Originally posted by NBlitz
Got to love that edit button. Else everyone would see how two-faced certain people are 

two-faced?

Originally posted by Lawlmonster

Originally posted by BadSpock

Massively, who just voted GW2 game of the year, is not rosey-eyed fanbois chees'n on the current hotness-

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/12/19/where-guild-wars-2-goes-wrong/

Have some pretty interesting and intelligent arguments against the game that I tend to agree with.

Pretty much highlights the issues I have with the game almost perfectly.

 

Good for them. It'd be nice to see more of this kind of journalism around here in featured articles.

Indeed it would. Reviews here seem to come in two flavors: Don't have anything nice to say, don't really say anything at all -and- a rubber stamp of approval.

Originally posted by grimal

Wow.  Ok, first off, DPS stands for damage per second.  Combat in DnD was never based on real time.  There were turns or rounds, so how could it have been Damage Per Second?  It couldn't have been!

Did you NOT see where I said there was a NeverWinter Night Online MMORPG made back in 1991? Or that it was followed by Meridian 59? Or how about right after that I mentioned EQ being based off them.

D&D gold box games had SPELLS WITH LINGERING EFFECTS AND BLEEDS from melee attacks which would TICK each round of combat, This is where the idea of DAMAGE PER SECOND comes from...YEAH, Meridian 59 had real time combat and thus had DPS before EQ.

The very idea that you are now pretending EQ is not a D&D clone is crazy, the arugment has no meaning other than to argue.

Originally posted by BadSpock

To pique your interest - the highlights in bullet point form-

You spelled and used pique properly.  I'm going to cry from  the realization that I am not the only one here who bothers using their brain and spellchecker before posting.

Originally posted by Scarfe

Originally posted by KingJiggly
Okay, calm down yall before I close this thread down. 

haha, you just popped a forgetten thread back to the top, thats like a bouncer slapping you in the face when you've drunk too much. 

But GW2, not bad but insanely overrated. 

Shhhhhhh!

Originally posted by BadSpock

Massively, who just voted GW2 game of the year, is not rosey-eyed fanbois chees'n on the current hotness-

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/12/19/where-guild-wars-2-goes-wrong/

Have some pretty interesting and intelligent arguments against the game that I tend to agree with.

Pretty much highlights the issues I have with the game almost perfectly.

To pique your interest - the highlights in bullet point form-

-Roles are horribly underexplained and unclear

-Dynamic events don't work in their role as quest replacements

-Area flow is problematic

-Crafting is a freaking mess

-The story is weak

 

Better late than never.

I think the issue with classes runs deeper than just "bad explanation". Ignoring the Trinity is no easy task. So far, I haven't see a single MMO which really succeeded in this in any long term quality. Too much a jack of all trades mentality in the GW2 classes.

Other than that I agree to all they said.

Originally posted by Rayshe
I found there was very little to understand for GW2, the Synergies slapped you in the face for what you should go for. I'm not saying its bad, Im just saying its simpler than others. Some people want that others dont.

Well put. 

Having the Holy Trinity taken out of the game seemed like a blessing to my grp of guild friends, it was supposed to give us freedom to be whatever we wanted, not tied to any specific role.

However when we entered our first dungeon we suddenly found ourselves running around like headless chickens, here was a grp of 5 friends who had been together through many MMO's over a 10 yr span, who had defeated many dungeons in our time with an air of authority as we knew our classes and our roles inside out, here we where running in circles, hitting everything in sight, not having a clue what was coming next and dying every time we where the main focus of the mob.

Fortunately we don't take ourselves seriously, it was downright funny and bemusing to suddenly find that we just didn't have a clue how to play our classes, we where lost as to how we could overcome even the simplest of dungeon critters, in the end it was an element of pure luck and persistence that got us through to the end.

Did we want to enter the next dungeon, not on your life, it wasn't fun anymore, if you can't figure out your roles in the dungeon, if you can't manage the simplest of mobs inside without dying 3 or 4 times whats the whole point, it becomes a frustrated mess, and your relying on zerging or out dpsing the encounter to survive.

I know if the game introduced a Holy Trinity me and my friends would be back in the game in a heart beat, but as it stands there isn't a chance we will head back and act like headless chickens again.

