Let's be honest here, those of you complaining about the gold -> silver conversion rates, how long (if at all) have you played the game?

Like I said before, it's quite possible, and somewhat easy to get the following:

- Step Across Clouds

- Whirlwind Step

- Full Silver Gear (2-3 buffs each)

- Goose Step

- Step On High Ladder

That right there, will put you near the top of the pack.  Some differences come into play when we start talking about other school skills - some of which are RIDICULOUSLY highly priced (Emei block skill 5-6 ding).  Yeah you could drop the $150 - $180 to outright buy that but that is utterly insane.  All you'd have to do is go farm some scripts yourself, it's not hard.  Again, a matter of time not so much of winning.  You don't need those extra books to be powerful.  I'm a pure beggar - I do fine.

Instead of just seeing a function and throwing out your first reaction, actually take a look at the game and consider the total situation.  From a player that is effectively free ($20 for VIP), I do not feel like I'm at a significant disadvantage.

Think about it another way.  This also develops a hard floor on the price of silver -> gold and a soft, player driven ceiling.  Looking at how much it costs for the lowest tier of gold which is $3 for 10 gold (3.33 gold per $1 --> 33 liang).  Thus 1 gold will probably settle near or around 33 liang (say 10% arbitrage) so 37 liang.  The thing about this conversion rate is that it is going to prevent cash shop items from inflating to ridiculous levels, because you can always just go drop $3 for 10 gold.

There are also massive silver sinks in the game, for just about everything you do. I think the game economy is setup in a way to mitigate each factor being complained about here.

Originally posted by Aeonblades
Game is P2W even if it is a decent game. Don't sugar coat it. If you can buy the major currency in a cash shop, that is clearly P2W. Rabid Fanboys inbound I'm sure.

I guess it just depends on your definition of P2W

I always took the "if you can't get it in game with reasonable expectations but you can buy it in the cash shop and you need it to play the game (ie not a vanity outfit or pet or mount skin) then yes it is pay 2 win"

Some people think if a subscription gives you benifits it is pay 2 win...but I think this is stupid because of course a subscription gives you benifits...otherwise no one would buy the damn things. Charity case gamers be damned the game has to support itself somehow.

As far as currency, google any game and that games currency and you will get currency sellers. Your sig says you play Swtor

https://www.google.com/search?q=swtor+gold&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a

it is simply not the case that because other games don't have it built in they don't have the feature. I know plenty of people who spent 5 bucks on WoW gold back in the day to buy up netherweave bags not to have to deal with inventory space problems. GW2 and Eve also have it built in and no one calls those titles pay 2 win even though they have the EXACT SAME FEATURE.

That being said, there is a very fine line with cash shops and pay2win...and if they start offering skills in the cash shop that you can not get in the game, I will just drop this title in the recycle bin and be done with it. Until then, stop bitching, I have spent 6 dollars in this game. 3 to test out the rate of "buying cultivation"...which was very slow...and 3 for a hat, because I wanted a hat.

I've decided that I'm going to spend 5-10$ a month after lauch. It's a great game, more worthy of my money than any game post WoW BC. I just have to figure out what to spend it on... 

Spending big gold on level 1 skills is rediculous when my own skills do 5 times the dmg. Spending on gear is just rediculous when I've seen good players beat geared bad players nude, more than once. 

I might buy some costumes or something, not sure. I'm going to support the title though.

Originally posted by bcbully

I've decided that I'm going to spend 5-10$ a month after lauch. It's a great game, more worthy of my money than any game post WoW BC. I just have to figure out what to spend it on... 

 

Spending big gold on level 1 skills is rediculous when my own skills do 5 times the dmg. Spending on gear is just rediculous when I've seen good players beat geared bad players nude, more than once. 

 

I might buy some costumes or something, not sure. I'm going to support the title though.

I would wait until they have a gold sale since they seem to do one every 2 weeks or so. Buy Gold to get the bonuses and then just sit on it unless you want to do a purchase event. It seems that the gold to silver ratio is meant to be a sliding scale so maybe in a couple months from now you get 12-15 Silver per gold.

Sometimes an old man jumps out of the bushes and offers to sell me rare books so it's handy to have some emergency money on hand just in case.

They only item I have really bought that I wanted was the 30 day gathering books. Those come in handy since we have capped vigor. Pretty much made back what I paid for it in 1 day. Other than that if they offered more Teleport points I would pay for those too. Other than that the 9 bucks/30 gold a month for VIP is enough for me.

