I'm asking this as an honest question and not as a trolling attempt. Why does everyone think ascended gear is such a horrible thing for the average GW 2 player? From everything I've read, this gear will only be necessary for a very small section of the game. It won't affect your ability to explore the world, play most of the dungeons, or effectively PVP.

I get that ArenaNet talked a lot of smack about "there is no endgame," but if you looked at GW 1 there were several "elite" areas like Realm of Torment and The Deep/Urgoz's Warren that appealed to a very small number of elite dungeon runners. Heck there was a time with the Factions dungeons where you had to be in an elite guild just to access those areas. None of that affected my ability to beat missions, grind titles, or play in team arenas.

So if you're against the new gear, what is your biggest fear? Is it imbalancing WVW, preventing most players from progressing, or creating a sense of elitism in the community?

Because it makes a new level of BiS items even if by only a small margin.  People seem to think this creates a gear grind but it doesnt if you dont care about the marginal stat difference (or farm legendary items which is what this game is about anyway).  I think its over reaction by people who dont understand what the concept really is.  

The majority argument is these stat differences creates a partition between those who have BiS items and those who dont which really isnt the case except in the particular dungeon

Apparently there is allot of people out there dont want to be "outgeared" by the next guy when they take a break from the game for a couple of months or dont play as often as the next guy.  Im not saying thats whats going to happen to GW2 but obviously there is large group of players that are terrified that it will.

Personally I need it to stay engaged in the grind of repeating the same thing over and over and over which happens in games like this. And to me its no different than someone wanting to come back and do something they havent done for years and not wanting anyone to have gotten something they dont have.  Or earned something that makes them more powerfull then them.  Its not realistic in an MMO, even anything remotely close to one like GW2.

I could do without the gear, sure, but i really need something to work towards now, as i'm not a fanatic of pvp.

I have money, exotics, few characters level 80, dungeons have been beat repeatedly for their exotics, and now...now i have nothing to do in this game i love. I dont really care what they give me, just give me something.

     The source of the outrage is less what they are doing, and more about that they lied to us to get us to buy the game. I dont know why it is that people find it hard to believe that there are still people out there that might get a little upset that they basically paid someone for a stated service and then the service was denied. That is pretty much the definition of fraud. 

     Had Arenanet been a bit more honest with there customers up front about there intention to add a gear grind, this wouldnt be an issue. But instead all the prerelease marketing explicitly stated the exact opposite (numerous times and with great detail).

     I have no problem with gear grinds. I have a problem with dishonesty. It is likely that i will abondon this game at some point in the future for a gear grind, but if i do it will be because the other game will not go out of thier way to lie to me about it.

     Im not going to be reactionary about all this. I will still play GW2 till another promising game comes along, but this action on Arenanet's part is the difference between me investing my loyalty and money into GW2 vs me moving onto the next thing.

     I just dont see why i should support a company that thinks so little of its customers that it has to BS them. Maybe many of you will pay for the priveledge of being lied to. I will not. They already rec'd about $400 from me, but they wont see a penny more after this.

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

On top of that, it shows where Arenanets priorities are. They promised this is something they'd never do. And rather than come out and admit to what this is, they tried to play it off like this WASN'T a gear grind.

Meanwhile, their WvW gets no attention, despite it being the part of the game in need of the most.

Originally posted by Nailzzz

     The source of the outrage is less what they are doing, and more about that they lied to us to get us to buy the game. I dont know why it is that people find it hard to believe that there are still people out there that might get a little upset that they basically paid someone for a stated service and then the service was denied. That is pretty much the definition of fraud. 

     Had Arenanet been a bit more honest with there customers up front about there intention to add a gear grind, this wouldnt be an issue. But instead all the prerelease marketing explicitly stated the exact opposite (numerous times and with great detail).

     I have no problem with gear grinds. I have a problem with dishonesty. It is likely that i will abondon this game at some point in the future for a gear grind, but if i do it will be because the other game will not go out of thier way to lie to me about it.

     Im not going to be reactionary about all this. I will still play GW2 till another promising game comes along, but this action on Arenanet's part is the difference between me investing my loyalty and money into GW2 vs me moving onto the next thing.

     I just dont see why i should support a company that thinks so little of its customers that it has to BS them. Maybe many of you will pay for the priveledge of being lied to. I will not. They already rec'd about $400 from me, but they wont see a penny more after this.

but what is now stopping you from doing exactly what you were doing before? just like the OP i dont get what everyone is crying about. your saying arenanet didnt lie to you before this but how is this effecting what you were doing before? i think the world is just going downhill so fast and people do nothing these days but complain and complain when the reality is they dont know what their even complaining about. my question to everyone saying arenanet lied is, until they announced this you were enjoying the game and fealt they didnt lie to you, what is stopping you from doing EXACTLY what you were doing before?

