Originally posted by Thane

Originally posted by MagnusCeleritas

No one was talking to you...

Er wait...are you talking to yourself? Wannabe troll? Wtf is a narcist? Jesus is now involved?

Holy @#$@ am I in trouble now. He's brought a mexican with him.

you made a thread in the community i use.

u are trying to justify your lame behaviour of cheating.

 

you sir, have been reported (not by me, your lousy post was reported already)

you have been supporting illegal means. you sir, are a cheater. nothing else.

 

and no, we dont think you are cool because you bought ingame money, we think you are a weirdo.

Why would I think I was cool in a community that abhors buying gold and likens it to drug dealing?

I thought I was a Narcissistic Sociopath...not a Full On Retard.

Originally posted by MagnusCeleritas

Originally posted by DarSepki

Great post Kyleran!

 

OP has stepped over the line with buying gold. But repeatly claimed his source does not contribute to the problems related to gold buying, stealing accounts, etc. Unless you know the personally, and know thier exact methods, than no they are not trusted.

Pass blame to the high level farmers, and the fact that lower level items go for higher prices. Welcome to inflation. Knowing this problem, isn't it just as easy to sell and work the AH a bit to get the gold that you need. That is if OP is smart enough! Instead lets just assume that the gold is aquired only by those who farm exclusively for it and not by those who play smart with what they have.

Managing your virtual resources IS a part of the game. It may be called grindy or boring, but buying gold is considered cheating and the reason why accounts caught with this activity are banned. To the OP, you have two choices, either play by the rules established by the game (and supported by the community), or as you stated:

...Alt-F4 and unsub: grindy boredom.

It is that simple. Making money is easy, alot easier than the other things that you claimed that you are good at. And it takes far less time that you claim. But if you cannot face these facts, it does not justify for cheating and supporting ruining the game experience.

Making gold as a level 1 is not as easy as you think it is, unless you get to a high level first (preferably max level).

Ironically, the sole reason I buy gold is because I am NOT max level.

 

Could it be that some of us actually prefer the adventure, and DONT want to rush to end game? I rarely have a max level in any game-- do you know why? It's not because I don't play enough. It's because of two reasons: I dont want one, and I have too many alts to have one.

Okay, I lied, in DAoC I had one and it was crazy fun. Getting there was not though. Me and my friend labeled it "Dark Age of Task Dungeons" due to how boring and mind-numbing the grind was to max level. (Back in the beta days of DAoC, I had so many characters on so many realms, I never even came close to max level, so that's why I only did on the classic server- hence the Task Dungeons). And it's kindof a lie, bc I almost had several in WoW. Technically though, I almost never have a max level character. Primarily because I play A LOT of games. Even if I play a ton, I dont play ONE a ton. I always have at least a FPS, a MMO, and a RTS--  and find myself playing browser or console games instead! Hahahahaha....

 

Anything boring is something I don't want to participate in. I do not ruin my game experience, I enhance it.

 

The biggest irony that I taste is that no one knows the vendor I buy gold from, but is so insistent that they are evil. If I were to pay IRL cash to my nephew to harvest gold for me, I swear to all that is holy-- everyone here would insist he is somehow a slave, being forced to stay up all night (by me I guess?) perhaps locked up in my Sociopath basement.

 

Hahahahha, it all fits!

 

I'm a narcissistic Sociopath who is so sociopathic, he locks his enslaved chinese nephew (despite the fact I'm african american and not asian in any way) in my sociopath basement, where he is forced to grind for gold 23/7, with a single hour of sleep. He doesn't eat or drink, as I have an IV for that so he can play. When he dies, I am such a narcissistic genius that I believe I am frankenstein monstering him, making him come back to live. In reality, none of this is real, and I am my nephew, I am chinese, and I dont' even play WoW- I yell at a cardboard box all day and pee in it.

Thanks for proving the point for me, your terrible at making money ingame.

I stopped playing WOW years ago, got too easy. But my wife started a new character at level 1, about a year ago. With no outside assistance, and mearly leveling herself with a gathering profession she made thousands and did not even get to level 80.

The assumptions you make about gold grinding ingame are legendary. Also you were beat by a girl.

