Originally posted by boxsnd
Not so fast GW2 fan! If in the near future we see other MMOs adopting things like no trinity, the downed mechanic in PvE and PvP, hearts and dynamic events, overflow servers etc then we might say it's influential. Until then, patience.

GW2, first mmo with no trinity!

OHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

Magic!

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

What has GW2 influenced?  like at all?

And if you say people talking about it, I will laugh in your face as you'd have just called The War Z more influential.

i said it on the first page of this thread but to me one of the biggest things is it showed a AAA MMO can release as B2P and still roll out monthly content updates.. i can't think of a single other MMO that has released content patches this fast not even Rift did.

So it did something well.  Now, tell me what it has influenced?

perhaps OP should of worded a little differn't i would say GW2 will be the most influential MMO released in 2012 moving forward into 2013.. while GW2 has it's shortcomings it does plenty of things very well that will influence games in the future.... like pretty much every game that does well others will look to it and see what it did well.. my hopes is they expand on what GW2 does well and learn from what doesn't do so well

Originally posted by fiontar 

What makes you say there is nothing in TESO like GW2? I've noticed that TESO is now hyping "Dynamic Events",  players getting their own rewards for events/kills that players cooperate on and GW2 style resource nodes. There isn't much info on TESO, but in what we do know there are already at least those three freatures borrowed from GW2. I'll bet you there will be many more, major and minor, by the time the game launches.

Misinformation or ignorance? I've given up trying to discern, but the number of such posts is discouraging.

(BTW, If they can pull it off, TESO may match the GW2 Manifesto better than GW2 did on persistance of player influence. It looks like they are combining Dynamic Events with Phasing so that if players "save a village" it remains saved and the villagers celibrate the PC on return. I have mixed feelings about the approach, but it has potential to be awesome. It should be clear, though, that it's yet another thing that GW2 inspired.).

I must say though saying TESO is GW2 inspired is much like saying EQ2 was WOW inspired, we're talking about systems that would require quite a bit of devlopment time. IS a few months after release enough time to conceptualize these ideas as well as develop them? The game is entering beta soon. Very similar to EQ2 and WOW's launch cycling.

MMO development is largely a game of cat and mouse, Concepts are always following trends in the industry, what was a common complaint/request 5 years ago? "Two factions suck we need three or more" Hence the DAOC influence in more than just GW2. "Static quest hubs suck, we need more believable world's/NPC's" hence new approaches to content, AOC, SWTOR, TSW, GW2, TESO etc....

This is a tech industry this is how things work in that environment.

Originally posted by Scorchien

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

What has GW2 influenced?  like at all?

And if you say people talking about it, I will laugh in your face as you'd have just called The War Z more influential.

i said it on the first page of this thread but to me one of the biggest things is it showed a AAA MMO can release as B2P and still roll out monthly content updates.. i can't think of a single other MMO that has released content patches this fast not even Rift did.

 AC had/has Monthly content updates .. long long ago, .. And as i said before UO had/has o threat/taunt mechaic 15 years ago .. so 2 more GW2 myths ....debunked

i remember paying a monthly sub for AC at launch.. or am i mistaken?

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

What has GW2 influenced?  like at all?

And if you say people talking about it, I will laugh in your face as you'd have just called The War Z more influential.

i said it on the first page of this thread but to me one of the biggest things is it showed a AAA MMO can release as B2P and still roll out monthly content updates.. i can't think of a single other MMO that has released content patches this fast not even Rift did.

So it did something well.  Now, tell me what it has influenced?

perhaps OP should of worded a little differn't i would say GW2 will be the most influential MMO released in 2012 moving forward into 2013.. while GW2 has it's shortcomings it does plenty of things very well that will influence games in the future.... like pretty much every game that does well others will look to it and see what it did well.. my hopes is they expand on what GW2 does well and learn from what doesn't do so well

Now that, is much more reasonable.

I can agree that it is possible Guild Wars 2 will become the most influential MMO to have released in 2012.

I think it is very poor reasoning of the OP to make it seem it already is the most influential game that was around in the year 2012.

Then again, fanboys say a ton of stuff that has no reason or thought behind it, and is completely wrong, so this is nothing new.

Had he instead listed reasons why he thought Guild Wars 2 could go on to influence other future games, that would have been a much smarter thing to write about.

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

What has GW2 influenced?  like at all?

And if you say people talking about it, I will laugh in your face as you'd have just called The War Z more influential.

i said it on the first page of this thread but to me one of the biggest things is it showed a AAA MMO can release as B2P and still roll out monthly content updates.. i can't think of a single other MMO that has released content patches this fast not even Rift did.

