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MMORPG.com Discussion Forums

Darkfall: Unholy Wars

Darkfall: Unholy Wars 

General Discussion  » Perma Banned For Wanting Refund

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241 posts found
  mastersam21

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/16/05
Posts: 39

1/20/13 8:01:43 PM#221

From the sound of it he is getting his refund its just taking a while. Last time I disputed with paypal it took almost a month to get my refund, but that is depend from case to case. 

In case of this topic I think AV hasnt done no wrong here. OP did goto AV first about a refund, but didnt like their answer so he looked for a different path with paypal and did a chargeback. AV is in the right to ban him right away because he broke his agreement with them. Some people just need to understand what being accountable for their decisions wheather its within the law or not. I hope Op learned something positive from this because its because of accountability is what messing many things up in this world, people like to point fingers elsewhere.

  Ramonski7

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 5/21/03
Posts: 2696

"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something."

1/20/13 9:15:15 PM#222
Originally posted by Aragon100
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Aragon100
Originally posted by GrayGhost79
Originally posted by Aragon100
Originally posted by Yanik
Originally posted by joshbaby03

http://i45.tinypic.com/1zdykab.jpg

 

Today I was banned for requesting PayPal to seek a refund from AV on my behalf due to their product not being as advertised, as well as not having any discernable release date.  I just want ya'll to know that they will ban you if you try to get your money back in any way possible, and more than likely you will not get anything back in the end.  This is fraud in my book, and I hope that MMORPG.com and other sites cover this...I don't know where to send this information so that it gets on the front page, but it needs to be.

 

Jed

[mod edit]

LOL.

So he is an arse for ventilating his frustration? His account was banned before he got a refund, that is fraud in my eyes. He still havent gotten his money so he should be able to log into the game.

Why would he want to? He doesn't like the game. It was bad enough that he wanted a refund. So... 

It's not about he wanting or not. He havent gotten any refund so his account should be open.

Explain why lol. 

1) He didn't like the game, to him it was bad enough to ask for a refund. 

2) He went through paypal to get said refund. 

3) Obviously the refund process started because Aventurine was notified and the account was banned as is standard practice in the gaming industry. 

4) You and he are PO'd because he can't play a game for free that he has no intent on paying for while he awaits his refund? 

 

Show me some proof that this is standard practice?

And why dont you same time give us some information they are following the EU business laws?

Pay the refund first and then close the account is the right way to do business. It is also a good way to avoid these kind of bad publicity.

Wrong! The probelm occurs because he used a thrid party to initiate the refund. It goes somehting like this:

Customer: AV I'd like a refund. (account open)

AV: Sorry we do not issue refunds. (account open)

Customer: Hey Paypal, I want a refund from AV I'm not happy with their product. (account open)

Paypal: Customer please be patient while we investigate and process your refund. (account open)

Paypal: AV our customer would like a refund, you have "x" number of days to comply. (account open)

AV: Paypal can we have the reason for the request and the customer's info to process a refund? (account closed)

Customer: Hey my account is closed! Paypal where's my money? (account closed)

Paypal: Customer please be patient. We have contacted AV and they are processing your refund. (account closed)

AV: Paypal our process of returning the customer money is complete we are sending you "x" amount for their refund.

Paypal: Thank you AV for your cooperation in this matter we are verifying this amount with our records.

Paypal: Customer our investigation is complete and we are now returning your funds.

Customer: Thanks Paypal....took you long enough!

 

All this is not instant and you are not the only person looking for a refund from a seller through paypal. I'm afraid to say they process hundreds if not thousands of refunds so it does take time. What do you think? Paypal is gonna return your funds while THEY wait for a refund?

 


"Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas."

  bongloads

Novice Member

Joined: 8/17/08
Posts: 389

1/20/13 9:20:35 PM#223
Originally posted by Sephiroso
you all are pathetic letting this go on for 22 pages

It's only 5 pages if you set your settings right

  jpnole

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/13/10
Posts: 1654

1/20/13 9:49:22 PM#224
Originally posted by joshbaby03

http://i45.tinypic.com/1zdykab.jpg

 

Today I was banned for requesting PayPal to seek a refund from AV on my behalf due to their product not being as advertised, as well as not having any discernable release date.  I just want ya'll to know that they will ban you if you try to get your money back in any way possible, and more than likely you will not get anything back in the end.  This is fraud in my book, and I hope that MMORPG.com and other sites cover this...I don't know where to send this information so that it gets on the front page, but it needs to be.

 

Jed

So create a new account when Paypal refunds you.