Originally posted by vgamer

Read this article first:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/25/china-prisoners-internet-gaming-scam

 

Now, how do you feel you potentially support this kind of activity? I know in your mind, you have this ideal picture where happy farmers are earning money to support their families. However, reality seems to suggest otherwise. Do you think that, maybe, there is slight chance that you're actually promoting this inhumane activities. This is besides phishing, scamming and other malicious things.

So if MMORPG gold farming would not exist, do you really think those prisoners would be treated significantely better? It is dictatorial and oppressive China you are talking about. 

Originally posted by MagnusCeleritas

Originally posted by someforumguy

Originally posted by MagnusCeleritas

Originally posted by Sicae

Thanks for supporting phishing mails, banner hacks and grind bots. Without you online games would never be the same.

/golfclap

I only buy gold from a trusted website which gathers its gold through farming.

You do realize that there ARE websites which run a professional business with an ethical policy...right?

I only have one source for anything I buy, solely for this reason. I do NOT support hackers or phishers. There is a reason I do not buy from the cheapest website, or why I never...EVER...buy from those who spam ads in game. (I'm sure those are phishers and hackers, guaranteed, along with most other vendors).

 

Thank you for being yet another 20-something male who assumes automatically the worse, without knowing any evidence or factual information to form said opinion.

Ah, assumptions, perhaps the most scientific type of evidence possible.

Just as your assumption that those companies are a professional business with an ethical policy? What does that even mean? They don't annoy players with their ingame spam and mail? They don't send phishing e-mails? They don't steal accounts? How can you even know if they do that or not?

It is a shady business, because they have no good reputation to begin with. There is nothing to gain (or more importantly to lose) in that department for them. So for you there is no way to know if they can be trusted or not. Unless you know them personally of course, which I highly doubt.

Those companies have nothing to lose if they actually start stealing accounts. I mean, who is going to point the finger at them? Pointing the finger at them means you admit buying gold from them and being scammed.

Idk...maybe the company is a US based company. maybe I know the employees. Maybe it's not a company, it's a vendor, and the vendor is my nephew, my brother, or my friend.

Heck, maybe I go to Yummy Tummy (the Chinese food place across the street from my apartment complex) and walk in, say "5000 gold Ching Chang Chong") and after I get kicked out (again...wtf business is this) I come back and somehow I got hacked and have 5000 gold now.

Or maybe by "I buy gold", what I mean to say is that I farm it myself, and place $1 in a piggy bank anytime I spend 300 gold. My vendor is me...but he can't be trusted. I heard he is a sociopath AND a narcissist (and a narcist, but it's okay bc the mexican gardner is coming to take care of him).

Your response worries me:/ Anyway, you just buy gold and then make up excuses for yourself. I agree with Coman:

To me it simply is cheating. Do not get me wrong I understand why you want to cheat this way, but to me any game where I start getting the feeling i need to cheat is not worth my time. I do not have a problem with poeple doing it though, but I dunno knowing that people either got hacked or actually where forced to work to get that gold leaves a bad taste for me if I would have brought it.

I think it is laughable to pay a sub for a game and then start buying gold so you can skip parts of the game. Most ppl realise that it actually makes the game not worth it to begin with. The ppl who actually start buying gold are just confused (which goes hand in hand with your last comment). Not to mention that your account can be all gone at the moment they catch you. Which makes me wonder if you then realise that it is your own fault and how deserved it is.

Originally posted by DarSepki

snip

Thanks for proving the point for me, your terrible at making money ingame.

I stopped playing WOW years ago, got too easy. But my wife started a new character at level 1, about a year ago. With no outside assistance, and mearly leveling herself with a gathering profession she made thousands and did not even get to level 80.

The assumptions you make about gold grinding ingame are legendary. Also you were beat by a girl.

The idea you don't know the difference between "you're" and "your" and you have a wife is incomprehensible. I refuse to believe anything you say as true. My ego just can't bare to understand or grasp this phenomenon.

