Originally posted by Agrias34

I don't see how people can stay interested in the current state of the PvP in this game.  I always loved and played PvP in GW1 for almost 3 years straight, GvG leading with my guild, top 100, and Hall of Heroes, getting higher ranks for my showoff /rank emote, random arenas we're awesome to play with random builds, even the PvE/PvP maps where the turtles would siege the castle, or the Jade Quarry map that released with Factions were amazingly fun.  What does GW2 have?  Like 4 maps and are all capture these points on the map, 5v5 with no real competitiveness to it in my opinion. 

 

That's exactly what team arenas were like in GW1, and team arenas was the least popular PvP pasttime to do in GW1 because it was premade teams with a good build that could dominate other teams, but it got boring.  Unlike random arenas where you didn't always have healers, or had 4 rangers sometimes due to the randomness, it was fun.  I miss GvG's, Hall of Heroes and everything else GW1 PvP had, and when playing GW2, I was saying to myself along with a lot of my PvP guildmates, that we wish we could just go back to GW1 how it was so popular and PvP centric all those years ago.

 

Even if eSports can become of GW2, I don't see it being the most popular, or fun, or entertaining to watch.  I've already seen every build there is in the game, I've seen everything there is to see with the current PvP maps, nothing new has come as of that. 

If they can bring into GW2 what GW1 did with PvP, maybe then I would come back and play, Hall of Heroes was great, GvG's were amazing, yet none of that exists in GW2.  I couldn't be more disappointed with their PvP.

All this stuff and even more will be added at a certain time, we just don't know when exactly. GW2 is lacking a lot of stuff PvP mode wise, but gameplay wise, its 100x better than GW1 IMO. I wouldn't worry about stuff they will eventually add. We know it will come.

Originally posted by fat_taddler

Originally posted by Greyhooff

If this open, unscripted discussion with the developers is anything to go by:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hByqoWsnz-I&hd=1

GW2 is set for huge e-sport success.

They are very clear that they are not rushing it, but the announced balance changes, the pacing of changes, the way they are approaching their PVP game is fantastic.

I also LOVED the fact that this guy says clearly that some noobs just need to L2P. That kind of frankness only comes from someone who plays the game extensively himself, a developer who is also a competitive player = awesome.

No bullcrap, no marketing spin, just a skilled PVP developer with opinions and ideas who is open about discussing with the players.

You can tell this guy really cares about balance and competitive gaming above all, and that's exactly what you want.

Let's face it, PVP in other MMOs like SWTOR, WoW, Aion, AOC, etc is a joke. No one takes it seriously, and no MMO has e-sport PVP. It's too unbalanced.

GW2 has a very good chance at it because it's already the most balanced MMO, and about to become even more balanced in every little detail.

I think that with the mindset displayed in the video, they might have the biggest esport game of 2013. 

Anyway, just watch it in full and make up your own mind.

Blizzard just had their WoW Arena World Championships a couple of weeks ago.  It had Arena teams from all over the world going head to head for an entire weekend.   Not sure where you're getting your facts from.

 

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/7831336/The_Battlenet_World_Championship_has_Concluded_VODs_Inside-11_17_2012

I think that the problem there is Blizzard doesn't care too much about the pvp in WoW. Look at gaming outlets, they don't really cover it thoroughly like they do LoL, CoD, SF, SC2, ect.

GW2 is also nowhere near esport status but they seem interested and invested in making it happen.

Originally posted by Toxia

Originally posted by Syferus
Every dev talks the talk, hoping they can increase their numbers and keep up the visage of a bright future.  GW2 is no exception.  It is highly unlikely that GW2 will be the next big esport. By design the game was intended as a PvE experience first.  No matter the balancing changes or future plans for PvP, GW2 won't be able to compete with PvP based games like LoL or Dota2.  Their playerbases are focused on competition, while there is a large number of GW2 players that play GW2 solely for its PvE content.  If GW2 expands its playerbase so far that it's select PvP player base rivals WoW or LoL's then they might have a chance.  As of right now, it doesn't look like that will happen.

I wish they would stick to this, and stop changing everything for the sake of their PvP. They certainly seem more interested in PVP balance than PVE balance, which never go hand in hand. If 80% of your players came for the pve, yet only see constant nerfs and changing to their classes for the sake of pvp, it wont bode well. imo.

By desing this game was not intended to be as a pve game first, like almost all other mmo's. They based a lot of their design decisions around pvp, specifically spvp.

Originally posted by cronius77
i would seriously love to see how they can take probably one of the worst scanario based pvp systems out on the market today and turn it into Esports. Random teams even if you are in a group and bland scanarios with no point to pvp just ninja capping. I seriously do not understand the hype behind this title , their pvp is a step backwards not forward. I could even see Rift pvp being a better Esport than this . Please someone explain to me how this game could ever be esport as i would love to know because i love pvp.

You must be looking at something else. They even have ESL support.

I like GW2, but I think the likelihood is Firefall will be the next E-Sports big thing, not GW2.

Seems Firefall is more fast paced and built from ground up for competitive pvp.

