Originally posted by asmkm22

Once in a while I hire an employee who ends up basically having his personality.  They come in think they can change the industry (I'm not in the game industry, but one similar), without understanding some of the more basic realities that we have to deal with.  Employees like that don't last long.

So unless he has a rich uncle to bankroll his little dream game, he's in for a hell of a time getting funding, much less the position of authority to dictate design.

 Spoken like someone working in an industry that is running with outdated infrastructure and out of touch with its consumers and more than likely soon to be taken over, or run out of business by the movers and the shakers.

Companies with that mentality never grow nor can keep up with others. The very website you are posting on wouldnt be what it is if it wasnt for websites 10 years ago being moved by the wayside by someone making a website that broke the mold...and you NEVER break the mold with your train of thought, it requires a mind wanting to CHANGE the industry.

First of all "good for you that you are going into something that really interests you".

Secondly, I think you might find that the reality is different from the fantasy. Unless you are funding the entire thing yourself you might find that you can't call all the shots.

Heck, let's look at Curt Schilling. All he really wanted to do was make his "great game". But in the end, no matter the money he had, he cound't make solid business decisions and everything went bust.

It takes more than knowledge or even money to make a game. Sometimes you have to compromise.

heck, some of the plays I directed, where one would think I would have the ultimate say, ended up being lessons in compromise.

Sometimes it's like herding cats.

You might find that good intentions and a strong vision aren't enough. Then again, more power to you if you can make it happen.

Maybe this is the compromise where are trying to get them to realise? If they do acknowledge our petition it might be reason enough for them to make that modification, or atleast meet us half way?

Cheers to your thoughts though, helps to create a multi-perspective party.

Originally posted by asrlohz

First of all "good for you that you are going into something that really interests you".

Secondly, I think you might find that the reality is different from the fantasy. Unless you are funding the entire thing yourself you might find that you can't call all the shots.

Heck, let's look at Curt Schilling. All he really wanted to do was make his "great game". But in the end, no matter the money he had, he cound't make solid business decisions and everything went bust.

It takes more than knowledge or even money to make a game. Sometimes you have to compromise.

heck, some of the plays I directed, where one would think I would have the ultimate say, ended up being lessons in compromise.

Sometimes it's like herding cats.

You might find that good intentions and a strong vision aren't enough. Then again, more power to you if you can make it happen.

Maybe this is the compromise where are trying to get them to realise? If they do acknowledge our petition it might be reason enough for them to make that modification, or atleast meet us half way?

Cheers to your thoughts though, helps to create a multi-perspective party.

honestly, I'm all for a no boundaries eso. Just don't think they will do it as it wil fundamentaly change their game at this point.

Originally posted by asmkm22

Originally posted by Maelwydd

Originally posted by botrytis

Originally posted by asrlohz

Originally posted by sapphen

I feel that Tamriel should be seamless, if this is not possible then at least we should be able to travel the world on one character.  Not everyone likes making alts and it isn't fair to expect them to create and level 2 different alts in order to see the world.

While I would've love to have some type of wPvP, I want this option for PvE/exploration purposes.  IF PvP was added in then I would prefer to have a system in which people would flag themselves for PvP.  They would have to flag themselves "FFA wPvP or "Facton wPvP" to fight other players outside the AvA center stage.

I think the lack of full exploration (and even freedom to choose your faction) is a horrible direction for this game.  I would support Zenimax if they needed to take another year to make these changes.  I would rather see a complete game with the correct systems than an incomplete game that no one would be happy with.

Disclaimer:  Everything I said is my own opinion.  I don't mean to offend anyone here and would love to talk about it, but I kindly ask that we do so in a civil manner.

This is exactly what I want with TESO. That the game caters to everyone. We all play The Elder Scrolls in our own little way. I always go stealth and play as a Dunmer and explore rather than kill. We all have our own playstyles, I don't think that making the game an MMO should have to restrict some of us.

Of course, this is also a personal opinion. But I think that we all have our own reasons to why we'd want the whole continent to be free of restrictions.

Plain and simple, if the games caters to everyone it will end up pleasing no one. There will be too many compromises and it will end up pissing people off

My opinion here.

