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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Skyrim Hearthfire - a glimpse what MMOs need?

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  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

10/15/12 7:01:54 AM#61
Originally posted by Yamota
Originally posted by fenistil
Originally posted by Yamota
 

I am sorry, I do want MMORPGs to have more depth, but I really hope they dont turn out like SIMs Online or Second Life where you have wife, kids and that kind of stuff. MMORPGs have almost always been combat/adventure focused and I really hope they stay that way (but with more depth).

Pamper my kids with toys? OMFG... please no.

Noone says that mmorpg's should abandom combat and start sims online.

Just that there is demand for SOME mmoprg's that have some things ADDITIONALY to combat.  

Even if you would choose to play game like that (there would still be doznes on combat only mmorpg's) you would not HAVE TO do it.  

In Ultima Online alot players did not bother to have house, most did not bother to be crafters, etc   I don't understand why you would be against those features though in some of mmoprg's? 

I am talking about this social simulation life thingy with having children, wife, husband etc. Ofcourse MMORPGs should have non combat activities, such as crafting, but there are social life simulators out there and I would very much not like devs. spend resources to put those stuff in a typical high fantasy or sci-fi MMORPG as they have always been about combat and ADVENTURE.

I mean how much of the Lord of the Rings was spent regarding those things compared to adventuring? I know it was there but the focus of it was still the adventure and the quest of the one ring. Same with Star Wars and the only one I can think of which focused on social/drama stuff was the later Star Trek series which kind of sucked imo.

So again, there are social life MMOs but mixing those with typical high fantasy or sci-fi is not a good idea as it would take away precious resources. However I am all for more depth in regards to things that are typical in those settings. Such as magic, crafting, engineering etc but lets keep soap opera stuff out of MMORPGs pls.

Lotro? Really? This one has almost nothing.  Standard crafthing, standard instanced meaningless housing.

I think about games like in example UO or SWG.   (WITHOUT macroing and with better combat).

I see nothing bad with mmorpg that would allow you to take marriage with another player and even have kids in some way.

I would not use it myself as I don't wanna 'get married' in a video game, but I really see nothing bad with it.

No mmorpg's were not always ONLY about combat and adventure. There were multiple other things.  Crafting that was so substantial part of game that there were whole subset of players that were mainly playing for craftng and trading.  Some mmoprg's were heavily about teritorial control and politics.   Some had really complex and fun housing, town building or castles building, etc

 

Anyway - now is 2012 and not 1997 and there are no ~ 2 mmorpg's on the market anymore, so I am of opinion that noone have to feel forced.  If someone will develop an mmorpg with OPTION to have kids or things like that. Well for me it boils down to other features - if combat, crafting, trading and exploring will be good enough I will play.   Those SIM thing would propably mean that I would have more options in regards to housing and buildings generally and I  like it so it would be ok, even though I surely would not 'marry and have kids'.

 

Mmoprg's for me always were about virtual worlds in which I would have relative amount of freedom and diverse things to do - mostly about complex and good crafting, trading and combat.  

It was never about being computer version of story from Star Wars or Lotr.    If anything what would interest me in mmorpg based on popular IP would be not me 'getting similar adventures like Frodo'  but most intersting thing would be experiencing world and lore in much more interactive and detailed way than in books or movies. 

I played Lotro but never cared much about main story line and following trails of ring-bearer.  Was boring most of the time. What was fun?  Playing in Lotr world and seeing all those places + good community + combat.      Was a shame that crafting was so sub-par and game was just so shallow in many ways. Still had good time, but I require more from mmorpg's now, I had my time with simple themeparks and have enough of them for few years propably.

 

 

  Jemcrystal

Advanced Member

Joined: 1/02/08
Posts: 1356

Let em put a slave ring thru u're nose u're prob not going to like where they're taking you. Think.

10/15/12 7:05:11 AM#62
 

No, you're just fine for wanting housing mmo.  Second Life is to expensive.  It would be nice if a reasonably priced housing mmo came along with a surrounding forest for hunting, crafting, orc bashing.

