Originally posted by Icewhite
There's a level of raw paranoia that's displayed in some of those posts upthread that's just a little frightening. "I keep getting banned, because everyone hates me, they're always reporting me, I'm sure it's YOU and YOU and you over there, all the guys I hate the most...For No Reason!!one1!!! CoNsPiRaCy!!" Forum PVP...too long, too serious, way past time to stop.

Originally posted by KingJiggly

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by wordiz

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

 

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Originally posted by wordiz

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Originally posted by KingJiggly

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Originally posted by wordiz You'd be making a pretty extreme assumption. The decision to disband was made because people weren't logging in anymore, all PR aside.

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Thats not what your leader said. As given by the above poster lol. I completely understand why they disbanded, ques ques make it impossible for a guild of 1500 WVWVW guild to all fight at the same time... so it is more likely the indiviusal guilds spread around the servers to make it more even

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Hence, "All PR aside." He was trying to be as non-critical of the game as possible as a public relations move, but it's not the truth. The Alliance fell apart because people stopped playing, and it wasn't just the queues that caused this. I'm just being trolled aren't I? I still don't get, how you, as an outsider, think your opinions of our inner-operations even matter. I was trying to share the perspective of the alliance. Instead, I'm treated like I'm lying, candy coating, got you fact checking me when you weren't even involved in anything we're talking about.

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Welcome to MMORPG, where your post history is checked before your posts are responded to in order to catch your discrepencies.

 

And where you're reported for harassment when someone doesn't agree with you, and MMORPG.com takes special care in the matter because the topic of discussion regards Anet, of who they steady feed off the teet of.

AH, been there. And the funny thing is, some of the biggest offenders who report you are guilty of doing the exact thing they reported you for in other game's forums.

I got banned for "flaming", so I got hit to...

Now, Geezer, I never looked at his post history. Please read our entire conversation first, I was talking about hsi guild leader who gave the reasons for closing down which include: people leaving, queques, guild leaving, and the overall inabaility to play WvWvW due to having an insanely huge alliance (grats to them). So geezer, mind your own business next time, k?

You felt it was necessary to go all out and verify his story that had nothing to do with you at all, then come back here to a public forum to post your findings for all the world to see. Then you tell me to mind my own business on the matter? Really? 

Hmm tailspin is a very strong word, but personal experience is defenitely in the decline. Aside from my wife, my entire guild and friend list has gone dark, and been dark for about two weeks now. Every once in a long while, someone will pop on, but most hit 80, got bored, and moved on.

Nothing wrong with that, and I am a ways from 80, but this game in my experience does NOT have good retention. People chew through the content, then move on to something else. That might not do well for its long term success.

However, as a business model I think no one can argue that GW2 was a success for Anet. Whether it continues to be is another question.

Originally posted by itgrowls

Originally posted by lizardbones

 

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Originally posted by GolbezTheLion

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Originally posted by Creslin321 The fact that we can have one thread claiming that GW2 is a huge success and one claiming that it's essentially spiraling into failure right next to each other, and both seem equally "credible," should say something...

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Considering that players have posted irrefutable evidence to the contrary of the "tailspin" argument, I would say it's quite clear which statement has more credibility.

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If you get rid of information that isn't objective, you're not left with very much. In another thread that got locked (not because of my posts), we had this:
* Dramatic drop in players or player hours on a site that won't be named.
* Metacritic - overall positive reviews from 'professional' reviewers.
* Metacritic - overall positive reviews from regular people (who are probably players, but we can't be sure).
* Amazon - GW2 is still in the top 10 games.
* Amazon - GW2's position in the top ten is lower than it previously was.
* Anet - are hiring 12 developers.
* Anet - creating new content for the game.
* Anet - There are no dead servers in the server status page(s). Half the servers are 'full' and 30% are 'high'.
* MMORPG.Com - forum poll shows 50% of respondents are no longer playing the game. 50% are still playing the game.
* MMORPG.Com - review articles are overall positive.
* MMORPG.Com - game rating is overall positive.

And...that's it. None of this stuff depends on people having an opinion, none of it depends on anecdotal evidence and while the interpretation of the information is up for grabs, the information itself is pretty cut and dry.

I'm leaning towards the game is a success from Anet's perspective. I'm betting they are very happy with the game's performance. They're going to continue to expand the game and continue to happily sell expansions.

** edit **
In the poll, I voted that the argument was bad. It depends on a lot of hyperbole either way and hyperbole, while good for fiction, isn't so great for any sort of factual discussion. So...I don't think either thread is any sort of factual discussion on the relative success or failure of GW2.

 

Exactly, there are no such things as bad facts. Facts are facts despite people's tendency to try to discredit those facts. See it all the time in these forums.

One of the things i loved seeing in your list is they hired MORE devs, no game company does this unless they are successful. Also, they hired specialized programmers to find a way to detect the bots and their programs so they can gather evidence to ban effectively the right people and not the players by accident. It's what Blizz did as well. Took care of alot of problems. (right around the time just before the cata expansion, they did this because they added a rather heavy teleportation patch to the game, and bots were exploiting that teleportation script to do all kinds of things like fly and create geometric shapes with toons in the middle of orgrimar, i remember this.) look familiar? 