It might have been a good starting point to try and aim for the TES fans first rather then the DAOC fans. It is the TES IP afterall....

My opinion :)

TES fans are going to buy it regardless, so why "aim" to basically just make a multiplayer Skyrim?  The point of branching out into a new genre is to expand your audience, not canabalize your existing one.

Expand the audience... a majority of MMO players and TES fans ARE THE SAME PEOPLE (with the exception that not all TES players are MMO fans).  Which leads me to believe that it would've been better to aim the game towards TES fans.

Originally posted by jtcgs

Originally posted by asmkm22

Once in a while I hire an employee who ends up basically having his personality.  They come in think they can change the industry (I'm not in the game industry, but one similar), without understanding some of the more basic realities that we have to deal with.  Employees like that don't last long.

So unless he has a rich uncle to bankroll his little dream game, he's in for a hell of a time getting funding, much less the position of authority to dictate design.

 Spoken like someone working in an industry that is running with outdated infrastructure and out of touch with its consumers and more than likely soon to be taken over, or run out of business by the movers and the shakers.

Companies with that mentality never grow nor can keep up with others. The very website you are posting on wouldnt be what it is if it wasnt for websites 10 years ago being moved by the wayside by someone making a website that broke the mold...and you NEVER break the mold with your train of thought, it requires a mind wanting to CHANGE the industry.

Being realistic and pragmatic isn't the same thing as being outdated and out of touch.

Originally posted by Hycoo
Lets all be thankful it's one of the last mmorpgs with this type of gated/limited content. They gotta go a whole other direction if they wanna keep people playing their games.

Indeed I am glad.  I hope after this game it will make other AAA developers stop and think - I just hate to see another great IP molested.

You know this could've been the game that took MMOs out of their box too.

Originally posted by jtcgs

Originally posted by asmkm22

Once in a while I hire an employee who ends up basically having his personality.  They come in think they can change the industry (I'm not in the game industry, but one similar), without understanding some of the more basic realities that we have to deal with.  Employees like that don't last long.

So unless he has a rich uncle to bankroll his little dream game, he's in for a hell of a time getting funding, much less the position of authority to dictate design.

 Spoken like someone working in an industry that is running with outdated infrastructure and out of touch with its consumers and more than likely soon to be taken over, or run out of business by the movers and the shakers.

Companies with that mentality never grow nor can keep up with others. The very website you are posting on wouldnt be what it is if it wasnt for websites 10 years ago being moved by the wayside by someone making a website that broke the mold...and you NEVER break the mold with your train of thought, it requires a mind wanting to CHANGE the industry.

Not at all.  My point is, there are right ways of making change, and wrong ways.

Trying to change something with no experience and no understanding of why things are the way they are (often for reasons outside of your control, like consumer demand or available funding), only makes those in charge less likely to give you the chance to manage a project down the road.  If he wants to bypass the whole process of earning his way up to a position of responsibility then he has to simply start his own studio, making him in charge by default.  That takes quite a bit of money, however, which is what I mentioned.

As for this website, it "is what is is" simply because of the domain name.  There is very little in the way of quality here.  There's no journalism, only regular "opinion" articles that read like the summary of an actual article.  The tech behind the website is completely dated (look at how vieweing pictures requires a complete page refresh, for example) as well.  This site, is populated for the same reasons WoW is populated, and it has very little to do with quality.

Originally posted by asrlohz

First of all "good for you that you are going into something that really interests you".

Secondly, I think you might find that the reality is different from the fantasy. Unless you are funding the entire thing yourself you might find that you can't call all the shots.

Heck, let's look at Curt Schilling. All he really wanted to do was make his "great game". But in the end, no matter the money he had, he cound't make solid business decisions and everything went bust.

It takes more than knowledge or even money to make a game. Sometimes you have to compromise.

heck, some of the plays I directed, where one would think I would have the ultimate say, ended up being lessons in compromise.

Sometimes it's like herding cats.

You might find that good intentions and a strong vision aren't enough. Then again, more power to you if you can make it happen.

Maybe this is the compromise where are trying to get them to realise? If they do acknowledge our petition it might be reason enough for them to make that modification, or atleast meet us half way?

Cheers to your thoughts though, helps to create a multi-perspective party.

