Originally posted by TheScavenger

If any freemium game has items that are locked due to rarity, that you have to PAY for...that is pay to win.

 ** No, it is usually possible to get an unlock with in game gold or through other gameplay, it just might take a unreasonable amount of time. **

That is no different AT ALL, to a free to play that has items you have to pay to get. No matter how you look at it, its exactly the same.

 ** No, because first you must obtain the item which is in fact different than being given the item.  **

"everyone" hates on free to plays being pay to win (Allods was a big one to hate on)...what is different about freemiums? Why don't they get hated on for being pay to wins?

 ** Nothing is different about freemiums. People hate on freemiums constantly. **

You used the word "Most" In your title line but disqualified that by using the word "Any" in your first statement.

Then you used the word "Exactly" in your second statement.

Then you made a generalized statement based on your opinion, with an example, but attributed said opinion to everyone.The fault in this is that even in the sample that you offered people did in fact pay and play.

*Note - I do not entirely disagree with your concept, but your context contradicts itself.

Originally posted by XAPGame

Take it a step further and WoW is pay to win.  Since all content requiring level 21 or better is unreachable.

 

Originally posted by Yakkin

Wouldn't a pay to play technically count as pay to win, considering you can't even enter the game unless you paid a subscription, and if you don't, you don't get access to content and loot, thus making you fall further behind?

It's offtopic, but I've been wanting to ask for some time now. Just saying.

Yes, as has been pointed out this can be taken to rediculous extremes.

Is a 2000 dollar computer with SSD drives pay to win?

Originally posted by TheScavenger

"everyone" hates on free to plays being pay to win (Allods was a big one to hate on)...what is different about freemiums? Why don't they get hated on for being pay to wins?

The stance of an entitled generation.

The reason people aren't displaying hatred for freemium is probably because the expectation is that you should get more when paying for a premium service than what you receive for the free version.

Originally posted by XAPGames

Originally posted by TheScavenger

If any freemium game has items that are locked due to rarity, that you have to PAY for...that is pay to win.

Take it a step further and WoW is pay to win.  Since all content requiring level 21 or better is unreachable.

Actually, WoW is Pay to Win because of expansions.