I gave up on good housing in mmorpg's and played Sims 2 for a few years.  Cannot beat it's price since Sims 3 came out.  I can get an EP or SP for only $5-$15 on Amazon.  I managed to collect them all.  In TS2 you can have your dream home.  I would say to bad it is not an mmo but if it was they'd mess it up like they're going to mess up Skyrim with pvp.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q6EoRBvdVPQ

  fenistil

Novice Member

Joined: 9/22/11
Posts: 3016

10/15/12 7:25:29 AM#63
Originally posted by Jemcrystal
 

No, you're just fine for wanting housing mmo.  Second Life is to expensive.  It would be nice if a reasonably priced housing mmo came along with a surrounding forest for hunting, crafting, orc bashing.

Problem for me with Second Life it is that it is ONLY virtual world game and that those features are main and only part of the game and because of that being very expensive in development and also tied to RL cash.

I would prefer a mmorpg with less developed housing (cheaper) and virtual world stuff than in Second Life but with real combat and adventure gameplay.    I want to have meaningful housing and economy game elements and not necessarily playing total simulation game like Second Life, that is about very complex Sim-virtual life and real life money things.

  fiftyplusgeek

Elite Member

Joined: 8/17/12
Posts: 463

10/15/12 9:47:06 AM#64
Originally posted by fenistil
Originally posted by Jemcrystal
 

No, you're just fine for wanting housing mmo.  Second Life is to expensive.  It would be nice if a reasonably priced housing mmo came along with a surrounding forest for hunting, crafting, orc bashing.

Problem for me with Second Life it is that it is ONLY virtual world game and that those features are main and only part of the game and because of that being very expensive in development and also tied to RL cash.

I would prefer a mmorpg with less developed housing (cheaper) and virtual world stuff than in Second Life but with real combat and adventure gameplay.    I want to have meaningful housing and economy game elements and not necessarily playing total simulation game like Second Life, that is about very complex Sim-virtual life and real life money things.

Actually, SL is a great platform for RP. The beauty of it is that you have all the tools available to build your own RP simulation with levels, skills, weapons, armor, magic, etc.

Toxia, Dark City, Kingdom of Sand...all of these are pretty much indistinguishable from MMORPGs. I'm sure there are many others, but I haven't been in SL for years now.

I remember someone building a HUD for their "game" that looked just like WoW's interface when added to the viewport. Everything functional. And all done using a simple scripting language built rightinto SL.

Looking back, I'd have to say that I had more fun in the Toxia sim than any MMO I've played, with the exception of UO.

I am no longer responsible for anything my phone decides is correct in the way of word choices and punctuation.

  Aelious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2482

World > Quest Progression

10/15/12 11:10:02 AM#65
If the 50-100 million dollars a typical grade A MMMO takes was used differently in design I think it would be easier to have both a SIMS/2L social game and a full fledged combat/adventure game. Reduce 100% hand crafted content by 60% and spend that money coming up with automation tools and player generating tools (crafting, housing, tavern mini game interfaces, advanced communication features, etc.). I think we've reached a point where those with better tech will bring something unique.

IMO the blending of social games and tradional MMORPGs (specifically sandboxish ones) is imminent. It's just a matter of time for development to reach us. The reason is that the bane of the MMO industry is insufficient players to fill each game to a point if sustainability. That and a model style prone to player turnaround. The first MMO to successfully appeal to both social gamers and combat centric gamers will see WoW numbers. Maybe not as a subscription game but in unified popularity. Even the staunchest of adventure types have to admit that coming to a city or town and seeing a lot of players conversing/bustling around would be a welcome sight. The trick will be having the tech to create enough open ended content to keep them. 2cp
  AlBQuirky

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 1/24/05
Posts: 3304

Tomorrow's just a future yesterday...

10/15/12 12:03:51 PM#66


Originally posted by Jakdstripper

Originally posted by Elikal Now I have "played" the new DLC for Skyrim, Hearthfire. Now by itself there wasn't much to do, tho I felt it was worth the 4,99 Euro. I built a wonderful, large house overviewing a lake, I invited my husband into it, hired a steward, a bard and worked very hard to create all the furniture and shrines and gather all my many trophies and place them there. Finally I did what I had wished to do for a LONG time, I got two kids out of this horrible Orphanage and had two kids, which I pampered with toys and gifts and sweets. Oh and I managed to get two dogs as well. It didn't "do" anything, but it sorta filled me with glee, and made the game round.    
 wtf?....you play mmos to be a house wife?....:S....

