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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » A tiny nugget more news on EQ: Next

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113 posts found
  Quizzical

Guide

Joined: 12/11/08
Posts: 13169

12/18/12 5:42:57 PM#61
Originally posted by ice-vortex
Originally posted by Quizzical
Originally posted by ShakyMo
Plus there's like ZERO load time in ps2 which is important for the sort of game it is. High rez textures mean longer load times, more memory usage and more gpu memory usage. Hi rez textures also mean smaller playing fields OR repeating the same textures a lot in the same playing field.

From what I gather eqn is going to be ALL open world like PS2.

All else equal, higher resolution textures do have a huge impact on GPU memory requirements, but fairly little impact on loading times and system memory usage.

The big barrier on loading times is waiting for the hard drive to physically spin to the right spot before it can do anything.  On a properly defragmented drive, you pay that penalty exactly once, regardless of the size of the texture.

As for system memory usage, you don't keep textures in system memory for long.  You load them, pass them along into video memory, and then clear them out of system memory.

If the game is loading 4GB of textures into your memory compared to 512MB it certainly would have a major effect on loading times.

If you're trying to load 4 GB into video memory for texture buffers alone, I'm not sure if that will cause a crash or merely horrible performance on most video cards.  A 6 GB version of a Radeon HD 7970 could take it, but the game would be unplayable on any other consumer video cards.

Even 512 MB of video memory for texture buffers alone would be problematic on many video cards, so while you could offer it as a high resolution textures option, you'd better allow players to turn it off.  And even that 512 MB if loaded all at once is only about 4 seconds on a modern hard drive, apart from the delays to switch from one file to the next that don't depend on the texture resolution.

  toddze

Advanced Member

Joined: 8/02/08
Posts: 2195

I am not a hater, I call it like I see it.

12/18/12 5:43:08 PM#62
If your worried about graphics, stick to your single player online rpg's that you call MMO's. Give me a plethora of content engaging gameplay, and I could'nt care less about graphics.

Waiting for:EQ-Next, ArcheAge (not so much anymore)
Now Playing: N/A
Worst MMO: FFXIV
Favorite MMO: FFXI

  CalmOceans

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/11
Posts: 1807

12/18/12 5:53:36 PM#63
Originally posted by toddze
If your worried about graphics, stick to your single player online rpg's that you call MMO's. Give me a plethora of content engaging gameplay, and I could'nt care less about graphics.

For me it is partly about graphics too, if I wanted content I can already access it, it's called EQ1, it has more content and expansions than any MMO out there.

So the gameplay and graphics would need to be amawing to convince me.

  redcapp

Novice Member

Joined: 5/13/11
Posts: 733

12/18/12 7:35:54 PM#64
Well, I'm excited.  But this is meaningless.  Everybody hypes up their game. 
  Wizardry

Elite Member

Joined: 8/27/04
Posts: 6561

Perhaps tomorrow will be better.

12/18/12 7:51:50 PM#65

There is some really skewed statements in there.

He says his staff is not afrtaid to call BS,yet all EQ2 has been doing is copy cat Wow and the same linear questing design over and over.The ONLY things worth calling new or at least desirable are added cash shop>>>Housing and the dungeon maker.So you paY a sub then have to pay more again,no thanks to disrespecting the paying customers.

So if his staff can't get it right now,why would i be encouraged that they like what  they see?

Also not everyone has copied Eq,FFXI is the ONLY game to NOT copy cat linear questing.Sub class is Square Enix's sole design,they also have created more unique content ideas that anyone else.

I guess you think everyone is copying you if you only live in the mass media market or spend everyday trying to copy Wow.Also when you make it known that you are going all out cash shop,then customers will stay way before the gaem ever hiots Beta.

One other thing,you cannot look at EQ and say well it has been going 11 years,that MUST be the design we need.That is dumb,people are tired of it.You only get people sticking around because they are afraid to move on and many are afraid to let go of all their hard work,same reason bored people stay in Wow.

