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Neverwinter

Neverwinter 

General Discussion  » What's The Point?

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79 posts found
  olepi

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/15/07
Posts: 1024

2/10/13 10:40:59 AM#61

Some of the most fun I've ever had in an MMO was with the Ryzom Ring, creating a scenario, publishing it, and being the DM and watching people play it.  If the Foundry lets me do that, I will definitely play with it.

But not if it costs much money; I don't feel like paying the company so that I can create free content for the company.

------------
RIP City of Heroes. One of my favorite MMO's.

  Vesavius

Old School

Joined: 3/08/04
Posts: 7358

Players come for the game, but they stay for the people- Most Devs have forgotten this.

2/10/13 10:47:00 AM#62
Originally posted by Rider071
Originally posted by Warley

Even though most of us haven't played it we've still played it.  Let's be honest, folks, there won't be anything new or different here.  It's the same game done already over the years with a new name.  Plus, the root/base of this game comes from the same blockbuster, massive hits such as Star Trek Online and Champions Online.

Here's what is going to happen.  People are going to play it and like it for the first few days.  Then, after they feel it's the game for them, defended it to no end on forums, and feel its going to be the next big thing that newness will start to wear off.  They'll be too afraid to admit it by now, since they battled for it so hard, but they'll be to that point that they realize it's the same old game wrapped in a different package.

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

Someone mentioned DDO, but DDO is a seperately written universe (Eberron) with it's own rulesets, it actually was never true to D+D and didn't have to be.

 

By your reckoning, Forgotten Realms is not 'true' D&D either. Greyhawk is. FR was, after all, a seperatly written universe with it's own rulesets.

DDO, from what I see of NW so far, captures far more of the D&D PnP 'spirit' then the generic MMORPG design that NW clings to seems to.

  thark

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/01/03
Posts: 1107

2/10/13 10:53:37 AM#63
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by Rider071
Originally posted by Warley

Even though most of us haven't played it we've still played it.  Let's be honest, folks, there won't be anything new or different here.  It's the same game done already over the years with a new name.  Plus, the root/base of this game comes from the same blockbuster, massive hits such as Star Trek Online and Champions Online.

Here's what is going to happen.  People are going to play it and like it for the first few days.  Then, after they feel it's the game for them, defended it to no end on forums, and feel its going to be the next big thing that newness will start to wear off.  They'll be too afraid to admit it by now, since they battled for it so hard, but they'll be to that point that they realize it's the same old game wrapped in a different package.

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

Someone mentioned DDO, but DDO is a seperately written universe (Eberron) with it's own rulesets, it actually was never true to D+D and didn't have to be.

 

By your reckoning, Forgotten Realms is not 'true' D&D either. Greyhawk is. FR was, after all, a seperatly written universe with it's own rulesets.

DDO, from what I see of NW so far, captures far more of the D&D PnP 'spirit' then the generic MMORPG design that NW clings to seems to.

 I agree :)

  gillrmn

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/04/12
Posts: 251

2/10/13 11:26:50 AM#64
Originally posted by Warley

Even though most of us haven't played it we've still played it.  Let's be honest, folks, there won't be anything new or different here.  It's the same game done already over the years with a new name.  Plus, the root/base of this game comes from the same blockbuster, massive hits such as Star Trek Online and Champions Online.

Here's what is going to happen.  People are going to play it and like it for the first few days.  Then, after they feel it's the game for them, defended it to no end on forums, and feel its going to be the next big thing that newness will start to wear off.  They'll be too afraid to admit it by now, since they battled for it so hard, but they'll be to that point that they realize it's the same old game wrapped in a different package.

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

The point is not doing 'something different'. The point is doing something right.

 

Most games which tried to do something different crashed or had really short lives. And nothing exists now which can be called different for everything has been done once before. Everythng has already been tried at least once (usually more).

 

Here they are concentrating on things to do them right - hence the reason for delay. They are not getting influenced by tropes of 'this game should be X' but have their own vision and picking up elements which fit in their vision. The intrduction of rooting even when they can do without it is a point in study.

