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Guild Wars 2

Guild Wars 2 

General Discussion  » Perhaps this game requires too much grind after all

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146 posts found
  User Deleted
1/30/13 7:42:53 PM#41

Sorry Aerowyn Eyelolled and the rest, but that's no longer the case. The first month you could play how you wanted and not have anything stand in your way.

Like to craft, sure you can craft until you reach max level and then you're stuck having to run a single dungeon for any kind of drop to make anything or relying on a double RNG system for their bags (the only viable means other then FoTM of getting T6 mats).

Like to explore (a commonly pve only function in every other game out there) sure you can explore get up to as max as you can then be forced into a gank fest where players are allowed to finish the areas you need to get to, make seige equipment and prevent you from finishing. Or if you liked what you used to find in hidden chests all around Tyria, those days are gone.

Like to PVE? Sure you can pve all you want to until you reach level 80 and every drop in open world that's worth something is nerfed including the meta events, the dragon battles, the veterans/champions so you get nothing for time spent cept karma which is now useless with the new gear that requires dailies, and since all focus is not on the single dungeon you need ascended gear to resist agony for the only part of the game they really are putting an effort into. Have we seen a single meta that was not temporary for a holiday since launch? Nope.

I'd suggest people stay far away from this game until management can take their heads out of their butts and get back to the manifesto and remove the problems making this game extremely stingy, full of holes, where they allow griefing so long as it gets people to pay them.

 

You all know my history in defending this title, I suggest you look at the entire picture of how the economy is, how the devs have failed to fix the items requested, how they've focused only on keeping players with new temporary content as a distraction rather then fixing the glaring problems with this game and how this will ultimately be self defeating as more and more people leave the game. 

Think about it, if they can push someone with my history of defending this title away imagine what's wrong with their management department.

 

Keep Diablo III in mind when you take a look at this title.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

1/30/13 7:56:19 PM#42
Originally posted by itgrowls

Sorry Aerowyn Eyelolled and the rest, but that's no longer the case. The first month you could play how you wanted and not have anything stand in your way.

Like to craft, sure you can craft until you reach max level and then you're stuck having to run a single dungeon for any kind of drop to make anything or relying on a double RNG system for their bags (the only viable means other then FoTM of getting T6 mats).

Like to explore (a commonly pve only function in every other game out there) sure you can explore get up to as max as you can then be forced into a gank fest where players are allowed to finish the areas you need to get to, make seige equipment and prevent you from finishing. Or if you liked what you used to find in hidden chests all around Tyria, those days are gone.

Like to PVE? Sure you can pve all you want to until you reach level 80 and every drop in open world that's worth something is nerfed including the meta events, the dragon battles, the veterans/champions so you get nothing for time spent cept karma which is now useless with the new gear that requires dailies, and since all focus is not on the single dungeon you need ascended gear to resist agony for the only part of the game they really are putting an effort into. Have we seen a single meta that was not temporary for a holiday since launch? Nope.

I'd suggest people stay far away from this game until management can take their heads out of their butts and get back to the manifesto and remove the problems making this game extremely stingy, full of holes, where they allow griefing so long as it gets people to pay them.

 

You all know my history in defending this title, I suggest you look at the entire picture of how the economy is, how the devs have failed to fix the items requested, how they've focused only on keeping players with new temporary content as a distraction rather then fixing the glaring problems with this game and how this will ultimately be self defeating as more and more people leave the game. 

Think about it, if they can push someone with my history of defending this title away imagine what's wrong with their management department.