So it did something well.  Now, tell me what it has influenced?

perhaps OP should of worded a little differn't i would say GW2 will be the most influential MMO released in 2012 moving forward into 2013.. while GW2 has it's shortcomings it does plenty of things very well that will influence games in the future.... like pretty much every game that does well others will look to it and see what it did well.. my hopes is they expand on what GW2 does well and learn from what doesn't do so well

Now that, is much more reasonable.

I can agree that it is possible Guild Wars 2 will become the most influential MMO to have released in 2012.

I think it is very poor reasoning of the OP to make it seem it already is the most influential game that was around in the year 2012.

Then again, fanboys say a ton of stuff that has no reason or thought behind it, and is completely wrong, so this is nothing new.

Had he instead listed reasons why he thought Guild Wars 2 could go on to influence other future games, that would have been a much smarter thing to write about.

I agree that Aerowyn is much more reasonable.

I also agree that it is possible Guild Wars 2 will become the most influential MMO to have released in 2012.

I also agree that fanboys say a ton of stuff that has no reason or thought behind it, and is completely wrong.

However, your perception of what I wrote is nothing more than an interpretation, and an inaccurate one at that. I could have, however, titled it in a more suitable way to express my point, but I'm currently analyzing relative inaccuracies and the resulting effects on the hive mind, and therefore it seems like a more beneficial miscalculation than detrimental.

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by fiontar 

What makes you say there is nothing in TESO like GW2? I've noticed that TESO is now hyping "Dynamic Events",  players getting their own rewards for events/kills that players cooperate on and GW2 style resource nodes. There isn't much info on TESO, but in what we do know there are already at least those three freatures borrowed from GW2. I'll bet you there will be many more, major and minor, by the time the game launches.

Misinformation or ignorance? I've given up trying to discern, but the number of such posts is discouraging.

(BTW, If they can pull it off, TESO may match the GW2 Manifesto better than GW2 did on persistance of player influence. It looks like they are combining Dynamic Events with Phasing so that if players "save a village" it remains saved and the villagers celibrate the PC on return. I have mixed feelings about the approach, but it has potential to be awesome. It should be clear, though, that it's yet another thing that GW2 inspired.).

I must say though saying TESO is GW2 inspired is much like saying EQ2 was WOW inspired, we're talking about systems that would require quite a bit of devlopment time. IS a few months after release enough time to conceptualize these ideas as well as develop them? The game is entering beta soon. Very similar to EQ2 and WOW's launch cycling.

MMO development is largely a game of cat and mouse, Concepts are always following trends in the industry, what was a common complaint/request 5 years ago? "Two factions suck we need three or more" Hence the DAOC influence in more than just GW2. "Static quest hubs suck, we need more believable world's/NPC's" hence new approaches to content, AOC, SWTOR, TSW, GW2, TESO etc....

This is a tech industry this is how things work in that environment.

Part of it is the technology required to make it work in a permanent online environment.

If we look at MMORPGs, MMORPGs at general, are much cruder than single player RPG and FPS in terms of AI, physics engines, etc, and those things are finally start to catch up.

What I think will be influenced by GW2 the most is the financial model (with a so far inoffensive cash shop) and all the little things that make the gaming experience so much more enjoyable, like sending crafting item straight to the bank, crafting from there, send and receive mail instantly from everywhere, the shared resources and enemies, the no roll to loot, etc.

Originally posted by boxsnd

How on earth is all-dps more complex than the trinity? 

Well in trinity, you could say roles are set in stone and that makes it incredibly simple concept.

Or I will give you better example. Go play wow dungeon with 5 dps classes. You will see outright how much more complicated it becomes all of a sudden. Btw back in the days we often played 4 dps + healer or 4 dps + tank and it was great fun :)

Originally posted by troublmaker

This is a pretty loaded topic.

Influential, influential to who?  Influential to developers?

Is it to be believed that Guild Wars 2's buy to play format influenced Funcom's decision to make The Secret Wrold buy to play... or might Funcom have gone with a subscription model at launch regardless of Guild Wars 2?

Influential to fans?  So are fans going to start asking for Guild Wars 2 clones?  Or are we going to continue seeing World of Warcraft clones pop out.  Guild Wars 2 did well in sales... it roughly matches SWTOR's sales.  Would we think that SWTOR was the most influential game of 2011 then?

This world "influential" can really mean whatever the hell you want it to.

When you break down Guild Wars 2's features they're the same as other MMOs of previous.  Their success was in marketing a product and combining these features in such a way to please fans.  As well by not making it subscription based the 1M or so people who only played for a month and quit weren't running aroud nagging about how terrible the game was and how it's not worth a sub.

