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Guild Wars 2

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General Discussion  » ANet bog post on Fractals of the Mist

13 posts found
  fiontar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/04
Posts: 3726

 
OP  11/14/12 12:34:38 PM#1

Official Blogpost on Fractals of the Mist Dungeon

I think the most exciting news in the blogpost is that Fractals of the Mist features Level Scaling. It's a level 80 dungeon, but everyone will be scaled up to 80, in the same manner as WvW scaling, so anyone can participate.

Also, the difficulty increase for completing multiple "waves" is saved for each character and the difficulty level for a run will be determined by averaging the difficulty tier achieved by each character in the party. No word on when or whether the difficulty level resets for a given character. I would assume it has to reset, or people would hit a wall and not be able to advance further.

This does mean, however, that you don't need to have a pre-mde party ready to play FotM for a long session in order to push the difficulty limits. Characters in the party can be replaced and it may even be seen as beneficial to rotate in characters who have not progressed in difficulty in order to bring the average difficulty level down for groups that have hit the difficulty wall after extended play. I can see this being great for Guilds organizing ongoing FotM runs.

Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2838

11/14/12 12:37:29 PM#2

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, King of Tokyo

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3722

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

11/14/12 12:45:04 PM#3


Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".



Ouch.


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  Tonin109

Apprentice Member

Joined: 6/15/12
Posts: 202

Our Opinion May Differ

11/14/12 12:47:09 PM#4
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

"You’ll have to have some serious skills and solid tactics to make it through these Fractals. After a certain point, our new Ascended items and Infusions become crucial tools for survival."

if you quote , quote it right, they're talking about ascended items and you will need them when you're "far" in the dungeon

dont mislead people thanks

  fiontar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/04
Posts: 3726

 
OP  11/14/12 12:56:31 PM#5
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

They don't mention how difficulty level resets for a given character. Can you reset by exiting the hub? Does it reset every 24 hours?

The difficulty scales up with every succesful "wave" you progress through FotM, with each wave containing three random Fractals, "wings" and a Boss fractal on every even numbered wave. It appears Agony, the new Monster condition that Infused Gear counters, will be a fair portion of the method by which difficulty scales up.

Just to throw out some hypothetical examples, let's say that a low skill party (PUG) with out Infused Gear may be able to push through to waves 3-5 before itting "the wall". A skilled, premade party with out Infused gear may be able to push to waves 5 to 7 before hitting "the wall". Rings and Back Armor will be the only ascended gear available initially. Maybe accumulating Infused gear can allow you to push 1-5 waves deeper into the difficulty progression, depending on the quantity and quality of Infused gear you have accumulated.

As people play, casuals or hardcore, they will gain Ascended Gear and Infusions. This will allow them to get a little deeper than they could get on skill alone.

Since we now know that groups can change members and continue the current progression, with difficulty level based on the average difficulty factor of the characters making up the group, concerns about this system splitting the community are some what diminished. If one character "hits the wall" before other members of the party, either due to player skill or lack of infused gear, the party can always recruit another character and continue the progression.

In fact, for parties that hit the wall, it may be desirable to split the group and recruit characters into the two parties who are at zero difficulty for the day (or what ever the period is for tracking difficulty), in order to decrease the average difficulty level and allow more runs to be made.

On paper, it's a very interesting system and pretty innovative. It will be interesting to see how this all plays out. I've avoided dungeons up to now, but I am very interested in playing FotM!

Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2838

11/14/12 1:01:24 PM#6
Originally posted by Tonin109
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

"You’ll have to have some serious skills and solid tactics to make it through these Fractals. After a certain point, our new Ascended items and Infusions become crucial tools for survival."

if you quote , quote it right, they're talking about ascended items and you will need them when you're "far" in the dungeon

dont mislead people thanks

At some point my skill alone isn't enough - without the items I won't survive.

Am I misleading with my statements?

Items for me is something too look awesome, not to define survival.

No, I don't really care much about levels, stats or whatnot - there is max and not max for me.

Not max is a drag that hampers the developement of my player skill.

The funy part is 3 days ago these statements from my part would merit applause by a mojority in most forums about GW2.

Fortunately it seems it still does in GW2 official forums, which is a relief since I'm used to a very sharp and critical Guild Wars community.

Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, King of Tokyo

  Vhaln

Novice Member

Joined: 7/07/05
Posts: 3167

11/14/12 1:05:39 PM#7
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
Originally posted by Tonin109
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

"You’ll have to have some serious skills and solid tactics to make it through these Fractals. After a certain point, our new Ascended items and Infusions become crucial tools for survival."

if you quote , quote it right, they're talking about ascended items and you will need them when you're "far" in the dungeon

dont mislead people thanks

At some point my skill alone isn't enough - without the items I won't survive.

Am I misleading with my statements?

 

Maybe at some point, agony resist alone won't be enough.  Without enough skill, you won't survive, either?  

Sounds like skill will certainly help, and eventually becomes vital.  Isn't that the important thing?

 

When I want a single-player story, I'll play a single-player game. When I play an MMO, I want a massively multiplayer world.

  Gaia_Hunter

Elite Member

Joined: 5/04/12
Posts: 2838

11/14/12 1:07:07 PM#8
Originally posted by Vhaln
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter
Originally posted by Tonin109
Originally posted by Gaia_Hunter

I like everything until the part "items become crucial".

I prefer "player skill becomes crucial".

