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Jita (General)  » Should CCP be ashamed of themselves?

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59 posts found
  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

 
OP  1/12/13 11:20:40 AM#1

Most EVE players know that CCP merged with White Wolf, White Wolf produced a well known and loved pen and paper RPG. CCP wanted to pick up the World of Darkness IP and make a game. It would be no exaggeration to say things have not gone so well for the project, years have passed and the test bed for it has been through its own set of problems and effectively put on the back burner. Apart from a few screens and a tasty looking trailer we have seen nothing to show us a game is anywhere near happening. 
 
Now CD Projekt RED, a small dev like CCP have announced they will be releasing their own RPG based on a PnP RPG, they are going all out and created a full team of some of their veteran devs to get the project moving. Its hard to say if CD Projekt RED have more resources than CCP, CD Projekt had an awesome success with the Witcher franchise and GoG is shaping up as a viable DRM free Steam alternative. Good Old Games is certainly not as big as Steam but its creating its own loyal fanbase bit by bit, think of Steam in 2007 and thats kinda where GoG is at. 
 
CCP have a constant income from EVE and had several multinational studios, but they fact they had financial problems is no secret and unfortunately they had to lay off a lot of staff. If I was to make a guess I would say CD Projekt had the fatter warchest. Still CCP have had year after year to get something done with World of Darkness, although an MMO and an RPG are different technically creating worlds as detailed as CD Projekt do is a whole heap of its own challenges. They are apples and oranges but both are as challenging in their own way. They are really going to push the boat out for this game too, with an amazingly detailed world and true next gen graphics. 
 
So CD Projekt Red will probably release CyberPunk 2077 long before CCP can release World of Darkness. So the question is why cant CCP, an experienced Dev create the game they have years to work on?

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  ObiClownobi

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/12
Posts: 189

1/12/13 11:25:57 AM#2
I think CCP have more cash than Cd project, I think CCP will release first, I base this on the same evidence you are using, the voices in my head.


"It's a sandbox, if you are not willing to create a castle then all you have is sand" - jtcgs

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

 
OP  1/12/13 11:31:29 AM#3
Originally posted by ObiClownobi
I think CCP have more cash than Cd project, I think CCP will release first, I base this on the same evidence you are using, the voices in my head.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=O03WLn8SzaE#t=14s

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  sketocafe

Hard Core Member

Joined: 7/19/11
Posts: 529

1/12/13 11:40:32 AM#4
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.
  nyxium

Novice Member

Joined: 3/15/09
Posts: 1198

Tumbling down the rabbit hole?

1/12/13 11:46:09 AM#5
Complicated, very complicated. After monocleGate things went downhill for CCP as they got caught with their pants down and lost a lot of subs. They had to throw everything at EVE and WoD lost out. I am a fan of WoD and hope it or something like WoD, is released soon, or at least an ETA is given.

  bcrankshaw

Novice Member

Joined: 1/12/08
Posts: 555

1/12/13 11:47:20 AM#6
Originally posted by sketocafe
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.

This, I don't see the conflict in any area.

They are catering for different groups of people.

"after the time of dice came the day of mice "

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

 
OP  1/12/13 11:51:55 AM#7
Originally posted by sketocafe
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.

Derp, I covered that. Fact is the game CD Projekt are attempting is as complex and as challenging as creating an MMO. The challenges they face are different but both are difficult in there own way. 
 
CD Projekt are creating RPG mechanics covering over 4700 pages in 44 books, in a game filled with huge detail and no set linear path. Its basically trying to create something as detail heavy and as free formed as Morrowind combined with one of Biowares better RPGs like DA:O. The game will also have true next gen graphics. This is not something thats easily done

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  radesk

Novice Member

Joined: 10/04/09
Posts: 11

1/12/13 11:57:21 AM#8
I don't know, just like WarZ, NeverWinter and TERA, they have all adv. take the whole time to build an awesome game but in the end, they release an beta/alpah product with 1000000000 bugs that they could've done way before but they didn't  because it was supposed to be perfect.
  User Deleted
1/12/13 11:57:33 AM#9

No they should not be ashamed of themselves.

Patients is a virtue many gamers dont seem to have.

From a look of the WOD video and the scope of the world they plan to create, WOD will take some time.

  Paradigm68

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/24/11
Posts: 878

1/12/13 12:00:38 PM#10
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by sketocafe
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.