Or maybe we mean by influential as in influential on Blizzard who are notorious for soaking up features from other games to attract players back to their game.

 Its very loaded and op makes these rididculous threads with headlines are that world changing (in his head )to get people to click on them to up GW2 hit counter then sit and proclaim it (sliced bread) ..But again hope this is the same thing that we went thru with the ToR folks .. it will quiet down soon enough ..

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by Scorchien

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by kadepsyson

What has GW2 influenced?  like at all?

And if you say people talking about it, I will laugh in your face as you'd have just called The War Z more influential.

i said it on the first page of this thread but to me one of the biggest things is it showed a AAA MMO can release as B2P and still roll out monthly content updates.. i can't think of a single other MMO that has released content patches this fast not even Rift did.

 AC had/has Monthly content updates .. long long ago, .. And as i said before UO had/has o threat/taunt mechaic 15 years ago .. so 2 more GW2 myths ....debunked

i remember paying a monthly sub for AC at launch.. or am i mistaken?

    Lol .. big deal they reaped the public for enough box sales it will hold them for a bit . not to mention that these Halloween Xmas events were being developed During the games Development stage ... So it was mostly ready .. Altho still full of bugs and only some of the population could actually complete or enjoy them .. The threads are here go back and read them .. Many  folks were pretty unhappy with Anets weak attempt at Monthly content .. (and they had a head start on it)..

   So for them releasing bug infested , broken content is standard operatio .. its just a shame so many find this acceptable ..

     IMO they will never keep up the pace either of Monthly content .. (and this means meaningful content) not some bunk down the raod in June where they tell you .."Hey we put a new cow escort Event in Xzone .. "

    BTW remind me  did AC have  Threat/Taunt .... i dont think it did ...

Originally posted by koboldfodder

Hearts were just your basic quests without a start NPC or a set number of mobs to kill.  It was still Kill these or collect these type of things....every single quest was this way.

 

You expored things once....and only once, to fill your sheet thingy.  Loot was dull and boring.  I never got the feeling I got when I first got a Dragoon Dirk from Crushbone.  Level 10 sword was a little bit better than a level 9 sword, while not as good as a level 11 sword.  Crafting was boring WOW type.  PVP was instanced and really meant nothing in terms of the world.  The Dynamic events meant nothing either, as they would eventually reset.

 

Hmmmm..... I read posts like this and wonder if you were playing the same game I was? The hearts were more than just an average "kill 12 hogs and bring me heads" quest. Some offered puzzles to figure out and all of them allowed for you to choose what you wanted to do to complete the quest. Choice is a great implementation in a quest system! 

The great thing about the map completion is that you explored. I know in a lot of other MMOs there was little incentive from the developer to even get you to explore this vast world they created. In GW2 you want to explore and sometimes you happen upon an event while exploring that vista, or a little Easter Egg, or a Champion event, or a person in need.

PvP to some extent is similar to other games. It is meant for people to find enjoyment in the challenge of facing off against others and overcoming. Not all PvP has to affect the world your in. Now WvWvW does affect the world. If your server is ahead on the boards you get bonuses on your server. There is also guild recognition for PvP.

I do agree that for the Dynamic Events I also am disappointed. I was hoping for Anet to fulfill a dream of mine in which the world permanently changes around you. I do not agree that they mean nothing. If anything GW2 has done a good job to make each event meaningful to the zone your in and even the faction you chose to play. They all tell a part of the story of the region or add to the background of the race, region, and faction.

For those use to the "Gear-go-Round" grind then at times I can see GW2 not being as "exciting" for you. There is not a great focus on gear grinding in this game as a reward. There is however much enjoyment with a robust and enjoyable combat system, one of the best story telling in a MMO, and the lack of quest hub burn out. 

The gear in this game may not have the stat grind from level to level, but it is one of the most beautiful design of armor, weapon and accessories in a MMO. I enjoyed trying to find/craft new gear. It was not upsetting that the stats were minimal from level to level. It just meant my success in the game was more based on my skill with what I had rather than getting over stat'd gear.

I understand the game may not be for you, but please do not misrepresent the facts.

Originally posted by boxsnd
Not so fast GW2 fan! If in the near future we see other MMOs adopting things like no trinity, the downed mechanic in PvE and PvP, hearts and dynamic events, overflow servers etc then we might say it's influential. Until then, patience.

well at least we see the return of the 3 faction system returning, and for sure the flexible class system, the "no trinity" means that every class can be support or dps with in some secs ... (except the traits :/ )  i think all these are adapted by TESO which will be the next big thing as i see from the trends ...