"You’ll have to have some serious skills and solid tactics to make it through these Fractals. After a certain point, our new Ascended items and Infusions become crucial tools for survival."

if you quote , quote it right, they're talking about ascended items and you will need them when you're "far" in the dungeon

dont mislead people thanks

At some point my skill alone isn't enough - without the items I won't survive.

Am I misleading with my statements?

 

Maybe at some point, agony resist alone won't be enough.  Without enough skill, you won't survive, either?  

Sounds like skill will certainly help, and eventually becomes vital.  Isn't that the important thing?

 

It is a skinner box.

I'm not a donkey so I don't need a carrot.

Currently playing: GW2
Going cardboard starter kit: Ticket to ride, Pandemic, Carcassonne, Dominion, King of Tokyo

  DavisFlight

Novice Member

Joined: 9/25/12
Posts: 2604

11/14/12 1:08:40 PM#9
Seriously, why even bother with levels anymore.
  FrodoFragins

Hard Core Member

Joined: 4/29/10
Posts: 2910

11/14/12 1:11:13 PM#10
Originally posted by fiontar

Official Blogpost on Fractals of the Mist Dungeon

I think the most exciting news in the blogpost is that Fractals of the Mist features Level Scaling. It's a level 80 dungeon, but everyone will be scaled up to 80, in the same manner as WvW scaling, so anyone can participate.

Also, the difficulty increase for completing multiple "waves" is saved for each character and the difficulty level for a run will be determined by averaging the difficulty tier achieved by each character in the party. No word on when or whether the difficulty level resets for a given character. I would assume it has to reset, or people would hit a wall and not be able to advance further.

This does mean, however, that you don't need to have a pre-mde party ready to play FotM for a long session in order to push the difficulty limits. Characters in the party can be replaced and it may even be seen as beneficial to rotate in characters who have not progressed in difficulty in order to bring the average difficulty level down for groups that have hit the difficulty wall after extended play. I can see this being great for Guilds organizing ongoing FotM runs.

Sounds interesting and it does address a question I had regarding making groups with people at different stages.  I see only one likelihood though:

 

LFM Mist Dungeon: LVL25+ difficulty only

 

This is another case where a dungeon finder and rewards for using it would be beneficial.  That way people will be more willing to do lower difficulties, and thus get lower rewards.

  Nitth

Elite Member

Joined: 7/29/10
Posts: 3722

Magic Propels my Rolly Chair.

11/14/12 1:15:24 PM#11


Originally posted by DavisFlight
Seriously, why even bother with levels anymore.

That's what I said!!!!


TSW - AoC - Aion - WOW - EVE - Fallen Earth - Co - Rift - || XNA C# Java Development

  IPolygon

Novice Member

Joined: 11/20/11
Posts: 711

11/14/12 1:19:47 PM#12
The dungeon art looks nice. We'll see how it plays and if gear treadmill will be in effect.
  fiontar

Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/04
Posts: 3726

 
OP  11/14/12 4:41:41 PM#13
Originally posted by FrodoFragins
Originally posted by fiontar

Official Blogpost on Fractals of the Mist Dungeon

I think the most exciting news in the blogpost is that Fractals of the Mist features Level Scaling. It's a level 80 dungeon, but everyone will be scaled up to 80, in the same manner as WvW scaling, so anyone can participate.

Also, the difficulty increase for completing multiple "waves" is saved for each character and the difficulty level for a run will be determined by averaging the difficulty tier achieved by each character in the party. No word on when or whether the difficulty level resets for a given character. I would assume it has to reset, or people would hit a wall and not be able to advance further.

This does mean, however, that you don't need to have a pre-mde party ready to play FotM for a long session in order to push the difficulty limits. Characters in the party can be replaced and it may even be seen as beneficial to rotate in characters who have not progressed in difficulty in order to bring the average difficulty level down for groups that have hit the difficulty wall after extended play. I can see this being great for Guilds organizing ongoing FotM runs.

Sounds interesting and it does address a question I had regarding making groups with people at different stages.  I see only one likelihood though:

 

LFM Mist Dungeon: LVL25+ difficulty only

 

This is another case where a dungeon finder and rewards for using it would be beneficial.  That way people will be more willing to do lower difficulties, and thus get lower rewards.

Groups still pushing to hit the wall and limited on time may advertise for other characters with high difficulty ratings, but it's just as likely that parties that have hit the wall will look to split and recruit low difficulty rating members to lower the average rating and afford them selves more medium to high difficulty runs.

i.e. A group hits the wall at difficulty level 12. They split off into a pair and a trio and recruit level zero characters to fill the additional slots. This drops the party ratings to 4 or 7, affording the players the opportunity to possible get another 5 to 8 runs.

Gotta love a system that makes new arrivals valuable to players who have been playing for hours, with the bigest benefit being to guilds, where juggling parties this way can benefit the high hour players, while improving the level of inclusion of the more casual members of the guild.

As for a Dungeon Finder, we access the FotM through an Asuran Portal in Lion's Arch, so I anticipate finding others to group with will be fairly easy. (It's also possible that the hub will be shared and not instanced for each group, if so the hub would provide the lobby where people would recruit, rather than sitting outside the portal. Can't wait to discover the details).

BTW, even more excited about this after checking out the official preview video for FotM. The fractals are not your typical dungeon environments and I love the concept that they represent slices of space and time, with players able to experience events from the past/future. Strong hints that more fractals will be added regularly as part of the live update process, which is very nice.

Want to know more about GW2 and why there is so much buzz? Start here: Guild Wars 2 Mass Info for the Uninitiated