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11/20/12 10:40:03 AM#201
Originally posted by ShakyMo It is an FPS style game - you forgot and that is what many console games are.
if you like it great. But, let us give it a a week or 2 and I bet the hangman's noose will be out for this game too. It is all the new rage!!!  "You can fool some of the people all the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all the time." Abraham Lincoln |
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11/20/12 10:40:47 AM#202
Originally posted by ShakyMo
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11/20/12 10:43:22 AM#203
Sorry about the previous post. It broke the formatting and won't show me edit buttons. Let me try to make it better so they can remove the other one. Original Post: If there is no problem. Why are people waiting in queues for around an hour to do the dungeon when a day ago they were waiting minutes. Could it be that the "event" population left? Perhaps. Could it be that people are starting to move on? Perhaps. You want some metrics, watch this site over time and see what you discover. I too like evidence over claims and maybe this can give you some data that can be surveyed.
http://www.gw2lfg.com/
Scui Fractals of the Mists North America LFG FoM-12 less than a minute |
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11/20/12 10:44:48 AM#204
You are kuppa
WvW costs too much gold, you're forced into doing pve or using the cash shop to pay for it. You cant earn the gold to cover repairs and seige equipment through WvW alone. Also its inadvisable to enter WvW until you have your elite slot, yeah you're not technically forced but you are cannon fodder unless you level in pve to 30 or so first. |
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11/20/12 10:45:11 AM#205
If you believe the Forums then Yes. However, I used to be able to get into Lion's Arch on my Server without being transferred to an overflow. Now every time I go there I'm in an overflow I'm not giving a conclusion one way or the other as my Server may not be an accurate representation. |
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11/20/12 10:46:26 AM#206
Kuppa also no its not on a weekly timer like gw2.
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11/20/12 10:48:07 AM#207
Originally posted by ShakyMo I don't see why you can't. There is actual pve in wvw that can nab you a ton of gold. I wasn't counting that as regular pve because its part of wvw. I also don't think thats right. WvW is very crowded, you just have to make sure you play it safe until higher levels. Besides you level up pretty fast in WvW. I've actually got one character were I do mostly wvw on and I've been there at level 10, didn't die much either.
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11/20/12 10:48:42 AM#208
Originally posted by ShakyMo Is it on a timer though?? I thought it was on some sort of timer at one point.
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11/20/12 10:50:36 AM#209
Originally posted by cgnius As others have said, people who are happy with the game, don't usually post unless there is a technical problem, etc. People who don't like the game or just dislike it (I will not use the word hate any more) will post because they feel they need to be heard. That is fine but, don't take those posts as the majority of players or anything else. They are the people who want to complain.
Complain away, but pleae be educated about the complaints. "You can fool some of the people all the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all the time." Abraham Lincoln |
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11/20/12 10:52:42 AM#210
Originally posted by botrytis EvE does a lot right of what SHOULD make a MMORPG - but the game is not without it's fair share of problems (of which I could go on and on about them) which is why I think you see a lot of success and loyalty from EvE players and why so many are curious about EvE but in the end don't stick with it (like me.) As it relates to GW2 though, they get a lot of things right in what makes a good themepark MMO but on a basic design level they also made some pretty glaring mistakes - mistakes I don't think they forsaw as I know I sure didn't until they were in my face. I actually think GW1 was a better designed game for what it was trying to be. MMO History: |
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11/20/12 11:00:06 AM#211
I would agree GW1 has a better design for what it is, but the comparison between instanced lobby style and persistent world isn't fair because the latter introduces so many more hurdles and a level of complexity that the lobby style doesn't have to deal with. The main criticism I have for GW2, and this is true for most games, is that it is systems light. The only two systems GW2 has are its sPvP and crafting - those are actual systems. Everything else is content churn. I would go out on a limb and say that most game suffer from this. Trion has tried to introduce a freeform housing system in the form of Dimensions that is very rough and unpolished, but is the right direction to go in my opinion. Not so much housing itself (although I like that) but the idea of adding systems to their game in a way that allow players to create their own environment and world. I think Trion's system is still too on rails and disconnected from the rest of the game to be anything but a sideshow at this point, but at least they have made the attempt. Hopefully dev studios will start adding integrated systems into their games because this is what will keep players busy and can add a dynamic to the world that developers can't create by themselves. |
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GeezerGamer
 Advanced Member
Joined: 4/03/12
Who ever said "Familiarity breeds contempt" didn't have an internet connection. |
11/20/12 11:11:49 AM#212
Originally posted by BadSpock THIS. There is no doubt that ANET took a long look at what the major complaints were about themeparks and why games like WoW were losing Subs. But I also think that many players left WoW for reasons other than what they said. It's tough to explain, but players lost a "feeling" they got when they played WoW. And then to try to put that into words and explain why. So much was lost in that translation. So when ANET decided to design a game around it, they heard the words, but missed the "feeling".
I think they tried too hard to be too radically different all at once and as a result introduced to many new and untested mechanics. These mechanics had too many unforseen and undesireable dynamics. Mechanics such as allowing to post items to the TP from anywhere. In retrospect, it's probably not one of the better mechanics in terms of helping the game's economy....if it ever really had one.