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by vgamer

Read this article first:

 

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2011/may/25/china-prisoners-internet-gaming-scam

 

Now, how do you feel you potentially support this kind of activity? I know in your mind, you have this ideal picture where happy farmers are earning money to support their families. However, reality seems to suggest otherwise. Do you think that, maybe, there is slight chance that you're actually promoting this inhumane activities. This is besides phishing, scamming and other malicious things.

So if MMORPG gold farming would not exist, do you really think those prisoners would be treated significantely better? It is dictatorial and oppressive China you are talking about. 

No no no no no.

It's 100% gold farmers.

9/11? Chinese Gold farmers.

Wars? Chinese Gold farmers.

Local Robbery by a non-asian? Chinese Gold Farmers.

Korean, Vietnamese, or US gold farmers? Chinese Gold Farmers.

Originally posted by DarSepki Also you were beat by a girl.

Care to elaborate?

Originally posted by someforumguy

Osnap

Idk...maybe the company is a US based company. maybe I know the employees. Maybe it's not a company, it's a vendor, and the vendor is my nephew, my brother, or my friend.

Heck, maybe I go to Yummy Tummy (the Chinese food place across the street from my apartment complex) and walk in, say "5000 gold Ching Chang Chong") and after I get kicked out (again...wtf business is this) I come back and somehow I got hacked and have 5000 gold now.

Or maybe by "I buy gold", what I mean to say is that I farm it myself, and place $1 in a piggy bank anytime I spend 300 gold. My vendor is me...but he can't be trusted. I heard he is a sociopath AND a narcissist (and a narcist, but it's okay bc the mexican gardner is coming to take care of him).

Your response worries me:/ Anyway, you just buy gold and then make up excuses for yourself. I agree with Coman:

To me it simply is cheating. Do not get me wrong I understand why you want to cheat this way, but to me any game where I start getting the feeling i need to cheat is not worth my time. I do not have a problem with poeple doing it though, but I dunno knowing that people either got hacked or actually where forced to work to get that gold leaves a bad taste for me if I would have brought it.

I think it is laughable to pay a sub for a game and then start buying gold so you can skip parts of the game. Most ppl realise that it actually makes the game not worth it to begin with. The ppl who actually start buying gold are just confused (which goes hand in hand with your last comment). Not to mention that your account can be all gone at the moment they catch you. Which makes me wonder if you then realise that it is your own fault and how deserved it is.

Laugh all you want.

While I pay a sub for a game and spend a few dollars on gold, it is not even 50% the cost of the newest game you most recently bought.

I'm economical. You know. For the economy. Because gold farming is good for the economy. The IRL one and the game one.

Originally posted by IfrianMMO

Originally posted by DarSepki Also you were beat by a girl.

Care to elaborate?

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

I can't wait to find out.

*chubs popcorn*

Wasn't this guys name MagnusCelerius or something like that about 10 minutes ago?

Edit:

Ahhhhh, now his account is deleted. For a couple of minutes his name showed as something else and the avatar quote was the ever popular BR BR BR BR .

Originally posted by megabuu
No matter how you spin reasons to buy gold from third party vendors, there is one main thing to concider. It is against ALL ELUA's for MMOs to do it. You throw that out the window and you pretty much have no respect for those games or the hard work of the developers. Just earn the money like all hardworking gamers.

Developers have to either choose to allow gold selling for everyone in their game or none; the worst thing they can do is go the Guild Wars 2 path of selling gold themselves but not letting other "legit" people sell. 

Originally posted by Omnifish

Hmmm...

Most of that gold you buy, isn't from hardworking fellows grinding for it, it's from account steals.

Here's how it works: Player A on server B buys gold from Suppiler C.  Supplier C never keeps gold on any characters, or has tons of people working on it.  What they do have is lists of people who ordered gold before, through their site and their servers and most importantly emails.  They'll then try and find one for Server B and use the login details that person uses for their site as a WoW login, (most people use the same login details).

The other angle and the more despicable side is guild site farming.  So if we take the scenerio from before, the suppiler will start looking for guilds on server B. When he's found some, he'll go to there guildsites, he'll grab all of the email address of the directory, (which isn't difficult to do), put together a phising mail and start sending them out hoping to get lucky, i.e. that someone will either give the password or try and login to a premade phising site which spits out the login details to notepad.