  Revy106

Novice Member

Joined: 5/06/08
Posts: 40

1/22/13 3:56:51 AM#225
Did you actually get your money back? if so I really want to do this to
  Seelinnikoi

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/11/11
Posts: 533

1/22/13 4:03:45 AM#226

"Their subscription will be activated only after the launch of DF Unholy Wars, (January 2013)"

 

Hahaha, gotta love Aventurine and their launch dates! :)

  Lovely_Laly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 736

game is also real

1/22/13 5:40:00 AM#227


Originally posted by Revy106
Did you actually get your money back? if so I really want to do this to

yes, OP, please tell us the end of story.

try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2

  kastrix

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/12/10
Posts: 80

1/22/13 10:11:18 AM#228
If you live in europe isn't it you're legal right to get a refund for an preorderd product? I got a refund from Warz 40 days afterbuying it? They cant both ban you and not give your money back. Thats like a computer store taking back the computer you  bought and then not giving you back your money.
  sumfool

Novice Member

Joined: 3/11/09
Posts: 13

"you dirty rat"

1/22/13 10:59:44 AM#229
Originally posted by Corehaven

Im a little confused.  What would be a more acceptable outcome OP?  Other than getting your money back? 

 

That they would allow you to keep playing?   Of course they're going to ban you from beta.  But since you didn't like the game anyways, why even post about it?  Why do you care? 

 

Is this to let the community know that if you try and get a refund from Darkfall you won't be able to play it anymore?  I mean if that's the case then thanks for letting everyone know I guess.  Although its about the most common sense thing I could possibly think off. 

he has a right to be upset at being banned and not yet having his refund

  DeVoDeVo

Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/07/13
Posts: 87

1/22/13 11:11:11 AM#230

If this company called Adventurine has a “no refund” policy for stated service, then the purchaser should still be able to receive the service as long as Adventurine is holding the purchasers money.  To deny access to the game *and* keep his money is theft, plain and simple.

 

If the money is in dispute and not in the possession of either Adventurine or the OP, then I believe it is within Adventurines right to temporarily deny access to the game.  If the PayPal ruling goes against the OP, then the OP should have full access again to the beta.  To me, that is fair. 

 

 Banning a person for being a butthole in a game is understandable, but banning a person for requesting their money back is highly disturbing.  As an observer with no axe to grind against Adventurine, this looks bad in the public eye and will not go over well in the future.  Someone mentioned earlier that Adventurine should act quickly to resolve this dispute.  Great advice.

  joshbaby03

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/07
Posts: 14

 
OP  1/22/13 7:41:51 PM#231

Another update for everyone.  Still no update to the open claim on PayPal.  Still no refund, still banned.  The actual request for refund was opened on the 11th of January, updated/escalated by AV/Vivencia or whatever to a claim at that time.  Was banned at the same time AV responded to PayPal...yes I did try to go through AV directly for a refund first...which in it's Terms of Sale/Use states they only "ban" if a customer had not gone through their company for a refund first...which in fact I did.  I'm leaning toward being denied on the refund and still banned...which will just result in another opened claim against them for also saying that the account would be unbanned once the dispute was resolved.

Jed

  joshbaby03

Novice Member

Joined: 12/10/07
Posts: 14

 
OP  1/23/13 3:30:28 PM#232

Today:

----------------------------------------------------------------------
Notification of Case Resolution
----------------------------------------------------------------------


Dear {EDITEDOUT},

We have concluded our investigation into this case. Unfortunately, at this
time we are unable to decide this claim in your favor.


-----------------------------------
Transaction Details
-----------------------------------


Seller's Name: Aventurine SA
Seller's Email: paypal@aventurine.gr
Seller's Transaction ID: 1HE27513R7122831J

Transaction Date: Dec 16, 2012
Transaction Amount: -$14.95 USD
Invoice ID: AVNT00010954
Your Transaction ID: 9N655392NF097702H
Case Number: PP-002-156-182-381

Buyer's Transaction ID: 9N655392NF097702H

Sincerely,
PayPal

The account has also been unbanned at this point.  Not the solution I was seeking, but it will have to do.  If anyone would like a Darkfall Unholy Wars account for 10 dollars, send me a pm...we'll arrange something.  All you fanbois can be happy that I'm stuck with a steaming pile.  =)

Jed

  MyownGod

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/09/09
Posts: 207

1/23/13 3:46:39 PM#233
This is funny, some people actually think "Asking for refund, get no money back but the product get taken away from them" is normal. Well they are stealing from you, or in other words they are cheating you and what is fraud? In criminal law, a fraud is an intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual. So technically speaking Joshbaby03 they are damaging you as an individual by taking your money. I don't know where you are from but there is such thing called "Consumer rights" which leads to the "Refund law". I mean the game isnt even officially launched yet, meaning not even the final product, so it's like watching a movie, the movie haven't even start yet and you changed your mind and wanted to not watch the movie, so you are entitled to get your money back.
 
