Originally posted by Draemos

I made it to level 30 and realized I was doing the same handful of things over and over again and that everything was a Zerg. . Probably the worst leveling experience I've had  in a AAA game.  Hell I even made it to a higher level in Aion.  I wouldn't even have made it to 30 if the engineer wasn't a moderately unique class.

 

Your bar must be sticking about two inches out of the mud, because this game is decent at best.

 

 I want to take something and put it in context here.  You said, "probably the worst leveling experience I've had in an AAA game.

See, therein lies the problem. If you play GW2 like all the other AAA games and all you can think about is level, level, level then you will probably be bored.

I've found that playing the game by just going out and enountering things and forgetting about leveling brings a far more enjoyable experience. Funny part is that in this game I actually get startled when my "Level Up" occurs because I'm not expecting it. 

Funny how some people still can't grasp that this game was not made to be played like the typical MMO. It literally takes off most of the constraints and lets you "LIVE" the game. If you choose to do so that is. Otherwise follow the hearts, grind your levels, fast mode your dungeons and you'll be here complaining you're bored and have nothing to do.

Originally posted by Pretender00

Originally posted by Draemos

I made it to level 30 and realized I was doing the same handful of things over and over again and that everything was a Zerg. . Probably the worst leveling experience I've had  in a AAA game.  Hell I even made it to a higher level in Aion.  I wouldn't even have made it to 30 if the engineer wasn't a moderately unique class.

 

Your bar must be sticking about two inches out of the mud, because this game is decent at best.

 

 I want to take something and put it in context here.  You said, "probably the worst leveling experience I've had in an AAA game.

See, therein lies the problem. If you play GW2 like all the other AAA games and all you can think about is level, level, level then you will probably be bored.

I've found that playing the game by just going out and enountering things and forgetting about leveling brings a far more enjoyable experience. Funny part is that in this game I actually get startled when my "Level Up" occurs because I'm not expecting it. 

Funny how some people still can't grasp that this game was not made to be played like the typical MMO. It literally takes off most of the constraints and lets you "LIVE" the game. If you choose to do so that is. Otherwise follow the hearts, grind your levels, fast mode your dungeons and you'll be here complaining you're bored and have nothing to do

And for those of us that "live"d the game but still find it boring, repetitive, short, and disappointing....what do you say to that?

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Pretender00

Originally posted by Draemos

I made it to level 30 and realized I was doing the same handful of things over and over again and that everything was a Zerg. . Probably the worst leveling experience I've had  in a AAA game.  Hell I even made it to a higher level in Aion.  I wouldn't even have made it to 30 if the engineer wasn't a moderately unique class.

 

Your bar must be sticking about two inches out of the mud, because this game is decent at best.

 

 I want to take something and put it in context here.  You said, "probably the worst leveling experience I've had in an AAA game.

See, therein lies the problem. If you play GW2 like all the other AAA games and all you can think about is level, level, level then you will probably be bored.

I've found that playing the game by just going out and enountering things and forgetting about leveling brings a far more enjoyable experience. Funny part is that in this game I actually get startled when my "Level Up" occurs because I'm not expecting it. 

Funny how some people still can't grasp that this game was not made to be played like the typical MMO. It literally takes off most of the constraints and lets you "LIVE" the game. If you choose to do so that is. Otherwise follow the hearts, grind your levels, fast mode your dungeons and you'll be here complaining you're bored and have nothing to do

And for those of us that "live"d the game but still find it boring, repetitive, short, and disappointing....what do you say to that?

 

 I say fair enough, have fun in your new adventure elsewhere.

This is the ultimate rape of the word "innovation" by the way.

INNOVATION 10 ?

Removing quest hubs, so we get the same Kill X and Click X egg quests automatically?

No number for Kill X but a X percent bar filling up?

THAT is innovation 10 in the eyes of MMORPG? Really? This "10" score is an insult and ridicules all further reviews.

Well just so you know, YOU are the ones holding up the industry with reviews like that, it's a shame really, over a decade of the same cookie cutter quests and they rate that thing INNOVATION 10.

Instead of WoWclones we will get a bunch of slightly adapted GW2 clones for "innovation".

Oh and go look that word up in a dictionary before you EVER use it again.

