Originally posted by Karteli

EA set the date for their next earnings call.  Just under 2 weeks from now.

http://investor.ea.com/events.cfm?list=Future

Future Event
Jan 30, 2013 2:00 PM PT	Electronic Arts Q3 2013 Earnings Conference Call

Blizzard is probaby first week of February for Q4 2012  -- ncsoft is 2nd week of Feb for Q4 2012

will be alot of info floating around

Originally posted by Po_gg

I think it's shady and is a steal from the players - not that charging 10-20$ in the store for a few pixels wouldn't be a steal on it's own, but charging 1-100$ fo

I tell you what it's alot like all these shady retail stores in my town charging for merchandise.  They've got aisles full of crap I don't need but other people will pay big money for.  It's completely up to those shoppers whether or not they buy that stuff but they go ahead and do it anyway.  Shady I tell you.

EA's got a license to sell Star Wars memorabilia...if they put something cool enough in there I'll pay for it too.

Originally posted by Camaro68

Originally posted by Po_gg

I think it's shady and is a steal from the players - not that charging 10-20$ in the store for a few pixels wouldn't be a steal on it's own, but charging 1-100$ fo

I tell you what it's alot like all these shady retail stores in my town charging for merchandise.  They've got aisles full of crap I don't need but other people will pay big money for.  It's completely up to those shoppers whether or not they buy that stuff but they go ahead and do it anyway.  Shady I tell you.

 

EA's got a license to sell Star Wars memorabilia...if they put something cool enough in there I'll pay for it too.

I agree. I don't hate anything more than walking into a store and seeing people buy stuff I don't want.

And don't get me started on the craps tables.........

welcome to the world of gambling.

people in STO have been dealing with this for a long time now.

The boxes were even given lots more possible drops to get people to stop complaining about how crappy the drops were and how few ships came out of them like special consoles for example

People are going to buy these things unfortunately no one's going to stop the players from trying this one out. people like gambling too much. If you are trying to change the players minds you might as well not try, look at how much money casinos bring in each year and you'll see it's a lost cause.

Originally posted by Camaro68

Originally posted by Po_gg

I think it's shady and is a steal from the players - not that charging 10-20$ in the store for a few pixels wouldn't be a steal on it's own, but charging 1-100$ fo

I tell you what it's alot like all these shady retail stores in my town charging for merchandise.  They've got aisles full of crap I don't need but other people will pay big money for.  It's completely up to those shoppers whether or not they buy that stuff but they go ahead and do it anyway.  Shady I tell you.

 

EA's got a license to sell Star Wars memorabilia...if they put something cool enough in there I'll pay for it too.

I think you don't get the whole gambling issue of it... or just trolling. They don't sell you merchandise, and the shoppers in your example who are willing to pay, they don't get the stuff either. They get only the chance for it. Do you think all the people in the thread (and numerous other threads in STO forum, and a few closed ones in LotRO :) ) are just randomly babbling about gamble?

And +1 to itgrowls, it's the same ol' gambling as casinos, only game companies can do it without any regulations because they're using the grey area of "only virtual items, there's no real money attached"

Originally posted by itgrowls

welcome to the world of gambling.

people in STO have been dealing with this for a long time now.

The boxes were even given lots more possible drops to get people to stop complaining about how crappy the drops were and how few ships came out of them like special consoles for example

People are going to buy these things unfortunately no one's going to stop the players from trying this one out. people like gambling too much. If you are trying to change the players minds you might as well not try, look at how much money casinos bring in each year and you'll see it's a lost cause.

It's a model that works.  Many games have them, like GW2 and STO.

CCGs like Magic: The Gathering and Pokemon made a mint from the same type of thing with randomized booster packs.

Casinos have popped up everywhere.

Some people like to gamble.  Others are overly worried about what other people spend their money on.

Originally posted by Camaro68

Originally posted by Po_gg

I think it's shady and is a steal from the players - not that charging 10-20$ in the store for a few pixels wouldn't be a steal on it's own, but charging 1-100$ fo

I tell you what it's alot like all these shady retail stores in my town charging for merchandise.  They've got aisles full of crap I don't need but other people will pay big money for.  It's completely up to those shoppers whether or not they buy that stuff but they go ahead and do it anyway.  Shady I tell you.

