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News & Features Discussion  » [Editorial] Star Wars: The Old Republic: Give BioWare a Break

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145 posts found
  Aeonblades

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

1/17/13 12:18:11 PM#41
Originally posted by TrunksZ

I'm not going to take the bait, sorry, it's already easy enough to get into trouble here :p It's not even about SGR really, it's about features that actually matter to 90% of the player base.

I will say this, 3 threads do not constitute a huge following, I have seen probably 100x more posts about PvP, End Game, Glitches/Bugs and actual problems with the game, not just a publicity stunt where they bend to a small minority of players. I have no problem with SGR, heck, encourage it even if it's where society is headed, just if you are going to do this, why not fix the real problems? I want to love this game, I have been faithful that it will end up fixed, but even fans start losing steam at some point.

I can tell that you didn't even look at the links I provided, first of all the first thread I provided is 534 pages long, also they keep locking every other thread made about the subject and I am not trying to bait you into anything, they added a new battleground not long ago, but I bet you are not happy about that either, they're releasing an event in the next patch, but I bet you're not happy with that either, they're releasing an expansion within the next few months, but you won't get happy about that either. My point is some people will  never get satisfied, maybe your standards are just too high.

Great 534 pages. For a game that sold millions of copies. Half of the posts are just filler, you do realize this? It's still not the point, you keep going on and on about SGR like it matters, put it in, leave it out, most people don't care, just fix the game is my point.

And I guess wanting to have a game be fun and playable is too high of an expectation for a AAA MMO these days. Silly me for wanting a game to play. One new battleground and one new raid means nothing if half the game is still broken and buggy.

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  zomard100

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/16/11
Posts: 232

1/17/13 12:18:53 PM#42
Wait..... wait a sec... I search and search  in my Star Wars encyclopedia.... No, there is nothing about   SGR. I think i never saw planet Earth in Star Wars universe.  Do alliens really  have SGR?
  floreairfoot

Novice Member

Joined: 2/11/11
Posts: 62

1/17/13 12:23:30 PM#43

I guess being gay is not "family friendly"?

 

According to a few of you.

 
 
  TrunksZ

Novice Member

Joined: 1/30/05
Posts: 267

1/17/13 12:26:00 PM#44
Originally posted by Aeonblades

Great 534 pages. For a game that sold millions of copies. Half of the posts are just filler, you do realize this? It's still not the point, you keep going on and on about SGR like it matters, put it in, leave it out, most people don't care, just fix the game is my point.

And I guess wanting to have a game be fun and playable is too high of an expectation for a AAA MMO these days. Silly me for wanting a game to play. One new battleground and one new raid means nothing if half the game is still broken and buggy.

Game is fun already, but it feels like some players are just looking for things to complain, help me understand your point of view what do you mean the game is "broken and buggy"?

Edit: I don't like to mention WoW, but I will, how long it takes WoW to release a BG or a Raid for that matter? and it has much more resources than Bioware, oh, but thats an AAA MMO, right?

Edit: Didn't really like how this came out, it will probably lead to misinterpretation.

  Myria

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/07/09
Posts: 549

1/17/13 12:30:03 PM#45

It's been quite a while since it mattered what Bioware did -- as far as most of these armchair devs are concerned, anyway. Literally the only thing they could do that might please them is announce they were shutting down the game, and even then there would be as much bitching about how they did it as there was nasty self-satisfied "I told you so" posts.

Seriously, just look at this thread. Most of these posts hit the same tired talking points, the same righteous fury, the same transparently faux rage. How in the hell these people haven't gotten sick of carrying this weird torch is a mystery, I suppose it mostly comes down to safety. The forum herd has declared all out war on ToR, so it's safe to pile on. Original thought be damned, it's all EAWare's fault that SWG is dead! Or whatever the twisted rational might be this week.

For better or ill -- better, mostly -- sites like this one long ago made themselves irrelevant to the overall market. Between the endless hype/crash addiction, the desperate need to knock anything remotely popular, and the constant sewer of vitriol, they've turned -- assuming they were ever anything else -- into an online version of those too-cool-for-you record stores of yore where only bands no one else has even heard of could possibly be decent and the main activity was looking down one's nose at anyone not you. Amusing places to visit from time-to-time, but amusing in large part because of how wholly and totally irrelevant they were in the grander scheme of things, and how little self-awareness they had.

