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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » We got enough Games. Give me a World.

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186 posts found
  DMKano

Elite Member

Joined: 6/17/11
Posts: 5516

11/05/12 8:57:02 AM#41
Originally posted by TangentPoint

Very good point.

I think Right Brain and Left Brain could have a lot to do with it... at least assuming there's an aspect to that where one side wants to be actively engaged and more in control of what they're doing, while the other side wants to just sorta kick back and enjoy the show.

That kinda works with movies, too, when I think about it, heh.

Not to go on a tangent but the whole left/right brain theory we learned about is a myth, our brain doesn't really work like that, but millions were taught wrong information.

 

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog/brain-myths/201206/why-the-left-brain-right-brain-myth-will-probably-never-die

  Kuinn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/11
Posts: 2028

11/05/12 9:02:10 AM#42
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

 

Yes, because the sandbox game where you run around in wizard robes shooting fireballs and burning down towns, is just like your real life.

  apocoluster

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/15/07
Posts: 1299

\m/,

11/05/12 9:05:09 AM#43
Originally posted by dzoni87

OP, sadly that will not going to happen. "Worlds" are no longer welcomed by gaming community, let alone MMORPG players.

Why? Because they dont care for "worlds". All they want is a "level cap race" "endgame" "PHAT LEWT" and other things. I dont even understand anymore, why putting "world" or levels in MMO at all. It just cost resources.

Sad, but true fact. No one will ever make the game for us, minority of players. Well at least, im enjoying GW2 while it lasts...

EDIT: Yea, GW2 is 'instanced' ('zoned' should be proper world), but that is more about technical aspect of the discussion. I dont really mind even 'instancing' if done properly.

EQ Next supposed to be Sandy...also Project Calypso for the sci fi bent is totally sandy

No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  Sovrath

Elite Member

Joined: 1/06/05
Posts: 17290

11/05/12 9:06:55 AM#44
Originally posted by Quirhid
Originally posted by Sovrath
Originally posted by tom_gore

Then tell me, because I cannot by the love of god undestand, WHY do developers keep developing Games instead of Worlds?

Because there are people who prefer "games" over "worlds".

There are a few people at work who play video games (which is a first for me as usually I'm the only one or one of two people).

Of those who do and who played Skyrim (to use your example) all played for the quests and main story and stopped. One of the guys who would be considered an avid gamer told me that he didn't like skyrim because it was too open for his taste. He preferred Dishonored over Skyrim because it brought you from one section to the other and if you found a side quest then you could do it but still be firmly guided through the game. He felt that he froze when walking outside. "what now?" Didnt' like it.

My girlfriend's ex played Skyrim and after he did all the main quest and the side quests as well as things like Mage college, compansions etc, stopped playing. He also said that it was too open for his taste.

So there you go.

Likely no game is "too open" but in Skyrim's case, aside from the quest lines, its quite boring. There's really not a whole lot you can do or achieve. So why play it after you've finished the major storylines?

And yet I have 508 hours in the game. So in light of your statement, why do you think I, and perhaps others play it after those quest lines are done and "achievements" have been done (though truth be told I never play any game for achievements so usually ignore them until they happen).

That also might explain, go to the core, of why some people want more open worlds and some do not.

  apocoluster

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/15/07
Posts: 1299

\m/,

11/05/12 9:08:41 AM#45
Originally posted by Kuinn
 
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

 

Yes, because the sandbox game where you run around in wizard robes shooting fireballs and burning down towns, is just like your real life.

DICTIONARY

metaphor

Definition

met·a·phors Plural

NOUN 

1. 

implicit comparison: the use to describe somebody or something of a word or phrase that is not meant literally but by means of a vivid comparison expresses something about him, her, or it, e.g. saying that somebody is a snake

2. 

figurative language: all language that involves figures of speech or symbolism and does not literally represent real things

3. 

symbol: one thing used or considered to represent another

[ 15th century. Via French or Latin < Greek metaphora < metapherein "to transfer" < pherein "to carry" ]

met·a·phor·ic ADJECTIVE

met·a·phor·i·cal ADJECTIVE

met·a·phor·i·cal·ly ADVERB

Translations

 

No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  Gdemami

Elite Member

Joined: 9/23/08
Posts: 7034

11/05/12 9:13:18 AM#46


Originally posted by tom_gore

So what is it so difficult to create a World?