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by fiontar 

What makes you say there is nothing in TESO like GW2? I've noticed that TESO is now hyping "Dynamic Events",  players getting their own rewards for events/kills that players cooperate on and GW2 style resource nodes. There isn't much info on TESO, but in what we do know there are already at least those three freatures borrowed from GW2. I'll bet you there will be many more, major and minor, by the time the game launches.

Misinformation or ignorance? I've given up trying to discern, but the number of such posts is discouraging.

(BTW, If they can pull it off, TESO may match the GW2 Manifesto better than GW2 did on persistance of player influence. It looks like they are combining Dynamic Events with Phasing so that if players "save a village" it remains saved and the villagers celibrate the PC on return. I have mixed feelings about the approach, but it has potential to be awesome. It should be clear, though, that it's yet another thing that GW2 inspired.).

I must say though saying TESO is GW2 inspired is much like saying EQ2 was WOW inspired, we're talking about systems that would require quite a bit of devlopment time. IS a few months after release enough time to conceptualize these ideas as well as develop them? The game is entering beta soon. Very similar to EQ2 and WOW's launch cycling.

MMO development is largely a game of cat and mouse, Concepts are always following trends in the industry, what was a common complaint/request 5 years ago? "Two factions suck we need three or more" Hence the DAOC influence in more than just GW2. "Static quest hubs suck, we need more believable world's/NPC's" hence new approaches to content, AOC, SWTOR, TSW, GW2, TESO etc....

This is a tech industry this is how things work in that environment.

The GW2 Manifesto, plus plentiful Arenanet blog posts, have given other developers a lot to copy for about three years now. So, no, it's not like there hasn't been enough time for GW2 to influence TESO. It's also not too late for GW2 live to influence a game coming out later this year. If Arenanet had been a lot more secretive during development, you might have a point on some features, but they were very open about the ways they wanted to change MMO design.

The 8 minute intro to TESO video borrows heavily from the GW2 manifesto video in style and substance and I do not think that's coincidence.

Originally posted by fiontar

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by fiontar 

What makes you say there is nothing in TESO like GW2? I've noticed that TESO is now hyping "Dynamic Events",  players getting their own rewards for events/kills that players cooperate on and GW2 style resource nodes. There isn't much info on TESO, but in what we do know there are already at least those three freatures borrowed from GW2. I'll bet you there will be many more, major and minor, by the time the game launches.

Misinformation or ignorance? I've given up trying to discern, but the number of such posts is discouraging.

(BTW, If they can pull it off, TESO may match the GW2 Manifesto better than GW2 did on persistance of player influence. It looks like they are combining Dynamic Events with Phasing so that if players "save a village" it remains saved and the villagers celibrate the PC on return. I have mixed feelings about the approach, but it has potential to be awesome. It should be clear, though, that it's yet another thing that GW2 inspired.).

I must say though saying TESO is GW2 inspired is much like saying EQ2 was WOW inspired, we're talking about systems that would require quite a bit of devlopment time. IS a few months after release enough time to conceptualize these ideas as well as develop them? The game is entering beta soon. Very similar to EQ2 and WOW's launch cycling.

MMO development is largely a game of cat and mouse, Concepts are always following trends in the industry, what was a common complaint/request 5 years ago? "Two factions suck we need three or more" Hence the DAOC influence in more than just GW2. "Static quest hubs suck, we need more believable world's/NPC's" hence new approaches to content, AOC, SWTOR, TSW, GW2, TESO etc....

This is a tech industry this is how things work in that environment.

The GW2 Manifesto, plus plentiful Arenanet blog posts, have given other developers a lot to copy for about three years now. So, no, it's not like there hasn't been enough time for GW2 to influence TESO. It's also not too late for GW2 live to influence a game coming out later this year. If Arenanet had been a lot more secretive during development, you might have a point on some features, but they were very open about the ways they wanted to change MMO design.

The 8 minute intro to TESO video borrows heavily from the GW2 manifesto video in style and substance and I do not think that's coincidence.

TESO has been in development for 5 years+. Are you saying for two years they had a different form of content delivery, and switched with GW2's manifesto? There are no facts to support such a claim.

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by fiontar

Originally posted by Distopia

Originally posted by fiontar 

What makes you say there is nothing in TESO like GW2? I've noticed that TESO is now hyping "Dynamic Events",  players getting their own rewards for events/kills that players cooperate on and GW2 style resource nodes. There isn't much info on TESO, but in what we do know there are already at least those three freatures borrowed from GW2. I'll bet you there will be many more, major and minor, by the time the game launches.