It's amusingly notable that Rift has same-sex marriage -- with, unlike ToR, no apparent reason for marriage at all, given the near complete lack of story, let alone romantic storylines -- and no one really cares. ToR talks about adding it and it's a sign of the apocalypse.

Imagine that.

  mnemic666

Hard Core Member

Joined: 12/23/10
Posts: 108

1/17/13 12:31:54 PM#46

I've been a big critic of BioWare and SWTOR since launch, as I feel it's the most disappointing handling of an extremely promising game/property with a ton of potential in the history of...well maybe ever. But this is ABSOLUTELY not one thing I've criticized them about.

I'll critisize them for taking so long to implement it, but I'm not going to critisize their implementation from anything other than a development standpoint. Their implementation comes as a result of a development team that's inept, understaffed, and mismanaged. Its small scope is a direct result the previous poor live development for this game.

However, I fully support them making a move to implement the feature in order to stay true to their word (even if it is quite late), and their desire to continue expanding it in the future.

There are a MILLION reasons to criticize BioWare and SWTOR, and a whole lot of them are extremely valid. But the criticism that this feature has received is a result of:

1. Bigots who can't handle that OMG GAY IS A THING AND IT'S IN MY GAMEZZZZZZZ. There's no point in sugar coating it, they're bigots just as those in the 60's who supported segregation were bigots.

2. People who feel that BioWare apparently has some hatred of SGR/LBGT (something which isn't exactly true, and is definitely not true of EA) so they are segregating them on one planet. If they didn't want it in the game, they coudl do what they've done with the grey moral alignment rewards and the super secret space project; pretend it doesn't exist and not talk about it.

I criticize the hell out of BioWare for SWTOR in every aspect, but I support their implementation, and hopfully expansion, of this feature in the game. Equality matters, and if you're going to include features like scripted romances in the game, make sure that everyone is covered (let's not go down the, I WANT TO ROMANCE MY SPEEDER/JAWA/ANIMAL BLAH BLAH road, that's pointless and you know it).

  Harafnir

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/18/04
Posts: 1379

1/17/13 12:34:31 PM#47
Good read and I agree. Bioware has done a lot of stupid stuff since joining EA (always seem to happen in combinaiton with EA) but giving players more options to play a game the way they want it is not one of those stupid things.

"This is not a game to be tossed aside lightly.
It should be thrown with great force"

  Samhael

Hard Core Member

Joined: 5/28/04
Posts: 626

1/17/13 12:37:41 PM#48

Give BioWare a break?  Nope. They had their chance and blew it big time.

But that has nothing to do the the same-sex relationship thing. It's the game itself.  SWTOR, DA2, and ME3 were massive disappointments. I've learned my lesson.

  MisatoTremor

Advanced Member

Joined: 6/10/03
Posts: 69

1/17/13 12:44:35 PM#49


Originally posted by bigsmiff
I think that people put the pressure on Bioware to add it when they obviously didn't want to put it in their game. Star Wars has always been a somewhat family friendly IP, and now people want to change it into something that it has never been. Bioware should have just told people no in the beginning and left it at that. Now they are under pressure to add stuff that has no business being in a video game.

*Just my opinion*



They said no at that time but that caused an even madder outrage as the one we have now. So they changed course on this matter.

Maybe they'll change this time, too. But that would cause SGR implementation or even the whole expansion to be pushed back for obvious reasons.

Overall I'd say Bioware/EA have managed to almost make one unlucky decision after another with SWTOR.

Misato - TankDoc for Life

  Aeonblades

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/12/12
Posts: 2123

1/17/13 12:46:37 PM#50
Originally posted by TrunksZ
Originally posted by Aeonblades

Great 534 pages. For a game that sold millions of copies. Half of the posts are just filler, you do realize this? It's still not the point, you keep going on and on about SGR like it matters, put it in, leave it out, most people don't care, just fix the game is my point.

And I guess wanting to have a game be fun and playable is too high of an expectation for a AAA MMO these days. Silly me for wanting a game to play. One new battleground and one new raid means nothing if half the game is still broken and buggy.

Game is fun already, but it feels like some players are just looking for things to complain, help me understand your point of view what do you mean the game is "broken and buggy"?

Edit: I don't like to mention WoW, but I will, how long it takes WoW to release a BG or a Raid for that matter? and it has much more resources than Bioware, oh, but thats an AAA MMO, right?