That is a wrong question. In your generic qq about a game no developer wants to make to suit your desires, you missed out all other gamers.


So the real question here is: Do current MMO gamers want to create their own worlds and adventures?


The answer is: Unlikely.


Problem solved.

  Cantorage

Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/13/10
Posts: 191

11/05/12 9:20:11 AM#47
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by tom_gore

So what is it so difficult to create a World?


 

That is a wrong question. In your generic qq about a game no developer wants to make to suit your desires, you missed out all other gamers.


So the real question here is: Do current MMO gamers want to create their own worlds and adventures?


The answer is: Unlikely.


Problem solved.

The current brunt of MMO consumers weren't around when MMORPG was defined as a technology. In it's vision, it was always meant to be more about the world than the game, eventually though, as with all things, money priorities wins out for game makers. Thus, we have the casual loot-oriented throw-away hallways of today where actual gamers have no reason to sticking around for more than a month, and even while doing it, hating it all along.

 

Game consumers dictate gamers these days, it's no secret.

  ignore_me

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/04/11
Posts: 2034

11/05/12 9:25:11 AM#48
Originally posted by Gdemami

 


Originally posted by tom_gore

So what is it so difficult to create a World?


 

That is a wrong question. In your generic qq about a game no developer wants to make to suit your desires, you missed out all other gamers.


So the real question here is: Do current MMO gamers want to create their own worlds and adventures?


The answer is: Unlikely.


Problem solved.

Imagine a customer wanting a product that fits his needs, what gall!

This is the institutionalized prostelizations of a Theme Park thrall in disguise as scorn. He needs you to stay in theme park raid land, to firmly secure a steady flow of more one-time MMORPG's by keeping developer interest high instead of player interest.

His biggest fear is that they will create a world, and the public will like it in lieu of spoon fed linear NPC patronage.

Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  Kuinn

Hard Core Member

Joined: 1/10/11
Posts: 2028

11/05/12 9:25:53 AM#49
Originally posted by apocoluster
Originally posted by Kuinn
 
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

 

Yes, because the sandbox game where you run around in wizard robes shooting fireballs and burning down towns, is just like your real life.

DICTIONARY

metaphor

 

Does your dictionary have "failed metaphor" anywhere in it? If you play a sandbox game where you can shoot fire and lightning, it's not comparable even on metaphorical sense to real life, that's exactly the stuff you want to play games for vs. the real life where you can only dream of it.

  Reklaw

Elite Member

Joined: 1/07/06
Posts: 6167

The adult I am takes care of most things real life. However my inner-child is a GAMER!!

11/05/12 9:27:34 AM#50
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

Disagree, we have plenty of game "games" to choose from, yet little sandbox type games atmost open world games that still doesn't satisfied the wants and needs of a sandbox gamer.

And how can anyone say that the real world is sandboxy enough when we are talking about fantasy or sci-fi worlds we like our sandbox to coinsied in?

MMORPG's started of with giving gamer a complete different game experiance compared to what we already could play in other genre's.

But....I do know there is a niche audience for a sandbox type of MMORPG, it's not for the masses. The masses have proven time and time again that being more guided is more fun then being at a lost. Nothing wrong with that. But then can't you admit there is room for more?

When someone askes for a more sandboxy type of MMORPG, he/she also wants that entertaining form of escapism, but atleast speaking for myself I want that escapism in a more believable world set in a sci-fi or fantasy world where it's not only about combat, though it may take a major part. there is a hugh community that can support a game if there is more to it then just playing a online combat game. As said we have plenty of that already.....

 

 

  marcuslm

Hard Core Member

Joined: 2/01/05
Posts: 236

11/05/12 9:34:10 AM#51

Exactly!!

 

This was a thought that I myself had about GW2 recently. As big and beautiful as the world is, it feels really closed in because there is always something going on eveywhere you go.