Originally posted by AwDiddums

Having the Holy Trinity taken out of the game seemed like a blessing to my grp of guild friends, it was supposed to give us freedom to be whatever we wanted, not tied to any specific role.

However when we entered our first dungeon we suddenly found ourselves running around like headless chickens, here was a grp of 5 friends who had been together through many MMO's over a 10 yr span, who had defeated many dungeons in our time with an air of authority as we knew our classes and our roles inside out, here we where running in circles, hitting everything in sight, not having a clue what was coming next and dying every time we where the main focus of the mob.

Fortunately we don't take ourselves seriously, it was downright funny and bemusing to suddenly find that we just didn't have a clue how to play our classes, we where lost as to how we could overcome even the simplest of dungeon critters, in the end it was an element of pure luck and persistence that got us through to the end.

Did we want to enter the next dungeon, not on your life, it wasn't fun anymore, if you can't figure out your roles in the dungeon, if you can't manage the simplest of mobs inside without dying 3 or 4 times whats the whole point, it becomes a frustrated mess, and your relying on zerging or out dpsing the encounter to survive.

I know if the game introduced a Holy Trinity me and my friends would be back in the game in a heart beat, but as it stands there isn't a chance we will head back and act like headless chickens again.

 

 

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

Originally posted by Wraithone

Originally posted by AwDiddums

Having the Holy Trinity taken out of the game seemed like a blessing to my grp of guild friends, it was supposed to give us freedom to be whatever we wanted, not tied to any specific role.

However when we entered our first dungeon we suddenly found ourselves running around like headless chickens, here was a grp of 5 friends who had been together through many MMO's over a 10 yr span, who had defeated many dungeons in our time with an air of authority as we knew our classes and our roles inside out, here we where running in circles, hitting everything in sight, not having a clue what was coming next and dying every time we where the main focus of the mob.

Fortunately we don't take ourselves seriously, it was downright funny and bemusing to suddenly find that we just didn't have a clue how to play our classes, we where lost as to how we could overcome even the simplest of dungeon critters, in the end it was an element of pure luck and persistence that got us through to the end.

Did we want to enter the next dungeon, not on your life, it wasn't fun anymore, if you can't figure out your roles in the dungeon, if you can't manage the simplest of mobs inside without dying 3 or 4 times whats the whole point, it becomes a frustrated mess, and your relying on zerging or out dpsing the encounter to survive.

I know if the game introduced a Holy Trinity me and my friends would be back in the game in a heart beat, but as it stands there isn't a chance we will head back and act like headless chickens again.

 

 

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

I never wished for the trinity harder than after my 20th death, spawn, run, cycle in a GW2 dungeon.  GW2 tried to get rid of the trinity, the experiment failed, hopefully from now on developers will stick with the old adage 'if it ain't broke...' 

Originally posted by Wraithone

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

 What a load of bunk. There are many people finding GW2 dungeons the best they've seen in years as well, and tossing out the pigeon-holing trinity (and the incessant vertical progression)  tossed out with it most of the reasons dungeons became boring jobs instead of fun instances with a variety of things that could go wrong, or right. The only reason the trinity appeared to work for so long is that people were sucked along with the gear grind, and once someone created a video on the "right" way to do each dungeon thought was tossed out the window in lieu of a script.

When what the last time anyone, outside of GW2, went into a dungeon and actually had to figure out how to do it? Through all my years in WoW we always followed the script that Blizzard gave to the top guilds in beta, and that was it. Follow the script. Screw up and tank or healer dies, wipe and start over. DPS dies so you can't meet the enrage timer, wipe and start over. Blame the hunter.

Originally posted by Scarfe

Originally posted by Wraithone

Originally posted by AwDiddums

Having the Holy Trinity taken out of the game seemed like a blessing to my grp of guild friends, it was supposed to give us freedom to be whatever we wanted, not tied to any specific role.

However when we entered our first dungeon we suddenly found ourselves running around like headless chickens, here was a grp of 5 friends who had been together through many MMO's over a 10 yr span, who had defeated many dungeons in our time with an air of authority as we knew our classes and our roles inside out, here we where running in circles, hitting everything in sight, not having a clue what was coming next and dying every time we where the main focus of the mob.

Fortunately we don't take ourselves seriously, it was downright funny and bemusing to suddenly find that we just didn't have a clue how to play our classes, we where lost as to how we could overcome even the simplest of dungeon critters, in the end it was an element of pure luck and persistence that got us through to the end.