What's wrong with being a housewife? (YouTube vid)

I saw that for the XBox, Elikal. I was wondering how good it was. I hope, hope, HOPE it comes out for PC soon :) It looks like great fun :)

- Al

Personally the only modern MMORPG trend that annoys me is the idea that MMOs need to be designed in a way to attract people who don't actually like MMOs. Which to me makes about as much sense as someone trying to figure out a way to get vegetarians to eat at their steakhouse.
- FARGIN_WAR

  Icewhite

Made History

Joined: 7/11/11
Posts: 6495

Pink, it's like red but not quite.

10/15/12 12:09:49 PM#67
Originally posted by Starpower
They serve no function other than as a trophy.

Actually, if often amazes me how much time/effort players put into acquiring certain trophies...

But yeah, trophies only 'sell' if you can convince your consumer market that they must have the latest and best at all times.

S'why a lot of raiders hit the "top end" exactly once.  The second time, they see the treadmill (stick) more clearly than they see the prize (carrot).

Self-pity imprisons us in the walls of our own self-absorption. The whole world shrinks down to the size of our problem, and the more we dwell on it, the smaller we are and the larger the problem seems to grow.

  StonesDK

Apprentice Member

Joined: 8/06/11
Posts: 1843

10/15/12 2:12:20 PM#68
Originally posted by Icewhite
Originally posted by Starpower
They serve no function other than as a trophy.

Actually, if often amazes me how much time/effort players put into acquiring certain trophies...

But yeah, trophies only 'sell' if you can convince your consumer market that they must have the latest and best at all times.

S'why a lot of raiders hit the "top end" exactly once.  The second time, they see the treadmill (stick) more clearly than they see the prize (carrot).

There certainly seems to be a big market for what I consider the dullest and unimaginable use of housing in MMORPGs. Housing could be used as focal points, places where people have a reason to gather other than to look at that shiny armor mounted on the wall. That would require the elimination of auction houses, crafting areas in NPC cities, and actual needs your character needs filled that can only be filled in player homes, I'm talking actual game mechanics.

But why do all that when players will gladly settle for a lot less, like a trophy room and an epeen sized house based on your ability to farm coins and mats.

 

 

  3-4thElf

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/12
Posts: 496

10/15/12 6:52:00 PM#69
Originally posted by Vesavius
Originally posted by 3-4thElf

I'm not a "must have" kind of player with player housing.

I always thought EQ2's version was tacked on and could've  been a bit more. I liked have my own lil' place to throw auctions up, but there should've been a lil' more or something.

Wizards 101, a kids game of course, actually has pretty great housing with the pet system, the gardens, and what not. I also enjoy LotRO's little rented community instances.

There's room for it in MMOs of course, but it'd have to be a bit more than just a trophy showcase in my opinion. 

 

EQ2's housing is far far from 'tacked on'... How could it have be more, in your opinion? Assuming that you are just not referring to the fact that it is instanced ofc?

I mean... it has pretty much a whole crafting sphere devoted to it. Housing is woven throughout your play experience if you chose it to be, with collections, quests, etc giving housing based rewards right through your game from L1.

What more, beyond maybe it not being instanced, would you like to see in EQ2 housing wise?

 

Well my experience is in regards to the first 14 months or so of the game.

Crafting was done in other instances when I was playing, and selling / buying was done with a message board.

I played a bit after and the only thing I saw added to the housing was an extra room for the cheapest house and an idol to the deities.

a yo ho ho

  Aelious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2482

World > Quest Progression

10/15/12 10:35:48 PM#70
EQ2's housing/item system is vast and a game by itself if you're a carpenter. You can even write your own books and place them in your house with the other hundreds of books in the game. I'm not sure how many items in the game can be placed in your home but I'm sure it's in the thousands by now.

That being said they could add such things as doors to your other houses or guild Hall that are uninstanced. I'm not sure how doable that is nuts and bolts wise but it would be nice. In a perfect world EQ2's system would be open world or community instanced but it's current iteration is enough. /crossfingers for EQN.
  VengeSunsoar

Apprentice Member

Joined: 3/10/04
Posts: 4851

Be Brief, Be Bright... Be Gone.

