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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Do we really need races?

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103 posts found
  User Deleted
1/11/13 1:46:35 AM#21

I think one driving factor of races is character customization in terms of stats.  This works well in games where character balance isn't a big deal.  My guess is that in PVP games where everyone is supposed to be equally effective in combat, it would be a big negative.

 

When they get into classes are locked into a specific race, then that blows the diversity for me.  If I have to play an Orc in order to be a warrior, that's not much of a choice.

 

  Magiknight

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/10/09
Posts: 744

1/11/13 1:51:15 AM#22
Different races should definitely limit your choices for classes to some degree.
  Luckshmi

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/05/12
Posts: 73

1/11/13 2:19:41 AM#23
Originally posted by Ramonski7
Originally posted by Lovely_Laly

Seems it great fashion for latest game design to bring several races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.

If you're going to throw out races, then you might as well throw out classes and factions. If devs focused more on gameplay rather than made up factions, races and classes wouldn't it be even better?

i have to agree with this one, I would like to see something *limitless*

  kadepsyson

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/15/06
Posts: 1966

The doctors say his chances are 50/50...but there's only a 10% chance of that.

1/11/13 2:22:22 AM#24
Originally posted by Lovely_Laly

Seems it great fashion for latest game design to bring several races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.

No we don't need races.  There is an MMO after all where you aren't a race, you are a machine - Perpetuum.

El Psy Congroo

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

1/11/13 2:55:49 AM#25

I would argue no - many very good fantasy and scifi stories have only human 'player' characters.

The extra effort that goes into resizing and refitting gear for the various races in a normal game could instead go into creating more variety of gear - cultural etc. variance which would enrich the game just as much.

Just my two-pence on the subject, and a very subjective subject it is...

  Caliburn101

Novice Member

Joined: 3/30/11
Posts: 647

"Imagination is more important than knowledge." Albert Einstein

1/11/13 2:55:49 AM#26

I would argue no - many very good fantasy and scifi stories have only human 'player' characters.

The extra effort that goes into resizing and refitting gear for the various races in a normal game could instead go into creating more variety of gear - cultural etc. variance which would enrich the game just as much.

Just my two-pence on the subject, and a very subjective subject it is...

  Rydeson

Elite Member

Joined: 3/05/07
Posts: 3258

1/11/13 3:16:42 AM#27

     Yes.. i like as many races as one can get, and they should have racial bonuses too similar to EQ...  I hate homogenized classes, and equally hate homogenized races too..  I want my Elf to see in the dark and dammit.. I want that feature back in the game too.. If you are in the middle of a cave as a human with no light sourse, guess what?  Exactly!!!

     Yes, Ogre's should be bigger and carry more weight.. And what happen to the days that strength actually meant something besides warrior combat bonus?  Games today have become so carebear arcade I can just scream..

  Quirhid

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5511

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

1/11/13 10:23:00 AM#28
Originally posted by XAPGames

I think one driving factor of races is character customization in terms of stats.  This works well in games where character balance isn't a big deal.  My guess is that in PVP games where everyone is supposed to be equally effective in combat, it would be a big negative.

 

When they get into classes are locked into a specific race, then that blows the diversity for me.  If I have to play an Orc in order to be a warrior, that's not much of a choice.

There is no negative impact to PvP if the system is balanced, but usually it isn't. Infact, I can't remember a balanced PvP game with races...

I'm not a fan of races if they funnel you into specific classes. It is effectively the same as restricting specific class choices to specific races only it gives more ways to gimp yourself. If Orc Warrior is the only good warrior, then only orcs should be warriors. If goblins make poor warriors, goblins shouldn't have that as an option.

But I don't care about babysitting stupid players. Let them make their poor choices if they want to, however I do mind it when those same ignorant people claim this is "depth". More choices to gimp yourself is not depth no matter how you spin it.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Phry

Elite Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 5203

1/11/13 10:34:29 AM#29
Originally posted by kadepsyson
Originally posted by Lovely_Laly

Seems it great fashion for latest game design to bring several races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.

No we don't need races.  There is an MMO after all where you aren't a race, you are a machine - Perpetuum.

different machines can be considered to be different races though, so that particular statement is misleading

  Saerain

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/27/06
Posts: 945

1/11/13 10:44:36 AM#30

Visually, races are a great way to vary player characters when you don't have very robust customization at the creation stage.

Mechanically, they're a nice additional layer of branching.

But most importantly, I think, they tend to be intrinsic to the setting. Usually.

Favorites: EVE, VG, LotRO | Playing: None | Anticipating: SC, ED, TD, EQN, CU

  VengeSunsoar

Advanced Member

Joined: 3/10/04
Posts: 4763

Be Brief, Be Bright... Be Gone.

1/11/13 11:05:21 AM#31

It's hard to play a game where you aren't actually playing a person, machine, animal, mineral, vegetable.  The race is just the visual representation of you.

So Yes you really need races.  I think it would be impossible to play a game in this setting without something representing you.

Other games could do it, chess, checkers.... but not this genre.

Can anyone give examples of an MMORPG/FPS... where they are not represented by something?

Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2906

I actually still like MMORPGs

1/11/13 11:28:04 AM#32
Originally posted by Vannor

If a creator like in CO and CoX was put into a fantasy MMO we'd be able to create our own races.. that'd be interesting.

But, yes, we need races. Races are a requirement of lore and story in fantasy. The storylines of almost all fantasy stories, games or otherwise, is almost always largely centered around racial conflicts. Monsters themselves are races.