Originally posted by AresPL
@Alamareth keep in mind its still CB, and 1h limit makes population small, in chinese version no one would event buy emei block, 3 months after they allowed everyone to play I got running on water for free, I have 3 running on water skill and 2 wall run in bank only to give some newbie as I cant sell them for 5L

What 1 hour limit?  They just gave away several thousand keys to remove that limitation.

Also, it should be blatantly obvious that prices lower as the items become more common.  Remember Jump Across the Clouds selling for 50L+?  Now you can barely give it away.

Point being, as I said in my post, there are some seriously irrational prices out there right now.  People can drop hundreds to buy those items, but it doesn't make it smart or worthwhile.

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by Biskop
It's new, it's Asian, and it's more innovative than all recent Western games.

Of course people will hate it.

But most of the people bashing it just spread ill-informed bs and blatant misinformation ("it's ptw", "it's a Korean grinder", "combat sucks" etc), which is easily proven wrong by a simple fact check.

People trying to bash the actual features have a much harder time since that requires them to actually play and understand the game. And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate Wushu's uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun.

If people are spending cash like that on a game and people don't like it then it is not hate.

 

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by Biskop
It's new, it's Asian, and it's more innovative than all recent Western games.

Of course people will hate it.

But most of the people bashing it just spread ill-informed bs and blatant misinformation ("it's ptw", "it's a Korean grinder", "combat sucks" etc), which is easily proven wrong by a simple fact check.

People trying to bash the actual features have a much harder time since that requires them to actually play and understand the game. And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate Wushu's uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun.

If people are spending cash like that on a game and people don't like it then it is not hate.

 

 

I and a couple friends put some decent time into this one before we quit the beta and while it may be a new game, and "Asian", it is not a new type of Asian game. It is the same old, if slightly slicker, Asian grinder with the standard cash shop (including P2W items) and slightly better crafting than usual. A few new twists, with the PKing side of things, but the novelty wears off. That said, the same old grind is there. As is the "absolute necessity" of using the cash shop or suffering greatly, as is common in most Asian grinders.

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by Biskop
It's new, it's Asian, and it's more innovative than all recent Western games.

Of course people will hate it.

But most of the people bashing it just spread ill-informed bs and blatant misinformation ("it's ptw", "it's a Korean grinder", "combat sucks" etc), which is easily proven wrong by a simple fact check.

People trying to bash the actual features have a much harder time since that requires them to actually play and understand the game. And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate Wushu's uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun.

If people are spending cash like that on a game and people don't like it then it is not hate.

 

 

I and a couple friends put some decent time into this one before we quit the beta and while it may be a new game, and "Asian", it is not a new type of Asian game. It is the same old, if slightly slicker, Asian grinder with the standard cash shop (including P2W items) and slightly better crafting than usual. A few new twists, with the PKing side of things, but the novelty wears off. That said, the same old grind is there. As is the "absolute necessity" of using the cash shop or suffering greatly, as is common in most Asian grinders.

Yet another post that shows NO DETAILS.  Please, enlighten me - what's the grind and what's the absolutely necessary item in the item shop?  I'll just list everything I think you can pull out of your ass:

- Spying - I'll give you this one, I do 4 a day for the tokens - every day.  Grind?  Yeah, but at least it's not boring.  There are other ways of obtaining experience.

- Forbidden Instances - Capped at 7 per week.  I try to cap it out.  It is good for raising world reputation and items.  Grind?  Yeah, but equipment/rep grinding is nothing new and I don't foresee it going away in the near future.

- Team Practice - I do it every day to max out my cultivation.  It's a mini game, hence I don't consider it a grind.

- Shifu Challenge - You can choose to do it every day or wait until the end of the week and do a 12 rounder.  It's designed to max out your lifeskill experience.  You can choose this or crafting.  Not a grind.

- Daily Events - A choice for additional power, never the same experience.  Not a grind.

- Material Collection - An unholy grind for upgrades, but if you want the power - you must spend the time.  Is it ideal?  Nah, but it sure seems like a universal reality in any/all MMORPGs.

So, please - elaborate.

Originally posted by Aeonblades
Game is P2W even if it is a decent game. Don't sugar coat it. If you can buy the major currency in a cash shop, that is clearly P2W. Rabid Fanboys inbound I'm sure.

