Originally posted by Nadia

Originally posted by boxsnd
But GW2 copied a lot of things from other games too. WvW from DAoC/WAR, sPvP from WoW arenas/bgs, dynamic events from WAR/RIFT etc. 

WOW did not add BGs until June 2005  http://www.wowwiki.com/Battleground

 

GW1 had sPVP before WOW

globaled.

Originally posted by trash656

Pretty hard to judge just from looking at screenshots and gameplay videos, although that being said, I hope the game will be descent. From the "looks" of it, it's following the WoW formula and I really really really hope they don't go down that route, Because there is already enough of those WoW cloned Formula MMO's already out there.

Instead I hope they keep it to the ideal Elderscrolls route, the fact you cannot travel to enemy zones, and that there is phasing has me concerned because then that means the game is not as open world as what was stated by developers. And I already am weary of developers and PR people because most of them are full of shitbags. So I'm not holding my breath for anything and keeping a negative tone towards this game, then I won't be dissapointed if I find out that it's another SWTOR, or GW2 deal.

I don't really see a lot of WoW in it, other than it's Fantasy based.  As far as the hotbar goes, eh, it doesn't need to be that big.  One of the things I hated in WoW was the classes in my opinion had WAY too many skills to deal with.  Shamans, Hunters, all had too many utility skills.  I like the more simplified set they're doing here.  Remember, there isn't a need for a lot of buttons when most of your attacks depend on how long you hold your mouse button or how you move while striking.

Besides, WoW's formula was also taken from EQ.  Now WoW is nothing more than a childrens game.  They couldn't pay me to come back.  Right now I'm happy still playing Skyrim because of all the additional content you can get from the Modding community.  Some of those guys should be working for Bethesda, because they're damn good.  I love the look and feel of ESO, but that's not where my worries come from.  I've already stated them once in this thread.  So wont rehash them here again.

Just for once though, I'd like a MMO to really be a RPG like they used to be.  Quit making things that are only good for a month or so.  It's making me not want to buy them anymore and just play games like Oblivion, Skyrim, Tomb Raider ( Exploration in this game series is always great ) and similar other games.  The things I love about Elder Scrolls is how much detail there is in the game.  I don't know how they're going to keep that intact when they have hundreds of thousands of players on one server.....  24 hours, 7 days a week ZERG Fest coming up!

Originally posted by Caliburn101

Originally posted by hikaru77

Originally posted by Destai
I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

This is an entirely unsupportable statement which has been disproven again and again on these forums.

I am not a GW2 'fanboi' - I don't play GW2 anymore. But that's because it's set in a 'popcorn and bubblegum' world, not because it was a copy of the average to crapola games mentioned (except for DaoC ofc).

Dynamic events and the fluid combat are both excellent in GW2, and they made a non-trinity model really work.

So yes it was a push forwards, in all kinds of ways - it just didn't come together as a whole for me due to the fluff and the lack of guild features and support.

"they made a non-trinity model really work." Are you being sarcastic? Death zerging is not a successful alternitive to the trinity model, it's embarrassingly stupid.

First of all, ur topic is for ESO pvp, so that changes the subject abit from what u really had as title. 

And for the second of all, why would it be just a GW2 clon... And the pre prestent GW2 pvp it was realm vs realm but not world pvp or a single duel... so that sucked, and ESO will have world pvp since there are 3 factions and not the previous casual 1vs1 faction. And the pvp is hard to make uniqe since pvp exists in all mmo's these days, and quite hard to make something really new about that. It's just the archtype of wich pvp battle will take place and so forth.. 

For the PvE however is GW2 and for example Skyrim quite similar to the interact with the world. Without grouping up and public quest's ofcourse. But ESO will copy all Elderscrolls previous game's and skyrim is the top notch singel RPG so they will practically copy paste that part for sure, for a good reason aswell!

SO big story short:

Yeah in some parts it will look similar, but the pvp concept faction vs faction vs faction in ESO will rock so thats a BIG difference from GW2 where u cant even kill a player from ur own server....

Originally posted by Eir_S

I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet.  Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".

Pretty naive if you ask me.  If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen.  And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.

Didnt they say TESO's 'massive player versus player' will have a max limit of 200 players? Im pretty sure ive seen more people than that on my screen in GW2 WvWvW. I hope im wrong, does anyone know?

Originally posted by Darth-Batman

Originally posted by Eir_S

I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet.  Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".

Pretty naive if you ask me.  If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen.  And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.

Didnt they say TESO's 'massive player versus player' will have a max limit of 200 players? Im pretty sure ive seen more people than that on my screen in GW2 WvWvW. I hope im wrong, does anyone know?

Maybe 200 people per faction?  600 Total?

I like how this non-trinity stuff gets brought up.  GW2 is poorly designed in Dungeons.  It needed a tank and healer combo to really survive.  Right now most that go in, try to zerg it with massive dps and that's it.  Now there are those few, I do mean few, that try and use the tools given to them.  In other words they are trying to make use of the healing and support capabilities of some of the classes and do well.  Which means it's not go in, zerg, die, re-enter, zerg, die, rinse repeate.....  Which I have been a part of many of those groups and I just quit.  I don't even bother with it.  Waste of time.

In my opinion, any kind of MMORPG that tries to come out with a system that does not require a Tank type and Healer type for support in a Dungeon and or Raid, has severely dumb downed the challenge aspect or made it just like GW2, where all you are getting out of it is a repair bill and lots of frustration.  Thankfully there are healing capabilities in even Skyrim, saved my hiney quite a few times as well as my Follower.  But....  I would think that is something that would carry over in ESO so not worried about that.

