Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Originally posted by asmkm22

Originally posted by Quizzical
Regardless of whether this or any other project is blessed by Valve or not, I think there could be a market for $400 pre-built rigs with specs chosen to be sensible for a severe budget gaming system.  (A10 APU with 1866 MHz DDR3 in properly matched channels.)  But not if it's $1100 for a severe budget gaming system, as that misses the "severe budget" part.

Maybe, but it seems like a bad year to think about releasing something like this with Xbox and Playstations getting updating this year most likely.  I'd hate to invest in a Steambox device for the same price that I can get a next gen console that servers almost the same purpose (aside from the traveling thing someone mentioned).

The problem is if Xbox and PS3 do see new systems this year, what are they going to offer? Sony just filed a patent on software that will remove the ability to play second hand games. Microsoft had similar information leak. Both have purchased streaming game companies (Well sony has, Microsoft has been looking into streaming companies. I don't know if Microsoft has actually purchased one yet, they could even be working on the service on their own). 

 

Other leaked information and materials along side the rumor mill don't paint a pretty picture for what the next gen Xbox and PS are going to have in store for us. There are some nice additions in the information, but theres a lot of bad in there. 

 

Now what steam has going for it. Steam is known as a cheap source for games. The recent sales followed by the announcment of steam enabled devices is going to do good things for them. Sure... you can likely get a new gen PS or Xbox for around a grand that offers similar or slightly better performance and specs and then spend 60-70+ a game or you can spend a grand on a "steam box" device that does a lot more, has free online service, has cheaper games (Some times much cheaper. Look at the recent sale bundles lol, $100 for 6-10 good games isn't bad. On the go Steam gaming, locally delivered Steam gaming, so many ways to play Steam games which are mostly the games people want to play. 

 

Me personally, I think its the other way around in the end. Microsoft and Sony would not be wise to launch a console this year. Numerous gaming devices are launching this year on top of streaming services, hardware, and software. Without a solid lineup of games from the word go and competetive pricing it could prove to be a very bad move for either to launch. 

 

The industry has stagnated as a result of the consoles not being replaced.  Both next gen consols are actually expected by the end of this year, with some recent reports that xbox 720 might be as early as this summer.

As for the patent that sony applied for regarding locking down used and rented games, there isn't a lot of expectation that it is actually getting implemented, at least not in this next generation.  It's either a defensive patent, or something for the future.  Most analysts know that it would be a bad move on Sony's end to do that, because it would then just become a selling point for Microsoft to advertise on, about how the Xbox isn't restricted.  Not saying it won't happen, just that if it does, it's only going to hurt Sony to do it now.

Lastly, steam games are certainly very affordable, and it's about the only real selling point I can see for a steambox device.  it still doesn't seem like a great sell right now for the reasons I've already mentioned.  Older titles on older hardware only attract certain types of customers; the same types that bought a Ps2 long after the Ps3 had been out for example.  Everyone else is going to be looking at their 300 to 400 dollars and comparing a steambox with a cheap library of decent games that play on lower settings, or a next gen console that will be fairly cutting edge for at least a few years.

Now, it's very possible that right now, the whole steambox thing really is in the prototype phase, and Valve just needs a few smaller OEMs like Xi3 to be able rough out some basic hardware, enough for Valve to start doing some internal testing to determine what kind of specifications they want.  By the time an actual product gets released, it could very well be a few years down the road, and by then the steambox may very well be on better footing.

Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Originally posted by asmkm22

Originally posted by moosecatlol

Not the steambox, a failed kick starter project that is being picked up by valve.

Threads like these deserve to be deleted.

The problem is that people are using the term steambox to reference a specific device, when it's really more of a category of devices, like "windows box" or "linux box."

The thread is fine.

Samsung Galaxy S4 announced!  IT"S THE GOD DAMN STEAM BOX!!!!  check it out, the thing can run the steam mobile app, therefor this must be the steambox.  I know, you may think of it as a smartphone, but it is actually the steambox.

 

Actually when I think of "Steam Box" I am looking for information on Valve's hardware device that they have not yet announced.

Thats what he said. People are looking for a Valve made Steam Box. The problem is there isn't one and there isn't one going to be announced. Valve isn't developing any hardware. They have partnered up with different hardware developers and manafacturers to do it for them. The "Steam Box" is actually referencing these devices, it's just that some don't understand that.

Or maybe they are going to make one, and they haven't announced it officially yet as per this quick blurb from Ben Krasnow: "For example, it's true that we are working on getting Steam into the living room, and are planning for a hardware box, but we have no current plans to announce anything in 2013," Krasnow said"

But yeah keep calling any device that does something related to Steam the "Steam Box" when in fact the actual device by Valve may be forthcoming, whatever you wanna do.

