Originally posted by caetftl

Originally posted by FlawSGI

Originally posted by caetftl

Xfire mattered when it painted a pro-gw2 picture, now that it paints a bad one it is no longer allowed.

Not true. Xfire data is a tool and many scoff at the notion of using it no matter what picture it paints. I can agree it is useful for something, just not determining populations or painting pictures as you say. I can't recall any pro Xfire discussions anyways because the only time the tool is brought up is when someone wants to show that there is a decline in Xfire population.

 

GW2 is basically a perfect example of why the quality of games has gone down hill... because the consumers of present are much more casual and easy to lead around.

We once again disagree. The quality of MMO's has been pretty bad for years. While I am looking for a deeper and more meaningful MMO experience, there hasn't been one produced. I don't lay that at the feet of Anet because IMO they have produced a great gaming experience. I also don't claim that because something is casual friendly that it lacks in quality, that is a matter of taste and the two should not be confused.

 

It is a b2p game, and anet already got people to buy 2million + copies based on hype, sure they could have made a good game that retained most of its players and had them investing in the cash shop here and there, but that would have taken longer to develope and woulda had higher production costs, what they did was release a quick fix moneymaker that was the casual and easy themepark that all the people who don't want to think while playing a game would love. 

 I didn't buy on hype, I bought on information and choice but I get your dig. Most of this portion of your rant is filled with animosity so I won't get into it other than to say you have your opinion but I think you are speaking out of your ass. I agree it's b2p though so cudos for getting that right. If all they cared about was the initial box sales then there would not be many patches and holiday events and such to keep a playerbase around. 

If you want better mmos, you have to become better consumers... that includes not convincing yourself a game will be godly no matter how many flaws it has, as many of you have done.

I'd say some have done but not many seeing as how many of us who supprt Anet can see the glaring flaws of the game. The only thing is some peoples ideas of flaws are not universal. The game is not perfect but it delivers on what they said and what I expected. It's the people that have the unrealistic expectations who wound up being let down. 

Regarding OP. You aren't going to get a straight answer because nobody knows for sure since there has been no release of the actual server population levels that I know of. All we can tell you is what we experience and I can say that anytime I log in there are people doing stuff. Now that the holidays are over maybe the ques and overflow servers will become a non issue. I know I get thrown into overflows and that doesn't happen unless people are in the game. Some may have come back just to try the holiday content and will leave again, I don't know. Then again maybe the game got a flock of new players with their advertisement on the Hobbit movie paired with christmas. Either way, I see people and I do stuff with them when I level so if that is your biggest concern then that's all I got. Now needing those people to play the game is another discussion all together. Hope this helps.

What you think are glaring flaws, as opposed to what someone objective thinks are glaring flaws are night and day. I never mentioned what I felt were glaring flaws actually so hard to know if they are night and day. And to say I don't think objectively from the little I wrote in response to you is a little assuming. Just look how skewed your perspective is on the points you "disagree" with... all of a sudden the fanbois always hated xfire, which is a joke, because most of you praised it, when gw2 was showing good numbers...  Once again, i never really saw anyone praising Xfire data only to turn around and change their opinions due to the tools population data. Read my first response to you. Trying to dive into deeper concepts doesn't change what I actually said. You, on the other hand, are just using this argument to attack it's fanbase.

 

Your behavior, your capacity for processing reality, are all indications that what I say is true... until people become smarter consumers, we will have inferior products shoved down our throat.  Now you can say gw2 was godly, and sold lots of copies (not really that many relative to most big games) but the reality of it is no other big mmorpg release turned off the hardcore and skilled players quicker than gw2... it got boring after 3 days for most of the competent players, not even swtor honeymoon phase was that short.  Nice personal attack and overgeneralization. 

It gets tired when people defend gw2, and they were the same people that weren't actually good at all the other games, yet the people that were good talk about how boring and skilless it is.  That should tell you the type of people gw2 caters to.  If you think you should be a credible source on how good of an mmorpg gw2 was, show people you were actually good enough at the other ones to have a deep understanding of what makes a good game.  Cause if you were one of those people that could only endure wow for 20 levels, you couldn't have endured any good mmo to max, which is when the meat of mmorpgs begin.  In GW2 there is no meat, at any point, the game is always shallow and flimsy.  Another hate filled rant that has little to do with the OP BTW. You sure make a lot of assumptions about me from the very little I responded to and many of your conclusions seem derived from stuff that was never spoken of. I didn't really defend GW2, only played devils advocate to most of what you stated which was also derailing and opinionated as all hell. I also never said anything about being good or bad at any game.  My opinions didn't mirror your own so sorry if that upset you enough to go off on a second derailing rant that had almost nothing to do with my responses. I am sure there is a point hidden in there, but you appear to make your arguments and forget what the argument was actually about. I almost feel like you must be having a discussion with someone else.

Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

Originally posted by asmkm22

Originally posted by Ginaz
I logged in for about 10 mins the other day out of boredom for anything else to do and most of the servers (NA) were listed as either full or heavy.  Still seems like a lot of people are playing.  I wonder, though, how many would play if there was a sub fee attached.  I doubt the servers would be as busy as they are.

I couldn't care less about what the populations are listed as.  I only care about what's happening in game, and what I've been seeing a lot of lately is people standing around cities doing very little.  PvP is active enough, but it's kind of stale, and very much still a zergfest, so not all that interesting.

At least in WoW, when I'd be standing around in a city, I was actually waiting for something interesting to pop, like a dungeon or raid.  With GW2, it feels like I'm literally just killing time until I decide to log out, or work up enough boredom to queue into a fight.  I'm definitely not interested in any of the crappy group PvE content, which is a complete mess.

