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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Crafting mechanics in most MMOs are horrible

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  TheScavenger

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:06:45 PM#1

Here is crafting in an MMO...okay so I haven't played them all, so maybe something is similar to the best (UO).

 

*click button*

*waits for all 20 copper ore to turn into ingots*

*click button*

*click button*

*click button*

"Item!"

 

Vanguard has horrible crafting. It is more just frustrating, than complicated. It randomly gives you complications, that you have barely any control over.

 

SWG was good in the item variety...so that made it a lot better. I didn't particularly like the actual mechanics, but it was VERY useful to have a crafter. Every item pretty much was crafted. Harvesting was far more interesting though in mechanics, if I recall correctly. V

 

Actually, the only MMO that actually had good crafting and still does, is Ultima Online. And SWG was really good too.

 

Why is UO more interesting? Sure you click click click, but it is FAR more interactive than any other MMO. Click hammer, click ore...make sure near a smelter...click smelter...make ore into ingot. And that doesn't include making armor/weapon.  Okay maybe not EXACT, might have more steps or done a bit differently...its been a long time...but you get the idea. Sure its the same clicking, but it is actually far more realistic than every single other MMO. It FEELS like REAL crafting, not some automated system.

 

Maybe thats why every MMO have such horrid crafting...its all automated for you...or in some horrible cases, you click a button and you let the computer craft 20 of said item and you fall asleep on the keyboard while it makes items.

 

Too bad no other MMO has ever done UO's crafting. Its far more interesting than anything else I've PERSONALLY seen. But I'm sure there must be other MMOs that have done a proper crafting system...but I haven't played any outside of UO.

 

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  TheScavenger

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Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:08:17 PM#2
Re-worded thread title to fit the actual post more...for any that saw this thread before the name change.

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  spankybus

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1/25/13 6:09:04 PM#3
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2. Crafting had skills that you have to engage when certain 'situations' occurred during the building process. It could have been more involved and challenging, but it beat the hell out of selecting items, pressing GO and seeing it fail for no other reason than a math algorithm that i cannot control.

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  TheScavenger

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Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:10:05 PM#4
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2. Crafting had skills that you have to engage when certain 'situations' occurred during the building process. It could have been more involved and challenging, but it beat the hell out of selecting items, pressing GO and seeing it fail for no other reason than a math algorithm that i cannot control.

ah, yes EQ2. Somehow forgot this one. It actually is much more interactive than most. Loved the crafting most out of the themepark MMOs, since it was so involved. 

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  Yizle

Novice Member

Joined: 4/24/10
Posts: 528

1/25/13 6:13:32 PM#5
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2. Crafting had skills that you have to engage when certain 'situations' occurred during the building process. It could have been more involved and challenging, but it beat the hell out of selecting items, pressing GO and seeing it fail for no other reason than a math algorithm that i cannot control.

One of my least favorite games to craft in. EQ2 took crafting to a more boring time consuming degree then I ever cared for.

  Rohn

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/02/08
Posts: 3739

1/25/13 6:20:07 PM#6
I like the crafting in Mortal Online, in that it takes actual player knowledge, instead of just being given simple recipes.  Players can have actual trade secrets, which I think it great.

Hell hath no fury like an MMORPG player scorned.

  Quirhid

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Joined: 1/28/05
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1/25/13 6:25:30 PM#7
I agree. That's why I'd like it to be as less involved as possible. One click and wait. Eve and Fallen Earth had the right idea. You can do something else while "crafting".

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Quizzical

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Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 13305

1/25/13 6:39:21 PM#8
If you want more interactive crafting, then try A Tale in the Desert and Puzzle Pirates.
  User Deleted
1/25/13 6:40:28 PM#9
Crafting in MMO's only seems bad because the vast majority of items created are useless.  If crafting had more impact on the game, it would be more tolerable in most cases.
  Thorkune

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Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1789

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1/25/13 6:42:51 PM#10
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2.

EQ2 has the worst crafting that I have ever tried. I hate any game mechanic that forces me to spam buttons to craft something. I applaud them for trying something different, but it just insn't for me.

  Thorkune

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Posts: 1789

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

1/25/13 6:44:19 PM#11
Originally posted by Roxtarr
Crafting in MMO's only seems bad because the vast majority of items created are useless.  If crafting had more impact on the game, it would be more tolerable in most cases.

Very true. Crafting isn't worth doing these days.

  TheScavenger

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:44:39 PM#12
Originally posted by Roxtarr
Crafting in MMO's only seems bad because the vast majority of items created are useless.  If crafting had more impact on the game, it would be more tolerable in most cases.

yeah this too, makes crafting bad. Was very bad in WoW, when really there wasn't any items you could craft of use...probably why I always chose alchemy/engineering/enchanting. But, every item I could craft as a blacksmith, I could just buy off the auction house from someones dungeon drop...and it would be WAY better.

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  Quizzical

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Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 13305

1/25/13 6:44:44 PM#13
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2.

EQ2 has the worst crafting that I have ever tried. I hate any game mechanic that forces me to spam buttons to craft something. I applaud them for trying something different, but it just insn't for me.

And this illustrates why most MMORPGs have horrible crafting:  because a large fraction of their playerbase doesn't like crafting.  If the best gear comes from an activity that your players hate, they complain.  See raiding.

  Thorkune

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Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

1/25/13 6:46:30 PM#14
Originally posted by Quizzical
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2.

EQ2 has the worst crafting that I have ever tried. I hate any game mechanic that forces me to spam buttons to craft something. I applaud them for trying something different, but it just insn't for me.

And this illustrates why most MMORPGs have horrible crafting:  because a large fraction of their playerbase doesn't like crafting.  If the best gear comes from an activity that your players hate, they complain.  See raiding.