It reminds me of how my mom used to call my Xbox a "Nintendo" bless her heart.

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Also, yes you can build a more powerful desktop to crush this tiny Piston.  But if you don't feel like moving your computer from your desk over to your TV, or don't feel like moving your desktop when you travel across the country, this could be an excellent choice.

I'd love a device that's incredibly easy to transport and lets me play my steam library of games where I travel to personally.

Build a mini itx then?  Mine has a 7970 and an i5 3570k and I can lug it around fairly easilly.  The only problem with lugging it around is when I need to drag my monitor with me.  Oh how I constantly regret getting a big one -.-

Edit :

On another note, depending on how these things are priced, they may end up being incredibly silly to buy compared to just building a tiny mini itx which supports only shorter video cards.

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Originally posted by Castillle

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Originally posted by kadepsyson Also, yes you can build a more powerful desktop to crush this tiny Piston.  But if you don't feel like moving your computer from your desk over to your TV, or don't feel like moving your desktop when you travel across the country, this could be an excellent choice. I'd love a device that's incredibly easy to transport and lets me play my steam library of games where I travel to personally.

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Build a mini itx then?  Mine has a 7970 and an i5 3570k and I can lug it around fairly easilly.  The only problem with lugging it around is when I need to drag my monitor with me.  Oh how I constantly regret getting a big one -.-

Edit :

On another note, depending on how these things are priced, they may end up being incredibly silly to buy compared to just building a tiny mini itx which supports only shorter video cards.

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Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by Castillle

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Originally posted by kadepsyson Also, yes you can build a more powerful desktop to crush this tiny Piston.  But if you don't feel like moving your computer from your desk over to your TV, or don't feel like moving your desktop when you travel across the country, this could be an excellent choice. I'd love a device that's incredibly easy to transport and lets me play my steam library of games where I travel to personally.

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Build a mini itx then?  Mine has a 7970 and an i5 3570k and I can lug it around fairly easilly.  The only problem with lugging it around is when I need to drag my monitor with me.  Oh how I constantly regret getting a big one -.-

 

Edit :

On another note, depending on how these things are priced, they may end up being incredibly silly to buy compared to just building a tiny mini itx which supports only shorter video cards.

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Is it possible to build a PC with integrated graphics chips, or would that just be one of those little Android PC sticks?

 

Castillle basically already said this, but here:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113280

If the integrated graphics in that were a discrete card, you'd expect to pay about $60 for it in order for it to be a decent value for the money.

The only things stopping integrated graphics from outperforming $200 discrete cards are that a large processor plus a large GPU is an enormous die--which means expensive and poor yields--and they can't get nearly enough memory bandwidth to feed a higher end GPU in a processor form factor.  The first problem will greatly lessen with subsequent die shrinks (and yes, compared to $200 discrete cards of the future, too), and they're working on the second.  Apparently Intel is working on a silicon interposer to have some video memory inside of the CPU package, but that's still expensive.

Originally posted by Castillle

Originally posted by kadepsyson

Also, yes you can build a more powerful desktop to crush this tiny Piston.  But if you don't feel like moving your computer from your desk over to your TV, or don't feel like moving your desktop when you travel across the country, this could be an excellent choice.

I'd love a device that's incredibly easy to transport and lets me play my steam library of games where I travel to personally.

Build a mini itx then?  Mine has a 7970 and an i5 3570k and I can lug it around fairly easilly.  The only problem with lugging it around is when I need to drag my monitor with me.  Oh how I constantly regret getting a big one -.-

Edit :

On another note, depending on how these things are priced, they may end up being incredibly silly to buy compared to just building a tiny mini itx which supports only shorter video cards.

Sure, you could go a bit bigger in size, and build your own.

I think this is more marketed for people who want to grab it at the store, and just use it wherever they may be though.  No need to build or select parts or what have you, just take it with you and plug in.

It's there to give people access to their steam games in an incredibly easy and portable yet capable platform.

I can probably fit it inside the case that I use when I travel with my Xbox 360.  Swap between Xbox games in Airport terminals and my Steam Library.

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Originally posted by Quizzical

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Originally posted by lizardbones  

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Originally posted by Castillle

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Originally posted by kadepsyson Also, yes you can build a more powerful desktop to crush this tiny Piston.  But if you don't feel like moving your computer from your desk over to your TV, or don't feel like moving your desktop when you travel across the country, this could be an excellent choice. I'd love a device that's incredibly easy to transport and lets me play my steam library of games where I travel to personally.

