Originally posted by BadSpock

 

Let's face it - SWG may have had some great ideas, but the implementation was so poor the writing was on the wall since launch people.

SOE mismanaged and ran this thing into the ground long before WoW came out in 2004 and stole just about everyone who was still playing SWG.

With all that said and still people claim it to be the best goes to tell you how good it really was flaws and all. The search continues......

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by BadSpock

/snip

Let's face it - SWG may have had some great ideas, but the implementation was so poor the writing was on the wall since launch people.

SOE mismanaged and ran this thing into the ground long before WoW came out in 2004 and stole just about everyone who was still playing SWG.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Go look at the chart at MMOCharts.com to see the best numbers available.

It shows: there were plenty of people playing SWG, in regards to total historial numbers for SWG numbers after the launch of WoW.

There were heavy drops after: 1. the CU (which was badly done) and 2. the NGE (the worst patch in MMO history).

You didn't like SWG, fine.

There were plenty of people that did, and considering its low production price, it was solidly financially successful as well.

 

What killed the game and its subs was the Holocron. This was told by Raph Koster himself a ways back. You can find it on his web site if you want to dig it up. 

Originally posted by Zekiah

Regardless of the bugs Spock, the game was DAMN fun. All they had to do was fix what they had but they chose not to.

I'd still be playing today if they did.

I would too.

The game had so much potential.

I left when they told me that "content' was grinding out a dozen or so professions in order to try and unlock my FS slot.

Professions I had NO interest in pursuing - the first Holocron I got was for Doctor I believe.

I wanted to be a SMUGGLER, I wanted them to FIX SMUGGLER.

I didn't want to be a Doctor, I didn't want to be a crafter, I wanted to be a Smuggler and Pilot and both of those parts of the game were complete trash.

They lost my sub by failing to do exactly what you said - fix what they had.

That's the true story of SWG people - failed execution.

That is what makes it's story so damned tragic - it had the potential to be THE defining MMORPG of the genre - a true game-changer that would last forever and be the touch stone of every game to follow.

But they f*cked it up - and they lost their players - and then someone came along and did a whole lot better at the execution part.

Can you guess what game that was/is? lol

Originally posted by Zeppelin4

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by BadSpock

/snip

Let's face it - SWG may have had some great ideas, but the implementation was so poor the writing was on the wall since launch people.

SOE mismanaged and ran this thing into the ground long before WoW came out in 2004 and stole just about everyone who was still playing SWG.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Go look at the chart at MMOCharts.com to see the best numbers available.

It shows: there were plenty of people playing SWG, in regards to total historial numbers for SWG numbers after the launch of WoW.

There were heavy drops after: 1. the CU (which was badly done) and 2. the NGE (the worst patch in MMO history).

You didn't like SWG, fine.

There were plenty of people that did, and considering its low production price, it was solidly financially successful as well.

 

What killed the game and its subs was the Holocron. This was told by Raph Koster himself a ways back. You can find it on his web site if you want to dig it up. 

That is what he said, in regards to hurting the fabric of the player interdependency part of the game. And he was right.

But that is not what made the majority of people quit.

The stupidifying of the game mechanics with the CU/NGE did far more damage.

Originally posted by mmoDAD
... still can't find one that holds my attention like old SWG did.

I feel the same way with Dark Age of Camelot, before they put in the turds called new frontiers and trials of atlantis. That was by far the best mmo I've ever played.

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by Zeppelin4

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by BadSpock

/snip

Let's face it - SWG may have had some great ideas, but the implementation was so poor the writing was on the wall since launch people.

SOE mismanaged and ran this thing into the ground long before WoW came out in 2004 and stole just about everyone who was still playing SWG.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Go look at the chart at MMOCharts.com to see the best numbers available.

It shows: there were plenty of people playing SWG, in regards to total historial numbers for SWG numbers after the launch of WoW.

There were heavy drops after: 1. the CU (which was badly done) and 2. the NGE (the worst patch in MMO history).

You didn't like SWG, fine.

There were plenty of people that did, and considering its low production price, it was solidly financially successful as well.

 

What killed the game and its subs was the Holocron. This was told by Raph Koster himself a ways back. You can find it on his web site if you want to dig it up. 

That is what he said, in regards to hurting the fabric of the player interdependency part of the game. And he was right.

But that is not what made the majority of people quit.

The stupidifying of the game mechanics with the CU/NGE did far more damage.

 

Again he said the Holocron did all the damage. The subs started to bleed when the holocron hit the game. That is how the NGE was born the final nail in the coffin. 

Originally posted by BadSpock

Originally posted by Zekiah

Regardless of the bugs Spock, the game was DAMN fun. All they had to do was fix what they had but they chose not to.

I'd still be playing today if they did.

I would too.

The game had so much potential.

I left when they told me that "content' was grinding out a dozen or so professions in order to try and unlock my FS slot.