  Hancakes

Novice Member

Joined: 2/06/11
Posts: 1106

1/23/13 4:05:39 PM#234
Originally posted by ucidaitaci
This is funny, some people actually think "Asking for refund, get no money back but the product get taken away from them" is normal. .
 

Try reading the above post

"The account has also been unbanned at this point"

  MyownGod

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/09/09
Posts: 207

1/23/13 5:01:07 PM#235
Originally posted by Hancakes
Originally posted by ucidaitaci
This is funny, some people actually think "Asking for refund, get no money back but the product get taken away from them" is normal. .
 

Try reading the above post

"The account has also been unbanned at this point"

I was pointing when he was banned, and pretty much replying to those people who actually think that was the case. They did how ever banned him for wanting to get a refund, which quite unnecessary. 

  Omali

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/09
Posts: 1108

1/23/13 5:09:58 PM#236
Originally posted by ucidaitaci
Originally posted by Hancakes
Originally posted by ucidaitaci
This is funny, some people actually think "Asking for refund, get no money back but the product get taken away from them" is normal. .
 

Try reading the above post

"The account has also been unbanned at this point"

I was pointing when he was banned, and pretty much replying to those people who actually think that was the case. They did how ever banned him for wanting to get a refund, which quite unnecessary. 

Or they banned him for the duration of the Paypal dispute, which any company offering a service would do if you opened a dispute in Paypal.

  Aethaeryn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/14/10
Posts: 1895

1/23/13 5:14:17 PM#237
Originally posted by joshbaby03

http://i45.tinypic.com/1zdykab.jpg

 

Today I was banned for requesting PayPal to seek a refund from AV on my behalf due to their product not being as advertised, as well as not having any discernable release date.  I just want ya'll to know that they will ban you if you try to get your money back in any way possible, and more than likely you will not get anything back in the end.  This is fraud in my book, and I hope that MMORPG.com and other sites cover this...I don't know where to send this information so that it gets on the front page, but it needs to be.

 

Jed

Most companies will do this automatically if you do it through a chargeback.  If you do it through them it will not happen.  If they said no refunts then that is why you are now banned.

This happened to me with Mortal Online when the launch was delayed for soooo long.  I had not even recieved the released product (save as you with DF2) and my account was banned.  It is not an insult.  It is also a way for companies to prevent fraud etc.  I would not worry about it or take it personally.  This will happen through autimatic processes from whoever runs their payments etc.

 

Ah I see it was resolved.  yeah. . banning is part of that process.  A human likely didn't even have anything to do with it.  With MO I got my money back from that account because they could not even bother to respond to paypal in the given time frame.  I later bought the game and subbed for a bit but that old account is still technically banned.

Wa min God! Se æx on min heafod is!

  Omali

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/09
Posts: 1108

1/23/13 5:40:18 PM#238
Originally posted by Aethaeryn

Ah I see it was resolved.  yeah. . banning is part of that process.  A human likely didn't even have anything to do with it.  With MO I got my money back from that account because they could not even bother to respond to paypal in the given time frame.  I later bought the game and subbed for a bit but that old account is still technically banned.

This one. Most account systems are set up so that if a charge-back is initiated or a paypal dispute, it will immediately and automatically disable the account associated so that the person can't continue using the service while also attempting to get their money back.

The fact that people are acting as though this is unprecedented, even though every company would do the same, is baffling. Try disputing a charge with your cable bill and see how long you have service.

  Lovely_Laly

Novice Member

Joined: 11/02/10
Posts: 736

game is also real

1/24/13 12:40:31 AM#239

oh well, seems one more company did not accept refunds.

means: be very careful when you order anything from gaming industry, as they seems not covering customer's claim and able to sell you anything, even unfinished and such w/o any
risk to pay you back.

very clever move!

again guys, think more then twice before pay anything new or anything you could regret.

still I don't understand PayPal policy, seems credit card will refund you after you declare it was wrong payment or you did not got payed product.

still debatable here as they sold you just Beta test. =D

try before buy, even if it's a game to avoid bad surprises.
Worst surprises for me: Aion, GW2

  BartDaCat

Novice Member

Joined: 7/07/04
Posts: 817

Gamer Forums, where "First World Problems" are our specialty!

1/24/13 12:54:35 AM#240
PayPal stopped honoring refunds for digital purchases some time back.  Never EVER use PayPal as your pay-point for a digital item, rather use your bank as banks will not tolerate any sort of fraudulent activity, and will tend to honor your claims over the receiver of funds.
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