 

Keep Diablo III in mind when you take a look at this title.

have you played since the ascended gear was put in? and specifically since most recent patch? they adjusted drops in many areas.. also not sure what you are talking about on the chest thing as completing the jumping puzzles i got chest from at launch i still get chests from now. As a whole the game plays the same as it always has and really have not noticed much change at all in that regard.. no sure why you are seeing it differn't... actually overall i feel more rewarded now for just playing the game than ever before(especially since last patch)

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  DaezAster

Novice Member

Joined: 6/18/12
Posts: 789

1/30/13 7:59:51 PM#43
Only big grind imo is for legendaries. Ascended items are pretty easy to get before you will actually need them in fotm. I love fractals so I have no complaints in that department. The new events for january seem to be getting people back out in the world and I'm glad there evolving and learning as apposed to sticking to some dreamers gameplan(aka manifesto). I still give anet kudos and though I have plenty of other games to play still spend the most time in tyria...
  eyelolled

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3085

I am more than some of my parts

1/30/13 8:38:12 PM#44

 

EDIT: Block is a nice feature I should utilize more often

 

All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

  Magnetia

Advanced Member

Joined: 11/07/11
Posts: 965

Any fool can know. The point is to understand.

1/30/13 8:43:13 PM#45

Do I require the best gear to do the hardest content? No, no I don't

They said you wouldn't need to grind to be effective and this is completely true.

There is still grind however and it is genuinely aesthetic despite the almost insignifigant stat bonuses. I can do all the content in greens already, I don't need to grind.

Play for fun. Play to win. Play for perfection. Play with friends. Play in another world. Why do you play?

  Isawa

Novice Member

Joined: 6/20/08
Posts: 1066

1/30/13 8:52:00 PM#46
If I can craft the gear stats I want, then I craft all of my gear. This option is much cheaper. Since you can't craft everything, then you can obtain your pow vit tough (for example) from karma and dungeons, wvw too. I've got a handful of 80s and cleared 4k points the other day - so I know what I'm talking about. I am not interested in legendaries because that is the real grind for shiny gear, stats are no better atm. Ascended gear has a somewhat of a grind, unless you are lucky and get rings from fotm lvl 10 dailies a bunch. With the new update, all you have to do is play the game and you should complete dailies and be rewarded for an eventual ascended. Everyone is at the same lvl here, because it's not like you can repeat dailies and get ahead.
  fundayz

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 10/14/10
Posts: 471

1/30/13 8:52:32 PM#47
Originally posted by Madimorga

That would be true if Exotic were still best in slot.  It isn't.

Sorry to burst your bubble but you having +50 stats at lv80 does nothing to improve your factions chance of winning. WvW relies A LOT more on communication and tactics than it does on stats or even individual player skill.

Anyone that complains about Ascended gear being more powerful is just looking for an excuse to blame their failures on.

"Oh if I had had Ascended I would never have failed that boss encounter"

"Well the whole enemy faction has Ascended gear, of COURSE we would lose"

 

 

Originally posted by Magnetia

There is still grind however and it is genuinely aesthetic despite the almost insignifigant stat bonuses. I can do all the content in greens already, I don't need to grind.

This. Anyone talking about Best In Slot in GW2 has no clue whatsoever. Stats are a non-factor once you have Rare quality items or higher for 95% of content. That other 5% just requires exotics which are darn easy to get.

 

  NomadMorlock

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/09/07
Posts: 445

1/30/13 8:52:50 PM#48

I was really enjoying the game until I was decked out in all Exotics.  I know there are Ascended pieces, but I'm not in a rush nor do I plan on grinding a legendary weapon. 

 

I realize now I miss the gear progression..and character progression past this point.  As I can't easliy acquire better gear..i really don't feel like I have something to work toward.

 

A little bored now with it.

  fundayz

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 10/14/10
Posts: 471

1/30/13 8:57:32 PM#49
Originally posted by NomadMorlock

I was really enjoying the game until I was decked out in all Exotics.  I know there are Ascended pieces, but I'm not in a rush nor do I plan on grinding a legendary weapon. 

 I realize now I miss the gear progression..and character progression past this point.  As I can't easliy acquire better gear..i really don't feel like I have something to work toward.

 A little bored now with it.