How good would the film Alien have been if the alien looked and acted just like a human? Would LotR have been half as interesting if it was just humans vs humans while a fellowship of humans had to take a ring to mordor where there were more humans? There's a reason why people that havn't read the books know little about the Easterlings (the Men who fought in the armies of Morgoth and Sauron, especially the Battle of the Pelennor).. because it's just not as interesting.

Funny, because they are making Neverwinter right now! :-p I dont think they have create your own races though. Sorry.

  Dreamo84

Defender of Worlds

Joined: 5/20/04
Posts: 2906

I actually still like MMORPGs

1/11/13 11:36:25 AM#33

I think we are seeing two sides of the MMO community with this topic.

The one side, wants to bring back and keep more RPG options. Plenty of races with a rich lore strengths and weaknesses. My character needs to eat and drink, etc.

The other side is, don't bother with all that extra stuff. Just give me balanced class, good PvP, lots of content, so I can PEW PEW :-p

 

 

Personally I think games need to be marketed towards different players and thats the problem. MMOs are trying to develope for both types of players and its not working, both are getting pissed. YOu can see it on  game forums especially like WoW.

Player 1: We want player housing!

Player 2: WoW, what a waste of time! They should spend time adding dungeons and class balance instead

etc etc

  Arclan

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/29/07
Posts: 1358

"Ideas are worthless. The only currency that holds any weight is the ability and drive to execute."

1/11/13 12:22:01 PM#34


Originally posted by Lovely_Laly
Seems it great fashion for latest game design to bring several races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.


O.P may be onto something. Devs have finite resources. I too would rather get a better game with less races than an inferior game with more races. Players could still pick skin tone, eye color, etc. I'm game.



Originally posted by Fendel84M
...Personally I think games need to be marketed towards different players and thats the problem...

Ding ding ding. A+. I have been arguing this on the EQ boards for years.

Luckily, i don't need you to like me to enjoy video games. -nariusseldon.
In F2P I think it's more a case of the game's trying to play the player's. -laserit
video game company layoffs are twice the national average.

  User Deleted
1/11/13 12:24:20 PM#35

I think it depends on the setting and the lore.  Sometimes you have games that try and fill out of check list of races without any real reason (fantasy games with elves and dwarves and usually one "ugly" race are bad with this).  

  Reklaw

Elite Member

Joined: 1/07/06
Posts: 6150

The adult I am takes care of most things real life. However my inner-child is a GAMER!!

1/11/13 1:33:23 PM#36
Originally posted by Lovely_Laly

Seems it great fashion for latest game design to less and less races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.

What you ask for is what we already have with FPS multiplayer games. In a RPG the more the better, so logical that a MMORPG should actually deliver allot of different races in their games. Unfortunaly as highlighted red, it's actually less races and more of the same with most of today's MMO's.

  kadepsyson

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/15/06
Posts: 1966

The doctors say his chances are 50/50...but there's only a 10% chance of that.

1/11/13 2:56:34 PM#37
Originally posted by Phry
Originally posted by kadepsyson
Originally posted by Lovely_Laly

Seems it great fashion for latest game design to bring several races, more or less pretty or ugly.

To be honest, I would prefer to have better designed factions for PvP or correct class balance.

Even more classes will bring more fun then 5-6 races.

Not sure what you guys thinking about, but I don't even know how to get hypo about small shhhh like gnome, dwarf etc to be your avatar. =XD

May be we should have only 2 races: pretty and ugly? or even just one?

I don't talk about NPC, I don't care what race they are.

No we don't need races.  There is an MMO after all where you aren't a race, you are a machine - Perpetuum.

different machines can be considered to be different races though, so that particular statement is misleading

I can change races then I guess?

El Psy Congroo

  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

1/11/13 3:04:46 PM#38
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

It's hard to play a game where you aren't actually playing a person, machine, animal, mineral, vegetable.  The race is just the visual representation of you.

So Yes you really need races.  I think it would be impossible to play a game in this setting without something representing you.

Other games could do it, chess, checkers.... but not this genre.

Can anyone give examples of an MMORPG/FPS... where they are not represented by something?

Arent you mixing character customization, race and avatar in general?

Runescape has just humans, tf2 too :)

Flame on!

:)

  Banaghran

Novice Member

Joined: 1/17/12
Posts: 872

1/11/13 3:07:54 PM#39
Originally posted by Saerain

Visually, races are a great way to vary player characters when you don't have very robust customization at the creation stage.

Mechanically, they're a nice additional layer of branching.

But most importantly, I think, they tend to be intrinsic to the setting. Usually.

This, in a nutshell.

Flame on!

:)

  kadepsyson

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/15/06
Posts: 1966

The doctors say his chances are 50/50...but there's only a 10% chance of that.

1/11/13 3:10:16 PM#40
Originally posted by Banaghran
Originally posted by VengeSunsoar

It's hard to play a game where you aren't actually playing a person, machine, animal, mineral, vegetable.  The race is just the visual representation of you.

So Yes you really need races.  I think it would be impossible to play a game in this setting without something representing you.

Other games could do it, chess, checkers.... but not this genre.

Can anyone give examples of an MMORPG/FPS... where they are not represented by something?

Arent you mixing character customization, race and avatar in general?

Runescape has just humans, tf2 too :)

Flame on!

:)

Not sure why you are encouraging flaming on a forum that has rules against it.

 

In any event, I would say there is no need for races, plural, but having something representing your player in the game world seems smart.

I would also say that in a fantasy world having a human with one color skin, and another human with a different color of skin should be considered the same race.  A human with one color of skin and a humanoid feline with the same color of fur as the humans skin would be two different races.

 

Perhaps species would be a better term?  Different factions of the same race is a different matter of course.

El Psy Congroo

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