What this whole shebam tells me is Smedley cannot think outside the box,it sounds like he is still living in the past but THINKS he has some new ideas.I am pretty sure these so called new ideas are the same old but with a twist to support more cash shop,i would bet on it.

http://www.youtube.com/user/Napolianboo#p/u/15/rCYLLQCNc1w
Samoan Diamond

  Theocritus

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/15/08
Posts: 3613

12/18/12 9:00:10 PM#66
    I hope EQ next goes back to the days where we were just thrown into the world and had to figure things out (ie pre tutorial days) for ourselves....Im so sick of hand holding in MMOs it isnt even funny...I better not see any exclamation points, question marks, or any other grammatical things over NPC heads.
  grimfall

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/25/07
Posts: 1152

12/18/12 9:23:07 PM#67
Originally posted by ice-vortex
Originally posted by Arclan

Give players time to talk while in a group. Otherwise friendships won't form; and friendships keep players around for years.

Action-oriented combat + out of combat regen = no time to chat = no friendships. IMO.


You don't have a guild with voice chat?

He just said you need friendships to form.  If he already had a guild with guild chat...

I think he's right, though.  You got to know players running around and waiting for mana to regen in EQ1.  Now, since you're constantly mashing buttons, you don't really get to know the people you game with.

  grimfall

Apprentice Member

Joined: 4/25/07
Posts: 1152

12/18/12 9:30:20 PM#68
Originally posted by Theocritus
    I hope EQ next goes back to the days where we were just thrown into the world and had to figure things out (ie pre tutorial days) for ourselves....Im so sick of hand holding in MMOs it isnt even funny...I better not see any exclamation points, question marks, or any other grammatical things over NPC heads.

As frustrated as all of us have been waiting for EQ Next, imagine how hard it has been on Blizzard, waiting to see the new game they're going to rip-off for Titan!

  CalmOceans

Advanced Member

Joined: 5/06/11
Posts: 1807

12/18/12 9:30:25 PM#69
Originally posted by ice-vortex
Originally posted by Arclan

Give players time to talk while in a group. Otherwise friendships won't form; and friendships keep players around for years.

Action-oriented combat + out of combat regen = no time to chat = no friendships. IMO.


You don't have a guild with voice chat?

Voice chat? Do you even know what EQ is like.

You think there are many guilds that use voice chat? 99% of EQ's guilds never use voice chat and never will.

Our guld will never use voice chat, and there are many reaons as to why, organisational skills in guilds that have over 100 people online at any time big can not be done with voice chat, you can not manage guilds that scale with voice chat.

Voice chat is extremely unpopular in EQ. This isn't WoW where you only need to manage 20 players, raiding is 54 players minimum, with usually 10-20 people benched.

Everything is done by typing in channels with a hierarchy, none of it is done with voice chat, voice chat is 100% useless for large-scale raiding.

 

Raid channel-> Officer channel -> Class channel

MT channel

Loot channel -> DKP channel

Guild channel

Bench channel

Recruit channel

 

Voice chat is useless.

 

The guy you responded to is 100% right, the number one reason the comminity established itself is through chatting in the game, voice chat lobbies are not only impractical, they also break up the community which is detrimental to the game.

  aspekx

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/24/05
Posts: 2151

12/18/12 9:50:15 PM#70
Originally posted by Indol

I, for one, am willing to give SOE the benefit of the doubt since we know too little to make a judgement at this point aside from the possibility that what Smedley says is true. If it is true, then we may be looking at something that truly evolves the genre. We can but hope.

 

i currently play SoE games. and enjoy them. if all goes well i plan on at least trying EQNext. however, i seriously doubt that Smed&Co. have the creative wherewithal to truly reshape the genre.