That's why Ascended gear was added. You already feel de-motivated by the grind to Ascended gear, imagine how you would feel if you only had Legendaries to go after now?

In addition, that's why Anet is adding systems like the Laurels, in order to facilitate that grind or at the least lower the entry barrier.

  Aerowyn

Novice Member

Joined: 2/20/12
Posts: 7969

1/30/13 9:04:29 PM#50
Originally posted by fundayz
Originally posted by NomadMorlock

I was really enjoying the game until I was decked out in all Exotics.  I know there are Ascended pieces, but I'm not in a rush nor do I plan on grinding a legendary weapon. 

 I realize now I miss the gear progression..and character progression past this point.  As I can't easliy acquire better gear..i really don't feel like I have something to work toward.

 A little bored now with it.

That's why Ascended gear was added. You already feel de-motivated by the grind to Ascended gear, imagine how you would feel if you only had Legendaries to go after now?

In addition, that's why Anet is adding systems like the Laurels, in order to facilitate that grind or at the least lower the entry barrier.

Laurels does help a lot imho.. next step and something i REALLY hope goes in is some sort of skill progression... if it were me i'd revamp the elite skill system and make elites obtainable by very hard encounters throughout the world.. then add new weapon skills all that you would unlock in a similar way and once unlocked you could mix and match that unlocked skill with your current weapon skill set like how the utility skills work... thinks this would be a huge boost for people who feel they don't have enough skill progression in the game... or enough variety in weapon skills

I angered the clerk in a clothing shop today. She asked me what size I was and I said actual, because I am not to scale. I like vending machines 'cause snacks are better when they fall. If I buy a candy bar at a store, oftentimes, I will drop it... so that it achieves its maximum flavor potential. --Mitch Hedberg

  KingPinoy

Novice Member

Joined: 12/14/11
Posts: 55

1/30/13 9:37:53 PM#51
Really? Anotehr "Why gw2 is not fun" thread?
  Corehaven

Novice Member

Joined: 7/27/11
Posts: 1574

I swear by my pretty floral bonnet, I will end you.

1/31/13 1:32:39 AM#52

I'm a pretty big fan of GW2 but yea, its more grindy than I thought it would be.  Which was fine originally as it was close enough.  However they are constantly adding to the grind as time goes on.

 

 I'm beginning to dread updates at this point, because it will either inevitibably add grindy things to the game, or take things already in the game and make them even more grindy.  Such as the new dailys they've implimented which I can't tell you how much I hate. 

 

I still like GW2, its just that Anet is making me like it a little less with each update they've done.  Oh there's TONS of good things in those updates.  The only problem with me is, I'd have been happy to live without those good things in exchange for not having to deal with the stuff I don't like, because I dislike it that much. 

  dimnikar

Novice Member

Joined: 11/06/12
Posts: 277

1/31/13 1:49:40 AM#53

Haha, funny how grind is only a term overused in conjuction with GW2, but any other game, it's the definition of insanity :D

 

Grind away hamsters!

http://lyrics.iztok.org/verse/Lynyrd_Skynyrd/Simple_Man/80615

  eyelolled

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/13/10
Posts: 3085

I am more than some of my parts

1/31/13 1:57:25 AM#54
Originally posted by Corehaven

I'm a pretty big fan of GW2 but yea, its more grindy than I thought it would be.  Which was fine originally as it was close enough.  However they are constantly adding to the grind as time goes on.

 

 I'm beginning to dread updates at this point, because it will either inevitibably add grindy things to the game, or take things already in the game and make them even more grindy.  Such as the new dailys they've implimented which I can't tell you how much I hate. 

 

I still like GW2, its just that Anet is making me like it a little less with each update they've done.  Oh there's TONS of good things in those updates.  The only problem with me is, I'd have been happy to live without those good things in exchange for not having to deal with the stuff I don't like, because I dislike it that much. 

It really makes it less grindy because while you are doing the exact same thing you were doing before, now you can get a laurel out of it as well. So if you were to grind for a month to get 1 item, now you'd get two instead because of the laurels.