 You don't seem to understand how games are made. Do you think they have some magic switch they can just turn on open world PvP and exploration with a seamless world and they are just not doing to spite people?

Just trying to give some perspective to this "Go anywhere, join any faction" debate.

Let's use World War II for an example. I don't think you found many American, British or other citizens of the allied countries taking strolls in downtown Berlin or Tokyo. I don't think the Nazi party or the Empire of Japan would have just accepted any person from one of the Allied countries who said "Hey, I want to join". The same examples would work in the other direction as well.

So, if the lore behind the game is based on a War with certain Alliances battling other alliances then the segregation makes perferct sense. I have a hard time getting my head around why people want it to be just willy nilly, unless they are just griefers who want to go to low level zones to gank lowbies.

I guess it's easier for me to see what they are going for here because I was a long time DAOC player. It was really done well prior to TOA. The PVE zones gave opportunity for exploration and for those who wanted risk while leveling, the best exp came from mobs in the frontiers where it was open season. Greater risk equaled greater reward.

I'm hoping the game can recapture some of DAOC's magic for me. But like I've said before, nostalgia is hard to duplicate.

Originally posted by sapphen

Originally posted by asmkm22

 

TES fans are going to buy it regardless, so why "aim" to basically just make a multiplayer Skyrim?  The point of branching out into a new genre is to expand your audience, not canabalize your existing one.

Expand the audience... a majority of MMO players and TES fans ARE THE SAME PEOPLE (with the exception that not all TES players are MMO fans).  Which leads me to believe that it would've been better to aim the game towards TES fans.

Doing it that way doesn't at all help the IP...

You want to offer two different genres for the sake of appealing to two different fan bases.  If they just release Skyrim with MMO middleware, what have they really done other than screw over future "offline" TES titles?  How much appeal would another Skyrim or Oblivion really hold if TESO was basically the same experience but with multiplayer?  They'd basically fracture the existing fan base into three sections without really growing any of them at all (PC gamers who enjoy playing offline TES with mods, PC gamers who enjoy playing TESO, and console gamers who only have the offline version with no mods).

They'd be funding development for two different games that essentially target the same audience.  There's a reason they created a whole new dev studio to handle this, and it wasn't just a random idea pulled out of a hat.

Anyway, that's not to say both games have to be totally different.  Just that there it makes much more sense to expand your audience than simply make your current audience even happier.

Faction Locking is Great!

you know what the means?  Reply ability..    DAOC had faction locking; all three realms had their own lore, classes, races, continents, architecture, and feel.

If you got bored, you just re rolled on a new realm and it was like a completely new game, Best idea ever.

I FULLY support faction locking.

Originally posted by WellzyC

Faction Locking is Great!

you know what the means?  Reply ability..    DAOC had faction locking; all three realms had their own lore, classes, races, continents, architecture, and feel.

If you got bored, you just re rolled on a new realm and it was like a completely new game, Best idea ever.

I FULLY support faction locking.

Seemless World is Great!

you know what that means?  Exploration.. WoW had seemless worlds; you could go anywhere, anytime no matter if it was enemy territories or not.

If you got bored, you just walked around to an enemy territory and it's a completely new game.  Best idea ever.

I fully support seemless worlds.

Originally posted by Thandras

Just trying to give some perspective to this "Go anywhere, join any faction" debate.

Let's use World War II for an example. I don't think you found many American, British or other citizens of the allied countries taking strolls in downtown Berlin or Tokyo. I don't think the Nazi party or the Empire of Japan would have just accepted any person from one of the Allied countries who said "Hey, I want to join". The same examples would work in the other direction as well.

So, if the lore behind the game is based on a War with certain Alliances battling other alliances then the segregation makes perferct sense. I have a hard time getting my head around why people want it to be just willy nilly, unless they are just griefers who want to go to low level zones to gank lowbies.

I guess it's easier for me to see what they are going for here because I was a long time DAOC player. It was really done well prior to TOA. The PVE zones gave opportunity for exploration and for those who wanted risk while leveling, the best exp came from mobs in the frontiers where it was open season. Greater risk equaled greater reward.

I'm hoping the game can recapture some of DAOC's magic for me. But like I've said before, nostalgia is hard to duplicate.