Originally posted by aRtFuLThinG

I like GW2, but I think the likelihood is Firefall will be the next E-Sports big thing, not GW2.

 

Seems Firefall is more fast paced and built from ground up for competitive pvp.

I liked what I saw of Firefall, but well Planetide 2, and both don't have that MMO feel at all

Originally posted by Kuppa

 

I think that the problem there is Blizzard doesn't care too much about the pvp in WoW. Look at gaming outlets, they don't really cover it thoroughly like they do LoL, CoD, SF, SC2, ect.

GW2 is also nowhere near esport status but they seem interested and invested in making it happen.

Not really. ANet 'says' a lot of things but you don't see much from them.

Esports is big business but it is also very new.

Recent IPL 5 had 'college football' view numbers, that's large enough for advertisers (mainstream ones) to notice and enquire.

Blizzard actually invests real $$$ / staff / resources towards esports.

All I see from ANet is just another empty promise from an MMO-Dev.

Originally posted by jpnz

Originally posted by Kuppa

 

I think that the problem there is Blizzard doesn't care too much about the pvp in WoW. Look at gaming outlets, they don't really cover it thoroughly like they do LoL, CoD, SF, SC2, ect.

GW2 is also nowhere near esport status but they seem interested and invested in making it happen.

Not really. ANet 'says' a lot of things but you don't see much from them.

Esports is big business but it is also very new.

Recent IPL 5 had 'college football' view numbers, that's large enough for advertisers (mainstream ones) to notice and enquire.

 

Blizzard actually invests real $$$ / staff / resources towards esports.

All I see from ANet is just another empty promise from an MMO-Dev.

Starcraft 2, yes - totally. It's a great e-sport and a fantastic meta. Blizzard puts lots of money into SC2 and it shows.

But the main thing is that SC2 actually has a good meta, and a solid PVP game for competitive play.

WoW is unbalanced garbage and will never be an e-sport. They tried in TBC but now even Blizzard doesn't try to get it on ESL, MLG etc.

WoW arena really is a joke, it's just the same 20 non-professional players year after year doing the only thing they know how, and no one in e-sports cares.

Originally posted by Greyhooff

 

 

Starcraft 2, yes - totally. It's a great e-sport and a fantastic meta. Blizzard puts lots of money into SC2 and it shows.

But the main thing is that SC2 actually has a good meta, and a solid PVP game for competitive play.

WoW is unbalanced garbage and will never be an e-sport. They tried in TBC but now even Blizzard doesn't try to get it on ESL, MLG etc.

WoW arena really is a joke, it's just the same players year after year doing the only thing they know how, and no one in e-sports cares.

WoW's raid stream had respectable numbers actually.

It wasn't LoL / SC2 numbers but it wasn't that bad.

Think WoW Arena with DOTA mixed-in would do fairly well actually.

Originally posted by jpnz

Originally posted by Greyhooff

 

 

Starcraft 2, yes - totally. It's a great e-sport and a fantastic meta. Blizzard puts lots of money into SC2 and it shows.

But the main thing is that SC2 actually has a good meta, and a solid PVP game for competitive play.

WoW is unbalanced garbage and will never be an e-sport. They tried in TBC but now even Blizzard doesn't try to get it on ESL, MLG etc.

WoW arena really is a joke, it's just the same players year after year doing the only thing they know how, and no one in e-sports cares.

WoW's raid stream had respectable numbers actually.

It wasn't LoL / SC2 numbers but it wasn't that bad.

Think WoW Arena with DOTA mixed-in would do fairly well actually.

WoW cannot be an esport. The metagame is just wrong, unbalanced and boring for competitive PVP. 

GW2 on the other hand is actually much closer to LoL and has a good shot in the next few months to get there, especially as it has actual e-sports backing rather than the wishful thinking of PVE players. 

LoL took a year to get to esports viability, and GW2 is well on the way already, especially when you consider the discussion posted above, it's the sort of talks Riot Games had when tweaking the meta for LoL in the early months.

Bear in mind that 3 months in, not many expected League to be e-sports viable, but Riot kept working on the meta and on PVP balance and now League is the #1 e-sport in the world, ahead even of SC2.

Pretty doubtful.  As much as I enjoy GW2's pvp, i'm not going to pretend its something which it isn't - and that is a hugely popular competitive online game.  And I think the SPvP community would generally agree with me.

The first month of guild wars 2, there was a lot of excitement surrounding Spvp.  Players were getting up to 6k viewers at a time for their streams.  There was a huge interest on who the top teams and players were, what the best builds were, what kind of strategy was being used, what kind of gear combination, team comp, ect. 

But, the more people played, the more the shortcomings started to come out.  Balance became a joke (and still is for some professions and builds).  There are a TON of bugs which are easily overlooked because theres so much going on during PvP.

Now, streams get 200 viewers at peak time.  There just generally is a lack of interest.  GW2's pvp is far behind WoW's pvp in terms of popularity, let alone starcraft 2 and League of Legends which in turn are far more popular then WoW, E-Sport wise.