Edit: Didn't really like how this came out, it will probably lead to misinterpretation.

Glitches, falling through objects, black screen at character select half the time (still) unbelievable lag if more than 10ish people are on the screen, horrendously slow combat/button recognition just to name a few. Don't use WoW as a reference, it's a game from 2006 which they have pulled most of their developers off of for another project. I don't play WoW anymore for the same reasons SWTOR is going down the drain, lack of credible development of features people actually want and not fluff filler content.

Not to mention WoW hasn't had truly challenging content since TBC. I'm not trying to be negative against Bioware or SWTOR, but a fan boy can only be a fan boy so long before he gets fed up with it.

Currently Playing: ESO and FFXIV
Have played: You name it
If you mention rose tinted glasses, you better be referring to Mitch Hedberg.

  cura

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/24/04
Posts: 876

1/17/13 12:47:57 PM#51
My only problem with it is that the game has so many flaws, bugs to correct, things to implement and yet they decided to spend money and their time on this crap. For me, unacceptable 
  Istavaan

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/25/12
Posts: 1398

1/17/13 12:50:05 PM#52
so we have f2p, p2p p2w,b2p.. does this create a new acronym. p2g?
  Talonsin

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 7/19/06
Posts: 1162

1/17/13 12:57:50 PM#53

With all the things they could do to improve the game, I dont think adding man-on-man love is in the top 50% of gameplay improvements needed.  I seriously wonder about the person or persons actually making the decisions.  I can honestly imagine somewhere in an EA boardroom this taking place...  "Hey guys, gay players account for almost 10% of our base.  Lets milk them and add gay romance options in a pay-only place.  We can add full breast shots in the following expansion and start milking the nerdy teenager playerbase we have next!  We believe this will increase sales of the expansion by almost 6%!"

 

 

 

  reploidx

Apprentice Member

Joined: 10/15/05
Posts: 318

1/17/13 1:00:30 PM#54
I see what they are doing with the whole thing. Start in one area, see how it goes and go from there. It seems like the planet only gayness is just a knee jerk reaction and adding more fuel to the "let's hate on TOR" fire. I don't like the game that much, so i don't play it and i don't follow up on it. But from someone who can see the whole picture, it seems BIOWARE will have to do voice acting with everyone's NPCs and PCs just to add all that same gender stuff. Only the haters will be championing this outright and not looking at what kind of logistics are needed to put all aspects of the SGR into the game.
  Distopia

Drifter

Joined: 11/22/05
Posts: 15844

"what a boring life, HATING everything" -Gorilla Biscuits

1/17/13 1:00:30 PM#55
Originally posted by baphamet

it just gives another thing for people to cry about. no matter what they do people will complain unless it involves them giving the people a completely free game and even then i bet people would complain.

i understand people have legitimate gripes with this game but people complain and over-exaggerate so much about this game, it doesn't even matter anymore.

its the boy who cried wolf and i don't listen anymore.

I have to agree with this completely, as well as with the original article. The "pay to gay" thing had me rolling my eyes as soon as I first saw it. A team can only cram so much into one expansion, and typically a team doesn't attempt to overhaul an entire MMO worth of content during the course of an expansion development period. Nor are they normally expected to.

For every minute you are angry , you lose 60 seconds of happiness."-Emerson

It is a sign of a defeated man, to attack at ones character in the face of logic and reason- Me

  BadOrb

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/11/13
Posts: 772

1/17/13 1:02:54 PM#56
Originally posted by floreairfoot

I guess being gay is not "family friendly"?

 

According to a few of you.

 
 

The funny thing is SWTOR is not a family friendly game it has a 16+ cert here in the UK. If anyone had played either a sith warrior or an IMP agent they would see this too , amoungst other classes. The sith warrior can have sex with someone and opt to have their companion Vette watch. Also the IMP agent gets tortured and it is quite disturbing. So no it ain't family friendly and people who say it is haven't even played many if any character classes all the way through.

So I don't think a few flirt options from NPC's be they same sex or SGR should annoy anyone at all. You can opt not to chose the flirt reply in the convos. As for people thinking that now they have to pay for the privalidge to have SGR then well it's only $10 and you get a level cap increase , new planet and a few other things. I'm quite amazed that all this has caused such a mass wave of media attention do we not live in the year 2013 or is this 1953 ?