 

I just remember those times in WoW when I was on a path in the forest somewhere and I could stand there for a while with no one coming by all. All you hear is the forest and the eery Night Elf music.  I always loved that. Of course it's been some time ago so WoW may not be like that anymore.

 

Anyway, I also feel like those quiet moments of solitude can make the world feel large and mysterious.

 

 

 

  ignore_me

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/04/11
Posts: 2034

11/05/12 9:34:49 AM#52
Originally posted by Kuinn
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

 

Yes, because the sandbox game where you run around in wizard robes shooting fireballs and burning down towns, is just like your real life.

Neither is sufficiently like real life for this to be a valid argument. Apple to Oranges to Pineapples

Survivor of the great MMORPG Famine of 2011

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19146

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

11/05/12 9:36:12 AM#53
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by Neherun
Originally posted by Thane
Originally posted by tom_gore

 

Naturally, if you decide to let them take it, they will. That's the issue, people don't want to lose anything, but they don't have what it takes to keep everything. Then they want bunch of artifical barriers to protect them, and the vicious cycle of instancing and roller coaster rides begun.

 

 

yeah cause nothing is more fun than a survival of the fittest, death sport,penal colony world filled with crafters and politicians...

Describes EVE perfectly, and you are correct, there is nothing more fun (for me) out there right now.

With the opportunity for great evil comes the chance for great good as well. 

Everything else is just a lukewarm in between.

I'm all for more, bigger, better virtual worlds, but know that my playing preferences are clearly in the minority of paying customers.

 

Arrogant, Condescending, Dismissive, Elitist, you speak as if these are bad things?
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  immodium

Hard Core Member

Joined: 11/03/07
Posts: 1301

11/05/12 9:43:08 AM#54
Originally posted by cura
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

Ill agree with you... as soon as i can travel through the universe in a straship looking for ancient civilizations or devote my life to study magic and evil planes of existance.

The human mind has really made Earth seem so dull.

Also Earth can only be sandboxy if you have enough cash to throw at it.

 

OT: Minecraft has shown that a few people like to play games inside a virtual world. The tools are there to do it. It's just doing it well.

 

  Aelious

Elite Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2459

World > Quest Progression

11/05/12 10:03:32 AM#55
Kenze

Because I like fantasy settings. It's not like EQ was that boxed in, the games today literally drag you around by the nose. Leave the boxed in fantasy play to consoles.
  apocoluster

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/15/07
Posts: 1299

\m/,

11/05/12 10:11:27 AM#56
Originally posted by Reklaw
Originally posted by Kenze
Originally posted by apocoluster
   Disagree.  Give me games.  The real world is plenty enough Sandboxy for me.  I play games to get away from it.

 

^this x100

Disagree, we have plenty of game "games" to choose from, yet little sandbox type games atmost open world games that still doesn't satisfied the wants and needs of a sandbox gamer.

And how can anyone say that the real world is sandboxy enough when we are talking about fantasy or sci-fi worlds we like our sandbox to coinsied in?

MMORPG's started of with giving gamer a complete different game experiance compared to what we already could play in other genre's.

But....I do know there is a niche audience for a sandbox type of MMORPG, it's not for the masses. The masses have proven time and time again that being more guided is more fun then being at a lost. Nothing wrong with that. But then can't you admit there is room for more?

When someone askes for a more sandboxy type of MMORPG, he/she also wants that entertaining form of escapism, but atleast speaking for myself I want that escapism in a more believable world set in a sci-fi or fantasy world where it's not only about combat, though it may take a major part. there is a hugh community that can support a game if there is more to it then just playing a online combat game. As said we have plenty of that already.....

