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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » What happened to the Sandbox PvP?

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  maccarthur2004

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/12
Posts: 488

12/07/12 6:32:40 PM#21
Originally posted by Vunak23
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by Vunak23
Originally posted by maccarthur2004

The budget to ArcheAge (production only) is around 25-30 milions. I think never a sandbox mmo had so much money into, and in the last 10 years it will be the first MMO that can be considered AAA and sandbox.

AA have only 2 flaws i know so far: the outdated tab-target system and the fact that will be released in no less than 2 years. :(

 

Idk  i think we will be close to release by the end of 2013. 

I mean Jakes main concerns right now are Korea and China, and China is developing/translating right along with Korea. We are gonna see OBT early next year and probably release a few weeks later for Korea. A month later I see China doing the same. 

Maybe a year and a half if they dont start the localization right away. It really doesn't take all that long to translate, FFXI/FFXIV and SE do it quick as hell. 

Course this is me being optimistic heh..

Russia will have a earlier release too. My bet to the release to western countries is no early than April 2014.

 

 

IDK I dont think Russia will be before EU and US, we have a bigger market between us then Russia. Now Japan will be before us I forgot about them. 

The eastern market* is more "avid" consumer of mmos than the western (Isn't for nothing that Korea is in the world vanguard in mmo production). The eastern market has too a clear (almost exclusive) preference toward sandboxes, with tough enviroment and rewards hard to be obtained.

 

*Korea, Japan, China, Russia and some countries of Eastern Europe.

 

 

"What we are aiming in ArcheAge is to let the players feel the true fun of MMORPG by forming a community like real life by interacting with other players, whether it be conflict or cooperation." (Jake Song)

  maccarthur2004

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/02/12
Posts: 488

12/07/12 6:37:29 PM#22
Originally posted by Rimmersman
Originally posted by Vunak23

ArcheAge is gonna be good, Ive betaed it. Yea I'm an old school gamer like yourself. It has most of everything we from Lineage/UO/Shadowbane etc want in a MMO. It does have a quest based leveling system, but I would say thats about as far as its themepark elements go...Hmm well a few instances, but the world bosses drop the best stuff so. 

I guess it will depend on how much they change from last CBT to OBT and Release. And what ever the western publisher decides to "Westernize"

 

Archeage is a hybrid not a sandbox MMO, it has themepark features which is okay. In fact Age Of Wushu is more sandbox, FFA PvP, no classes or levels, clan buildings all player made. It also has a bounty system and a prison system like Archeage, no safe areas and beheading for serious law breaker's. Every top weapons and armour and just about every item is player made, if you craft a blade you will need to find a carpenter to craft the hilt. And then you have the offline features where you actually stay on in the world as an npc manning you stall or doing chores for you faction. This has it's risks because you can be kidnaped by PKs and sold into slavery for another faction but they will have a bounty on them. If they build up to much crime points they can be sent to prison for up to 24 hours or have a public execution which also effects them for 24 hours. You can get your clan to pay for your release. There is also farming in the game like Archeage and all this in a beautiful open world that is based on feudal China, no elves or dwarfs or oversized weapons in Age Of Wushu. The second western BETA starts on the 20th of December through till the 9th of January. We will have updated content and quests and features. Make no mistake Age Of Wushu beta is a full PvP FFA sandbox MMO and before you log into the game it tells you that it's a pvp game and are you sure you want to proceed.

Seens very good (to be true :p). I will take a look.

 

 

"What we are aiming in ArcheAge is to let the players feel the true fun of MMORPG by forming a community like real life by interacting with other players, whether it be conflict or cooperation." (Jake Song)

  Rimmersman

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/15/12
Posts: 911

12/07/12 6:41:21 PM#23
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by Rimmersman
Originally posted by Vunak23

ArcheAge is gonna be good, Ive betaed it. Yea I'm an old school gamer like yourself. It has most of everything we from Lineage/UO/Shadowbane etc want in a MMO. It does have a quest based leveling system, but I would say thats about as far as its themepark elements go...Hmm well a few instances, but the world bosses drop the best stuff so. 