Well, if those stores are selling big black boxes for $10 a pop with only the promise that they *might* contain something, then yep, I think they are shady too.

I think you are missing the point.

Sell stuff in your cash shop, that's fine, whatever, but be honest and transparent about it. Using callous gambling mechanics and concealed pricing to manipulate the gulliable and addicted into spending more *is* shady.

I am glad though... I am against cash shops in games in general (believing they give the consumer an awful deal in reality) and these kinds of stunts will creat so much bad will and buyer's remorse amongst those that are pretty neutral to them right now that I no longer really feel the need to argue against them too heavily- Give these companies enough rope and they *will* hang themselves. Their greed makes anything else impossible in the long run.

Let me ask you though Cam... how much do you spend in EA's cash shop a month?

Originally posted by Rohn

Some people like to gamble.  Others are overly worried about what other people spend their money on.

Actually, self edit or I will be warned again for talking about ethics, despite everyone else also talking about ethics.

Originally posted by mrrshann618

 

Discusted at SWTOR "gambling packs"? well start looking around and you'll start to get more and more disgusted atMMO's in general. not jsut SWTOR

 This is true.  And in fact, this is true of game makers in general.  I have a hard time thinking of a single game company that isn't screwing people over somehow.

Making a Prima Guide?  You are charging us for free info!

Launch day DLC?  You already made enough money to create it, and then charged us twice.

Season Passes?  Multiply that DLC issue X4.

Monthly sub?  Well, why don't you launch new content every month, when we pay for it every month?

Buggy launch?  Game was not ready for launch then.

Always-ON DRM for offline playable games?  So, basically, the game is a glorified rental.

Doritos for in-game bonuses?  Thinly disguised Pay 2 Wins?  WOW!

Paid reviews?  YOU CORRUPT PIECE OF SHITE!!!

The point isn't that it should be justified.  The point is, the game industry is going downhill fast.  But, if you're going to judge EA and Bioware for the vile things they do, then you need to judge them all.  Soon, you'll realize that the gaming industry is wrought with corruption, evil marketing, and  customer manipulations that would make even some insurance executives blush!  Why?  Because either you, or your friends, have put up with it for years now.

Bonus example:  A whole quarter for just a few minutes of gameplay?  You have got to be kidding me!?

Originally posted by Souldrainer

Originally posted by mrrshann618

 

Discusted at SWTOR "gambling packs"? well start looking around and you'll start to get more and more disgusted atMMO's in general. not jsut SWTOR

 This is true.  And in fact, this is true of game makers in general.  I have a hard time thinking of a single game company that isn't screwing people over somehow.

Making a Prima Guide?  You are charging us for free info!

Launch day DLC?  You already made enough money to create it, and then charged us twice.

Season Passes?  Multiply that DLC issue X4.

Monthly sub?  Well, why don't you launch new content every month, when we pay for it every month?

Buggy launch?  Game was not ready for launch then.

Always-ON DRM for offline playable games?  So, basically, the game is a glorified rental.

Doritos for in-game bonuses?  Thinly disguised Pay 2 Wins?  WOW!

Paid reviews?  YOU CORRUPT PIECE OF SHITE!!!

The point isn't that it should be justified.  The point is, the game industry is going downhill fast.  But, if you're going to judge EA and Bioware for the vile things they do, then you need to judge them all.  Soon, you'll realize that the gaming industry is wrought with corruption, evil marketing, and  customer manipulations that would make even some insurance executives blush!  Why?  Because either you, or your friends, have put up with it for years now.

Bonus example:  A whole quarter for just a few minutes of gameplay?  You have got to be kidding me!?

Memories memories :) 

I still remember when I was growing up saving my quarters for the week and using them on arcade games. Good times. 

Originally posted by meddyck
Since the packs are making them so much money, they could lighten up on some of the F2P restrictions. Allow more warzones and space missions per week. Allow companion customization and hiding head slots. And let F2Pers have access to all of their quest rewards.

Maybe you should do more farming and less qq?

Originally posted by superniceguy

Originally posted by mrrshann618

STO had lockboxes long before SWTOR had a cash shop. They are essentially the same thing. It is proven to work on other MMO so why not SWTOR? Yeah they may have had longer runs, can be found during normal adventuring however to open them you need keys, and keys are most commonly bought from the online store.