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Build a mini itx then?  Mine has a 7970 and an i5 3570k and I can lug it around fairly easilly.  The only problem with lugging it around is when I need to drag my monitor with me.  Oh how I constantly regret getting a big one -.-   Edit : On another note, depending on how these things are priced, they may end up being incredibly silly to buy compared to just building a tiny mini itx which supports only shorter video cards.

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Is it possible to build a PC with integrated graphics chips, or would that just be one of those little Android PC sticks?  

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Castillle basically already said this, but here:

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113280

If the integrated graphics in that were a discrete card, you'd expect to pay about $60 for it in order for it to be a decent value for the money.

The only things stopping integrated graphics from outperforming $200 discrete cards are that a large processor plus a large GPU is an enormous die--which means expensive and poor yields--and they can't get nearly enough memory bandwidth to feed a higher end GPU in a processor form factor.  The first problem will greatly lessen with subsequent die shrinks (and yes, compared to $200 discrete cards of the future, too), and they're working on the second.  Apparently Intel is working on a silicon interposer to have some video memory inside of the CPU package, but that's still expensive.

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Except the X5A, which is worse than the X7A high end gaming one with the processor similar to the AMD A-10, costs roughly $800.

Specs for the X5A

General Specs:
– eSATA 3.0, 2.5 and 1.5 support
– USB 2.0 support
– PMC Optical Interface
– Internal Storage: 16GB mSATA SSD (up to 128GB)
– SSD Quick Boot Linux

External Connectors:
– 2 – eSATA 2.5 Ports
– 6 – USB 2.0 Ports (root hubs)
– 3 – Reconfigurable Audio channels
– (1-3, Microphone, Headphone and/or
Line-in/Line-out)

Internal Connectors:
– 1 – USB 2.0 Connector
– 1 – Fan Connector

Secondary I/O Module

General Specs:
– DirectX Support: DX11
– Open GL: v2.0
– Video Decode: UVD 2.0 – VC-1, MPEG2, MPEG4
– HDCP: v1.3b (up to 1080p)
– Side-Port Memory: 128MB (DDR2-800)
– DP/DVI: 1080p, with Digital Audio (HDMI optional)
– Max Resolution: 2560x1600 @ 32bpp (dual output capable)
– Dual Display Standard: DVI-DL + VGA, DVI-DL + DP, VGA + DP (HDMI converter optional)

External Connectors:
– 1 – Ethernet connector (10/100/1000)
– 1 – Display port (DP/DVI, HDMI optional)
– 1 – Display port (DVI-DL + VGA, DVI-DL + DP, VGA + DP)
– 1 – Power connector (19volts DC @ 3.42amps)

Unless they completely slash the price of those, I dont expect the X7A to cost any less than 1000-1200.

Originally posted by lizardbones


It would be reasonable to assume that the company that Valve has doing this can build each unit for less than we could buy the packages for on New Egg. A complete package using that chip runs $428 right now. Man, if they can sell these things, they are going to make a killing on the hardware alone.

Is it that the people making these new things that expect people will pay a lot of money for them, or is it that people see things that are relatively new and are willing to pay a lot of money for them?

 

I'm not sure it is Valve having anyone do this.  I think it is a seperate company building their own product while designing it to work with Steam with Valve's approval.

Valve will have their own hardware soon enough, so why are they having another company create their own competition?

Valve doesnt have anything to do with them aside from Valve investing in them most likely order to get more research done for the steambox. These Xi3 hardware are strictly PCs and dont have the same advantage of consoles where everyone has the same set up for an extended amount of time.  Theyre just making it smaller and easier to switch around parts.  Theres sposedly a way to link several of them together according to their old kickstarter page but Im not sure how that works yet especially since they dont have their own OS and you have to use standard x86/64 operating systems.

Im guessing Valve is the majority shareholder for Xi3 after their investment.
 

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Originally posted by Castillle
Valve doesnt have anything to do with them aside from Valve investing in them most likely order to get more research done for the steambox. These Xi3 hardware are strictly PCs and dont have the same advantage of consoles where everyone has the same set up for an extended amount of time.  Theyre just making it smaller and easier to switch around parts.  Theres sposedly a way to link several of them together according to their old kickstarter page but Im not sure how that works yet especially since they dont have their own OS and you have to use standard x86/64 operating systems.

 

Im guessing Valve is the majority shareholder for Xi3 after their investment. 

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Quite the oppisite.  This whole Xi3 thing will cause them to lose money or at best, have it stay stagnant.  What they get out of it is the ability for them to get into researching the best way to do steambox through Xi3.  The time they get the money back is when Valves steambox finally gets released or even further. 

