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EVE Online

EVE Online 

Jita (General)  » Nothing but a game of old players ganking newer ones.

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53 posts found
  notmex

Novice Member

Joined: 1/08/05
Posts: 43

 
OP  11/25/12 9:02:11 AM#1

Just look at their own forums. They are full of it. It truly is sickening.

 

I played for a few months, and it is really pathetic how older players prey on newer ones and call it skill.

 

The training model in this game gives older players a huge advantage in armor, hull, shields, weapon damage over newer players that can really never be made up.

 

What made me sick is how older players call it skill. Yes, it's very skillful to sit and watch your skill points tick by for a year or two so you can gank players under 6 months.

 

 

  User Deleted
11/25/12 9:07:27 AM#2

This just looks like a angry post from someone who has been killed in Eve by going into the wrong security area in space.

Ofc folks who have been playing the game for longer will have more skill points. And you will always get gankers in pvp games.

You have to approach this Eve in a diferent method to normal mmo's or as you have portraid here, you wont last.

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

11/25/12 9:09:54 AM#3

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  notmex

Novice Member

Joined: 1/08/05
Posts: 43

 
OP  11/25/12 9:12:00 AM#4
Originally posted by coxyroxy

This just looks like a angry post from someone who has been killed in Eve by going into the wrong security area in space.

Ofc folks who have been playing the game for longer will have more skill points. And you will always get gankers in pvp games.

You have to approach this Eve in a diferent method to normal mmo's or as you have portraid here, you wont last.

Ahh yes. My point exactly.

  pyrofreak

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/01/04
Posts: 1500

Peace (noun): A period of cheating between two wars.

11/25/12 9:15:50 AM#5

Every time some newbie goes on forums somewhere to complain about being ganked in EvE, I endeavour to gank a few more.

 

Go join RvB and learn to fight, and learn to love to fight.

Now with 57.3% more flames!

  User Deleted
11/25/12 9:16:37 AM#6
Originally posted by notmex
Originally posted by coxyroxy
 

Ahh yes. My point exactly.

I have to question whether this thread has a "point" at all.

  Loktofeit

Elite Member

Joined: 1/13/10
Posts: 12276

Currently playing EVE, SMITE, Project Gorgon, and Combat Arms

11/25/12 9:21:00 AM#7
Originally posted by pyrofreak

Go join RvB and learn to fight, and learn to love to fight.

Great advice!

RvB is a player-run organization that does small ship faction combat. It's a great way to experience PvP, learn the ropes and have fun in the process.

 

"And wikipedia is as accurate as Britannica. Wikipedia is very reliable. You would be hard pressed to find a more reliable source for these kinds of things." -fivoroth

  blackthornn

Novice Member

Joined: 7/31/04
Posts: 527

OMG I'm not temp banned again? WTF?? This day does end in Y right?

11/25/12 9:22:30 AM#8

lol if the game is as you say, did you really expect to get sympathy here where you are complaining about EVE players on the EVE section of a forum site where I'd guess about 30% atleast of the population are or have been EVE players?

 

I hate ganking, I hate open world pvp.  not my style (I prefer my pvp to be more e-sports oriented but that's just me and my opinion on it).  But really, to bitch about it on a section of the forum for an open world pvp game based on ganking and kill them all and take the cargo...................

 

 

yeah.  My 5 year old is laughing at you right now.  She looked at it as pirates....any pirate, with any skill, would prey on the easiest victims for fast loot, maybe not as good of loot as taking on a royal treasury frigate transporting tax tithes but 200 fast and easy adds up.  She phrased it as "big priates would run over lots of little ships and take their stuff easier than fighting another big ship and have to fight all day to beat them and maybe lose right?"

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

11/25/12 9:23:52 AM#9
Originally posted by bunnyhopper

I have to question whether this thread has a "point" at all.

Eve seems to generate a lot of QQ?  Would have considered that a 'given'.

You play in the sandbox, some big bully comes and kicks your firetruck.

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  DarSepki

Apprentice Member

Joined: 12/22/10
Posts: 51

11/25/12 9:29:44 AM#10

So it is like every other game that allows ganking in one way or other.

But the real question, is why do you feel this way? There are plenty of functional roles a new player, one who had played for a few months can get into. In under 3 months I got into an interceptor, and I still fly frigates half the time even after 4 years. T3 BCs can be amazing sniper boats, but a week old rifter can ruin one of thier days.

What new players lack is experience. There are plenty of ways to take advantage of a PVP situation over older, higher SP players.

  User Deleted
11/25/12 9:34:50 AM#11
Originally posted by notmex

Just look at their own forums. They are full of it. It truly is sickening.

 

I played for a few months, and it is really pathetic how older players prey on newer ones and call it skill.

 

The training model in this game gives older players a huge advantage in armor, hull, shields, weapon damage over newer players that can really never be made up.

 

What made me sick is how older players call it skill. Yes, it's very skillful to sit and watch your skill points tick by for a year or two so you can gank players under 6 months.

The good ,the bad and the ugly.