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

yeah there will be different tiers but you wont have to complete tier 1 to get tto tier 2 as they've already explained and stated, again i just dont get what the problem is

Originally posted by BattleFelon

I'm asking this as an honest question and not as a trolling attempt. Why does everyone think ascended gear is such a horrible thing for the average GW 2 player? From everything I've read, this gear will only be necessary for a very small section of the game. 

Ascended gear isn't even necessary for a small section of the game.  It's only required (presumably) to play a more difficult version of the same section of the game you had to play to acquire it in the first place.  You don't miss out on anything.  Moreover, I personally find that the motivation to pursue BIS gear is greatly decreased when I know other players can't examine me.  Yeah I have some green accessories on all of my 80s.  Does anyone know?  Nope.  Does it affect my performance?  Statistically, I'm sure it does, but not in any way I can possibly notice in GW2's combat.  

Originally posted by Nailzzz

     The source of the outrage is less what they are doing, and more about that they lied to us to get us to buy the game. I dont know why it is that people find it hard to believe that there are still people out there that might get a little upset that they basically paid someone for a stated service and then the service was denied. That is pretty much the definition of fraud. 

     Had Arenanet been a bit more honest with there customers up front about there intention to add a gear grind, this wouldnt be an issue. But instead all the prerelease marketing explicitly stated the exact opposite (numerous times and with great detail).

     I have no problem with gear grinds. I have a problem with dishonesty. It is likely that i will abondon this game at some point in the future for a gear grind, but if i do it will be because the other game will not go out of thier way to lie to me about it.

     Im not going to be reactionary about all this. I will still play GW2 till another promising game comes along, but this action on Arenanet's part is the difference between me investing my loyalty and money into GW2 vs me moving onto the next thing.

     I just dont see why i should support a company that thinks so little of its customers that it has to BS them. Maybe many of you will pay for the priveledge of being lied to. I will not. They already rec'd about $400 from me, but they wont see a penny more after this.

Hahaha this is complete and udder melodrama.

There is nothing about Ascended gear that changes the game to any significant degree and I challenge you to prove me wrong.

Never mind the fact Ascended is still not as powerful as Legendaries, which have been in the game since before release :S That +4 Power isn't going to let people beat current content significantly easier.

Oh and before you mention Infusions, from everything we've seen so far it seem like it's an added mechanic in order to improve PvE. There is multiple types of Infusions which means that they don't have a simple 1>2>3 progression but rather seem like specialized boons for specific content.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

This is completely fabricated.

There is even a whole post on the forums explaining that there won't be more and more tiers, specially not linearly progressive ones. Not only that but Ascended gear is not replacing the top-end gear, that is still legendaries; the power increase from Exotics to Ascended is not anywhere close to what you get from tier to another in other MMO's.

If anything, the fact that you can obtain Ascended gear without having to clear prerequisite dungeons (i.e. the current ones) further weakens your claim that it adds traditional progression.

Originally posted by Kalstark

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

yeah there will be different tiers but you wont have to complete tier 1 to get tto tier 2 as they've already explained and stated, again i just dont get what the problem is

Any form of tiers are bad. Period.

Second, they also said there'd never be a gear grind, and now there is, so what they promise doesn't mean jack anymore.

And please, stop with the "but its still under legendary tier" tripe. Legendary is cosmetic only. Stop pretending like the new gear doesn't improve stats. It does, 30%.

double posted somehow

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Kalstark

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

yeah there will be different tiers but you wont have to complete tier 1 to get tto tier 2 as they've already explained and stated, again i just dont get what the problem is

Any form of tiers are bad. Period.

Second, they also said there'd never be a gear grind, and now there is, so what they promise doesn't mean jack anymore.

And please, stop with the "but its still under legendary tier" tripe. Legendary is cosmetic only. Stop pretending like the new gear doesn't improve stats. It does, 30%.

Your made up 30% stat and your portrayal of opinion as objective fact make the rest of your arguments so much more persuasive.  

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

 

On top of that, it shows where Arenanets priorities are. They promised this is something they'd never do. And rather than come out and admit to what this is, they tried to play it off like this WASN'T a gear grind.

Meanwhile, their WvW gets no attention, despite it being the part of the game in need of the most.

ROFL!! Yeah WoW with 10 million subs is a bad design... You surely know how to make money with MMO don't you? Also from your logic, we should all be able to do any content at any level with any gear?? So if I need some lvl 40 gear to be able to do a lvl 40 dungeon its a bad design? Yeah nice one dude. You clearly have no clue how MMO works.