 

 

I didnt say Make Reklaw play Themeparks...I said give ME more games.  I guess  Ineed to break down my metaphor for the other guy.    Ive played plenty of MMOs, including the Sandy ones.  SWG, Eve, project Entropia and numerous numerous Themepark games too.  The assiciation FOR ME with sandparks to real life is that every one of the  sandy games ive ever played requires such an investment in time and effort on my part to maintain any sort of digital lifestyle for my toon, that in my mind Ive essentially come to think of sandy games as 2nd jobs.  To clarify i meant to say: 

 

  Disagree.  Give me somthing to relax with after a long day of work.  Sandbox games for me seem to be essentially a 2nd job.  I want to have fun on the few remaining hours that are available to me between Dinner and bedtime.   Rather than sitting in line waiting for Doctor buffs so I can hunt HQ times for my Armorcrafter machines, or suck  vibrant sweat off of beasts with dozens of others to sell to crafters or Down load my Millionth Veldspar rock...I want to be told to walk 50 feet and kill 10 rats.  Thank you.

 

No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  Onomas

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/05/11
Posts: 1160

Sandbox is your only hope for a decent mmo ;)

11/05/12 10:13:10 AM#57

Why would anyone want their games limited because they dislike one or two things? And large open world offers much more than a small map that you are lead around on a leash.

I like sandbox and large open world to explore and take my time. If i dont like something i simply have the option to ignore it or dont take part in it. But not having said feature doesnt give me the option and limits the game as a whole.

Narrow minded people in the gaming community this day in age. More = better, and you can choice what you want to do.

 

I guess due to the huge amount of crap mmo's with limitations out the butt the community just got use to it being this way.

 

And "i live in a world so i dont want to play in one" arguement is kind of lame. Because i highly doubt you are taking part in the entire world you live in, so the same can go for a game world. Nice to have it, but not forced to do everything..

  Thorbrand

Novice Member

Joined: 3/06/04
Posts: 1217

11/05/12 10:27:14 AM#58

The thing is true MMORPG games are still a niche group and everyone thought it would be cool to make online single player story driven games and call them MMOs. 90% of what makes a MMO is longer longer even in these games because the mass people playing them do not want them so develops don't make true MMOs. As long as we allow them to keep calling these games MMOs we will never see a true MMO until 2015 when Pathfinder Online comes out.

Notice that game isn't even on this site!

Now they can make these new games they call MMOs but I think they need to be defined for what they are: OSPSG!

There are some developers out there trying to make true MMOs but they are not supported because the new gamers think grahpics and flash are what matters when in a MMO it is gameplay and content which requires not the best graphic. Xsyon is about the best MMO out even though it isn't complete because it is a MMO. If more people would support it they could complete it and it would be huge, but games today would rather have pretty games without content.

Being a MMORPG gamer is a life choice just like playing PnP RPGs. It isn't for the gamers who are not serious in playing their games.

  apocoluster

Advanced Member

Joined: 4/15/07
Posts: 1299

\m/,

11/05/12 10:34:49 AM#59
Originally posted by Onomas

Why would anyone want their games limited because they dislike one or two things? And large open world offers much more than a small map that you are lead around on a leash.

I like sandbox and large open world to explore and take my time. If i dont like something i simply have the option to ignore it or dont take part in it. But not having said feature doesnt give me the option and limits the game as a whole.

Narrow minded people in the gaming community this day in age. More = better, and you can choice what you want to do.

 

I guess due to the huge amount of crap mmo's with limitations out the butt the community just got use to it being this way.

 

And "i live in a world so i dont want to play in one" arguement is kind of lame. Because i highly doubt you are taking part in the entire world you live in, so the same can go for a game world. Nice to have it, but not forced to do everything..

Why build all this world if its just going to get ignored for the most part by most of the players.   The players are doing what they want to do.  If every Themepark was deleted off every server right now..and replaced by open world player driven sandboxes your not going to have a new crop of sandbox players arrive...it will still just be you guys..the niche and the rest (well 99%) will just stop gaming.

No matter how cynical you become, its never enough to keep up - Lily Tomlin

  Venger

Novice Member

Joined: 8/03/04
Posts: 1322

Help Fight Global Warming
Shut Your Mouth :D

11/05/12 10:39:15 AM#60

I agree.  There are some people that also get it, refer to link below.  I wouldn't expect to see anything from big developers though.

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/appleton/greed-monger-a-crafting-focused-sandbox-mmorpg/posts/342590

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