I love crafting. I just don't like bad crafting systems. I started with SWG crafting, so every other system is boring to me now.

Assumption is strong in you...

  TheScavenger

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:50:57 PM#15
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by Quizzical
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2.

EQ2 has the worst crafting that I have ever tried. I hate any game mechanic that forces me to spam buttons to craft something. I applaud them for trying something different, but it just insn't for me.

And this illustrates why most MMORPGs have horrible crafting:  because a large fraction of their playerbase doesn't like crafting.  If the best gear comes from an activity that your players hate, they complain.  See raiding.

I love crafting. I just don't like bad crafting systems. I started with SWG crafting, so every other system is boring to me now.

Assumption is strong in you...

SWG was awesome in that, no two items were the same. And if you were a really good crafter (specialized even better), people came to you...from any amount of distance in the game world...just to buy your goods.

Isabella and Laenaya are on Photobucket!

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My (mostly) scenery screenshots of heavily modded Skyrim

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  MMOExposed

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 6/17/10
Posts: 5976

1/25/13 6:51:59 PM#16

Can somebody in future references, explain how these wonderful crafting systems in these games you speak of worked as when it was great.

This way some of the readers can get a understanding of your enjoyment of it and what you want from the future MMO titles in terms of crafting. also a video would be nice as well.

 

Because I been curious about how a crafting focused endgame progression system would work on a long term interest level.

  Thorkune

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Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1789

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

1/25/13 6:52:29 PM#17
Originally posted by TheScavenger
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by Quizzical
Originally posted by bigsmiff
Originally posted by spankybus
The only game that ever had crafting that didn't make my eyes bleed was Everquest 2.

EQ2 has the worst crafting that I have ever tried. I hate any game mechanic that forces me to spam buttons to craft something. I applaud them for trying something different, but it just insn't for me.

And this illustrates why most MMORPGs have horrible crafting:  because a large fraction of their playerbase doesn't like crafting.  If the best gear comes from an activity that your players hate, they complain.  See raiding.

I love crafting. I just don't like bad crafting systems. I started with SWG crafting, so every other system is boring to me now.

Assumption is strong in you...

SWG was awesome in that, no two items were the same. And if you were a really good crafter (specialized even better), people came to you...from any amount of distance in the game world...just to buy your goods.

Yep. After all these years, I still remember the guys that sold the best armor, weapons, ship parts, etc...

  Gardavsshade

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/27/11
Posts: 617

1/25/13 6:54:18 PM#18

let's see... some reasons have already been said... in general they are and this list is not an exhaustive list....

...most crafted items in MMOs do not equal drop loot or raid loot.... because crafted can never be better than raid loot... it's written somewhere I swear it is...

...MMOs once long ago were Developed by Players that were also Devs, and they wanted a functional and FUN crafting system, which may be why UOs crafting doesn't seem as brain dead as recent MMO crafting systems....

...modern Devs and their Bosses don't want you crafting anything, they want to say they have crafting in their MMO and then make your eyes bleed with it so you will go to their cash shop and buy with a CC what you would have crafted....

....Most Devs of MMOs now generally speaking are NOT MMO Devs, they are Console Game Devs, or CellPhone/Android Devs out of work, etc.....

So we have crafted items that are basically vendor trash, designed by Devs who first love was not MMOs, but are working as MMO Devs at the moment until something better comes along..., whose bosses are just Accountants who pretend to play and like MMOs at E3 when all they really like is money, and in the mean time the Devs are hoping to get back working on Andriod Apps again.

That about covers it.


Nothing to see here... just another MMO Ghost....

  TheScavenger

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/05/12
Posts: 681

Those who ask a question, are stupid for 30 seconds. Those who never ask, are stupid for life.

 
OP  1/25/13 6:55:36 PM#19
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Can somebody in future references, explain how these wonderful crafting systems in these games you speak of worked as when it was great.

This way some of the readers can get a understanding of your enjoyment of it and what you want from the future MMO titles in terms of crafting. also a video would be nice as well.

 

Because I been curious about how a crafting focused endgame progression system would work on a long term interest level.

Quoting. I'll respond in a more detailed post if someone doesn't...someone want to take a try at this? :) I would, but leaving in a few minutes.

Isabella and Laenaya are on Photobucket!

http://s4.photobucket.com/user/Vendayn/library/Skyrim/Anime%20Skyrim

My (mostly) scenery screenshots of heavily modded Skyrim

http://s4.photobucket.com/user/Vendayn/library/Skyrim/Anime%20Skyrim/Aesthetics

  Thorkune

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Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1789

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

1/25/13 6:58:33 PM#20
Originally posted by MMOExposed

Can somebody in future references, explain how these wonderful crafting systems in these games you speak of worked as when it was great.

This way some of the readers can get a understanding of your enjoyment of it and what you want from the future MMO titles in terms of crafting. also a video would be nice as well.

 

Because I been curious about how a crafting focused endgame progression system would work on a long term interest level.

I will give you an example of the process of making a set of RIS armor:

1. Master your Armorsmithing

2. Do a quest to be able to learn RIS armor crafting (Awesome quest BTW)

3. Go out and kill Kimogila for their scales(Not a guaranteed drop/you'll need a group)

4. Kill gurk kings for their hides( Not a guaranteed drop)

5. Gather the best resources needed to craft(gather samples/place harvesters)

6. Go get a crafting buff to craft better armor

7. Find the best crafting station available

8. Use factories if you want to speed up the process

9. Craft the armor

I hope I didn't forget anything, it's been a while

 

EDIT: I forgot that you need the woolamander harrower bone and peko peko albatross feather. Peko peko was a random boss that was very tough to kill

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