All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick.

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

1/31/13 7:23:25 AM#55

There is grind in GW2. The difference is that it's optional grind, not mandatory grind. You want a legendary weapon that gives you no better stats than other max weapons? Yes, you grind for it. You want a set of exotics for your character? Hell, I just equipped my necro in full exotics, including trinkets, amulet and rings, with materials I had in storage through gathering and salvaging. Gathering, btw, is part of the leveling process, so if you're not doing that you're the only one to blame. The fuss over ascended gear is one of the most ridiculous things I've seen... instead of instant-acquire exotics you have slightly better rings (and now amulets) that take a little bit of time investment to get. Basically, they're using the ascended tier to fill the time gap between legendaries and exotics.

 

As far as karma goes, they just added Orrian Jewelry Boxes as a karma sink because people were complaining about having too much and nothing to spend it on. Now you actually have a means to convert that karma to gold, which is a nice touch. (Plus they added exotic back pieces there as well!)

 

 

Oderint, dum metuant.

  Madimorga

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/26/10
Posts: 1997

1/31/13 7:29:19 AM#56

This is the rudest subforum I've ever been in.  But anyway.

 

The Ascended gear should and could have been cosmetic only, but Anet knew perfectly well if it had been cosmetic people wouldn't be grinding fractals like they are.  So they put stat advantages on it.  Not insignificant stats, either.

 

Then they didn't even have the courtesy to make sure those of us who don't do dungeons can get the gear in the same time frame.  Totally goes back on what they said about players not being forced to grind dungeons at level cap.  Totally goes against 'play your way'.

 

I don't have to get 'dominated' in pvp by someone's gear to know when a close fight I lost would have been a win.  Anyone who has gone into WvW undergeared and underleveled knows what it's like to lose to a worse player due to stats.   

 

 

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals.

~Albert Einstein

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3237

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

1/31/13 7:32:12 AM#57


Originally posted by MMOExposed
Perhaps this game requires too much grind after all. 

somebody on the forum posted a nice thread that maybe we could discuss over here as well to avoid any issues Anet may have with it.

 


Revolution Hi I like the rest of you bought into this game but I feel like I was punched in the gut and laughed at. This game was suppose to built on not having grind. This was one of Anet’s key manifesto points however now: 1. Legendary weapon grind 2. Gold Grind – you need atleast 100 gold for the ideal build and armor you want. If you want any of the ‘special’ weapon look at grinding out atleast another 300-500 gold (legend range for a min of 1.5k to 2.5k) -unless your brilliant at investing or lucky your looking at around 50-60 hours of grinding to get the armor and build you want. Ironically in GW1 which was ‘suppose’ to be more of a grind this was alot simplier and easier. Another key point of their manifesto was no gear grind as of now there is: 1. Ascended gear (what?! isn’t this what they said WOULD NOT happen? Did they not say how they disproved of this? How the game should be about having fun?) They already stated they tend to add more gear grinds later how (Why? The game was released for only 3 months and Anet felt they had to add in a gear grind already?) I can’t imagine what will happen in a year from now. 2. Karma gear -to get one set of karma get you need atleast 240k karma. Yeah for the above avg. causal – to hardcore this is possible but for us casuals this is NOT possible in a reasonable amount of time. And finally did they not state how this was directed towards everyday? People who simply do not have the time to put in 100s of hours into the game? The information given above tends to differ. What I don’t understand and what the community in general is confused about is why this game was marked towards people who don’t like grind. Simple put, why not market it towards the people that love grind? (not saying that is bad but it is a completly different market)  
 

 

I would agree. Seems strange to market the game to people that do not like a grind.

But one of the grinds I would add, is the leveling grind. why did they have a higher leveling curve for 1-30 compared to the higher levels? whats the point of that? especially seeing that players cant use elites nor run dungeons until level 30. the leveling curve is backwards. I remember early on Anet said that there would be no leveling curve. But I guess they changed their mind. But why?