  HorrorScope

Novice Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 612

2/10/13 11:36:06 AM#65
Originally posted by MurlockDance
Originally posted by nilden

I didn't say wotc couldn't commison another NWN. I didn't say that Neverwinter was Neverwinter Nights even though they have the entire setting in common it's obvious they are different games. I also never mention any IP rights.

I did say.. I would have prefered a Neverwinter Nights 3 not made by Cryptic. I would rather that this was NWN 3 coming out than D&D: Neverwinter.

Some reaons why would include:

Modding and module design plus player made servers/persitant worlds were great in NWN 2 but in NWN 2 you could only host a server with a static ip. The foundry while being a great feature along the lines of mission architect in City of Heroes will be much more limited than a stand alone NWN toolkit. I would much rather pay box price and own the game. You really don't need an MMO for group based adventuring just solid multiplayer support and letting players build and host their own servers. NWN 2 came out in 2006 and it would be a great time to update the engine and graphics etc in a third installment along with having all the classes and races expanding on NWN 1 and 2.

 

You said exactly what I have been thinking about while following this title. I would so love another great sRPG or non massively multiplayer RPG along the lines of NWN, BG, Torment

 

They are coming.... Divintiy Original Sin and Project Enternity to name a couple. DOS I'm looking forward to the most.

  ShakyMo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/21/11
Posts: 7246

2/10/13 12:21:17 PM#66
The guy who made Planescape has started working with those guys doing the wasteland kickstarter, been a few articles on the web on the spiritual successor to Planescape, they plan a simmilar story and themes to Planescape, but its not using d&d mechanics its using a wasteland / fallout type system.
  AG-Vuk

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/26/04
Posts: 822

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
Oh, I see it's too late to help you.

2/10/13 12:29:42 PM#67
Originally posted by gillrmn
Originally posted by Warley

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

The point is not doing 'something different'. The point is doing something right.

 

Most games which tried to do something different crashed or had really short lives. And nothing exists now which can be called different for everything has been done once before. Everythng has already been tried at least once (usually more).

 

Here they are concentrating on things to do them right - hence the reason for delay. They are not getting influenced by tropes of 'this game should be X' but have their own vision and picking up elements which fit in their vision. The intrduction of rooting even when they can do without it is a point in study.

Please stop while you have a modium of respectablity. This is Cryptic you are talking about. Anyone with any past experience knows this is the furthest thing from what they do or attempt. If you doubt that just visit STO, or any other game they've developed.  A Leopard does not change it's spots. 

  A.Blackloch

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/21/07
Posts: 840

"Choke on the smoke from my quill."

2/10/13 2:09:00 PM#68
I'm just waiting for the moment when our mmopgs have just 1 skill in quickbar and trained monkeys playing with pc gamers to populate the servers. Looks like it won't take long anymore.

  jtcgs

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/28/04
Posts: 1843

2/10/13 2:15:48 PM#69
Originally posted by AG-Vuk
Originally posted by gillrmn
Originally posted by Warley

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

The point is not doing 'something different'. The point is doing something right.

 

Most games which tried to do something different crashed or had really short lives. And nothing exists now which can be called different for everything has been done once before. Everythng has already been tried at least once (usually more).

 

Here they are concentrating on things to do them right - hence the reason for delay. They are not getting influenced by tropes of 'this game should be X' but have their own vision and picking up elements which fit in their vision. The intrduction of rooting even when they can do without it is a point in study.

Please stop while you have a modium of respectablity. This is Cryptic you are talking about. Anyone with any past experience knows this is the furthest thing from what they do or attempt. If you doubt that just visit STO, or any other game they've developed.  A Leopard does not change it's spots. 

 This of cource would be the same Cryptic that made City of Heroes a game that just had a massive online protest over the game being shut down 10 years after release beacuse it was still making money...so, guess maybe you should stop while you have a modium of respectability, if any are still giving it to you at all.