I seem to recall some doomsaying during that time as well from people who were leaving the game or who were still playing but threatened to stop when WoW had this teleport issue.

Facts are facts yes, but not all facts are useful or relevant. I can state as a fact that I can fit a square peg in a round hole. Just as long as that round hole is big enough of course. It's a fact, but not a very useful one. To me a certain unnamed site falls squarly in this category for instance.

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Originally posted by KingJiggly

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Originally posted by Icewhite

There's a level of raw paranoia that's displayed in some of those posts upthread that's just a little frightening.

"I keep getting banned, because everyone hates me, they're always reporting me, I'm sure it's YOU and YOU and you over there, all the guys I hate the most...For No Reason!!one1!!! CoNsPiRaCy!!"

Forum PVP...too long, too serious, way past time to stop.

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 Yeah, I just wanted to let him know everyone gets banned. People on this sight seem to think that GW2 owns this site... along with its fans. Of course, their seems to be more haters of the game nowadays than fanboys.

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I have never been banned. Not from this site or any other.

the player population is aging and I am not seeing huge #s of people in the lower level zones at this point. Anet needs to figure out how to bring in new people while giving all the level 80s something to do before they all get bored. Very similar to TSW in that respect. GW2 has no raiding, no nightmare level instances, and no real end game save wvwvw. Playing at level 80, over time, gets to be old - nothing much to do other than farm mats and craft, kill same world bosses over and over, run same dungeons over and over.

New content is going to be added in the near future but not sure how much content. I think they will follow the GW1 formula and do expacs for $ to actually get a lot of new stuff but I may be wrong.

Originally posted by cptndunsel

New content is going to be added in the near future but not sure how much content. I think they will follow the GW1 formula and do expacs for $ to actually get a lot of new stuff but I may be wrong.

I think you are correct here. They started releasing monthly free updates (haloween, in two weeks we are getting new zone and dungeon The Lost Shore, in december we get Wintersday... we will see how long they keep that up). They are also already working on expansion, which will most likely follow GW1 formula - add as much content as the original game, but I don't expect this in the next 12 months.

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by KingJiggly

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

Originally posted by wordiz

Originally posted by GeezerGamer

 

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Originally posted by wordiz

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Originally posted by KingJiggly

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Originally posted by wordiz You'd be making a pretty extreme assumption. The decision to disband was made because people weren't logging in anymore, all PR aside.

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Thats not what your leader said. As given by the above poster lol. I completely understand why they disbanded, ques ques make it impossible for a guild of 1500 WVWVW guild to all fight at the same time... so it is more likely the indiviusal guilds spread around the servers to make it more even

---

Hence, "All PR aside." He was trying to be as non-critical of the game as possible as a public relations move, but it's not the truth. The Alliance fell apart because people stopped playing, and it wasn't just the queues that caused this. I'm just being trolled aren't I? I still don't get, how you, as an outsider, think your opinions of our inner-operations even matter. I was trying to share the perspective of the alliance. Instead, I'm treated like I'm lying, candy coating, got you fact checking me when you weren't even involved in anything we're talking about.

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Welcome to MMORPG, where your post history is checked before your posts are responded to in order to catch your discrepencies.

 

And where you're reported for harassment when someone doesn't agree with you, and MMORPG.com takes special care in the matter because the topic of discussion regards Anet, of who they steady feed off the teet of.

AH, been there. And the funny thing is, some of the biggest offenders who report you are guilty of doing the exact thing they reported you for in other game's forums.

I got banned for "flaming", so I got hit to...

Now, Geezer, I never looked at his post history. Please read our entire conversation first, I was talking about hsi guild leader who gave the reasons for closing down which include: people leaving, queques, guild leaving, and the overall inabaility to play WvWvW due to having an insanely huge alliance (grats to them). So geezer, mind your own business next time, k?

You felt it was necessary to go all out and verify his story that had nothing to do with you at all, then come back here to a public forum to post your findings for all the world to see. Then you tell me to mind my own business on the matter? Really? 

Come one geezer you can do better than that. Please look at who you a responding to, look, it just right up here. ME. It seems it does have something to do with me, seeing that I began this discussion with him in the first place. 

Originally posted by Digna

Originally posted by JoeyMMOOriginally posted by wordiz
  And if you read what was written instead of what you thought was written you'd see your mistake. I didn't claim 90% of players were still playing. Learn to read properly. I wrote Many of the casual players (90+ % of gamers) are still having fun.

And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that statement.

I hate getting into numerical debates because no one can credibly cite references that support, either pro or con. 90% of WHAT gamers are still having fun? X quoter in a guild of 2K members and 90% of that guild still play? That isn't 90%. The percentage (when you make a statement like % of players with no definition of subsets) refers to ALL players. In this case 90% of all casual players and that number = (total sales - hardcore players - botters)

*snip*

If you read the statement a few more times I'm sure you'll see that I never claimed that 90% of any group of players were still playing. Let me clarify it for you since you seem to be having genuine problems actually understanding the sentence.

Many of the casual players, which make up over 90% of all players, are still having fun.

Now, how can you have a problem with a statement like that? I guess you could also try reading a post again BEFORE you jump in and simply prove you just read what you thought was written instead of what was written.