As to giving them a break , we'll yeah I agree really they listened to me and a couple of other people the other month. We protested about possibly having to pay to unlock characters that where merged onto a single server. So they didin't charge us. I can play all my 16 chracters for free still. They listened to the complaints about not having  LFG. They are quite secretive but that is only because of the uproar about a patch being a aweek late and taking out RWZ's at the last min. So again I don't blame them. PC gamers ( IMO ) on forums are a real bunch of crying , hating , abusive little brats , I only witnessed this on MMO forums though , not sure about other styles of games. I thought console forum users where bad , how I was wrong.

Also I have never heard the term Pay 2 Gay and I'm glad I haven't. There is so much hate for BW and EA on this forum itself that two of my recent posts where thought to be negative about SWTOR and DIsney when in fact they weren't . What does that tell you ? It is presummed that a person gears their posts against EA , BW , SWTOR and/or Disney , it's a sad state of affairs.

Try the game yourself if you haven't make up your own mind about it and don't act like sheep for gods sake. It's $4.99 for 4 action bars , 6 character slots and you can play the whole game all the way through , that's a bargain.

End of long post.

Cheers,

BadOrb. 

PSO 4 years , EQOA 4 months , PSU 7 years , SWTOR launch ongoing , PSO2 SEA launch ongoing , Destiny 360 launch ongoing.
"SWG was not fun. Let it go buddy." quote from iiNoSkillzii 10/18/13
The original propoganda pixie dust villain :[]

  Onomas

Novice Member

Joined: 7/05/11
Posts: 1160

Sandbox is your only hope for a decent mmo ;)

1/17/13 1:04:17 PM#57
Should never mix real world topics with games. We play games to escape real world issues and to have fun. Does it really matter if your boy toon can hold hands with another boy toon? Lot of people don't even make their character the same sex that they are.
Just improve the game stop wasting time on trivial things.
  TrunksZ

Novice Member

Joined: 1/30/05
Posts: 267

1/17/13 1:04:35 PM#58
Originally posted by Aeonblades

Glitches, falling through objects, black screen at character select half the time (still) unbelievable lag if more than 10ish people are on the screen, horrendously slow combat/button recognition just to name a few. Don't use WoW as a reference, it's a game from 2006 which they have pulled most of their developers off of for another project. I don't play WoW anymore for the same reasons SWTOR is going down the drain, lack of credible development of features people actually want and not fluff filler content.

Not to mention WoW hasn't had truly challenging content since TBC. I'm not trying to be negative against Bioware or SWTOR, but a fan boy can only be a fan boy so long before he gets fed up with it.

Leaving WoW aside, Neither my brother and I have experience any of those bugs, the most annoying bug I have experienced so far is the casual stuck between a rock and that Kira's lightsaber doesn't goes off when she puts it away, I am going to assume you have a gaming rig, but I can tell you that I don't experience any lag if more than 10 people in my screen, I think you are just simply bored of the game and I understand that, game gets old, but every game does.

  MMOGamer71

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/12/07
Posts: 1643

1/17/13 1:05:49 PM#59
Originally posted by Talonsin

With all the things they could do to improve the game, I dont think adding man-on-man love is in the top 50% of gameplay improvements needed.  I seriously wonder about the person or persons actually making the decisions.  I can honestly imagine somewhere in an EA boardroom this taking place...  "Hey guys, gay players account for almost 10% of our base.  Lets milk them and add gay romance options in a pay-only place.  We can add full breast shots in the following expansion and start milking the nerdy teenager playerbase we have next!  We believe this will increase sales of the expansion by almost 6%!"

 

 

 

^

This. almost an impossible to imagine business decision made to pander to the "minority" of your playerbase. 

 

Executive #1:  "Lets talk about adding new races to the Cartel Market to increase the playerbase by an estimated 15%"

Executive #2:  "Nah, lets talking about adding a gay planet that decreases our playerbase by 10%"

  Thorkune

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 9/28/06
Posts: 1842

Dyslexics of the world...UNTIE!

1/17/13 1:06:08 PM#60
Originally posted by Onomas
Should never mix real world topics with games. We play games to escape real world issues and to have fun.

My thoughts exactly, unless the game is based on real world. SWTOR is obviously not based on real world topics.

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