10/15/12 11:32:43 PM#71
Originally posted by Aelious
EQ2's housing/item system is vast and a game by itself if you're a carpenter. You can even write your own books and place them in your house with the other hundreds of books in the game. I'm not sure how many items in the game can be placed in your home but I'm sure it's in the thousands by now.

That being said they could add such things as doors to your other houses or guild Hall that are uninstanced. I'm not sure how doable that is nuts and bolts wise but it would be nice. In a perfect world EQ2's system would be open world or community instanced but it's current iteration is enough. /crossfingers for EQN.

 I just wish there wasn't a limit on the number of items you can have.  I have a castle I built on Tenebrous Isle.  Huge, awesome, made mostly out of different shades of marble and stone, lavishly decorated with a library, bedrooms, grand hall, small hall, spiral staircases, treasure, room marketplace, and super nice looking barn, kitchen, armory...  and not done because I am at my 1200 peice limit.  My interest severelly dropped when I realized I would not able to finish it.  Only have a fraction of the portals, shop peices and decorations I want, I do have all the crafting equipment and 5 chests though.  

Sure would be nice to finish it but until they raise the cap it won't, and I don't really want to compromise on it.  I loved building this thing, didn't enjoy the game a lot but loved building it. 

Quit worrying about other players in a game and just play.

  User Deleted
10/15/12 11:45:28 PM#72
Originally posted by Elikal

I know, there are the power zerger who just want to KILL STUFF in MMOs, and that's fine with me. But ever since I spent years in building my house in EQ2, I missed that, and missed being connected to the world in MMOs. I know how after EQ2 and SWG (my big SWG manor in our very alife player city... *sob*) I just could not play WOW at all; and my personal reason was, that I felt like a homeless. In EQ2 and SWG I *always* went back into my home after a longer play session or finishing an area. It was a sort of ritual. I logged out "at home". I gradually got larger homes, and I placed all my trophies in it. In SWG had even had a big ingame marriage with another player, we built our manor together in our guild's player city. Sigh.

Now I have "played" the new DLC for Skyrim, Hearthfire. Now by itself there wasn't much to do, tho I felt it was worth the 4,99 Euro. I built a wonderful, large house overviewing a lake, I invited my husband into it, hired a steward, a bard and worked very hard to create all the furniture and shrines and gather all my many trophies and place them there. Finally I did what I had wished to do for a LONG time, I got two kids out of this horrible Orphanage and had two kids, which I pampered with toys and gifts and sweets. Oh and I managed to get two dogs as well. It didn't "do" anything, but it sorta filled me with glee, and made the game round.

 

I really miss that in MMOs. When I ran through Guild Wars II, often I wished I had a house for trophies, a NPC hubby and could adopt some of these super cute kids, and I would always bring them some exciting stuff and tales from my adventures.

But I guess that's just silly me... :

i could only say one thing after reading your story " hahaha. what a loser " 

  Aelious

Hard Core Member

Joined: 9/27/11
Posts: 2482

World > Quest Progression

10/15/12 11:46:47 PM#73
Wow, just wow nice job! I hope they raise the cap as well so you can finish it. I'm going to delve into it myself. I have a 20 Troub I'm going to make a Carpenter... Maybe a Fury, but I have other characters to do other trades. Gratz again!
  Elikal

Spotlight Poster

Joined: 2/09/06
Posts: 8067

“No path is darker then when your eyes are shut.” -Flemeth

 
OP  10/16/12 12:45:38 AM#74
Originally posted by Aelious
Wow, just wow nice job! I hope they raise the cap as well so you can finish it. I'm going to delve into it myself. I have a 20 Troub I'm going to make a Carpenter... Maybe a Fury, but I have other characters to do other trades. Gratz again!

Good memories. ^^ Crafting furniture was actually the only crafting I ever liked. Nothing like seeing your own furniture in your and your friends houses. :)

A forum is a place where people can discuss about different opinions. So what I don't get is, how people react offended when they come to a forum and then find... well different opinions. If a different opinion offends you, what are you even doing here?

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