"There are at least two kinds of games.
One could be called finite, the other infinite.
A finite game is played for the purpose of winning,
an infinite game for the purpose of continuing play."
Finite and Infinite Games, James Carse

  aspekx

Advanced Member

Joined: 12/24/05
Posts: 2151

12/18/12 9:51:12 PM#71
Originally posted by CalmOceans

Voice chat is useless.

 

The guy you responded to is 100% right, the number one reason the comminity established itself is through chatting in the game, voice chat lobbies are not only impractical, they also break up the comminity which is detrimental to the game.

i wholeheartedly agree with this.

"There are at least two kinds of games.
One could be called finite, the other infinite.
A finite game is played for the purpose of winning,
an infinite game for the purpose of continuing play."
Finite and Infinite Games, James Carse

  Aelious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2312

World > Quest Progression

12/18/12 9:59:48 PM#72
Major laugh at the pic CalmOceans. That's obviously a misplacement of a texture in PS2 and not a correct representation of the game's graphics. That said there is a reason why the textures are not as sharp as other games and of course it's because of the big battles with 100's of people.

Have you tried changing the config file to actually get max graphics out of PS2. I haven't tried it but when you see the sharp pictures in PS2 articles that's how your seeing it.
  Aelious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2312

World > Quest Progression

12/18/12 10:04:46 PM#73
As far as voice chat it will be great in EQN I think. PS2 already has proximity voice enabled and with SoEMote also using facial recognition can you imagine what that will do to public places in game? You will actually be able to just walk up to someone and have a fully animated conversation with a stranger.
  sgtalon

Novice Member

Joined: 7/30/04
Posts: 109

12/18/12 10:05:25 PM#74

Looks pretty awesome to me. I wish i could find some pictures of the huge battles. I will have to get my own sometime.

Anyone that isn't sure about PS2 just go try it out. It is totally free. The game is awesome.

  kjempff

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/12/04
Posts: 666

Make worlds not stories

12/18/12 10:06:22 PM#75

 – and these guys are gamers, so they’re not afraid to call bullshit when they see us make a mistake. It’s happened before. We’ve made mistakes, and the guys internally will call us on it every time.

Maybe you should have listened the past 10 year when the guys "called on you"... errr what is that smell ? It smells like Smedley pie. I guess a good MMORPG could come out of SOE, but I want the proof in my hands before I beleive it. Will define the next generation of mmos, hmm GW2re did we hear that before?

 

  Xhieron

Novice Member

Joined: 10/03/06
Posts: 130

Don't trust these people. They're crooks.

12/18/12 10:07:59 PM#76

TLDR: Brief hype time, long combat pacing, infrequent but non-zero voice acting.

 

I agree with the sentiment that actiony combat with no downtime is good for playability but absolutely awful for community-building.  Sure, voice-chatting guilds is great, but I'm not familiar with many guilds that do their recruiting by giving out their TS/Vent info to any stranger willing to accept a party invite.  Sometimes you want to get to know people without having them on voice com, and sometimes, heaven forbid, you just want to listen to some damn music!  Having a slower pacing to combat action and a lower level of twitchiness is ideal for that.  For that matter, instant and near-instant travel has some of the same issues.  I had a lot of good conversations with folks while on auto-follow in EQ1 and FFXI en route from the teleport-in point to camp.

I'm not suggesting that EQN should have five-minute-long-even-with-KEI downtime--after all, some people want to solo sometimes--but GW2, for instance, is way, way too far on the twitchy end of the spectrum (and that's the least of my few but major criticisms for that game).  I think it's possible to have time to talk without feeling like the time is wasted if you're not spending it talking.

 

On the voice acting, I think there's a place for it.  Honestly I'd be a little miffed if EQN had zero voice acting.  Hell, even vanilla WOW had voice acting, scripted and brief though it may have been.  However, I also agree that SWTOR's level of voice acting was symptomatic of their misallocation of development resources to story at the expense of life-sustaining gameplay systems.  GW2 had decent acting, but while it's not a major issue of mine with respect to them, I'll admit that at times it felt a little wasted and unnecessary.  I don't want voiced conversations as part of the gameplay except in very, very rare circumstances.  I do, however, want voice acting as another kind of sound effect.