Discusted at SWTOR "gambling packs"? well start looking around and you'll start to get more and more disgusted atMMO's in general. not jsut SWTOR

 

Yeah and SWG had it in TCG too, with a $15 sub fee.

 

Either way I have no intentions on paying anything on any MMO on these things, but in SWG I got 5 free packs each month with the sub, and STO I have a 1 lifetime subscription (which has well paid itself now after 3 years so now is fully free) with a monthly stipend of dilithium, and 1 free account, so over time I can get unlock the boxes without doing anything, and STO has more things worthwhile to do to get more dilithium, whereas SWTOR does not (for credits)

 

The other thing in STO is, all you have to do is play the game to get the lockboxes from loot drops, you do not buy the lockboxes from the ZEN store (unless it is an in game trade from other players using whatever currency you want), only the keys, so you need to play the game within the limit, to get the lockboxes before a new lockbox is introduced, and you can still hoard the lockboxes away and get the keys when you are ready. STOs way of doing it promotes gameplay, whereas SWTORs way is all Cartel Store.

Nope it isn't all Cartel Store at all , the gambling packs can be sold on the GTN and thus if someone grinds for their in game credits then they can grab some for free. Also you could hoard them and sell them at a mega profit when they vanish from the Cartel Market.

I believe the OP missed the metrics for what things sell for on the GTN from these boxes. Plus you don't have to buy them at all you could just grind for in game credits and buy everything you want from there instead. I'm glad the 2 new level 10 crystals will be fixed soon , really want to buy some cyan / blue and orange / red ones , you can only have so many pink / purple ones.

The main thing about all this is Damion Schubert is being very active over the last few days detailing various things. one really funny thing is how in an early build they had an alien speaking player character race on tython but after 4 missions you just wanted to punch the monitor so no they aren't going to introduce any alien player races. No wookies , jawa's etc.

Funny stuff,

BadOrb.

Originally posted by ezpz77

I'd say that gambling packs are most definetly a sustainable business model. As long as they can keep churning them out, weak-willed individuals will shell out hundreds of dollars, or more, at the chance of winning it big. The trick is to make the stuff in them really desirable and rare. I fully expect to see more items added to these packs that give players a very obvious advantage in game.

I consider myself a pretty thrifty guy. I've never even played a poker game for cash, but years ago, I dropped about $150 on gambling packs in Atlantica Online (in one sitting.) By the time I got what I was after, I didn't even care about the item anymore. A few hours later, my wife ripped me a new ass, and that was the end of my gamblin' days, but they can be extremely effective. I wouldn't doubt for a second that EA is making a truckoad of cash off of them.

Yeah. Thats called addiction ;-) 

Could care less if there were gambling packs in the game.  I wont be using them.  Not for me to tell others not to waste money/time on them if it works for them.

I just want to play my character, which this doesnt interfere with at all.

Originally posted by BadOrb

Originally posted by superniceguy

Originally posted by mrrshann618

STO had lockboxes long before SWTOR had a cash shop. They are essentially the same thing. It is proven to work on other MMO so why not SWTOR? Yeah they may have had longer runs, can be found during normal adventuring however to open them you need keys, and keys are most commonly bought from the online store.

Discusted at SWTOR "gambling packs"? well start looking around and you'll start to get more and more disgusted atMMO's in general. not jsut SWTOR

 

Yeah and SWG had it in TCG too, with a $15 sub fee.

 

Either way I have no intentions on paying anything on any MMO on these things, but in SWG I got 5 free packs each month with the sub, and STO I have a 1 lifetime subscription (which has well paid itself now after 3 years so now is fully free) with a monthly stipend of dilithium, and 1 free account, so over time I can get unlock the boxes without doing anything, and STO has more things worthwhile to do to get more dilithium, whereas SWTOR does not (for credits)

 

The other thing in STO is, all you have to do is play the game to get the lockboxes from loot drops, you do not buy the lockboxes from the ZEN store (unless it is an in game trade from other players using whatever currency you want), only the keys, so you need to play the game within the limit, to get the lockboxes before a new lockbox is introduced, and you can still hoard the lockboxes away and get the keys when you are ready. STOs way of doing it promotes gameplay, whereas SWTORs way is all Cartel Store.