“I hope we shall crush...in its birth the aristocracy of our moneyed corporations, which dare already to challenge our government to a trial of strength and bid defiance to the laws of our country." ~Thomes Jefferson

  insaner666

Novice Member

Joined: 3/29/11
Posts: 18

2/10/13 2:21:22 PM#70

F2P Fucked SWTOR, with the cartel market and its greedy items.

Theres Too Many restrictions, and an ex-subscriber cant stand them.

 

I Hope people dont waste money on games that treats the player like this (even if some do deserve to be sucked of money XD)

Why i care?, honestly because it affects me in the future... People will cause this model to be a succes and then it will be a norm, things we got in the past for free we will have to pay and we will not even notice their schemes.

  AG-Vuk

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/26/04
Posts: 822

Fat, drunk and stupid is no way to go through life, son.
Oh, I see it's too late to help you.

2/11/13 10:59:09 AM#71
Originally posted by jtcgs
Originally posted by AG-Vuk
Originally posted by gillrmn
Originally posted by Warley

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

The point is not doing 'something different'. The point is doing something right.

Please stop while you have a modium of respectablity. This is Cryptic you are talking about. Anyone with any past experience knows this is the furthest thing from what they do or attempt. If you doubt that just visit STO, or any other game they've developed.  A Leopard does not change it's spots. 

 This of cource would be the same Cryptic that made City of Heroes a game that just had a massive online protest over the game being shut down 10 years after release beacuse it was still making money...so, guess maybe you should stop while you have a modium of respectability, if any are still giving it to you at all.

That incarnation of Cryptic left when CoX was sold to NC Soft. NC Soft retained most of the staff of Cryptic for CoX . Of course it matters little that their last 2 offerring are such smashing successes, which we know they weren't. Hey , 1/3 success rate I guess that's what passes for acceptable. If this were a school semester , it would rank as failure. Granted in Business not everything can be a success, but when the formula you use has failed in 2/3 attempts that should a warning sign. But hey it was Cryptic that shut down CoX . One should reconsider before casting that stone.

  BadSpock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 8/21/04
Posts: 7749

Logic be damned!

2/11/13 11:09:28 AM#72
Originally posted by azzamasin

God its going to be fun to actually play a themepark (THE BESTEST GENRE OF MMO's) and never run out of content because the game is setup first and formost as a dungeon adventurers ultimate game.  Neverwnding content thanks to the Foundry UGC.  No longer will I play an MMO and grow bored of it in 2 months because the developers cant keep up with content demand. 

Optimism. I like it! This site always needs more of it.

I also love Aerowyn's quote - "But how can you possibly have fun without spending 18 hours a day for 10 years in a deep, meaningful game?!?" *paraphrased*

I love it.

MMO's are supposed to be fun. If the game is fun, I'll play it. If the game is really fun and I want to invest in my character a bit, I'll spend some money.

 

Now Playing: Destiny, WoW

  MurlockDance

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/20/10
Posts: 1225

2/12/13 4:04:22 AM#73
Originally posted by HorrorScope

They are coming.... Divintiy Original Sin and Project Enternity to name a couple. DOS I'm looking forward to the most.

Ooo thanks ! I will definitely keep track of those games. Is Divinity Original Sin based on Divine Divinity by any chance ?

Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994.

  gillrmn

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/04/12
Posts: 251

2/12/13 9:31:03 AM#74
Originally posted by AG-Vuk
Originally posted by gillrmn
Originally posted by Warley

Send a message to the game industry, "We're tired of the same crappy formulaic game design." DO NOT GIVE THEM YOUR MONEY!

The point is not doing 'something different'. The point is doing something right.

 

Most games which tried to do something different crashed or had really short lives. And nothing exists now which can be called different for everything has been done once before. Everythng has already been tried at least once (usually more).

 

Here they are concentrating on things to do them right - hence the reason for delay. They are not getting influenced by tropes of 'this game should be X' but have their own vision and picking up elements which fit in their vision. The intrduction of rooting even when they can do without it is a point in study.

Please stop while you have a modium of respectablity. This is Cryptic you are talking about. Anyone with any past experience knows this is the furthest thing from what they do or attempt. If you doubt that just visit STO, or any other game they've developed.  A Leopard does not change it's spots. 