Here's the deal: If people are playing an MMO, there's a vast and overwhelming probability that they can read.  Now, to be fair, some of them can't.  You'll have some illiterate or semi-literate folks, and occasionally you'll have a five-year-old (yes--yes you will; that's reality).  But nobody's outraged that the tooltips aren't voiced for player accessibility, so I don't feel like every single line of dialogue in the game needs to be voiced.

A few examples where having voiceovers is good in a sandbox:  To the extent that you have NPCs, they need to be voiced when they're trying to get attention.  Hearing "Hey, you, come'ere!" and the like in GW2 was an excellent tool to direct my attention to an NPC with information to offer, even if the result was that I disregarded it.  If you have cutscenes, for whatever reason, you need some voice acting.  In a sandbox environment, if you have an event during the life of the game that's going to make a major change as a result of player action/inaction (e.g., the nukes are falling/Bahamut is coming, the floating island is breaking off and rising into the air, the Emperor is being deposed and beheaded), your game should already have the tech to push out the change with some flair.  And finally, you need voice acting for a lot of stuff that, while we sometimes take it for granted, is absolutely integral to any game with any NPCs:  Eventually somebody's gonna set a village on fire.  Ideally it's a player village, but whether it is or isn't, you should put in the time and money to record some quality I'm-on-fire screaming, along with some "OH SWEET JESUS! TIMMY'S IN THAT HOUSE!" one-liners, whether there's any Timmy-rescuing quests or not (hint: there shouldn't be.  Fuck Timmy).  And of course it goes without saying, you're going to have to record combat grunts for the PCs anyway, so you might as well throw in some extras to show us you care.

 

Finally, someone mentioned earlier the aspiration that a company would develop their game quietly and then just release it, and I really couldn't agree more.  SOE, like everybody else, has paid advertising staff on retainer; they probably have more than one guy whose entire job is to determine what the falloff range for hype from a particular marketing device is going to be, and there have got to be peer reviewed studies of long-term online software interest-generation out there by now.  Does the literature really say that talking about your game monthly for five God-damned years before its release date produces a net increase in revenue?  Shit, you've got people who were planning to buy the game when you first announced it who have died by the time it came out.  --and not even in accidents!  You know there were people out there who heard about Guild Wars 2 back in 2007, got excited, then got cancer, went into remission, and then relapsed and died before it came out!  I know the development cycle is long, and I want to know what's going on as much as the next guy, but trust me when I say that once you've got the hook in me for a game, the only thing you can do by continuing to trickle out information is lose me.

So on that note, I do want to know what EQN is going to be; I want an idea of the basic model, and sure, I'd be happy to take a look at some screenshots and a video.  But I really don't have the time or the energy to get on another hype rollercoaster.

Peace and safety.

  ice-vortex

Novice Member

Joined: 5/21/10
Posts: 903

12/19/12 2:27:40 AM#77
Originally posted by CalmOceans
Originally posted by ice-vortex
Originally posted by Arclan

Give players time to talk while in a group. Otherwise friendships won't form; and friendships keep players around for years.

Action-oriented combat + out of combat regen = no time to chat = no friendships. IMO.


You don't have a guild with voice chat?

Voice chat? Do you even know what EQ is like.

You think there are many guilds that use voice chat? 99% of EQ's guilds never use voice chat and never will.

Our guld will never use voice chat, and there are many reaons as to why, organisational skills in guilds that have over 100 people online at any time big can not be done with voice chat, you can not manage guilds that scale with voice chat.

Voice chat is extremely unpopular in EQ. This isn't WoW where you only need to manage 20 players, raiding is 54 players minimum, with usually 10-20 people benched.