In both cases the objective is to strip the stolen account of assets to then supply Player A with the gold they ordered.

I don't know if you work for these companies or if you genuinely are someone whose bought gold and never thought about it from another perspective, but whatever justification you give to yourself you are benefiting from stealing. 

First they run the mails on hackerdatabases with passwords from hacked webbsites, if they are lucky they have find someone who used the same password everywhere saving them a whole lot of work as well.

There was a time when goldfarming and selling it was common, and we all heard about the Chinese prison who forced the inmates to farm Wow gold but today most of the gold around is hacked.

And the only way to stop this is to stop buying gold. If you must buy gold play a F2P which sell what you need in their itemshop and buy it legally instead.

Anyone buying gold from an illegetime site deserves to get their account hacked.

Originally posted by Deleted User

Originally posted by IfrianMMO

Originally posted by DarSepki Also you were beat by a girl.

Care to elaborate?

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

 

I can't wait to find out.

 

*chubs popcorn*

By making money while leveling, and being able to level to CAP. Something you were not able to do.

It is a small thing, I am sure that you do not consider as an achievement. But I do not see deleting my forum account as an achievement either.

The problem’s with gold buying are the following:

• It’s intrinsically linked with account hacking/stealing.  Without a market for gold, account hacking would become obsolete.
• It encourages and perpetuates the very economic inequality the OP claims to have a problem with.  It puts a lot of gold in the hands of a few, putting the rest of the population at an economic disadvantage.
  • Would the OP then suggest that everyone else who feels they’re at a disadvantage economically also buy gold?  This suddenly creates a link between the real world economy and the game’s virtual economy, and we’re well aware of the wealth disparity that exists in the real world.   This creates an uneven playing field at a fundamental level that is beyond the control of the developers to balance. 
  • “But other high level players already have this economic advantage” is not an argument.  First, these are just 2 paths to the same problem.  Second, there’s a fundamental difference between earning this advantage by playing the game how the game was designed and artificially generating this advantage by bringing real world money into the equation. 
• Gold buying is often intrinsically linked with botting or massive farming parties, which, depending on game design, can often negatively affect the in-game experiences of players trying to enjoy the game. 

Originally posted by Homitu

The problem’s with gold buying are the following:

• It’s intrinsically linked with account hacking/stealing.  Without a market for gold, account hacking would become obsolete.
• It encourages and perpetuates the very economic inequality the OP claims to have a problem with.  It puts a lot of gold in the hands of a few, putting the rest of the population at an economic disadvantage.
  • Would the OP then suggest that everyone else who feels they’re at a disadvantage economically also buy gold?  This suddenly creates a link between the real world economy and the game’s virtual economy, and we’re well aware of the wealth disparity that exists in the real world.   This creates an uneven playing field at a fundamental level that is beyond the control of the developers to balance. 
  • “But other high level players already have this economic advantage” is not an argument.  First, these are just 2 paths to the same problem.  Second, there’s a fundamental difference between earning this advantage by playing the game how the game was designed and artificially generating this advantage by bringing real world money into the equation. 
• Gold buying is often intrinsically linked with botting or massive farming parties, which, depending on game design, can often negatively affect the in-game experiences of players trying to enjoy the game. 

Gold buying directly enables all of these practices that negatively influence players’ experiences.  Without gold buyers, all of these practices cease to exist.  By buying gold, you're choosing to perpetuate these problems.  There's simply no way around that. 

Precisely, that's why developers should either endorse gold-buying & selling for everyone or not for anyone (which includes that they themselves do not sell gold). 

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by megabuu
No matter how you spin reasons to buy gold from third party vendors, there is one main thing to concider. It is against ALL ELUA's for MMOs to do it. You throw that out the window and you pretty much have no respect for those games or the hard work of the developers. Just earn the money like all hardworking gamers.

 

Developers have to either choose to allow gold selling for everyone in their game or none; the worst thing they can do is go the Guild Wars 2 path of selling gold themselves but not letting other "legit" people sell. 