I don't know what you mean by "modium of respectablility" but I still stand by my statement for it is true.

I am not defending the cryptic in any way - I hate their marketing team. I believe especially the suits from PWE are a bunch of liars and have reason to believe that community moderators are told to lie in forums to form opinions. Although I do not have any proof but I have a big reason to believe that they are systematically supressing opinions and have a large say in who gets keys in so-called contests which are not fair.

 

But that is in no way related to the game. the game is still execellent. The development team has a vision. Their product is still good. Yes they have an evil parasite of liars attached to it - but thankfully they have no say in game development - which has so far been execellent. And for all their faults, even the marketing team is doing fine in minting the money from their product.

  Gravarg

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 8/24/06
Posts: 3179

2/12/13 9:33:30 AM#75
Originally posted by Punk999
To have fun is my point hopefully.

You sir, deserve a cookie!

 

I think people get too caught up in what features a game has.  For me, there's only ONE question that really matters...Am I having fun?

  olepi

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/15/07
Posts: 1024

2/12/13 9:41:24 AM#76

"What's the point?"

If you take this to the maximum, you can ask this question about life itself. Whats the point?

I propose that we have no idea of the true context of life, we have no idea what the "point" is, or even if there IS a point at all. Does it really matter if you raise hamsters, skydive, or play MMO's?

To me, at least for MMO's, the point is to have fun, and my vision of fun is:

- learning new things, how to do things in a new, better way

- seeing new things, new territory, exploring

- crafting a character, in order to see new things, explore, etc. Trying out various builds and approaches to the game

Almost any well-done game can provide this, especially "virtual worlds" that are wide open.

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RIP City of Heroes. One of my favorite MMO's.

  User Deleted
2/12/13 4:43:51 PM#77

So lets say you're a DM and you want to create a campaign for your players.  Your players pick their classes and the DM designs a series of encounters and dungeons for the players to go through.

The players get together and they jump into the game and ABSOLUTELY FRICKIN' LOVE IT.

The DM thinks, "This is awesome.  I wish other people could see the work I've put in."

Wouldn't it be great if there was a new game that could let you do that?

 

Boy I wish Neverwinter could do that.  Oh wait...it can.  

You can turn DnD night into Neverwinter night and still have that experience of adventuring with your friends.  And it's free.

That's the point.

 

  User Deleted
2/12/13 4:46:13 PM#78
Originally posted by BadSpock
 

If the game is really fun and I want to invest in my character a bit, I'll spend some money.

That seems to be how Cryptic is planning to make their money actually.  Making a fun game that people will WANT to spend money on.

  hehenep

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/03/04
Posts: 210

2/12/13 11:11:08 PM#79
Originally posted by AG-Vuk
Originally posted by jtcgs

 This of cource would be the same Cryptic that made City of Heroes a game that just had a massive online protest over the game being shut down 10 years after release beacuse it was still making money...so, guess maybe you should stop while you have a modium of respectability, if any are still giving it to you at all.

That incarnation of Cryptic left when CoX was sold to NC Soft. NC Soft retained most of the staff of Cryptic for CoX . Of course it matters little that their last 2 offerring are such smashing successes, which we know they weren't. Hey , 1/3 success rate I guess that's what passes for acceptable. If this were a school semester , it would rank as failure. Granted in Business not everything can be a success, but when the formula you use has failed in 2/3 attempts that should a warning sign. But hey it was Cryptic that shut down CoX . One should reconsider before casting that stone.

Note:  Cryptic had nothing to do with CoH's shutdown.  There was theorizing about the game's liscence to the engine Cryptic used expiring when the news was first anounced but the Paragon Studios devs made a point to let everyone know that they had the rights to the engine for CoH in perpetuity.  I believe several of Paragon Studios' devs are now actually working at Cryptic.

... also CoH wasn't quite 9 years old.  So 8 not 10.

 

That said, from the bit of the game I've seen it looks like it's decently fun, so hopefully Cryptic did it right.  Time will tell though.

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