Nope it isn't all Cartel Store at all , the gambling packs can be sold on the GTN and thus if someone grinds for their in game credits then they can grab some for free. Also you could hoard them and sell them at a mega profit when they vanish from the Cartel Market.

I believe the OP missed the metrics for what things sell for on the GTN from these boxes. Plus you don't have to buy them at all you could just grind for in game credits and buy everything you want from there instead. I'm glad the 2 new level 10 crystals will be fixed soon , really want to buy some cyan / blue and orange / red ones , you can only have so many pink / purple ones.

The main thing about all this is Damion Schubert is being very active over the last few days detailing various things. one really funny thing is how in an early build they had an alien speaking player character race on tython but after 4 missions you just wanted to punch the monitor so no they aren't going to introduce any alien player races. No wookies , jawa's etc.

Funny stuff,

BadOrb.

You can only buy the stuff from the GTN as long as another player has bought them from the Cartel Store and put them up for sale. It is guaranteed money to EA.

STO is grind dilithium and buy on the store, no money needs to go to Perfect World at all if you play the game instead.

If people get fed up of grinding credits in SWTOR for these pakcs, then people who bought the packs to get credits, might end up taking longer to sell, or people may reduce the Cartel Pack purchases and then less appear on the store. In STO this is not an issue as the keys will always be for sale, and if people give up going for dilithium to buy the keys, then no other player will lose out, only Perfect World.

STOs way of doing things, make this sort of thing more fun and rewarding. I never touched SWGs TCG loots packs with a barge pole, and I liked SWG more than STO.

"Why am I always broke?" - Spent his last 50 bucks on a virtual game item.

"Why am I so goddamn fat? - Just after gobbling down his third big mac of the day. 

Too bad the giant asteroid never hit.

There have been cases in the way past if I remember correctly where people would buy and buy items in the chance of getting the stuff they need in a game, leading to it being obsessive and rather draining should we say on funds.. Needless to say people who sometimes get addicted sometimes do strange things to get those items, which filters over into the real world causing all sorts of issues..

Id have to brand the whole pack stuff and take ones chances as a terrible method with no regard to who may be on the other end of the stick... they can not vet every person buying so they should find new ways to bring in the money other than old underhanded tactics praying on peoples lack of willpower to not want goodies should we say....

It may work but its not really nice is it now.

To be honest i very much prefer this kind of boxes over "golden bullets" or other pure P2W items If they are what keeps the game afloat i saythey can churn out them boxes til the cows come home.

I like them in most games. It is fun to buy one or two every now and then for the thrill as you click it. 9/10 times you get just stuff. But every now and then you get some good stuff.

Then again i would never plunk down several hundreds in those boxes.. no game have had that good boxes yet.

Edit: Also i like to point out that the desire for "cool stuff" have pretty much been the driving force of capitalism... So if it works in the real world... Ofc it will work in a game.

Originally posted by superniceguy

 *SNIP

In STO this is not an issue as the keys will always be for sale, and if people give up going for dilithium to buy the keys, then no other player will lose out, only Perfect World.

 

 

To convert dilithium to ZEN, someone has to have purchased the ZEN and put them on the exchange. While it is possible to short Cryptic by buying low and selling high, they still make money from people willing to buy ZEN and convert it to dilithium.

The ZEN on the exchange is not from Cryptic, it is from other players.

Well from what I've seen the cartel pack's and the Cartel Market altogether appear very popular.The newest big Cartel pack (Skip Tracer) has the gtn (ah) flooded with item's for sale on the server I'm on.

The only thing I don't like is how the latest pack also allow's to get rare's and super rare's from the previous 2.So it is even harder to get what you want from the new pack.

Let's say pack set 1 and pack set 2 both had 20 rare's/super rare's per set.So you had those in the random generator per set.With set 3 you have another 20 plus the previous 40 thrown into the random generator.So if looking for a rare/super rare from the new pack's you have a less chance then in the other 2 set's.These are just random figure's here and I don't know the exact number of rare/super rare's.

I bought 4 pack's and got a speeder and clothing from a previous set.My opinion is once a pack is no longer for sale,the new pack shouldn't offer item's for the same pack in a later pack.