By that logic, every game that has a RMT system (EVE,GW2,EQ now with Kronos, just to mention a few) is P2W.

If you need to vent at least try to elaborate a bit more than "I Say SO!"

I and a couple friends put some decent time into this one before we quit the beta and while it may be a new game, and "Asian", it is not a new type of Asian game. It is the same old, if slightly slicker, Asian grinder with the standard cash shop (including P2W items) and slightly better crafting than usual. A few new twists, with the PKing side of things, but the novelty wears off. That said, the same old grind is there. As is the "absolute necessity" of using the cash shop or suffering greatly, as is common in most Asian grinders.

I loled this guy talking out of his ass. In nowdays it's cool for kids saying 'another asian grinder' even they don't have to learn or play the game.

Originally posted by muthax

Originally posted by Aeonblades
Game is P2W even if it is a decent game. Don't sugar coat it. If you can buy the major currency in a cash shop, that is clearly P2W. Rabid Fanboys inbound I'm sure.

By that logic, every game that has a RMT system (EVE,GW2,EQ now with Kronos, just to mention a few) is P2W.

If you need to vent at least try to elaborate a bit more than "I Say SO!"

No it's not. EQ Krono can be purchased with platinum in game or in the cash shop, however, anyone can earn it and it does not make your character stronger in any way. AoW is assuredly P2W, as the major form of currency is available in the in game shop and it makes your character more powerful.

EQ uses seperate currencies for gear, platinum is worth next to nothing unless you are on the roleplaying server.

GW2 isn't even worth a mention really, and I didn't play EvE enough to care.

Originally posted by Alamareth

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by Biskop
It's new, it's Asian, and it's more innovative than all recent Western games.

Of course people will hate it.

But most of the people bashing it just spread ill-informed bs and blatant misinformation ("it's ptw", "it's a Korean grinder", "combat sucks" etc), which is easily proven wrong by a simple fact check.

People trying to bash the actual features have a much harder time since that requires them to actually play and understand the game. And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate Wushu's uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun.

If people are spending cash like that on a game and people don't like it then it is not hate.

 

 

I and a couple friends put some decent time into this one before we quit the beta and while it may be a new game, and "Asian", it is not a new type of Asian game. It is the same old, if slightly slicker, Asian grinder with the standard cash shop (including P2W items) and slightly better crafting than usual. A few new twists, with the PKing side of things, but the novelty wears off. That said, the same old grind is there. As is the "absolute necessity" of using the cash shop or suffering greatly, as is common in most Asian grinders.

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by Biskop
It's new, it's Asian, and it's more innovative than all recent Western games.

Of course people will hate it.

But most of the people bashing it just spread ill-informed bs and blatant misinformation ("it's ptw", "it's a Korean grinder", "combat sucks" etc), which is easily proven wrong by a simple fact check.

People trying to bash the actual features have a much harder time since that requires them to actually play and understand the game. And most people that make it past the tutorial seem to appreciate Wushu's uniqueness, even if they don't find it fun.

If people are spending cash like that on a game and people don't like it then it is not hate.

 

 

I and a couple friends put some decent time into this one before we quit the beta and while it may be a new game, and "Asian", it is not a new type of Asian game. It is the same old, if slightly slicker, Asian grinder with the standard cash shop (including P2W items) and slightly better crafting than usual. A few new twists, with the PKing side of things, but the novelty wears off. That said, the same old grind is there. As is the "absolute necessity" of using the cash shop or suffering greatly, as is common in most Asian grinders.

Yet another post that shows NO DETAILS.  Please, enlighten me - what's the grind and what's the absolutely necessary item in the item shop?  I'll just list everything I think you can pull out of your ass:

- Spying - I'll give you this one, I do 4 a day for the tokens - every day.  Grind?  Yeah, but at least it's not boring.  There are other ways of obtaining experience.

- Forbidden Instances - Capped at 7 per week.  I try to cap it out.  It is good for raising world reputation and items.  Grind?  Yeah, but equipment/rep grinding is nothing new and I don't foresee it going away in the near future.

- Team Practice - I do it every day to max out my cultivation.  It's a mini game, hence I don't consider it a grind.

- Shifu Challenge - You can choose to do it every day or wait until the end of the week and do a 12 rounder.  It's designed to max out your lifeskill experience.  You can choose this or crafting.  Not a grind.