Derp, I covered that. Fact is the game CD Projekt are attempting is as complex and as challenging as creating an MMO. The challenges they face are different but both are difficult in there own way. 
 
CD Projekt are creating RPG mechanics covering over 4700 pages in 44 books, in a game filled with huge detail and no set linear path. Its basically trying to create something as detail heavy and as free formed as Morrowind combined with one of Biowares better RPGs like DA:O. The game will also have true next gen graphics. This is not something thats easily done

How did you cover that? You can't compare a standalone game to an MMO in terms of complexity. Just because you list things that CD Projekt is doing doesn't in any way mean it is comparable to what CCP is doing.

  MindTrigger

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/19/07
Posts: 2628

1/12/13 12:01:52 PM#11

I don't know about ashamed of themselves, because EVE is an amazing accomplishment, but I would love to see them do something more, including evolve EVE.

I'm sure you've read their dev posts on EVE.  They want to expand it and keep it alive for a very, very long time.  Trouble is, it doesn't really seem to be going anywhere.  They can only expand on the current gameplay model so much without starting to add other branches of play such as WiS, planets, etc.

I dont' play EVE only because the game that exists now with space flight only doesn't appeal to me, but I so want to join the EVE experience in general.

As for WoD, I read they were talking about putting some information out at the end of 2012, which clearly didn't happen.  It would be nice at least to hear some kind of status update.

A sure sign that you are in an old, dying paradigm/mindset, is when you are scared of new ideas and new technology. Don't feel bad. The world is moving on without you, and you are welcome to yell "Get Off My Lawn!" all you want while it happens. You cannot, however, stop an idea whose time has come.

  Mawnee

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/16/12
Posts: 182

1/12/13 12:04:17 PM#12
Originally posted by KroxMalon

...

Patients is a virtue many gamers dont seem to have.

.....

 

We cant all be doctors......

  risenbones

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/08/09
Posts: 195

An opinion once stated is no longer humble.

1/12/13 12:04:35 PM#13
Nope because CCP have also just released another game called Dust 514 for the playstation.  Granted they have sat on the WoD IP for a fair while but they are doing things no-one else has tried.  Tied to that WoD i very different to what CCP have done in the past and when you look at what they have been adding to Eve and to a certain extent what they are doing with Dust it's all kind of laying some basic ground work for stuff they can use with WoD.  So while nothing looks like it's officially moving on WoD things like getting an avatar moving around captains quarters on a space station could be seen as experiance in avatar design and animation that could be put to use in WoD.

The lesser of two evils is still evil.

There is nothing more dangerous than a true believer.

  bcrankshaw

Novice Member

Joined: 1/12/08
Posts: 555

1/12/13 12:05:01 PM#14
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by sketocafe
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.

Derp, I covered that. Fact is the game CD Projekt are attempting is as complex and as challenging as creating an MMO. The challenges they face are different but both are difficult in there own way. 
 
CD Projekt are creating RPG mechanics covering over 4700 pages in 44 books, in a game filled with huge detail and no set linear path. Its basically trying to create something as detail heavy and as free formed as Morrowind combined with one of Biowares better RPGs like DA:O. The game will also have true next gen graphics. This is not something thats easily done

I don't get your point, it makes no sense

Why would CCP be ashamed because another development company is making a complex single player RPG? Should they also be embarrassed because Bethesda made Skyrim and it was sold millions of copies?

There is very little correlation technically around the development of how an MMO and a single player game is designed. So no, CCP shouldn't be ashamed

"after the time of dice came the day of mice "

  Cameron27

Novice Member

Joined: 9/03/07
Posts: 150

1/12/13 12:06:56 PM#15
I'm pretty sure they want to use the same graphics engine that they did for walking in stations, which turned out to be a giant resource hog that can't support multiple players in the same area. So until they solve this very important issue I don't think WoD is going anywhere. Once CCP releases pod pilot out of ship content, then I think people can start getting excited for WoD.

"I will not play it nor any other MMO until they make it possible to obtain the best gear without forcing people to group up to do so." SwampRob

  ObiClownobi

Novice Member

Joined: 12/02/12
Posts: 189

1/12/13 12:13:20 PM#16
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by ObiClownobi
I think CCP have more cash than Cd project, I think CCP will release first, I base this on the same evidence you are using, the voices in my head.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=O03WLn8SzaE#t=14s

So no evidence then of your assertations?