Dynamic Events?  GW2's idea there failed.  All it is, is a repeated or triggered event that is the exact same every time.  It doesn't change and due to the lack of any real rewards, a lot of players don't even participate in them.  There are very few players at any given event on my server at any given time.  They just don't want to bother with them because they really are just that boring.  The only ones that get attention are the ones that take over a location that you need to work in.  Those they kinda have to do to gain access to the NPC's there.  But since there really isn't any quests in the game except your class line?  Again, not many participate.  They just want to get all the objectives of the zone done and move to the next.

ESO has a lot to offere that GW2 will never have.  Tons of Story and Lore, quests and places to discover all over the land.  Elder Scrolls has too rich of a story ( GW1 Had a lot of story, was a shame that GW2 lacked that ) for it not have a great building foundation here.  My only dread is I hate PvE zerging.  So eh, we'll see how it goes.

Originally posted by Maephisto

Originally posted by Darth-Batman

Originally posted by Eir_S

I was listening to a video with a friend about TESO's "massive PvP zone" and everything they said sounded exactly like GW2's WvW and the promises of ANet.  Now she is the only friend of mine that was disappointed with GW2 so she tells me "Yeah but GW2 was rushed, if you do it right you can influence player behavior".

Pretty naive if you ask me.  If there is the possibility of zerging, a zerg will happen.  And that's exactly what's going to happen in TESO.

Didnt they say TESO's 'massive player versus player' will have a max limit of 200 players? Im pretty sure ive seen more people than that on my screen in GW2 WvWvW. I hope im wrong, does anyone know?

Maybe 200 people per faction?  600 Total?

Hard to tell really, I got on with some friends over the weekend and it was so busy out there that I didn't even see what killed me till after I was dead and a LOT of players just appeared suddenly.  That takes a lot of players in one location for that to happen to me on my computer.  That was rough!  It's not like they give us a number count per side there how many are out.  Sometimes wish they did lol!

Originally posted by AreQ

 

So, will ESO be a GW2 in diverent settings? What do you guys think?

Hopefully not.

There is nothing in GW2 I want to see cloned in any other title.

ESO should only clone previous Elder Scrolls titles and Skyrim plus adding some unique new ideas and real innovation.

Originally posted by azurrei

Originally posted by Caliburn101

Originally posted by hikaru77

Originally posted by Destai
I think the features it wants to use are simply good features. Guild Wars 2 used those things because they make a great game and signify a push forward for MMOs. I wouldn't go so far as to say it's a clone. From what I've read and seen, it seems a deeper game. Guild Wars 2 , while fun and large, is a large kiddy pool. It's fun, there's a water slide, but it is still 4 feet deep.

GW2 wasnt a push forward for MMOs, it was just a bad copy of warhammer, Rift and Daoc, they have lost active players even more fater than D3 did. And thanks god, ESO wont be like GW2 at all. 

This is an entirely unsupportable statement which has been disproven again and again on these forums.

I am not a GW2 'fanboi' - I don't play GW2 anymore. But that's because it's set in a 'popcorn and bubblegum' world, not because it was a copy of the average to crapola games mentioned (except for DaoC ofc).

Dynamic events and the fluid combat are both excellent in GW2, and they made a non-trinity model really work.

So yes it was a push forwards, in all kinds of ways - it just didn't come together as a whole for me due to the fluff and the lack of guild features and support.

"they made a non-trinity model really work." Are you being sarcastic? Death zerging is not a successful alternitive to the trinity model, it's embarrassingly stupid.

Sometimes the trinity model is embarrassingly stupid also. In Rift it was ZERG ZERG ZERG to get through the high dungeons - what a pain. In GW2, I have one lvl 65 character and have not done any crafting for leveling - I have been playing the zones and PS and have not died - I guess there goes your zerg mentality out the window.

Why would they want to clone a crappy game like GW2? Like GW2 was the first game to have castle sieges anyways....

Are we talking about the same guys who claimed healing in PvP was just about watching healthbar and therefore included no healers in their game? Those guys obviously never played a healer in a competitive PvP setting and this is why even as an avid PvP player I skipped GW2 which was supposed to be a PvP centric game.

Originally posted by Shadanwolf
Matt Firor developed DAOC.

Mark Jacobs was the lead designer for DAOC - and we all know how WAR turned out

hopefully Matt will have better success

Originally posted by Foxxen

 

Where I feel ESO is going to come up short is the way the server is set up.  One Mega Server means everyone will just zerg through the content.  There is going to be way too many on one server for it to be any fun.  To me being on the highest populated servers in games has always been frustrating.  The one thing I miss in MMORPG's is the true Guild aspect.  No game since DAoC has done Guilds right.  There is no need to be in them, no need to form groups, no need to be a part of anything really.  I blame this one on WoW, definitely after they put in the Group Finding tools for both dungeons and raids.  They just pulled the nail on any reason once so ever to be part of a guild.

 

 

I respect your opinion, but this is one example of why I ignore the opinions of most on these forums. For every post like this, this will be an equal number of posts that cry when there aren't enough people on the server or the server feels like ghost towns at certain levels when people zip through the content. Then we get into endless threads about merging servers, etc. Similar to when people complain about long wait times, then when there are none people say the game isn't doing well. Similar to people here who say GW2 sucks, but SWTOR sucks both for conflicting reasons..especially the sandbox crowd who will never get the kind of game they want. You just can't make these forums happy. They never will be. It's like our country, forever divided lol.

Originally posted by Tayah
From their descriptions it seems a lot like the typical themepark.

This sums it up quite nicely.