I guess it will depend on how much they change from last CBT to OBT and Release. And what ever the western publisher decides to "Westernize"

 

Archeage is a hybrid not a sandbox MMO, it has themepark features which is okay. In fact Age Of Wushu is more sandbox, FFA PvP, no classes or levels, clan buildings all player made. It also has a bounty system and a prison system like Archeage, no safe areas and beheading for serious law breaker's. Every top weapons and armour and just about every item is player made, if you craft a blade you will need to find a carpenter to craft the hilt. And then you have the offline features where you actually stay on in the world as an npc manning you stall or doing chores for you faction. This has it's risks because you can be kidnaped by PKs and sold into slavery for another faction but they will have a bounty on them. If they build up to much crime points they can be sent to prison for up to 24 hours or have a public execution which also effects them for 24 hours. You can get your clan to pay for your release. There is also farming in the game like Archeage and all this in a beautiful open world that is based on feudal China, no elves or dwarfs or oversized weapons in Age Of Wushu. The second western BETA starts on the 20th of December through till the 9th of January. We will have updated content and quests and features. Make no mistake Age Of Wushu beta is a full PvP FFA sandbox MMO and before you log into the game it tells you that it's a pvp game and are you sure you want to proceed.

Seens very good (to be true :p). I will take a look.

 

 

 

Go to the Age Of Wushu section on this site and check out the vids we have put up. The game takes some getting used to but once you have figured it out you will be okay.

  snapfusion

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/17/11
Posts: 976

12/07/12 7:00:32 PM#24
Their gone because you and the other couple of hundred people that want to play them dont make it worth a developers time.  DF and MO are struggling to maintain a population as it is.
  Kiljaedenas

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/29/11
Posts: 466

To err is human, but to really f*ck things up you need a computer.

12/07/12 7:16:47 PM#25
Originally posted by Cecropia
Originally posted by nariusseldon
Originally posted by Haxzon

What do you think? Anyone else longing for this? Or are you happy with how the mmorpg worlds are now?

...I don't like my pve & pvp mixing.

It works like magic in EVE. Seperating the two is unecessary and primitive. When you have both the PVEers and the PVPers dependent on each other, not only do you dramatically increase the popularity of your game, but you end up with the foundation for a masterpiece like EVE Online. Win, win.

 

This is very true. In Eve  the PvE carebears build the vast majority of the stuff that the PvPers kill each other with. The carebears are the main financial movers and shakers in the marketplace. Without the carebears the PvPers wouldn't have anything decent to fly. Without the PvPers the carebears wouldn't have any customers buying their stuff.

Where's the any key?

  Rimmersman

Advanced Member

Joined: 10/15/12
Posts: 911

12/07/12 7:18:21 PM#26
Originally posted by snapfusion
Their gone because you and the other couple of hundred people that want to play them dont make it worth a developers time.  DF and MO are struggling to maintain a population as it is.

 

Perhaps in the west but in the East sandbox mmos are being made or should I say hybrid. Archeage and Age Of Wushu are but two such games. Then we'll have some being made in the west as well, hybrids are on their way, make no mistake about about that.

  Quirhid

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5516

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

12/07/12 7:48:10 PM#27

What happened? People realized they don't have to set their alarm clocks to wake them up in the middle of the night to destroy or defend somehthing. Or wait of hours to get a party going. Or grind for days to recouperate lost resources.

They found out that there are alternatives where they can have more fun and whenever they want with little time investment.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  Maelwydd

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/26/09
Posts: 1133

12/07/12 7:59:32 PM#28
The problem is, the sandbox games that are out there think PvP=sand. They forgot the other 95% of the game. EvE is probably the only game that is what you are after, and if you are good with spreadsheets, happy paying for multiple accounts, don't have a life and think being good at it means you are cool in real life then it is the game for you. Oh and if you don't mind WOW in space type combat (i.e. press buttons upon rotation and the really skilled press different buttons when certain situations arise) and the fact you are a spaceship. There are no good, ground based sandbox games out there, people that play games like DF and MO are just so short on options they play them from desperation.
  Vunak23

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/27/10
Posts: 659

In your house Eatin' your Cookies!

12/07/12 8:24:35 PM#29
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by Vunak23
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by Vunak23
Originally posted by maccarthur2004

The budget to ArcheAge (production only) is around 25-30 milions. I think never a sandbox mmo had so much money into, and in the last 10 years it will be the first MMO that can be considered AAA and sandbox.

AA have only 2 flaws i know so far: the outdated tab-target system and the fact that will be released in no less than 2 years. :(

 

Idk  i think we will be close to release by the end of 2013. 

I mean Jakes main concerns right now are Korea and China, and China is developing/translating right along with Korea. We are gonna see OBT early next year and probably release a few weeks later for Korea. A month later I see China doing the same. 

Maybe a year and a half if they dont start the localization right away. It really doesn't take all that long to translate, FFXI/FFXIV and SE do it quick as hell. 