"It's a sandbox, if you are not willing to create a castle then all you have is sand" - jtcgs

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11822

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ESO, and Combat Arms

1/12/13 12:24:55 PM#17

Can someone link me to the information on Cyberpunk 2077 that we are basing this all on? I couldn't find anything but a trailer and a couple of high level devblogs. I'm not saying CD won't make a great game. IMO, they've delivered solidly with both Witcher and Witcher 2, so I look forward to Cyberpunk 2077. I'm just lost as to what the OP is going on about as I haven't seen anything about the features, gameplay, release date, scope of game or .... well, anything at all.

 

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

 
OP  1/12/13 12:25:49 PM#18
Originally posted by bcrankshaw
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by sketocafe
CCP is making an MMO, CD Project is making a standalone RPG. So no.

Derp, I covered that. Fact is the game CD Projekt are attempting is as complex and as challenging as creating an MMO. The challenges they face are different but both are difficult in there own way. 
 
CD Projekt are creating RPG mechanics covering over 4700 pages in 44 books, in a game filled with huge detail and no set linear path. Its basically trying to create something as detail heavy and as free formed as Morrowind combined with one of Biowares better RPGs like DA:O. The game will also have true next gen graphics. This is not something thats easily done

I don't get your point, it makes no sense

Why would CCP be ashamed because another development company is making a complex single player RPG? Should they also be embarrassed because Bethesda made Skyrim and it was sold millions of copies?

There is very little correlation technically around the development of how an MMO and a single player game is designed. So no, CCP shouldn't be ashamed

You are not getting it, you have two very similar products produced by two similar devs. 
 
CCP are a small breakout dev that created something unique an provide an awesome service (EVE) 
 
CD Projekt are a small breakout dev that created something unique and provide an awesome service (GoG) 
 
Both have a loyal fanbase, both have announced that they will bring a pen and paper RPG to life by basing a game on it. The projects are different, very different in fact and are apples and oranges but both are very difficult and challenging apples and oranges.  
 
So why cant CCP make some progress with theirs after all these years when CD Projekt will most likely get theirs out even though CCP have had years and years of a head start. Its not about CD Projekt Vs CCP its about highlighting CCPs inability to actually get somewhere with WoD.

If one dev can take on converting a PnP into a game thats as challenging as creating an MMO why cant CCP do it. By the way for those not getting it, if you have two challenges say climbing a mountain and running a marathon they are very different. Both are difficult in their own way and have there own complications and difficulties to overcome. I  am not comparing the challenge they both face directly I am simply saying that the RPG CD Projekt are creating is no easier than creating an MMO.

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  Garkan

Gurista

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 544

Thug, Thief, Killer, Pirate

 
OP  1/12/13 12:29:55 PM#19
Originally posted by ObiClownobi
Originally posted by Garkan
Originally posted by ObiClownobi
I think CCP have more cash than Cd project, I think CCP will release first, I base this on the same evidence you are using, the voices in my head.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=O03WLn8SzaE#t=14s

So no evidence then of your assertations?

Good Sir, you seem a very perky sort and very energetic. I am sure that instead of adding absolutely nothing to the discussion you could take the time to find out the info yourself, after all self education is the best education.

/tips hat

-Damn monocle fell out-

Currently playing:

EVE online (Ruining low sec one hotdrop at a time)

Gravity Rush,
Dishonoured: The Knife of Dunwall.

(Waiting for) Metro: Last Light,
Company of Heroes II.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 11822

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, ESO, and Combat Arms

1/12/13 12:33:50 PM#20
Originally posted by Garkan

If one dev can take on converting a PnP into a game thats as challenging as creating an MMO why cant CCP do it. By the way for those not getting it, if you have two challenges say climbing a mountain and running a marathon they are very different. Both are difficult in their own way and have there own complications and difficulties to overcome. I  am not comparing the challenge they both face directly I am simply saying that the RPG CD Projekt are creating is no easier than creating an MMO.

What are you basing this on, though? Can you link to pages on the scope of the two projects. There's very little on World of Darkness out and from what I read on the Cyberpunk 2077 site, they were still deciding which parts of the PnP to use and which parts to cut. I think some of us would be able to understand how you arrived at this seemingly odd conclusion if we saw what information this you used to reach it.

 

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