 

Whats your opinion on this?


You know what, Im probably in the minority but i actually don't mind a grind. As long as it's going somewhere.

If i were directed to grind so i can be on the same plateau as others i don't find that a 'meaningful grind'

I don't mind a grind that puts you ahead, Say: Eve Online mining grinds, The more effort you put in the more profit you will make.


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  Volkon

Novice Member

Joined: 9/14/10
Posts: 3813

Facts do not require fiction for balance.

1/31/13 7:36:04 AM#58
Originally posted by Madimorga

This is the rudest subforum I've ever been in.  But anyway.

 

The Ascended gear should and could have been cosmetic only, but Anet knew perfectly well if it had been cosmetic people wouldn't be grinding fractals like they are.  So they put stat advantages on it.  Not insignificant stats, either.

 

Then they didn't even have the courtesy to make sure those of us who don't do dungeons can get the gear in the same time frame.  Totally goes back on what they said about players not being forced to grind dungeons at level cap.  Totally goes against 'play your way'.

 

I don't have to get 'dominated' in pvp by someone's gear to know when a close fight I lost would have been a win.  Anyone who has gone into WvW undergeared and underleveled knows what it's like to lose to a worse player due to stats.   

 

 

 

They're adding more avenues towards ascended gear as we speak. They've just added a "dailies = ascended gear" route, so you never have to set foot in Fractals if you don't want to, and they'll be adding more avenues in the near future, including some PvP specific ones for the sPvP or WvW crowds. 

 

By the way... the most someone will have in WvW is two ascended rings with marginally better stats. If you get dominated by someone there it's not the rings that are to blame. They just simply beat you that fight, or were a thief. 

Oderint, dum metuant.

  User Deleted
1/31/13 7:42:29 AM#59
Originally posted by Aerowyn
Originally posted by itgrowls

Sorry Aerowyn Eyelolled and the rest, but that's no longer the case. The first month you could play how you wanted and not have anything stand in your way.

Like to craft, sure you can craft until you reach max level and then you're stuck having to run a single dungeon for any kind of drop to make anything or relying on a double RNG system for their bags (the only viable means other then FoTM of getting T6 mats).

Like to explore (a commonly pve only function in every other game out there) sure you can explore get up to as max as you can then be forced into a gank fest where players are allowed to finish the areas you need to get to, make seige equipment and prevent you from finishing. Or if you liked what you used to find in hidden chests all around Tyria, those days are gone.

Like to PVE? Sure you can pve all you want to until you reach level 80 and every drop in open world that's worth something is nerfed including the meta events, the dragon battles, the veterans/champions so you get nothing for time spent cept karma which is now useless with the new gear that requires dailies, and since all focus is not on the single dungeon you need ascended gear to resist agony for the only part of the game they really are putting an effort into. Have we seen a single meta that was not temporary for a holiday since launch? Nope.

I'd suggest people stay far away from this game until management can take their heads out of their butts and get back to the manifesto and remove the problems making this game extremely stingy, full of holes, where they allow griefing so long as it gets people to pay them.

 

You all know my history in defending this title, I suggest you look at the entire picture of how the economy is, how the devs have failed to fix the items requested, how they've focused only on keeping players with new temporary content as a distraction rather then fixing the glaring problems with this game and how this will ultimately be self defeating as more and more people leave the game. 

Think about it, if they can push someone with my history of defending this title away imagine what's wrong with their management department.

 

Keep Diablo III in mind when you take a look at this title.

have you played since the ascended gear was put in? and specifically since most recent patch? they adjusted drops in many areas.. also not sure what you are talking about on the chest thing as completing the jumping puzzles i got chest from at launch i still get chests from now. As a whole the game plays the same as it always has and really have not noticed much change at all in that regard.. no sure why you are seeing it differn't... actually overall i feel more rewarded now for just playing the game than ever before(especially since last patch)

Yep tried it every patch day and every time they had something new, nothings the same as prior to nov 15th. dunno what game you're playing unless you actually do dungeons something that was never supposed to be the game focus in the first place.