Its perfect scenario,imagine The good,the good and the good.

When you have those advantages,imagine what all kind of good things you can do with those or bad or ugly.

 

  Deathenger

Advanced Member

Joined: 9/07/08
Posts: 395

Wipe yourself off, U DEAD!

11/25/12 9:36:10 AM#12

Really? I dont know about you but I dont recall threads about newb hunting and drueling over killing/campintg new players. Not many people want to get concorded in Empire space just to kill your Ibis and pod with no implants. I'm thinking the game was too hard for you, or you wandered into low/null security space and someone sent you back to the clone vat, or your just hating for the hell of it and never even played the game!

Older players have a TEMPORARY advantage. Just because you cant fly a capital ship or Armageddon right out of the box doesent mean you cant be competive in a couple months.... just like any other game!

As far as skill goes, well let me just tell you I have only recently started to get into PvP with the Red vs Blue alliance. I lost a ton of ships trying to learn all the details like managing modules, range, transversal speed, cap management on active mods.... ect. Within the last couple weeks I went from free lunch to a compeditor. I'm now confident I can beat any frig unless I go up against a ship fitted specifically to counter mine.

Proof? Sure I got some. In this first video, I had previously fought this guys Merlin, well I messed up and capped out and my after burner offlined, allowing him to get out of warp scram range and warping off half way into hull. Well he decided to come back in a ship with a capicitor Neut to try and counter my cap munching duel armor repair setup. Wow... listen to me, talking like I somewhat know my stuff, but are fairly new to the pvp game.... enjoy this first video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ypI3nD3-aQo

So now in the second video I'm 1 v 1 a guy who clearly has been playting a hell of a lot longer than I have, and I can almost guarantee hes sitting on over 500million isk in implants where I have maybe 50mil in implants.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XETUJy9WaMw

Now, I'm not going to pretend I'm using a newb character. I have a 87million skill point toon that I aquired from a kind gentleman from these very forums in a "You can have my stuff" thread. I found out when I first started playing this character, you cannot buy "skills" in eve. There is no pay to win no matter how much ISK you have. This is skill based pvp but there is also the chance of fighting the wrong ship too, because there is more skill than just flying your ship. You have to have skill at knowledge of the game too! Just like it takes time to train up your skills, it also takes time to learn how to use them.

  free2play

Hard Core Member

Joined: 10/13/05
Posts: 1807

11/25/12 8:56:38 PM#13

EVE has a bad habit of talking out of both sides of its mouth.

You get banned for going to a noob system and griefing people there. Yet leave that over populated pocket and you are ripped to shreds for the mail it creates. EVE O GD is the biggest liability to EVE right now. You will be trolled, flamed, insulted and humiliated at every corner if you go in there and show signs you aren't a hard core fanboi. If you pay attention, you will see it's less than 50 people doing it but they are relentless.

Much like the habits in the game, it's an extreme minority but it's like poison. It don't take much to kill a man. or a game.

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19097

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

11/25/12 9:05:30 PM#14
What can I say, there's dues to be paid, like any mmorpg, perhaps EVE's is a bit longer than most, but specialize properly and you will be competitive with anyone. But if you don't think there isn't any skill involved well then you really don't know EVE.

Arrogant, Dismissive, Elitist, you speak as if these are bad things?
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  KhinRunite

Novice Member

Joined: 11/05/10
Posts: 897

11/25/12 9:11:04 PM#15
OP you should find a game where actual skill decides the outcome of a match, and not by virtue of points earned over time.
  idgarad

Novice Member

Joined: 7/22/09
Posts: 175

11/25/12 10:34:52 PM#16
Originally posted by notmex

Just look at their own forums. They are full of it. It truly is sickening.

 

I played for a few months, and it is really pathetic how older players prey on newer ones and call it skill.

 

The training model in this game gives older players a huge advantage in armor, hull, shields, weapon damage over newer players that can really never be made up.

 

What made me sick is how older players call it skill. Yes, it's very skillful to sit and watch your skill points tick by for a year or two so you can gank players under 6 months.

 

 

That's pretty much a flat out lie born out of not undestanding how the game actually works. However rather then just be a douche about it, here is some education.

 

The way skills work in relation to ships is larger ships have more skill pre-requisites then smaller ship. So to be a cap skilled Battleship pilot for example may take say 70 million skill points while a cap frigate pilot may take only 20 million skill points.

Now your ship, regardless of size has a concept of a "Fit" or for non-eve players, it is effectively a spec line.

Now the bettter your fitting skills are the more stuff you can effectively fit in the ship. WIth 10 million skill points you might be able to fit 2 shield hardeners but with 15 million skill points you might be able to squeeze a third hardener in there. Either way there are a max number of high, medium, and low slots and a limit on your ship's CPU and Powergrid. Fitting skills can increase those as well as reduce item's needs for Powergrid and CPU.

Higher skill pilots\older pilots have two advantages: They usually have better fitting skills and they have more money.