Remember that without Valve stamp, Xi3 wasnt even able to successfully kickstart. Also, I posted the price for the X5A model and the specs in my previous post. 

Edit : Price point is high because they most likely werent earning anything during the R&D phase.  And as you may know, engineers are pretty expensive. This applies to NVIDIA shield, Project Fiona, etc.

Originally posted by Castillle

Quite the oppisite.  This whole Xi3 thing will cause them to lose money or at best, have it stay stagnant.  What they get out of it is the ability for them to get into researching the best way to do steambox through Xi3.  The time they get the money back is when Valves steambox finally gets released or even further. 

 

Remember that without Valve stamp, Xi3 wasnt even able to successfully kickstart. Also, I posted the price for the X5A model and the specs in my previous post. 

Edit : Price point is high because they most likely werent earning anything during the R&D phase.  And as you may know, engineers are pretty expensive. This applies to NVIDIA shield, Project Fiona, etc.

 

That's why you pay them in shares. 

honestly though, what's the point of this, just to own a cute computer?  Hey apple can do it, why not us!?  *boggle*.  A new PC OS that prevents piracy with steam at the heart of it that requires an always on connection would go a lot further.  Build hardware around it if you want, but don't underpower and overprice it. 

Originally posted by Quizzical
What's the internal hardware?  Trinity?  Richland?  Kabini?  The claimed 384 shaders in integrated graphics fits Trinity A10 chips, but there isn't a 3.2 GHz Trinity A10 quad core.  It could conceivably also be Richland, which might well also have a 384-shader part.  Or maybe they got AMD to make a custom bin, which AMD will do for customers that want to buy a zillion chips.

current models use trinity. steambox might end up with richland. 

the A7X is using a A10-5800 undeclocked, AKA the A10-4600M.

I actually had a similar idea years ago.  The problem is console hardware is mostly fixed for the life of the unit, except maybe memory.  So I thought maybe if they made it with a modular design.  Another words, at a certain point, you might want to upgrade your console's graphics.  Instead of being stuck with on board, I thought wouldn't it be cool if it was just a cartridge that any one with no tech experience what so ever could slide the old one out and new one in, without ever having to open the console up.  Same with cpu and maybe memory.

It's not exactly the same thing. 

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Originally posted by Castillle
Quite the oppisite.  This whole Xi3 thing will cause them to lose money or at best, have it stay stagnant.  What they get out of it is the ability for them to get into researching the best way to do steambox through Xi3.  The time they get the money back is when Valves steambox finally gets released or even further. 

 

Remember that without Valve stamp, Xi3 wasnt even able to successfully kickstart. Also, I posted the price for the X5A model and the specs in my previous post. 

Edit : Price point is high because they most likely werent earning anything during the R&D phase.  And as you may know, engineers are pretty expensive. This applies to NVIDIA shield, Project Fiona, etc.

 

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Originally posted by Castillle
– DirectX Support: DX11
– Open GL: v2.0

Wait, what?  If it's any recent AMD graphics, it's at least OpenGL 4.2, and possibly 4.3 by now.

@Quiz - I didnt check those specs I just copy pasta'd their page for the X5 lol.

"Conversely, we believe our X3A Modular Computer will be the ideal entry-level machine. Powered by a Dual-Core 64-bit, x86-based 1.65GHz chip and 4GB of DDR3 RAM, the X3A Modular Computer is designed for most home and office applications. The X3A Modular Computer will come standard with 32GB of solid-state storage (upgradeable to 1TB), can support two high-definition displays simultaneously, and will have two USB 3.0/2.0 ports, four eSATAp ports, four USB 2.0 ports, and a 10/100/1000 Ethernet port.

Housed in a cube-like chassis roughly the size of a grapefruit (4.27x3.56x3.656-inches) and needing an energy-friendly 18 Watts of power to run, Xi3’s X3A Modular Computer is slated to begin shipping in early 2013 at prices starting at under $500."

However its been rebranded int othe X5A with a slightly better processor (or higher bin) rated at 1.8GHz now.  It seems woefully expensive though if you wanted a better SSD.

Searching Xi3 in google will give you the prices theyre selling for but with the Xi3 main website down, its hard to see their own prices.  One website shows it as an Athlon Dual Core for the X5A which mimics how the rest of the stores say its a dual core AMD chip

@Lizard - Without Valve promoting them, they failed to kickstart.  I doubt Valves name would add THAT much to their sales.

Edit : I feel like im getting sick -.- 

Since price points always talks about the minimum specs....

Here are the X7A models.

Expect the bottom bin processor board to cost about $700 and expect it to have 32GB storage.  Bottom bin processor would be this underclocked to 3.0ghz