Also, don't tell me this is the most balanced MMO.  Its not.  Blind fanboyism right there.

Originally posted by Greyhooff

 

 

WoW cannot be an esport. The metagame is just wrong, unbalanced and boring for competitive PVP. 

GW2 on the other hand is actually much closer to LoL and has a good shot in the next few months to get there, especially as it has actual e-sports backing rather than the wishful thinking of PVE players. 

LoL took a year to get to esports viability, and GW2 is well on the way already, especially when you consider the discussion posted above, it's the sort of talks Riot Games had when tweaking the meta for LoL in the early months.

Bear in mind that 3 months in, not many expected League to be e-sports viable, but Riot kept working on the meta and on PVP balance and now League is the #1 e-sport in the world, ahead even of SC2.

LoL being in the esports scene has little to do with 'balance' and more to do with the fact there are 70 Million accounts that play that game. Riot also throws huge amount of money which I can't see ANet doing; esp since we are talking 'Millions' in prize money.

Originally posted by Kuppa

Originally posted by fat_taddler

Originally posted by Greyhooff

If this open, unscripted discussion with the developers is anything to go by:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hByqoWsnz-I&hd=1

GW2 is set for huge e-sport success.

They are very clear that they are not rushing it, but the announced balance changes, the pacing of changes, the way they are approaching their PVP game is fantastic.

I also LOVED the fact that this guy says clearly that some noobs just need to L2P. That kind of frankness only comes from someone who plays the game extensively himself, a developer who is also a competitive player = awesome.

No bullcrap, no marketing spin, just a skilled PVP developer with opinions and ideas who is open about discussing with the players.

You can tell this guy really cares about balance and competitive gaming above all, and that's exactly what you want.

Let's face it, PVP in other MMOs like SWTOR, WoW, Aion, AOC, etc is a joke. No one takes it seriously, and no MMO has e-sport PVP. It's too unbalanced.

GW2 has a very good chance at it because it's already the most balanced MMO, and about to become even more balanced in every little detail.

I think that with the mindset displayed in the video, they might have the biggest esport game of 2013. 

Anyway, just watch it in full and make up your own mind.

Blizzard just had their WoW Arena World Championships a couple of weeks ago.  It had Arena teams from all over the world going head to head for an entire weekend.   Not sure where you're getting your facts from.

 

http://us.battle.net/wow/en/blog/7831336/The_Battlenet_World_Championship_has_Concluded_VODs_Inside-11_17_2012

I think that the problem there is Blizzard doesn't care too much about the pvp in WoW. Look at gaming outlets, they don't really cover it thoroughly like they do LoL, CoD, SF, SC2, ect.

GW2 is also nowhere near esport status but they seem interested and invested in making it happen.

I think Blizzard has tried since the arena scene eventually became really popular once TBC was released.  But the problem is, and Blizzard realized this later but they wouldn't say it, the problem is that WoW wasn't meant to be a very competitive pvp game, let alone an e-sport.  Its a game that's main goal has been and will always be to get better loot.  Its not spectator friendly.  It has suffered from balance issues throughout it's existence.  And, on top of all that, every expansion, they re-make a lot of the mechanics and features.

While they did a fantastic job with the mechanics and controls, and they allowed pvp in their game, and eventually things just started following into place, Blizzard wasn't really prepared for the publics desire to see WoW's arena scene flourish like SC and WC did.  After all, WoW's main devs were huge EQ nerds and stated they wanted to make something similar to that.  They stated at one point that they wish they didn't put in arena before rated battlegrounds because the constant need to balance classes in arena was too much work.

Originally posted by jpnz

Originally posted by Greyhooff

 

 

WoW cannot be an esport. The metagame is just wrong, unbalanced and boring for competitive PVP. 

GW2 on the other hand is actually much closer to LoL and has a good shot in the next few months to get there, especially as it has actual e-sports backing rather than the wishful thinking of PVE players. 

LoL took a year to get to esports viability, and GW2 is well on the way already, especially when you consider the discussion posted above, it's the sort of talks Riot Games had when tweaking the meta for LoL in the early months.

Bear in mind that 3 months in, not many expected League to be e-sports viable, but Riot kept working on the meta and on PVP balance and now League is the #1 e-sport in the world, ahead even of SC2.

LoL being in the esports scene has little to do with 'balance' and more to do with the fact there are 70 Million accounts that play that game. Riot also throws huge amount of money which I can't see ANet doing; esp since we are talking 'Millions' in prize money.

I can see all this happening in GW2 in a few years time.

League didn't launch being an esport with million dollar prizes.

That came after years of growing popularity due to Riot's focus on PVP balance, tweaking, meta analysis and dialogue with gamers - and GW2 is making the same moves, that's what the video is all about.

Originally posted by Greyhooff

GW2 is set for huge e-sport success.

lol 

No.

Originally posted by Foomerang

I think anet devs talk too much imo. Seems like every day, one of em is pushing something onto us.

, and when they talk, they use such hyperbola. Reminds me of Gab and the BioWare gang. 

I just don't think you can say  "This will be a big Esport." It's something that kinda has to happens.