Misinformation or ignorance? I've given up trying to discern, but the number of such posts is discouraging.

(BTW, If they can pull it off, TESO may match the GW2 Manifesto better than GW2 did on persistance of player influence. It looks like they are combining Dynamic Events with Phasing so that if players "save a village" it remains saved and the villagers celibrate the PC on return. I have mixed feelings about the approach, but it has potential to be awesome. It should be clear, though, that it's yet another thing that GW2 inspired.).

I must say though saying TESO is GW2 inspired is much like saying EQ2 was WOW inspired, we're talking about systems that would require quite a bit of devlopment time. IS a few months after release enough time to conceptualize these ideas as well as develop them? The game is entering beta soon. Very similar to EQ2 and WOW's launch cycling.

MMO development is largely a game of cat and mouse, Concepts are always following trends in the industry, what was a common complaint/request 5 years ago? "Two factions suck we need three or more" Hence the DAOC influence in more than just GW2. "Static quest hubs suck, we need more believable world's/NPC's" hence new approaches to content, AOC, SWTOR, TSW, GW2, TESO etc....

This is a tech industry this is how things work in that environment.

The GW2 Manifesto, plus plentiful Arenanet blog posts, have given other developers a lot to copy for about three years now. So, no, it's not like there hasn't been enough time for GW2 to influence TESO. It's also not too late for GW2 live to influence a game coming out later this year. If Arenanet had been a lot more secretive during development, you might have a point on some features, but they were very open about the ways they wanted to change MMO design.

The 8 minute intro to TESO video borrows heavily from the GW2 manifesto video in style and substance and I do not think that's coincidence.

TESO has been in development for 5 years+. Are you saying for two years they had a different form of content delivery, and switched with GW2's manifesto? There are no facts to support such a claim.

GW2 was announced just after GW1: Factions came out so it has been longer than that for GW2.

Originally posted by eyelolled
I'm honestly surprised that the haters aren't just admitting it and saying "yeah, it was definately the king of 2012, but in 2013..."

Funny thing though, you didn't claim it was king.  You claim it was influential - which, in 2012, it wasn't.

It may influence things in later years, even in 2013.  But not 2012.  It was probably one of the least influential of 2012.

In 2013 ArcheAge was released.  Also a publishing deal for the west was announced.  If anything, ArcheAge could be king of 2013, and more influential than Guild Wars 2 over time.

Peronsally, I feel The War Z was far more influential in 2012 than GW2, because of the media attention and things actually happening because if it.  Not saying The War Z is a good game, just far more influential than GW2 given the time period of 2012.

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by eyelolled
I'm honestly surprised that the haters aren't just admitting it and saying "yeah, it was definately the king of 2012, but in 2013..."

Funny thing though, you didn't claim it was king.  You claim it was influential - which, in 2012, it wasn't.

It may influence things in later years, even in 2013.  But not 2012.  It was probably one of the least influential of 2012.

 

In 2013 ArcheAge was released.  Also a publishing deal for the west was announced.  If anything, ArcheAge could be king of 2013, and more influential than Guild Wars 2 over time.

 

Peronsally, I feel The War Z was far more influential in 2012 than GW2, because of the media attention and things actually happening because if it.  Not saying The War Z is a good game, just far more influential than GW2 given the time period of 2012.

I didn't claim it was king. I did claim it was influential, which in 2012 it was.  Developers aren't waiting around to watching time go by so they can look back at a game 5 years later and start doing something about it. So if you want to tell yourself that the influence doesn't happen until the "influenced" game has been released than go ahead, but I'm still saying that it happened last year and is still happening right now.

The way I see it is it was the most anticipated, most talked about and best received game of 2012. The hype is starting to come down now, 5 months after release, but it's still way above any other game that was release last year.

I'm not saying that everyone loves the game, or that it didn't have a single problem, or that if you eat the disk you'll pinch a gold brick. All I'm saying is the blatantly obvious.  Look at the commotion this game has raised, in so many facets, both good and bad.  THAT is influence, and I don't see any other game reaching as far.  

the War Z ??? seriously ?! maybe you wanna say the Day Z ?

go look the WoW what will add and compare it with the GW2 ..., i just heard they will add jumping puzzles ???

Originally posted by loulaki

the War Z ??? seriously ?! maybe you wanna say the Day Z ?

 

go look the WoW what will add and compare it with the GW2 ..., i just heard they will add jumping puzzles ???

Is that true?  All this fluff is getting absurd.  We may as well all sit in a room together, break out our gameboys and play tetris at this rate.