There are no "legit" sellers beyond the developer. "Legit" sellers means they are farming areas for gold, this impacts other players. To be profitible they will be forced to either bot keeping them from being legit, phish and hack accounts which would keep them from being legit, buy low from others and sale high which they can't afford to do reliably, or get slave labor which would keep them from being legit. A "legit" seller beyond the developers/publishers does not exist. Anet can not regulate these "companies" no one is regulating them.

Originally posted by GrayGhost79

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by megabuu
No matter how you spin reasons to buy gold from third party vendors, there is one main thing to concider. It is against ALL ELUA's for MMOs to do it. You throw that out the window and you pretty much have no respect for those games or the hard work of the developers. Just earn the money like all hardworking gamers.

 

Developers have to either choose to allow gold selling for everyone in their game or none; the worst thing they can do is go the Guild Wars 2 path of selling gold themselves but not letting other "legit" people sell. 

There are no "legit" sellers beyond the developer. "Legit" sellers means they are farming areas for gold, this impacts other players. To be profitible they will be forced to either bot keeping them from being legit, phish and hack accounts which would keep them from being legit, buy low from others and sale high which they can't afford to do reliably, or get slave labor which would keep them from being legit. A "legit" seller beyond the developers/publishers does not exist. Anet can not regulate these "companies" no one is regulating them.

I mean "legit" in the sense that the manner in which they obtain the gold is within the rules of the game. You are right though that that won't stop them from attempting to bot or hack accounts. "Slave labour" is not necessarely equivalent with "Cheap labour" and it is not a foreign concept that we in the Western world buy products which "uses" cheap labour in other countries to drive down the prices. 

"Legit" in the sense I mean does exist, specially among unemployed teenagers who don't mind getting a low salary for "playing the game".

Originally posted by DarSepki

Originally posted by Deleted User

Originally posted by IfrianMMO

Originally posted by DarSepki Also you were beat by a girl.

Care to elaborate?

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

 

I can't wait to find out.

 

*chubs popcorn*

By making money while leveling, and being able to level to CAP. Something you were not able to do.

It is a small thing, I am sure that you do not consider as an achievement. But I do not see deleting my forum account as an achievement either.

You missed the point.

Our question is "Why does it matter that a girl may have beaten him?"

You are making it sounds like losing to a girl is somehow worse than losing to a guy.

Elaborate please.

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by Homitu

The problem’s with gold buying are the following:

• It’s intrinsically linked with account hacking/stealing.  Without a market for gold, account hacking would become obsolete.
• It encourages and perpetuates the very economic inequality the OP claims to have a problem with.  It puts a lot of gold in the hands of a few, putting the rest of the population at an economic disadvantage.
  • Would the OP then suggest that everyone else who feels they’re at a disadvantage economically also buy gold?  This suddenly creates a link between the real world economy and the game’s virtual economy, and we’re well aware of the wealth disparity that exists in the real world.   This creates an uneven playing field at a fundamental level that is beyond the control of the developers to balance. 
  • “But other high level players already have this economic advantage” is not an argument.  First, these are just 2 paths to the same problem.  Second, there’s a fundamental difference between earning this advantage by playing the game how the game was designed and artificially generating this advantage by bringing real world money into the equation. 
• Gold buying is often intrinsically linked with botting or massive farming parties, which, depending on game design, can often negatively affect the in-game experiences of players trying to enjoy the game. 

Gold buying directly enables all of these practices that negatively influence players’ experiences.  Without gold buyers, all of these practices cease to exist.  By buying gold, you're choosing to perpetuate these problems.  There's simply no way around that. 

Precisely, that's why developers should either endorse gold-buying & selling for everyone or not for anyone (which includes that they themselves do not sell gold). 

And a game like Entropia Universe does this.  They intentionally link the game's economy with real world economy.  It's part of the design and intent, and that's fine. 

I do disagree partly with the second half of your statement though.  I think there's eventually a choice developers have to make between the lesser of 2 evils because they can't have it both ways.  Presently, it is impossible to eliminate bots, 3rd party gold farmers/sells, and hacked accounts.  However, since the sole purpose of all that bad stuff is to accrue and sell gold, a well-executed developer sponsored means of offering gold to the wannabe gold buyers (who continue to be the source of it all and who are also ineradicable) may be the current most effective means of reducing or even all but eliminating the other problems.