Course this is me being optimistic heh..

Russia will have a earlier release too. My bet to the release to western countries is no early than April 2014.

 

 

IDK I dont think Russia will be before EU and US, we have a bigger market between us then Russia. Now Japan will be before us I forgot about them. 

The eastern market* is more "avid" consumer of mmos than the western (Isn't for nothing that Korea is in the world vanguard in mmo production). The eastern market has too a clear (almost exclusive) preference toward sandboxes, with tough enviroment and rewards hard to be obtained.

 

*Korea, Japan, China, Russia and some countries of Eastern Europe.

 

 

I agree Korea, Japan and China have a higher population and are there target audience. But Russia I doubt it. China, Korea Japan (I believe) and US/EU have Official AA sites while Russia doesn't.  XLGames even opened an Office up in the states for a while there. Eve if Japan doesn't have an official site, Jake came out and said after the Chinese release they would be moving on to a Japanese release before anything else. 

They just made a deal with Take-Two (possible Publisher). There is more in favor of a western release before a Russian release, more likely is the Russian release will be apart of the EU release and it all translated at once for French/Russian/German and English. 

"In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  Theocritus

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/15/08
Posts: 3613

12/07/12 10:30:04 PM#30
     You mean that great PVP where players used scripts and cheats to be max skill level in a few hours then kill noobs non stop as they step foot outside the gates of Brittain?? YEah what fun that used to be.....Im surprised I ever tried another MMO again after that experience.
  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

12/08/12 3:56:10 AM#31
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by fenistil
Originally posted by Yalexy
Maybe ArcheAge will deliver some two years down the road, but until then there's nothing on the horizon peaking my interest.

AA has potential to be nice good game, BUT it is not pure sandbox. FAR from it.   It has very big themepark parts.   So it is something similar to hmm Fallen Earth with few more sandbox features and bit bigger budget? Or Lineage II mixed with Vanilla WoW and some UO features.

AA will be 80-90% sandbox and 10-20% themepark. The themepark feature will be mainly the quests and a instanced "training camp" that will only give small to medium rewards. The "endgame" of AA will be 100% sandbox with FFA partial loot PVP, with some penaltys to who pk same faction players in southern continent and none in the northern.

There will also be instanced (and non-instanced) dungeons. Only a few not that much as in WoW or Rift or other themeparks, but still there will be.  Lately XL games went more into themepark teritories.  Don't misunderstand me - I still wait for this game and I still think AA have potential. I am not bashing it.  

I just personally believe that if someone expect next Ultima Online or SWG - will be disappointed, cause it won't be as sandboxy.

Still it might be great :)

  Grimmx

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/11
Posts: 207

12/08/12 4:07:12 AM#32
Originally posted by Haxzon

I have searched and searched for a mmorpg that would peak my interest again. It seems i just keep hoping for something that just wont be there ever again.

 

The "No Holds-Barred, stomach in knots, kill first ask questions later" kind of game... I'm not saying FPS. I'm saying MMORPG. The kind of game where you and the other players ARE the world.  The world where you have to have scouts while leveling so you dont get ambushed by other players and loot stolen. And after a long day of solo PKing or reaching your next conquest... you wonder on home to the city, castle, town, but not just any town... The town that you and your guild placed and built from the ground up! The one that you defend, nurture, love. And as long as your walls stand... your only real safehaven.

 

Yes, folks, I'm talking about a real Sandbox PvP. No Carebears allowed.  Something like Shadowbane!

 

I have played many mmorpg dating all the way back to UO and EQ... and many styles since but it seems no game has ever really peaked my interest until the game that stripped the boring quests and carebeared Anime content for the casual PvE player... and just went for it. Gave the world to the players. Yes it had its flaws, the game engine sucked, certain characters got nerfed because of the carebears (ie : a thief class was really a thief and could take the money right out of your pocket and be gone before you know it...) If you died, your inventory (not your equipped items) was fair game! I'm just saying I miss this game and truly believe with the new technology a game of this nature would thrive and prosper.

 

Where's my Sandbox! I wanna play?

 

What do you think? Anyone else longing for this? Or are you happy with how the mmorpg worlds are now?

Im at the same place.

Darkfall 2 release in 4 days and all FFA pvp gamers will head there.

Me included.

 

  AvsRock21

Novice Member

Joined: 7/26/10
Posts: 262

12/08/12 4:12:04 AM#33
Originally posted by Kalafax

and rampant ingame betrayal.