Everything is done by typing in channels with a hierarchy, none of it is done with voice chat, voice chat is 100% useless for large-scale raiding.

 

Raid channel-> Officer channel -> Class channel

MT channel

Loot channel -> DKP channel

Guild channel

Bench channel

Recruit channel

 

Voice chat is useless.

 

The guy you responded to is 100% right, the number one reason the comminity established itself is through chatting in the game, voice chat lobbies are not only impractical, they also break up the community which is detrimental to the game.

 

My EQ guild used voice chat as far back as at least Luclin. I remember when Ventrilo was publically released.

  Baseline

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/23/04
Posts: 491

12/19/12 4:05:24 AM#78
Originally posted by Hrimnir

Bold words! But, in any case, the game seems to have gone down well with SOE staff at its internal unveiling.

“I was really nervous about [showing SOE staff the game],” says Smedley. “We showed it to them on Monday, and I couldn’t sleep on Sunday night because I was scared. We’ve thrown out two previous designs of the game to go with something pretty crazy and… well, it’s awesome. When the team saw it I could barely breathe when they were watching it. But when I’d finished they were clapping and cheering – and these guys are gamers, so they’re not afraid to call bullshit when they see us make a mistake. It’s happened before. We’ve made mistakes, and the guys internally will call us on it every time. But they loved this, and we really felt vindicated that the way we’re going with Everquest Next is the right way. I feel good about it. We’re not trying to make WOW2 or Everquest 2.5 – we’re making something that we think will define the next generation of MMOs.”

They don't call bullshit because you pay them and they would get marks put on them as a negative nancy employee who brings down team morale.

As for him claiming "the guys internally will call us on it every time", sure, right, maybe when the economy was stronger, or maybe that's just in Smedley's fantasy world - the same place thought the SWG NGE was something 'clap and cheer' worthy.

I don't trust SOE one bit, I don't trust the entire gaming industry one bit at this point, because it's more overrun with suit-wearing snakes and beancounters rather than genuine quality game teams; oh, and I'm not just talking about the guys in accounting and marketing yadda yadda, I'm talking about even the developers, the coders, the designers; they have all become lazy and greedy, lacking in creativity and ambition. 

The piles upon piles of WoW and Call of Duty clones that litter what is nearing a decade is proof. These people, these 'game creators' organize nowadays more blatantly, as if they are just looking to create an ATM.

Go take a look at the top grossing game on mobile, 'Rage of Bahamut'. There is the future where the brain power goes. Simplified atm machines in the mask of games.

And now you have Steam adding RMT. A decade ago the gaming community abhorred this Pay2Win mentality. Now, with the blessing of the game creators themselves, RMT is legitimized and officially sanctioned, and my points are proven.

The entire 'gaming' industry is in its fall, and winter isn't far off. Everything happens in cycles.

  Caldrin

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/04
Posts: 4070

12/19/12 4:11:07 AM#79
Originally posted by SaltyBogey

EQ Next will be a massive failure... Don't believe me?

 

Check out SOE fantastic Light-Forge engine on Planetside 2... It's laughable at best

whats wrong with the engine?

For a fast pased MMOFPS game with 1000s of players in the same area PS2 looks stunning it also plays really well.. for a brand new engine to run that well is a really good thing. SOE have done an awesome job...

 

im really looking forward to EQ:next now and i cant wait for more info..

 

Other tha the repopulation and EQ:next im not really looking forward to any up-coming MMORPGs..

 

My 3D models
http://dragon3d.webs.com/

  Jyiiga

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/03/10
Posts: 1008

12/19/12 10:57:49 AM#80

EQ is still the only thing SOE really has going for it. Everything else is underpopulated, closed down or just sold off.

They don't know how to run things very well and most of them don't know how to handle community relations. 

I treat SOE like I treat Funcom at this point.. With a heavy dose of skepticism and the promise that I will never buy any of their games on release unless I have been given extensive time to try it out. 

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