I think the biggest area ANET "missed the boat" was trying to make the grind "fun" people who have been around MMOs since long before 2008 remember what grinding was. Yeah, we hated it, but it was (still is) a necessary evil. Too many games have been removing it. But instead, they need to embrace it. It is necessary afterall. And instead, make it more meaningful. Anyway. To try to make repetition fun in a video game? Not gonna happen. You can make the activities more fun than they were previously, but all that does is make it more enjoyable for a finite number of times before it gets boring. It just takes a tad longer to get boring, but still not long at all.
We played MMOs, not for "fun" but to achieve goals. They have always been goal oriented. The process of achieving those goals was not aways fun. It was never meant to be. But, it was in achieveing those goals, that were were able to create our own periods of "fun". If the conversation turned "Tit-for-Tat", and I've stopped posting, Consider it your win. |
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11/20/12 11:14:54 AM#213
Originally posted by botrytis Dear sir thank you. today is the day I have been on these forums (not registered) since 2004 made an account over a year ago, but today is the day I will be leaving and also you are correct in that post. Happy holidays, see you guys in game.
Add me in-game we will have some fun.
Silk.8302 or Sammy Eli |
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11/20/12 11:37:21 AM#214
Originally posted by GeezerGamer I would agree. If the fact that literally EVERYONE I know (to the tune of about 50 to 60 players) has quit, except for me and my wife, what *am* I supposed to use as an indicator? Not that it matters. Whether there is a mass exodus or not, *I* am experiencing a mass exodus on a personal level. |
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11/20/12 12:01:30 PM#215
Originally posted by Torvaldr Well I think Anet tried to bring some stuff over from GW1 that worked in a lobby style game that wouldn't and obviously doesn't work in a persistent world style game ala GW2. If you are doing a lobby style game, you have to have challenge, dynamic interaction (combat), and measurebale gains (progression.) It doesn't matter if you have to replay the same mission or area dozens of times if that area presents a challenge that must be overcome, if you are required to play competently with precision, and you have measurable gains. That's pretty much the bread and butter of the "themepark" success of games like WoW, which is in itself simply an extension of the Diablo addicitive design philosophy that has been/is still proven to work and be popular. Hell even FPS games like the Halo series and CoD have done incredibly well following those three basic tennants. What happened with GW2 is that Anet is asking players to repeat the same missions or areas dozens of times but -the challenge is artificial, like games of old like Contra etc. it's not really hard per say it's just unforgiving - which leads to frustration more than anything. -there really is no precisioin or required competence in the game play because all of the professions are homogonized into bland replicas of fully formed roles in other games (including their own freshman effort) and as such the "skill" required is summarized into whack-a-mole which even children only find fun at the county fair for a few minutes. -and the rewards are completely undesirable by the masses i.e. no progression. If you want to put a game into a persistent world, you have to reject the tennants of the lobby game almost entirely - you can't water them down and spread them out and try to hide them. WoW works and still works because the level up process is really just an extended tutorial. PvP offers challenge, hard-modes and heroics/challenge-mode dungeons/raids offer challenge. The combat is dynamic in the sense that it is reactive and each player has a defined role that is very well structured and the interactions between players within these roles hasn't been done better in any themepark than it is in WoW. Obviously the reward/progression treadmill is there. But in a persistent world, in order to "do it right" you have to do things completely differently. MMO History: |
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11/20/12 12:13:54 PM#216
No planetside isn't on Any timers,you own a base until one of the other sides take it off you. There's no "oh god I put all that effort in and they swapped the servers around an hour later"
Planetside works pretty much like daoc. |
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11/20/12 12:26:50 PM#217
I am not leaving the game for good since it is non-sub based, but I certainly won't be playing it that often. I am also unlikely to buy any expacs or gems, unless ANet turns around. The Ascended gear is a major turnoff to me.
Playing MUDs and MMOs since 1994. |
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11/20/12 12:32:50 PM#218
Originally posted by BadSpock So rather than putting things in the context with you being the self proclaimed speaker for the masses, why don't you rewrite the statement saying how this applies to you. Just because YOU need such substantial rewards does not mean I want the same thing. Here is an example; I find people that are self-righteously proclaiming to know the desires of the masses, tend to be blinded by their own ego. All of my posts are either intelligent, thought provoking, funny, satirical, sarcastic or intentionally disrespectful. Take your pick. |
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11/20/12 12:46:37 PM#219
Originally posted by eyelolled
Game makers need to consider what lots of players will enjoy. Maybe not "the masses" but a good enough percentage to cover their game financially, at least. I don't know about BadSpock, but when I talk about the popularity of their design decisions, I'm trying to look at it from their perspective, and open that up for discussion. Not just focus exclusively on what I personally enjoy.
What kind of discussion could we even have, just saying "I like this" and "Well, I don't" - there's nothing there to even discuss, really.
When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world. |
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11/20/12 12:54:32 PM#220
Originally posted by Vhaln Thanks for the above. I do agree with you. It seems people are polarized in politics, religion, etc. and why not games too. There is no longer any civil discourse about anything. It all comes down to name calling and attitude.
BadSpock has been very candid and I for one appreciate his thoughtful discourse. I am sorry to see him go but I appreciate the thoughtful remarks and discussion that came from it.
All games have a basic design and with the design comes specific desicions and compromises to make a game work. All games are like that. SWTOR put much of there money into voices, etc. Some put money into graphics engines (TERA with the Unreal 3 engine). All are compromises - we just have to pick what we like and go with it.
God bless all. "You can fool some of the people all the time, and all of the people some of the time, but you cannot fool all of the people all the time." Abraham Lincoln |
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