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

this score is a joke. Boring story, boring fetch quests, not worth a sub. 6/10 at best

 

thanls for such reviews, now we can be prepared for another 10 years of brain dead quest goals and collect quests. Thanks, really

 

 I really don't like golf, like at all, and I also have something against Italian plumbers.  So I give Mario Golf a 4/10.

Do you see anything wrong with this review score?

Ah yes, I based my score completely on personal preferences, biases, and ignored any of the objective merits of the game.  Anyone who gives GW2 something below a 7, is doing the same.

Creslin, you are usually very fair.  But for some reasor n, you seem to denounce anyone who gives GW2 a score lower than you deem acceptable.  You love the game, fine.   But just because someone doesn't love your game, you dismiss their view entirely.

This reeks of arrogance.

Don't think it reeks of arrogance at all.  Look the fact is that if you asked this person what an 8 to 10 was more likely than not they wouldn't be able to even tell you what a great MMO looks like and if they could you'll usually find that the reason behind their dislike is that they happen to love another genre or they are a die hard sandbox fan or themepark fan.   And to be honest, that's bs.  A great game is a great game period and transcends the perspective niche of one person or another for the sake of a review.  You want to review a game then you go past personal preferences and you review it based upon it's strengths and weaknesses as an MMO as a whole and if a person's only rebuttle is "boring story" "boring this" "boring that" "I'm just bored because I can't ride a dragon", etc.  then it's really not worth the time to even reply to.  Personally I think Creslin is stating a fact, now that fact may or may not be backed up by reviewers as a whole i haven't really checked yet but in my own unbiased opinin (and it is truly unbiased btw with regard to GW2) this game deserves a solid 7 at least.

rofl 9.3

This game deserves a 7.5/10 at best. 

Low standards ftw I guess.

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

this score is a joke. Boring story, boring fetch quests, not worth a sub. 6/10 at best

 

thanls for such reviews, now we can be prepared for another 10 years of brain dead quest goals and collect quests. Thanks, really

 

 I really don't like golf, like at all, and I also have something against Italian plumbers.  So I give Mario Golf a 4/10.

Do you see anything wrong with this review score?

Ah yes, I based my score completely on personal preferences, biases, and ignored any of the objective merits of the game.  Anyone who gives GW2 something below a 7, is doing the same.

Creslin, you are usually very fair.  But for some reasor n, you seem to denounce anyone who gives GW2 a score lower than you deem acceptable.  You love the game, fine.   But just because someone doesn't love your game, you dismiss their view entirely.

This reeks of arrogance.

 It's not arrogance, I just see anything below a seven for GW2 as being outside of a reasonable score, and thus I question it.  Also, my statement would allow for someone to give GW2 say like a 7.1, which is a pretty freaking low score.  That's a C-.

It's kind of like if someone gave The Matrix (first one) a 6, I would say they are smoking crack.  Or on a more rational level, their subjective, personal feelings about the movie did not allow them to see its objective merits.

Even if I personally HATE a game, I would still try to give it points for things that it did well objectively, or compared with its peers.  I really did not like SWTOR for example, but I gave it like an 8 if I remember right.

Also, I want to clarify that there is an issue of different "scales" here.  Some people really like to explore every number from 1-10, and give games a 4 that are like an 8 on metacritic.  I just want to be clear that I base all my scales (and your scales) off of the US grading system...which is pretty accepted among all the reviews out there.

I can't recall disagreeing with an MMORPG.COM review so strongly.

The scores for gameplay, innovation, and longevity are particularly risible to me, but hey, I realize fun is ultimately deeply subjective.

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

This is the ultimate rape of the word "innovation" by the way.

INNOVATION 10 ?

Removing quest hubs, so we get the same Kill X and Click X egg quests automatically?

No number for Kill X but a X percent bar filling up?

THAT is innovation 10 in the eyes of MMORPG? Really? This "10" score is an insult and ridicules all further reviews.

Well just so you know, YOU are the ones holding up the industry with reviews like that, it's a shame really, over a decade of the same cookie cutter quests and they rate that thing INNOVATION 10.

Instead of WoWclones we will get a bunch of slightly adapted GW2 clones for "innovation".

Oh and go look that word up in a dictionary before you EVER use it again.

 

Reminds me how you progress even in the most "sandbox" of MMOs... oh yes, just the same. You have to kill stuff, collect stuff, craft stuff. Wait, that's actually not even limited to MMOs. And not even to video games.