What does have all 5's in a skill get you in a Loki versus all 4's with the identical equipment (Quick Example)?

+21 DPS, +600 EHP (Effective Hitpoints) and the ability to run a shield repper for 12 minutes rather then 6 minutes.

Average fight duration in low-sec? < 30 seconds. In PvP most people don't active rep anyway.

The margin a higher-skill player has shrinks with the ship. Since most pvp is in frigates, destroyers, and cruisers the difference between a year old pilot and a 10 year veteran is actually tiny.

However, Eve Online is a game that I will firmly state requires about a year of investment to really get a good footing.

Eve Online is less a game and more a simulation. In fact I would use the term 'Hobby'. It is closer to model trains then say World of Warcraft. It just so happens that people can blow up your train set.

I did a simple test after reading this: I created a 14 day trial Minmatar pilot and took my 25 mil skill point pilot and put them both in a rifter with basic meta 1 (basic) fits. I had them orbit one another at 2000 and hit fire on both of them to compare.

The test toon's ship popped when the 25 mil skill point pilot was 50% into armor. So the skilled character has about a 25% advantage compared to the 7 day old character. That isn't bad at all.

Now interestingly enough in what 4 years of playing I've only been in a solo pvp fight, perhaps 5 times. Eve is oddly a very social game, fly alone, die alone. 

With new chances coming in December it will make it easier for newer players to spec into ships to 'catch up' to more established pilots. Eve does have some serious problems with engaging new players but old players preying on new players? To be honest... new players cost too much. In hi-sec I'm not going to blow a 10 mil fit destroyer to blow up a new player for 10k in salvage, a bunch of tech-1 junk, and shitty implants.

For new players also the difference between PvP and PvE fits for ships is MUCH MUCH MORE STARK then in other MMOs. In a lot of MMOs you can use PvE and PvP mix and match a lot more then in Eve. A great example is to check Battleclinic's fitting database for say, a Hurricane and see the difference in PvE vs PvP fits.

99% of the posters like this are usually pilots that fly into 0.0 or low-sec not understanding those areas and getting blown up. This game requires actual skill, not at flying imaginary ships, but paying attention (Situational Awareness). Do I orbit at 5k or 15k? Do I use Thermal damage or Kinetic? Is it better to use a bigger shield repper less often or use a smaller shield repper constantly? Understanding how gate camps work. How to scout. Understanding when to use your pod for scouting low-sec (insta-warp) and when not to (0.0 with warp bubbles). Not flying directly to things. etc. It has a learning curve... not a game mechanics learning curve, the game itself is actually simple to play. It is the application of those game mechanics where the learning curve is.

Now my borderline douche statement:

If you are going to bitch about Eve Online as "Someone who's played a few months" those few months had better have been with Eve University, otherwise you are just blowing smoke up other people's asses and talking smack about shit you couldn't figure out on your own.

The Ultimate Eve Online Summary:

Eve Online's 'tutorial' ends when you hit 5 million skill points. If you haven't hit 5 million skill points, "You are still in tutorial mode, play accordingly"

 

  User Deleted
11/25/12 10:40:48 PM#17
Originally posted by bunnyhopper
Originally posted by notmex
Originally posted by coxyroxy
 

Ahh yes. My point exactly.

I have to question whether this thread has a "point" at all.

yup lol +1

  Boldyn

Novice Member

Joined: 12/29/04
Posts: 262

11/25/12 10:47:24 PM#18

Debate-ending fact:

 

Only way to get ganked in EVE is if you allow them to gank you.

 

End of story.

  Chivalry1978

Novice Member

Joined: 8/06/04
Posts: 193

Life is a game, just without a reset button

11/25/12 10:51:02 PM#19

I played Eve for over 4 years...Im not gonna lie a great amount of that time was spent training and farming plexs..many a weeks all I did was log on to change skills.  After this 4 years I was able to gank almost everyone I saw. There was no skill to it really, not like when eve first came out and everyone was on par with each other, then you had to have skills and tactics, now its basicly invest 6 months and follow a pvp training guide to skills. 

The reality is that Eves pvp is not casual gamer friendly and does tailor itself to the those who have been there longer. It has little to do with actual skill but more to do with skill points. Eve will never change this as those people who have been playing for so long would cry worse then the casual gamer because in order to stay on top in pvp they would actually have to have skill...This would cause a mass exodus of their player base....So just dont play. In all honesty its kinda a crap game with way to much micromanagement.

 

  injenu

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/11
Posts: 144

11/25/12 10:56:27 PM#20

I can sympathize with the idea that there's some elitism when it comes to EVE.  I remember going on my first few fleet blobs with 200+ pilots and not understanding half the shit the FC would say, and would get admonished for simply not knowing terminology. 

In regards to older players ganking newer players, this is just a matter of "We went through it, so you must as well" type of attitude.  I agree with this sentiment, because if not for being ganked, scammed, and admonished in the way in which I was, you would never learn to stay alive. That's what this game is all about, which is resourcefullness, as well as mental toughness from the losses you will take on the way. 

 

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