Wow normal Bc dungeons was quite challenging, it was when dungeon finder arrived it turned into easy mode. And it wasnt becouse of dungeon finder, i think that tool is quite good but rather what they did to adjust to that system. They removed the need for CC to make the que shorter. Befor dungeon finder a CC was needed ( u might manage without but pug would't), but to shorten the que they decided to ignore cc and add more aoe clearance, this is where wow died for me.

Another item helpd to destroy wow is talisman items, the level bonus dont hurt the game at all. But the power you get from items make you quite insane if you put an non talisman and someone with talisman beside each other. I can see why they did this and it makes alt better to level and tbh a little fair to give em an bonus. But it ruins dungeon runs as they are to powerfull.

At end game i think wow atleast when i tried it last is one of the harder mmorpg out there. Its just a wierd curve from easy mode leveling and hard as hell endgame.

Originally posted by XxGrimmxX
So the reality of it is, not everyone is in a great guild that can down content pretty regularly.

This does not adress game difficulty. naturally below-average players will find average difficulty to be very challenging.

Originally posted by ezpz77
These people who call WoW easy mode are probably the same people that die standing in fire 30 seconds into a Looking For Raid group, and have never set foot into a hardmode raid or high rating arena.

Pretty much this. People babble about "easy mode" without ever having done any of the diffcult content -- or, around here, likely even played the game at all -- so it's pretty hard to take them seriously. Come back when you have a few hard mode world firsts or have won a tournament or three. Given all the big talk around here that shouldn't be any trouble... Right?

Right?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

Originally posted by Latronus
ROFLMAO.  WoW has ALWAYS been easy mode compared to what came before it.  The games these days usually make it very easy to level a toon to max level after the game has been out a while so people can raid on alts faster.

That is wrong, if you actualy playd eq1 you would know you could throw numbers at it instead of skills. if you playd other games instead of eq1 and l2 i guess your right as those 2 was the ones oldtimers i playd. They both sufferd from throwing numbers at boss as it was no 20-30-40-100 limit in those game.

Those games was tuned for high numbers, they was not tuned for 10/20 people only

Originally posted by Myria

Originally posted by ezpz77
These people who call WoW easy mode are probably the same people that die standing in fire 30 seconds into a Looking For Raid group, and have never set foot into a hardmode raid or high rating arena.

Pretty much this. People babble about "easy mode" without ever having done any of the diffcult content -- or, around here, likely even played the game at all -- so it's pretty hard to take them seriously. Come back when you have a few hard mode world firsts or have won a tournament or three. Given all the big talk around here that shouldn't be any trouble... Right?

Right?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

http://www.wowprogress.com/item/34389_Spaulders+of+the+Thalassian+Defender/rating/us/greymane

does it count ?

Originally posted by Robokapp

Originally posted by Myria

Originally posted by ezpz77
These people who call WoW easy mode are probably the same people that die standing in fire 30 seconds into a Looking For Raid group, and have never set foot into a hardmode raid or high rating arena.

Pretty much this. People babble about "easy mode" without ever having done any of the diffcult content -- or, around here, likely even played the game at all -- so it's pretty hard to take them seriously. Come back when you have a few hard mode world firsts or have won a tournament or three. Given all the big talk around here that shouldn't be any trouble... Right?

Right?

Yeah, that's what I thought.

http://www.wowprogress.com/item/34389_Spaulders+of+the+Thalassian+Defender/rating/us/greymane

 

does it count ?

That link doesn't work for me. Either way, no raider who has participated in hardmode progression raiding will say it's easy mode.

i always find threads like this funny because calling something easy mode is completely biased to who you are asking. WOW still has raids that are not only far superior to EQ2 and Rift but harder as well if you are the right level for them. Downing bosses in both firelands and old black wing decent was not easy mode when it first released. But do you really want to spend months working on content that only 2 or 3% of your playerbase will ever see and complete?

Games are not ment to be so hard that they frustrate people in the first place , they are ment to be fun and create excitement. While wow is not some hardcore game at heart it still presents challenges to average gamers who do not spend 40+ hours a week trying to do raids. Ive run into TONS of players in regular heroics that couldnt even do simple step mechanics on boss fights , so obviously its hard to most of them.

Dunno, I only played into WOTLK, but the one thing I noticed when starting over into the end of the TBC expansion and into WOTLK, was that they removed a large portion of the elite quests from the old vanilla version. Not sure how they stand on that with the new world since cataclysm.

As far as I could compare the new Naxxramas from WOTLK to the old one, it was much easier. That's as far as I can compare though: vanilla to WOTLK. I did hear that they buffed raid difficulty in Cataclysm.

for the hardcore raiders (heroic raids) WoW is still difficult, but people severely underestimate the 8 years of practice WoW players and guilds have.  Heroic Ragnaros (firelands) was at worst on par with Akylios (Rift) in difficulty, probably harder.  But Rift is still new so it *seemed* harder.

Outside of heroic raids though (and ranked PvP), WoW is easy.  Even the Cata heroics that were considered hard were fairly easy if the group worked together(cc, marked mobs, etc).

EQ's difficulty was largely due to the massive coordinaton involved, but they were able to release all the content at once (instead of staggering it) and still have 99% of guilds not finish the content before the next expansion.  However EQ's group content was significantly more difficult than other games.

EQ2 for a while had probably the most difficult raiding out there.