Stop spreading false rumor of what you think will happen because you clearly have no clue whatsoever. If you hate the game so much, why bother wasting your time coming to the GW2 forums and saying nonsense all the time?

About DAoC raid I can't really say but don't try to make me believe that being high RR didn't gave you no advantage whatsoever...

Try harder next time please.

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Originally posted by Kalstark

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

yeah there will be different tiers but you wont have to complete tier 1 to get tto tier 2 as they've already explained and stated, again i just dont get what the problem is

Any form of tiers are bad. Period.

Second, they also said there'd never be a gear grind, and now there is, so what they promise doesn't mean jack anymore.

And please, stop with the "but its still under legendary tier" tripe. Legendary is cosmetic only. Stop pretending like the new gear doesn't improve stats. It does, 30%.

No one said that the new gear doesn't improve stats, only the troll failed to understand its meaningless. The 30% is from exotics to Ascended only, not YOUR CHARACTER stats. That's what you trolls failed to understand. If you count from the character stats, the 30% is just plain false. 5 more points in a stat where you have 1000 points in it is meaningless and if you don't understand it then go back to school.

What we had before was

Tier 1: Exotic

Tier 3: Legendary

What we got now is

Tier 1: Exotic

Tier 2: Ascended

Tier 3: Legendary

Anet just filled in the blanks for those who don't have the time or desire to farm for legendary and I find that was a smart move.

Originally posted by Kalstark

Originally posted by DavisFlight

Content should not be gated by something like gear. It's purely bad game design. People shouldn't be locked out of content period, much less have to go through a linear set of chores before they can get to said content.

And while its only a small set of chores so far, as this game grows eventually there'll be multiple tiers you have to grind before you see new areas.

 

DAoC managed just fine without ever doing that. Raids were gated by SKILL and CHALLENGE, not by artificial stat barriers.

yeah there will be different tiers but you wont have to complete tier 1 to get tto tier 2 as they've already explained and stated, again i just dont get what the problem is

You can't skip levels. its called progression yo

Edit: Currently, Legendaries have the same stats as exotics. Anyone who says Legendaries have higher stats don't know what they are talking about.

The community outrage is because the new content does the following

1) Creates gating- Right now, you are limited to the level of fractal you earned. You can't skip levels. On top of this, drops increase in quality and quanity are increased as you level. Leveling fractals is only done by completing a fractal set.

Not only that, but future content will require Agony buffs. Don't expect to do new content (whether dungeons or not) unless you "earned" Ascended armor from the privious dungeon

2) Adds in an insane amount of grind. It appears to take at least 10-15hrs to get your first ring, which may not even be the one you need for your build. 

3) Better gear is tied to RNG. Currently, Mist Essence is a random drop. People have found ways to grind it out, but its still a random drop. 

4) The entire feeling of the community has changed. Peopel are now kicking people out of groups, or refusing them in groups, based on levels

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Originally posted by Kalstark

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Originally posted by Nailzzz      The source of the outrage is less what they are doing, and more about that they lied to us to get us to buy the game. I dont know why it is that people find it hard to believe that there are still people out there that might get a little upset that they basically paid someone for a stated service and then the service was denied. That is pretty much the definition of fraud.       Had Arenanet been a bit more honest with there customers up front about there intention to add a gear grind, this wouldnt be an issue. But instead all the prerelease marketing explicitly stated the exact opposite (numerous times and with great detail).      I have no problem with gear grinds. I have a problem with dishonesty. It is likely that i will abondon this game at some point in the future for a gear grind, but if i do it will be because the other game will not go out of thier way to lie to me about it.      Im not going to be reactionary about all this. I will still play GW2 till another promising game comes along, but this action on Arenanet's part is the difference between me investing my loyalty and money into GW2 vs me moving onto the next thing.      I just dont see why i should support a company that thinks so little of its customers that it has to BS them. Maybe many of you will pay for the priveledge of being lied to. I will not. They already rec'd about $400 from me, but they wont see a penny more after this.

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but what is now stopping you from doing exactly what you were doing before? just like the OP i dont get what everyone is crying about. your saying arenanet didnt lie to you before this but how is this effecting what you were doing before? i think the world is just going downhill so fast and people do nothing these days but complain and complain when the reality is they dont know what their even complaining about. my question to everyone saying arenanet lied is, until they announced this you were enjoying the game and fealt they didnt lie to you, what is stopping you from doing EXACTLY what you were doing before?

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It doesn't stop me playing exactly as I did before, did it piss me off? Yes. Anet said that gear grind wasn't the way forward, they did a u-turn, yes I'm going to point that out and register my distaste on the official forums but I'm not quitting over it, it also makes me worry about the future of the game when there was none before as far as stat progression goes, they stated there will be more.