Not the first time I've heard the WWII argument.  In my opinion it's more like the dynasty wars in china.  It wasn't governments fighting each other but rather groups of people (families rather) fighting for control over areas and people. While some joined the armies others rebelled.

Originally posted by WellzyC

Faction Locking is Great!

 

 

you know what the means?  Reply ability..    DAOC had faction locking; all three realms had their own lore, classes, races, continents, architecture, and feel.

 

If you got bored, you just re rolled on a new realm and it was like a completely new game, Best idea ever.

 

I FULLY support faction locking.

 

DAoC lore is different from TES lore.

Originally posted by asmkm22

Originally posted by jtcgs

Originally posted by asmkm22

Once in a while I hire an employee who ends up basically having his personality.  They come in think they can change the industry (I'm not in the game industry, but one similar), without understanding some of the more basic realities that we have to deal with.  Employees like that don't last long.

So unless he has a rich uncle to bankroll his little dream game, he's in for a hell of a time getting funding, much less the position of authority to dictate design.

 Spoken like someone working in an industry that is running with outdated infrastructure and out of touch with its consumers and more than likely soon to be taken over, or run out of business by the movers and the shakers.

Companies with that mentality never grow nor can keep up with others. The very website you are posting on wouldnt be what it is if it wasnt for websites 10 years ago being moved by the wayside by someone making a website that broke the mold...and you NEVER break the mold with your train of thought, it requires a mind wanting to CHANGE the industry.

Not at all.  My point is, there are right ways of making change, and wrong ways.

Trying to change something with no experience and no understanding of why things are the way they are (often for reasons outside of your control, like consumer demand or available funding), only makes those in charge less likely to give you the chance to manage a project down the road.  If he wants to bypass the whole process of earning his way up to a position of responsibility then he has to simply start his own studio, making him in charge by default.  That takes quite a bit of money, however, which is what I mentioned.

As for this website, it "is what is is" simply because of the domain name.  There is very little in the way of quality here.  There's no journalism, only regular "opinion" articles that read like the summary of an actual article.  The tech behind the website is completely dated (look at how vieweing pictures requires a complete page refresh, for example) as well.  This site, is populated for the same reasons WoW is populated, and it has very little to do with quality.

Being a consumer grants you a perspective that the developers lack. Every angle possible should be viewed by a developer. More often than not games fail because the devs think that their game is the most wonderful thing in the world, and disregarding any and all critisism. That is of course more common within the smaller companies.

Originally posted by Thandras

Just trying to give some perspective to this "Go anywhere, join any faction" debate.

Let's use World War II for an example. I don't think you found many American, British or other citizens of the allied countries taking strolls in downtown Berlin or Tokyo. I don't think the Nazi party or the Empire of Japan would have just accepted any person from one of the Allied countries who said "Hey, I want to join". The same examples would work in the other direction as well.

So, if the lore behind the game is based on a War with certain Alliances battling other alliances then the segregation makes perferct sense. I have a hard time getting my head around why people want it to be just willy nilly, unless they are just griefers who want to go to low level zones to gank lowbies.

I guess it's easier for me to see what they are going for here because I was a long time DAOC player. It was really done well prior to TOA. The PVE zones gave opportunity for exploration and for those who wanted risk while leveling, the best exp came from mobs in the frontiers where it was open season. Greater risk equaled greater reward.

I'm hoping the game can recapture some of DAOC's magic for me. But like I've said before, nostalgia is hard to duplicate.

Well, I should tell you that Albert Einstein actually went to America to avoid the war. That didn't cause the Americans to arrest him and keep him as a prisoner of war. That doesn't mean that anyone could come and go of course but let's be frank, I'm not asking for you to be able to join any faction at will, I'm asking to be able to walk around Tamriel and explore without being restricted by your alliance.

And yes, you might have a good perspective from a DAOC sort of standpoint, but this is not DAOC, even if it does share some of its traits. Zenimax's goal is to make an MMO that captures the feeling of The Elder Scrolls, not to capture the feeling of DAOC. And The Elder Scrolls series are renowned for being open and explorable, no matter what faction you choose to follow, be it thieves- or mages guild. In oblivion you could still get into the Arcane Tower even if you didn't join the Mages Guild.