Professions I had NO interest in pursuing - the first Holocron I got was for Doctor I believe.

I wanted to be a SMUGGLER, I wanted them to FIX SMUGGLER.

I didn't want to be a Doctor, I didn't want to be a crafter, I wanted to be a Smuggler and Pilot and both of those parts of the game were complete trash.

They lost my sub by failing to do exactly what you said - fix what they had.

That's the true story of SWG people - failed execution.

That is what makes it's story so damned tragic - it had the potential to be THE defining MMORPG of the genre - a true game-changer that would last forever and be the touch stone of every game to follow.

But they f*cked it up - and they lost their players - and then someone came along and did a whole lot better at the execution part.

Can you guess what game that was/is? lol

Well, if they would have spent their time fixing Smuggler and adding space/ground smuggling missions (would have been frikkin' cool heh) instead of coming out with a new game every year or so, it would have been epic.

But that's what happens when you have a bunch of jack wagons in charge, you get a whole bunch of fail.

Originally posted by Zeppelin4

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by Zeppelin4

Originally posted by Burntvet

Originally posted by BadSpock

/snip

Let's face it - SWG may have had some great ideas, but the implementation was so poor the writing was on the wall since launch people.

SOE mismanaged and ran this thing into the ground long before WoW came out in 2004 and stole just about everyone who was still playing SWG.

Never let the truth get in the way of a good story.

Go look at the chart at MMOCharts.com to see the best numbers available.

It shows: there were plenty of people playing SWG, in regards to total historial numbers for SWG numbers after the launch of WoW.

There were heavy drops after: 1. the CU (which was badly done) and 2. the NGE (the worst patch in MMO history).

You didn't like SWG, fine.

There were plenty of people that did, and considering its low production price, it was solidly financially successful as well.

 

What killed the game and its subs was the Holocron. This was told by Raph Koster himself a ways back. You can find it on his web site if you want to dig it up. 

That is what he said, in regards to hurting the fabric of the player interdependency part of the game. And he was right.

But that is not what made the majority of people quit.

The stupidifying of the game mechanics with the CU/NGE did far more damage.

 

Again he said the Holocron did all the damage. The subs started to bleed when the holocron hit the game. That is how the NGE was born the final nail in the coffin. 

That may be what he said, and what you believe, but it is not born out by the available sub numbers.

There were declines after SWG peaked, but the substantial dips were after each of the CU and NGE patches.

Heck, in the late CU timeframe subs were even increasing again, because SOE had a team of 2-3 fixing and cleaning up a lot of broken bits and making small changes that people wanted for ever (increasing the base inv from 50 to 80, increasing factory crate size for some things, cleaning up the "Shuttle crash in the wilderness bug and many others).

Yes, Hologrinding/holocrons were not good for the game, but those were not the worst things.

^^^^

Well I will side with Raph on this and my game play experience. What is ironic is Bad Spock post right after mine says he left because of the Holocron. :P

Originally posted by Zeppelin4

^^^^

Well I will side with Raph on this and my game play experience. What is ironic is Bad Spock post right after mine says he left because of the Holocron. :P

remember ppl was in large groups AFKing spots with fast NPC respawns just for the holocrons

all planets was filled with those

also the permadeath helped the game to go for the NGE.

every huge change in a game brings lower subs, but the game with NGE after 1 year it was stabilized and regenerated fast with new players

I still dont get why no other game to my knowledge has had a entertainer class.

It brought players into the cantina , created a social expierience  and gave people buffs.

It was perfect.

8 years playing wow and Im still waiting for those players to go to the tavern and talk about the good hunt over some beers like wow said the taverns were for.

Lets not forget what they did to the Creature handler class. Everyone complained about people running around with 3 rancors. There was a SIMPLE fix they could have done to correct that issue but they didnt do it. All they had to do was fix the master level option where we could give pets away. It was supposed to be only able to do that at master level and only to other master level players. Instead they had to redo the entire freaking profession and completely ripped it to shreads and litterly killed the profession all together. Their response when they put in the sweeping change? "We will revist these changes in 1 year". Are you freaking kidding me? There are multiple reasonsI hate smedley and that one was the top of the heap. You dont screw over an entire class like that and then tell your playerbase to shut up, we are not going to listen to you for a year and then we will probably not do anything then. The NGE was yet another proof that smedley thinks he is god and that its his way or nothing. How he is still employed I will never know. He doesn't know jack shit about running an MMO.  It still amazes me that after EQ, he still doesn't understand his players. Players prove him wrong time and time again and instead of going hey, you are right, its broken, he will flat out call you a liar and tell you to kiss his ass. The only way sony is ever going to make a comeback in the mmo world is to get rid smedley and get a person in there that knows how to listen to their playerbase. 

Sadly for me, they ruined swg 3 months into the game when they effectively killed the creature handler class and it was 100% smedleys fault. I honestly have never hated a person as much as smedley and the sad part is I have never actually met him.