What exactly should people be doing in a city?

There is a world out there to do stuff in game.

I know it can be an alien concept.

After all I probably see and definitely play with more people in a single GW2 day than the 6 months my GF and I strolled the world of WoW, also known as the great empty since everyone is queueing for instances in a town.

 

It's not about what they *should* be doing in the city; it's about the fact that they are in the city at all.  With WoW, players pop in and out of cities while waiting on queues, which are pretty short, meaning that any one person isn't in the city for a long time.  Not unless they truly are there to just chat or RP or something.

With GW2, it seems people are in the cities because there's nothing else to do.  queues are nearly instant, so it's not like they're waiting on those.  If the wide open world truly has so much to do, I'd see more people out in it while leveling characters, which  I don't see these days.

But sure, you can go wander around and see the sites again.  Watch the same "dynamic event" play out for the 100th time, or masterfully complete a jumping puzzle again for some random loot.  This is all assuming you've filled all the hearts on the map though.  I suppose if you still haven't done that (which is incredibly easy and a bit boring) then yes, there is a wide open world for you to explore for a couple of hours.  That's hardly a compelling end-game scenario though.

Originally posted by asmkm22

It's not about what they *should* be doing in the city; it's about the fact that they are in the city at all.  With WoW, players pop in and out of cities while waiting on queues, which are pretty short, meaning that any one person isn't in the city for a long time.  Not unless they truly are there to just chat or RP or something.

With GW2, it seems people are in the cities because there's nothing else to do.  queues are nearly instant, so it's not like they're waiting on those.  If the wide open world truly has so much to do, I'd see more people out in it while leveling characters, which  I don't see these days.

But sure, you can go wander around and see the sites again.  Watch the same "dynamic event" play out for the 100th time, or masterfully complete a jumping puzzle again for some random loot.  This is all assuming you've filled all the hearts on the map though.  I suppose if you still haven't done that (which is incredibly easy and a bit boring) then yes, there is a wide open world for you to explore for a couple of hours.  That's hardly a compelling end-game scenario though.

People are in Lion's Arch looking for groups, crafting (Mystic Forge is Lion's Arch only), several NPCs traders only exist in LA like the dungeon rewards or Lionguard Lyn, displaying gear, in transit to other parts of the world (jumping to the heart of mists -> lion's arch is free after all), collecting stuff from the TP, sorting their loot in th bank.

What queues? WvW queues?

Why are you assuming the majority of people playing in GW2 are in cities?

LA is only a fraction the players playing - still it is normal that the central HUB will always have people.

GW2 after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

WoW after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

Yeah, a world of difference.

On my current EU Server [Heavy] Elona Reach it's like that:

Lions Ar...ch got an Overflow between 17:00 and 0:00 ~
Jormags Claw almost lag free :)

Orr is empty
You see average between 10-30 other people in 2 hours playtime in a mid level zone (lvl40+)
Beginner Zones are aside from Event "Zone boss" farmers empty. (less than 10 people in an hour you probably cross)

But i don't feel lonely, thanks to all the Rangers and their bears running in trains next to me :)

Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

 

/snip

Why are you assuming the majority of people playing in GW2 are in cities?

LA is only a fraction the players playing - still it is normal that the central HUB will always have people.

GW2 after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

WoW after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

Yeah, a world of difference.

 

 

Look, even ANet admitted the wasteland in the 20-70 zones is an issue; 'we have to figure something out'.

So if players are not in cities, where are they?

GW2 actually makes it harder to go out into the world at level cap while WoW makes it easier since WoW doesn't level you down. Having a challenge all the time is a game design choice that doesn't appeal to everyone and it isn't surprizing that 20-70 zones are dead.

I have a full exotic geared level 80 elemental. I really hate going anywhere in Orr cause of the amount of mobs and now that there are less players in Orr (most are in FoTM), it is even worse. So I won't go to Orr, count another player that isn't in the world and in cities / WvW.

I had my doubts about this whole level scaling in GW2 and well, guess ANet 'has to figure something out'. LOL

Originally posted by jpnz

Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

 

/snip

Why are you assuming the majority of people playing in GW2 are in cities?

LA is only a fraction the players playing - still it is normal that the central HUB will always have people.

GW2 after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

WoW after level cap- Alts, PvP, collect stuff, get gear, get titles.

Yeah, a world of difference.

 

 

Look, even ANet admitted the wasteland in the 20-70 zones is an issue; 'we have to figure something out'.

So if players are not in cities, where are they?

GW2 actually makes it harder to go out into the world at level cap while WoW makes it easier since WoW doesn't level you down. Having a challenge all the time is a game design choice that doesn't appeal to everyone and it isn't surprizing that 20-70 zones are dead.

I have a full exotic geared level 80 elemental. I really hate going anywhere in Orr cause of the amount of mobs and now that there are less players in Orr (most are in FoTM), it is even worse. So I won't go to Orr, count another player that isn't in the world and in cities / WvW.

I had my doubts about this whole level scaling in GW2 and well, guess ANet 'has to figure something out'. LOL

So you don't know where the players are.

The you know the players are in FOTM.

While it is easy (and boring) when you can kill all the mobs with a sneeze in WoW you get nothing - no challenge and no rewards.

So everyone queueing in town.

Yes, (some) Orr events aren't easy without a zerg and now there are areas with higher rewards.

Of course Orr was also designed for groups but challenge is something MMORPG players don't like very much.

Still, I'm currently around Orr and I see players everywhere although not the massive zergs.