most of them just say it doesn't work at all, instead of trying to wrap their heads around the detail behind the system (particularly aggro) works.  It's easier to say "it's fail" than to admit maybe you don't understand it because the idea of everything going for the tank has been bashed into your head for a decade.  *shrug*  If you say this, however, people will say you're wrong.

Even I don't understand the GW2 aggro system completely, even after months of playing and/or reading others' experiences.  But there is a system, it's just more complex than the usual.  Is that better?  Maybe, maybe not, it's all opinion anyway.

  Serelisk

Novice Member

Joined: 8/02/11
Posts: 845

2/10/13 11:47:00 AM#219
Originally posted by moosecatlol

There is no best, there is only how a game is designed. For instance, would you say that TF2 would be better if everyone was homogenized? How about Forge(lulshamannerfs)?

At the same time, how would you feel if Marauders from Path of Exile could only tank, and Witches could only fill dps roles?

But what I am more curious about, is the fact that people actually think that there are not tanks nor healers in Guild Wars 2. I can safely say that if you've played Guild Wars 2 up to this day, and still don't understand the aggro mechanic intricacies, then you definitely did not make it passed FL50, and probably never will seeing as FL51 is walled off.

See, I don't even know what that's like cause I don't even do dungeons. I just do WvW and am a commander in a 400 man guild on Fort Aspenwood. And I can probably safely say a lot of people commenting on GW2 combat here saying it's messy or what have you don't have a firm grasp on what sigils, runes, traits, and probably most importantly, skill combos, do to the game. We can certainly start talking roles there. :-)

  red_cruiser

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/12/07
Posts: 462

2/10/13 11:49:23 AM#220
Originally posted by Rydeson
     I hate the holdy trinity.. You end up with a 3 class game..  DPS, Tank and Heals....... I want to see something similar to the original EQ..  I want to see more roles and hybrids, but that isnt' going to happen unless you throw "PvP" and "Raid" balance out the window..  I want a PURE PvE game with a variety of classes to play.. The more the better :)

This is what I agree with.  More roles; not less.

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