The innovation is in the form. And there, GW2 definitely deserves a very high score compared to the bland WoW clones we got since 8 years. Yes, in MMORPGs, you will always have to kills stuff, collect stuff, craft stuff. That's the essence of those games. Don't like it? Well, maybe it's time for you to accept that MMORPGs aren't for you then. Those dance games for playstations or whatever don't involve killing stuff, try those.

Originally posted by umie214
the haters really amuse me. this is exactly why we know GW2 is huge. it's disturbing the status quo big time and people just cant stand it. kudos ANet

Don't confuse the number of complaints with the importance of a game.

Originally posted by The_Korrigan

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

This is the ultimate rape of the word "innovation" by the way.

INNOVATION 10 ?

Removing quest hubs, so we get the same Kill X and Click X egg quests automatically?

No number for Kill X but a X percent bar filling up?

THAT is innovation 10 in the eyes of MMORPG? Really? This "10" score is an insult and ridicules all further reviews.

Well just so you know, YOU are the ones holding up the industry with reviews like that, it's a shame really, over a decade of the same cookie cutter quests and they rate that thing INNOVATION 10.

Instead of WoWclones we will get a bunch of slightly adapted GW2 clones for "innovation".

Oh and go look that word up in a dictionary before you EVER use it again.

 

Reminds me how you progress even in the most "sandbox" of MMOs... oh yes, just the same. You have to kill stuff, collect stuff, craft stuff. Wait, that's actually not even limited to MMOs. And not even to video games.

The innovation is in the form. And there, GW2 definitely deserves a very high score compared to the bland WoW clones we got since 8 years. Yes, in MMORPGs, you will always have to kills stuff, collect stuff, craft stuff. That's the essence of those games. Don't like it? Well, maybe it's time for you to accept that MMORPGs aren't for you then. Those dance games for playstations or whatever don't involve killing stuff, try those.

 

I dont think he's saying the game didn't reinvent the genre so it's not innovative. What he's saying is the illusion of removing quests does not count for innovation. Here's some innovation in the genre in the last year:

SWTOR: Fully voiced quests with multiple story arcs

TERA: Real time action combat

TSW: Class-less progression system with freeform ability wheel. (Also most technically advanced graphics engine on the market).

LOTRO: Fully functioning mounted combat system (expansion in 2 weeks)

Are any of these worthy of 10/10 in Innovation? Probably not, but they're still a lot more innovative than anything GW2 did.

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

this score is a joke. Boring story, boring fetch quests, not worth a sub. 6/10 at best

 

thanls for such reviews, now we can be prepared for another 10 years of brain dead quest goals and collect quests. Thanks, really

 

 I really don't like golf, like at all, and I also have something against Italian plumbers.  So I give Mario Golf a 4/10.

Do you see anything wrong with this review score?

Ah yes, I based my score completely on personal preferences, biases, and ignored any of the objective merits of the game.  Anyone who gives GW2 something below a 7, is doing the same.

Creslin, you are usually very fair.  But for some reasor n, you seem to denounce anyone who gives GW2 a score lower than you deem acceptable.  You love the game, fine.   But just because someone doesn't love your game, you dismiss their view entirely.

This reeks of arrogance.

 It's not arrogance, I just see anything below a seven for GW2 as being outside of a reasonable score, and thus I question it.  Also, my statement would allow for someone to give GW2 say like a 7.1, which is a pretty freaking low score.  That's a C-.

It's kind of like if someone gave The Matrix (first one) a 6, I would say they are smoking crack.  Or on a more rational level, their subjective, personal feelings about the movie did not allow them to see its objective merits.

Even if I personally HATE a game, I would still try to give it points for things that it did well objectively, or compared with its peers.  I really did not like SWTOR for example, but I gave it like an 8 if I remember right.

Also, I want to clarify that there is an issue of different "scales" here.  Some people really like to explore every number from 1-10, and give games a 4 that are like an 8 on metacritic.  I just want to be clear that I base all my scales (and your scales) off of the US grading system...which is pretty accepted among all the reviews out there.

So essentially....if someone has a wildly different view than you, you think they are "smoking crack" or are not seeing things objectively?  Wow.  If that's not arrogance, I clearly don't know what is.

 

No, that's not what I said, and you know it.  If someone like golf, and I don't, I don't tell them that it sucks.  I don't like Eve, but I don't see a need to go to the Eve forums and tell them about how I don't like the game and couldn't play it for an hour.  In fact, I completely accept their differing opinion of the game as valid.