Obviously you've never played EVE. It easily has the most robust and friendly community that I have seen in any mmo for years. You just need to use the alliance and corporation recruitment forums and get into a good corp. Every corp I've been in has been a great group of guys.  People who I would trust all of my assets with. EVE's only problem is haters spreading misinformation when they have never played the game and don't know anything.

  Grimmx

Novice Member

Joined: 8/30/11
Posts: 207

12/08/12 5:49:00 AM#34

Ive played all FFA pvp games out there up to now and EvE online is the ONLY FFA pvp game i couldnt get into. And i tried it several times because i wanted it to work.

EvE Online strenght is that it has done space combat right but that doesnt mean its for everybody. Its actually less skill based pvp than most other FFA pvp games out there.

 

So if your into tactical combat and dont mind beeing a spaceship, go EvE.

If your into skill based pvp and like to play a character of some sorts, go DF2.

 

  Vunak23

Apprentice Member

Joined: 11/27/10
Posts: 659

In your house Eatin' your Cookies!

12/08/12 7:39:56 AM#35
Originally posted by fenistil
Originally posted by maccarthur2004
Originally posted by fenistil
Originally posted by Yalexy
Maybe ArcheAge will deliver some two years down the road, but until then there's nothing on the horizon peaking my interest.

AA has potential to be nice good game, BUT it is not pure sandbox. FAR from it.   It has very big themepark parts.   So it is something similar to hmm Fallen Earth with few more sandbox features and bit bigger budget? Or Lineage II mixed with Vanilla WoW and some UO features.

AA will be 80-90% sandbox and 10-20% themepark. The themepark feature will be mainly the quests and a instanced "training camp" that will only give small to medium rewards. The "endgame" of AA will be 100% sandbox with FFA partial loot PVP, with some penaltys to who pk same faction players in southern continent and none in the northern.

There will also be instanced (and non-instanced) dungeons. Only a few not that much as in WoW or Rift or other themeparks, but still there will be.  Lately XL games went more into themepark teritories.  Don't misunderstand me - I still wait for this game and I still think AA have potential. I am not bashing it.  

I just personally believe that if someone expect next Ultima Online or SWG - will be disappointed, cause it won't be as sandboxy.

Still it might be great :)

I've played it and it is pretty damn sandboxy. Its not as Sandbox as it could be. But it really only has one or two themepark elements. Its quest/story based leveling and a few  instanced dungeons that don't even cary the best gear (thats for World bosses).

No its not as sandbox as UO or SWG. But is the closest we have come in the last 10 years, so I'm not complaining. 

"In the immediate future, we have this one, and then we’ve got another one that is actually going to be – so we’re going to have, what we want to do, is in January, what we’re targeting to do, this may or may not happen, so you can’t hold me to it. But what we’re targeting to do, is have a fun anniversary to the Ilum shenanigans that happened. An alien race might invade, and they might crash into Ilum and there might be some new activities that happen on the planet." ~Gabe Amatangelo

  Larsa

Novice Member

Joined: 2/14/04
Posts: 992

12/08/12 10:15:48 AM#36

Very strange topic.

I believe almost all (if not: all) sandboxes released in the last 5 years have been FFA PvP ones. Not sure what the OP wants. Practically all sandbox games of the last 5 years offer what he seems to look for.

Just out of the top of my head: Darkfall, Mortal Online, Xsyon, Haven&Hearth, Salem.

I maintain this List of Sandbox MMORPGs. Please post or send PM for corrections and suggestions.

  Hairysun

Novice Member

Joined: 6/11/05
Posts: 1068

Boo ....

12/09/12 3:36:36 PM#37

What happened to sandbox PvP?

 

"CLICKY"

 

Happens every time ......

 

 

~Hairysun

 

 

http://www.straightdope.com/

  lizardbones

Elite Member

Joined: 6/11/08
Posts: 10573

I've become dependent upon spell check. My apologies for stupid grammatical errors.

12/09/12 4:27:43 PM#38


Originally posted by Larsa
Very strange topic.

I believe almost all (if not: all) sandboxes released in the last 5 years have been FFA PvP ones. Not sure what the OP wants. Practically all sandbox games of the last 5 years offer what he seems to look for.

Just out of the top of my head: Darkfall, Mortal Online, Xsyon, Haven&Hearth, Salem.




Maybe that's the problem with trying to write a "sandbox" game. You give the players what they ask for, and they complain that it doesn't exist.

For every large, complex problem, there is a simple, clear solution that also happens to be absolutely wrong.

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