This game is far from what it was at launch. Heck it took 5 months to get them to see they had completely broken the engineer class and they finally fixed one of the bugs that was there since BWE2. Cone attacks missing. There's a serious problem with the management and their lack of understanding on how to allocate resources to get the job done as well as the need for a PTR. 

They had three things completely malfunction when they launched this patch which could have easily been avoided had their entire testing system didn't consist of two interns playing the new patch against 2 target dummies on a closed shell. Seriously, that's how bad it is, and it pretty much sums up what they've been doing with the nerfs to PVE something else they promised would not happen in the name of balancing pvp with their "new improved" testing practice where they claim a PTR is not needed. spsssh.

  botrytis

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 2505

1/31/13 7:49:42 AM#60
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Perhaps this game requires too much grind after all. 

somebody on the forum posted a nice thread that maybe we could discuss over here as well to avoid any issues Anet may have with it.

 

Revolution

Hi I like the rest of you bought into this game but I feel like I was punched in the gut and laughed at.
This game was suppose to built on not having grind. This was one of Anet’s key manifesto points however now:
1. Legendary weapon grind
2. Gold Grind – you need atleast 100 gold for the ideal build and armor you want. If you want any of the ‘special’ weapon look at grinding out atleast another 300-500 gold (legend range for a min of 1.5k to 2.5k) -unless your brilliant at investing or lucky your looking at around 50-60 hours of grinding to get the armor and build you want. Ironically in GW1 which was ‘suppose’ to be more of a grind this was alot simplier and easier.
Another key point of their manifesto was no gear grind as of now there is:
1. Ascended gear (what?! isn’t this what they said WOULD NOT happen? Did they not say how they disproved of this? How the game should be about having fun?)
They already stated they tend to add more gear grinds later how (Why? The game was released for only 3 months and Anet felt they had to add in a gear grind already?) I can’t imagine what will happen in a year from now.
2. Karma gear -to get one set of karma get you need atleast 240k karma. Yeah for the above avg. causal – to hardcore this is possible but for us casuals this is NOT possible in a reasonable amount of time.

And finally did they not state how this was directed towards everyday? People who simply do not have the time to put in 100s of hours into the game? The information given above tends to differ.
What I don’t understand and what the community in general is confused about is why this game was marked towards people who don’t like grind. Simple put, why not market it towards the people that love grind? (not saying that is bad but it is a completly different market)

 

 

 

I would agree. Seems strange to market the game to people that do not like a grind.

But one of the grinds I would add, is the leveling grind. why did they have a higher leveling curve for 1-30 compared to the higher levels? whats the point of that? especially seeing that players cant use elites nor run dungeons until level 30. the leveling curve is backwards. I remember early on Anet said that there would be no leveling curve. But I guess they changed their mind. But why?

 

Whats your opinion on this?

Sorry - if you want orders armor for example - it is 9 gold - 10-12 total with the superior runes - here is the proof - http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Order_of_Whispers_armor. That is not 100 gold. I don't know where people are pulling these numbers from - well I can say where but not on this forum.

 

As far as leveling, it is the same amount of xp needed to go from lvl 2 to 3 as it is from lvl 79 to 80. It is a flat line - there is no curve. Much of what you are talking about is design of the game. So now you want elite skills at level 1? I thought people wanted to have some acheivements and getting elite skills is one acheivement You can't have it both ways.

 

I think people just want to complain for the sake of complaining - this thread is dealing with a non-issue.

"In 50 years, when I talk to my grandchildren about these days, I'll make sure to mention what an accomplished MMO player I was. They are going to be so proud ..."
by Naqaj - 7/17/2013 MMORPG.com forum

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