In this case though, I'm just saying that your opinion is biased and not objective in the slightest.  Yep, I am saying that, not beating around the bush here.

If you are so intent on your score of GW2 being right, why don't you go ahead and justify it for us.  Tell us all the objective reasons why you think GW2 deserves a D score.  Now mind you, we are using the same scale that metacritic winds up averaging to here.  So this puts GW2 in the same league as games like:

Ghost Recon Online and Star Trek Online

So tell us, why do you believe that GW2 is on par with those two games?

Originally posted by zymmanyx
If u r new player u cant play ! if u want to play solo !  u cant !!! all mobs attack you ! so u need party to play this game ! so i quit !! this is new policy of ARENA NET ! u buy game & they make this game     imposible to play solo ! if u die & no1 @ to heal u ....then u pay alot coins to teleport few step ! they rober ur wallet ! nice job ARENA NET ! i know alot ppl how quit ! DONT BUY THIS CRSAP GAME

 Other than the teleport part of your post, it really sounded like you were talking about Everquest lol.  This post made me laugh.

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by grimal

Originally posted by Creslin321

Originally posted by Yakamomoto

this score is a joke. Boring story, boring fetch quests, not worth a sub. 6/10 at best

 

thanls for such reviews, now we can be prepared for another 10 years of brain dead quest goals and collect quests. Thanks, really

 

 I really don't like golf, like at all, and I also have something against Italian plumbers.  So I give Mario Golf a 4/10.

Do you see anything wrong with this review score?

Ah yes, I based my score completely on personal preferences, biases, and ignored any of the objective merits of the game.  Anyone who gives GW2 something below a 7, is doing the same.

Creslin, you are usually very fair.  But for some reasor n, you seem to denounce anyone who gives GW2 a score lower than you deem acceptable.  You love the game, fine.   But just because someone doesn't love your game, you dismiss their view entirely.

This reeks of arrogance.

 It's not arrogance, I just see anything below a seven for GW2 as being outside of a reasonable score, and thus I question it.  Also, my statement would allow for someone to give GW2 say like a 7.1, which is a pretty freaking low score.  That's a C-.

It's kind of like if someone gave The Matrix (first one) a 6, I would say they are smoking crack.  Or on a more rational level, their subjective, personal feelings about the movie did not allow them to see its objective merits.

Even if I personally HATE a game, I would still try to give it points for things that it did well objectively, or compared with its peers.  I really did not like SWTOR for example, but I gave it like an 8 if I remember right.

Also, I want to clarify that there is an issue of different "scales" here.  Some people really like to explore every number from 1-10, and give games a 4 that are like an 8 on metacritic.  I just want to be clear that I base all my scales (and your scales) off of the US grading system...which is pretty accepted among all the reviews out there.

So essentially....if someone has a wildly different view than you, you think they are "smoking crack" or are not seeing things objectively?  Wow.  If that's not arrogance, I clearly don't know what is.

 

No, that's not what I said, and you know it.  If someone like golf, and I don't, I don't tell them that it sucks.  I don't like Eve, but I don't see a need to go to the Eve forums and tell them about how I don't like the game and couldn't play it for an hour.  In fact, I completely accept their differing opinion of the game as valid.

In this case though, I'm just saying that your opinion is biased and not objective in the slightest.  Yep, I am saying that, not beating around the bush here.

If you are so intent on your score of GW2 being right, why don't you go ahead and justify it for us.  Tell us all the objective reasons why you think GW2 deserves a D score.  Now mind you, we are using the same scale that metacritic winds up averaging to here.  So this puts GW2 in the same league as games like:

Ghost Recon Online and Star Trek Online

So tell us, why do you believe that GW2 is on par with those two games?

 

 

 

I think you make some good points. I actually agree with your analogies and personally I don't think it's fair to lowball GW2 just because you don't like it. I don't like GW2, but I can't give it a "D" with a straight face. Being as objective as possible I would give it a C or maybe a C+. 

The problem I had with this review is that it's just so blatanly fanboy and not objective at all. 9.3 basically gives this game an "A" - which I think is ridiculous. I've been playing MMOs for 14 years, and I can honestly say there's only been 2 MMOs that deserve an "A" in the history of the genre: EQ1 and vanilla WoW.