- Daily Events - A choice for additional power, never the same experience.  Not a grind.

- Material Collection - An unholy grind for upgrades, but if you want the power - you must spend the time.  Is it ideal?  Nah, but it sure seems like a universal reality in any/all MMORPGs.

So, please - elaborate.

Originally posted by Burntvet
For myself, I mostly concentrated on the crafting aspects, my other friends did more of the combat side than I. Try doing ANYTHING crafting without the "pills". It even sucks with them. Without them, much worse. Harvesting, farming... meh, ok. But the actual grind out items for the XP gain... terrible. And like I said, with out the cash shop pills and a few other items, it was even more very unfun. And I like crafting in MMOs. I heard it was good in this game, but no... slightly better than average at the start, but when factoring in the "no pills" penalty and the typical Asian grind requirements, crafting gets a sub-par rating overall.

What?!

You don't have to grind a single item to earn xp for crafting. You can literally go from 0 to illustrious without making a damn thing by just playing bejeweled.

Honestly, I'm not sure we are playing the same game.  I've been maxing my daily crafting every day without even denting my vigor.  I took the begging lifeskill, got that to Legendary status and I now have about 600-700 max vigor every day.  That isn't easy to burn through.  I have another 150 pills just sitting in my bank.  I've heard that some advanced recipes really burn it hard, but that shouldn't be surprising.  I'm also an herbalist, and I rarely craft (only for myself) - so I spend most of my vigor collecting and that is a very slow burn.

I don't know what you mean by "grind out items for the XP gain".  That's not how you effectively level a manufacture life skill.  You only craft when you want an item.  Otherwise challenge your shifu to a minigame and get "free" crafting experience (noted that this does not help your case for lifeskill rankings, but it does move you forward).

Cash shop pills?  Like what?  The collection book is pretty powerful, but I don't have a huge problem with it.

I think your major problem is that you don't really understand the game yet, or at least the efficient ways of playing it.  That's a feature of this game, it isn't simple.  There are multiple ways of skinning the cat, so to say, but some are definitely better than others.

Originally posted by Alamareth

Honestly, I'm not sure we are playing the same game.  I've been maxing my daily crafting every day without even denting my vigor.  I took the begging lifeskill, got that to Legendary status and I now have about 600-700 max vigor every day.  That isn't easy to burn through.  I have another 150 pills just sitting in my bank.  I've heard that some advanced recipes really burn it hard, but that shouldn't be surprising.  I'm also an herbalist, and I rarely craft (only for myself) - so I spend most of my vigor collecting and that is a very slow burn.

I don't know what you mean by "grind out items for the XP gain".  That's not how you effectively level a manufacture life skill.  You only craft when you want an item.  Otherwise challenge your shifu to a minigame and get "free" crafting experience (noted that this does not help your case for lifeskill rankings, but it does move you forward).

Cash shop pills?  Like what?  The collection book is pretty powerful, but I don't have a huge problem with it.

I think your major problem is that you don't really understand the game yet, or at least the efficient ways of playing it.  That's a feature of this game, it isn't simple.  There are multiple ways of skinning the cat, so to say, but some are definitely better than others.

Really funny to see how so many people don't have a clue on what P2W really is. I bet the people who thinks that this game is P2W never played a REAL P2W game.

I'll say it again : If you can get what someone bought from the cash shop ingame, its not pay to win at all. P2W is when you can buy stuff (that CANT be acquire ingame) from the cash shop that will make you more powerful than the ones who can't. That is P2W. Everything else is just plain false. And please, don't say this is my opinion and everyone don't see it the same way. It's just pure logic. If you and someone else duel with the same gear/player skill, one grind for it and the other bought it from the cash shop, the person who bought it from the cash shop won't automatically win. Now, if you both duel with the same gear/player skill and one guy bought some "power" from the cash shop that can't be acquire ingame and the other guy couldn't since he's broke, who will win? Yeah the guy who spent some cash in the cash shop. That is P2W.

There is definitely a P2W aspect to it.

Thankfully gear doesn't seem to be the end all.

Originally posted by Fdzzaigl

There is definitely a P2W aspect to it.

Thankfully gear doesn't seem to be the end all.

Maybe, in all honesty though, siege equipment in GW2 felt far more P2W.