Did we want to enter the next dungeon, not on your life, it wasn't fun anymore, if you can't figure out your roles in the dungeon, if you can't manage the simplest of mobs inside without dying 3 or 4 times whats the whole point, it becomes a frustrated mess, and your relying on zerging or out dpsing the encounter to survive.

I know if the game introduced a Holy Trinity me and my friends would be back in the game in a heart beat, but as it stands there isn't a chance we will head back and act like headless chickens again.

 

 

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

I never wished for the trinity harder than after my 20th death, spawn, run, cycle in a GW2 dungeon.  GW2 tried to get rid of the trinity, the experiment failed, hopefully from now on developers will stick with the old adage 'if it ain't broke...' 

The game didn't fail. You failed to adapt. After the first run of each dungeon I pretty much never die.

Healers are a clutch for bad players. Its not them, its the healer, or the tank, or someone else. Its never them that is terrible.

Originally posted by evilastro

Originally posted by Scarfe

Originally posted by Wraithone

Originally posted by AwDiddums

Having the Holy Trinity taken out of the game seemed like a blessing to my grp of guild friends, it was supposed to give us freedom to be whatever we wanted, not tied to any specific role.

However when we entered our first dungeon we suddenly found ourselves running around like headless chickens, here was a grp of 5 friends who had been together through many MMO's over a 10 yr span, who had defeated many dungeons in our time with an air of authority as we knew our classes and our roles inside out, here we where running in circles, hitting everything in sight, not having a clue what was coming next and dying every time we where the main focus of the mob.

Fortunately we don't take ourselves seriously, it was downright funny and bemusing to suddenly find that we just didn't have a clue how to play our classes, we where lost as to how we could overcome even the simplest of dungeon critters, in the end it was an element of pure luck and persistence that got us through to the end.

Did we want to enter the next dungeon, not on your life, it wasn't fun anymore, if you can't figure out your roles in the dungeon, if you can't manage the simplest of mobs inside without dying 3 or 4 times whats the whole point, it becomes a frustrated mess, and your relying on zerging or out dpsing the encounter to survive.

I know if the game introduced a Holy Trinity me and my friends would be back in the game in a heart beat, but as it stands there isn't a chance we will head back and act like headless chickens again.

 

 

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

I never wished for the trinity harder than after my 20th death, spawn, run, cycle in a GW2 dungeon.  GW2 tried to get rid of the trinity, the experiment failed, hopefully from now on developers will stick with the old adage 'if it ain't broke...' 

The game didn't fail. You failed to adapt. After the first run of each dungeon I pretty much never die.

Healers are a clutch for bad players. Its not them, its the healer, or the tank, or someone else. Its never them that is terrible.

A failure to adapt doesn't make the change any more acceptable or correct (usually quite the opposite).  Dam dinosaurs failed to adapt to a meteor hitting the earth, I don't think said meteor was an improvement for them though. 

Originally posted by Scarfe

A failure to adapt doesn't make the change any more acceptable or correct (usually quite the opposite).  Dam dinosaurs failed to adapt to a meteor hitting the earth, I don't think said meteor was an improvement for them though. 

Made the earth a lot more enjoyable for other species though.

My mother refuses to use the internet. Should we abandon it because she doesn't enjoy it?

Originally posted by Scarfe

A failure to adapt doesn't make the change any more acceptable or correct (usually quite the opposite).  Dam dinosaurs failed to adapt to a meteor hitting the earth, I don't think said meteor was an improvement for them though. 

 Yep... and the tinity based dinosaurs went extinct, leaving room for the versatile mammals and birds to thrive.

Originally posted by Volkon

Originally posted by Wraithone

Well stated.  GW2 tried to get "creative" and in the process threw out the reason that dungeons have been fun for many people.  The trinity worked so long, so well for a reason.  GW2 dungeons have some of the worst reputation of any I've seen in years.  Sure, some people like them (so challenging...) but over all they are just a PITA for many people, so they don't even bother with them. 

 What a load of bunk. There are many people finding GW2 dungeons the best they've seen in years...

 

When what the last time anyone, outside of GW2, went into a dungeon and actually had to figure out how to do it? 

The first line is almost sig worthy.

Lastnight Age of Wushu. Before that every single TSW dungeon.