That is exactly right...

I remember searching for places I thought I would be safe to let the mobs beat me down so I could raise my defensive skills.  I never did find that safe place, but I still did spend hours raising the skills... and never did I actually max them out, but I felt like I was actually earning my characters improvements. 

vertical char progression and PVP should NEVER be mixed.

its fine and good for single player/coop games,

but NEVER PVP

Originally posted by corpusc

vertical char progression and PVP should NEVER be mixed.

 

its fine and good for single player/coop games,

 

but NEVER PVP

disagree strongly, its an mmorpg after all. nothing wrong with some difference in characters. If you dont want char progression and pvp in one game, play Call of Duty!

Originally posted by Keegar

disagree strongly, its an mmorpg after all. nothing wrong with some difference in characters. If you dont want char progression and pvp in one game, play Call of Duty!

This is were you new players are getting lost. You are so used to grind and level that you are not able to think outside the box.Lets imagine a hardcore player and casual player, and bouth have the same stats and levels. In every aspect of the game the hardcore player will an edge over the casual player.

The hardcore player owns a SOTL, the casual player a raft.

The hardcore player have a dozen horses, the casual run on fot.

The hardcore player have dragon armor, the casual bone.

The hardcore player has a bank full of great stuff, the casual don`t.

The hardcore player is loaded with money, the casual player is poor.

The hardcore player has more experience than the casual player.

The hardcore player owns a hous, the casual player lives in a starter city.

Don`t you see that there already  is a char progression? We don`t need more grind than the grind for gear and materials, because the gear define the level and stats of your char.

Originally posted by Hotjazz

Originally posted by Keegar

disagree strongly, its an mmorpg after all. nothing wrong with some difference in characters. If you dont want char progression and pvp in one game, play Call of Duty!

This is were you new players are getting lost. You are so used to grind and level that you are not able to think outside the box.Lets imagine a hardcore player and casual player, and bouth have the same stats and levels. In every aspect of the game the hardcore player will an edge over the casual player.

 

The hardcore player owns a SOTL, the casual player a raft.

The hardcore player have a dozen horses, the casual run on fot.

The hardcore player have dragon armor, the casual bone.

The hardcore player has a bank full of great stuff, the casual don`t.

The hardcore player is loaded with money, the casual player is poor.

The hardcore player has more experience than the casual player.

The hardcore player owns a hous, the casual player lives in a starter city.

 

Don`t you see that there already  is a char progression? We don`t need more grind than the grind for gear and materials, because the gear define the level and stats of your char.

 

 

There are various types of people. Some enjoy thrill of PvP kill, some enjoy political side, some enjoy PvE, some enjoy crafting, and some enjoy character progression. And character progression has special property in the game - it is the only thing you really keep in the game, you can lose anything else when you die, and makes you log on even though you have enough stuff for your player style otherwise. There are various types of people in the world and everyone enjoys differend stuff. Removing char grind will alienate some, having it as huge as DF1 had alienates much more. Let's hope AV finds the ideal point inbetween.

Originally posted by Hancakes

Originally posted by redman875

Also..whats the point of fixing all this stuff if your just going to be maxed out in a month...at least in my eyes.  Im not asking for the games origional 1.5 years heavy play to max, they increased XP i think 2 or 3 times and added medatation for offline skill gains...that was still fine...just the themepark timeframe to max level...i hate it.

But there's no skill in grinding, a macro or trained chimp can do it.  The people I've played with since UO are competitive PvP players and want to be on an even footing within a reasonable amount of time.  (UO/SB) 

Games should be fun, not feel like a job.

I'll never understand people like you

If a video game feels like a job for you I suggest you find somewhere new to work. Going out and selecting a nice and difficult model airplane and putting it together should be a process, if I wanted the one that snaps together and comes painted I will just buy a hotwheels  one. Jesus people... It says sandbox..... SANDBOX MEANS SLOWWWW. Stop trying to reinvent the genre. No one cares that you want to be on par with the vets in a couple hours. They are vets because they took time out of their life and used it towards a hobby. You have the same opportunity to do the same. There is not reason you should be able to take that from the veteran.

Originally posted by Hotjazz

Originally posted by Keegar

disagree strongly, its an mmorpg after all. nothing wrong with some difference in characters. If you dont want char progression and pvp in one game, play Call of Duty!

This is were you new players are getting lost. You are so used to grind and level that you are not able to think outside the box.Lets imagine a hardcore player and casual player, and bouth have the same stats and levels. In every aspect of the game the hardcore player will an edge over the casual player.

 

The hardcore player owns a SOTL, the casual player a raft.

The hardcore player have a dozen horses, the casual run on fot.

The hardcore player have dragon armor, the casual bone.

The hardcore player has a bank full of great stuff, the casual don`t.

The hardcore player is loaded with money, the casual player is poor.

The hardcore player has more experience than the casual player.

The hardcore player owns a hous, the casual player lives in a starter city.

 

Don`t you see that there already  is a char progression? We don`t need more grind than the grind for gear and materials, because the gear define the level and stats of your char.

 

 

What did you just say? I read this a few times over and I don't understand this arguement.

Originally posted by Topherpunch

Originally posted by Hancakes

Originally posted by redman875

Also..whats the point of fixing all this stuff if your just going to be maxed out in a month...at least in my eyes.  Im not asking for the games origional 1.5 years heavy play to max, they increased XP i think 2 or 3 times and added medatation for offline skill gains...that was still fine...just the themepark timeframe to max level...i hate it.

But there's no skill in grinding, a macro or trained chimp can do it.  The people I've played with since UO are competitive PvP players and want to be on an even footing within a reasonable amount of time.  (UO/SB) 

Games should be fun, not feel like a job.

I'll never understand people like you

If a video game feels like a job for you I suggest you find somewhere new to work. Going out and selecting a nice and difficult model airplane and putting it together should be a process, if I wanted the one that snaps together and comes painted I will just buy a hotwheels  one. Jesus people... It says sandbox..... SANDBOX MEANS SLOWWWW. Stop trying to reinvent the genre. No one cares that you want to be on par with the vets in a couple hours. They are vets because they took time out of their life and used it towards a hobby. You have the same opportunity to do the same. There is not reason you should be able to take that from the veteran.

WTF are you talking about, what "sandboxes" have you been playing? Clearly you have no idea what Sandbox is, as it has NOTHING to do with progression.  You could have a viable PvP character in SB and UO in a matter of days, yet its just the beginning as you venture out.   There is no "end game" ...

Originally posted by Topherpunch

What did you just say? I read this a few times over and I don't understand this arguement.

Ofcourse you didn`t, you are a WOW clone. You think sandbox and roleplaying are the level of your char.

Sandbox game can be slow if you want them to be slow. If you want to be a pirat with a fleet of ship, it will take time to optain those ships. If your clan is in a lot of sieges, it will take time to optain decent gear all the time. It is not sandbox to macro and AFK swim against a wall for weeks, because that`s what we all did in Darkfall.

You got a thousand games you can kill NPCs, grind epics, grind rep and level your char. Darkfall is a full-loot pvp sandbox mmo, and in a full-loot pvp mmo it is an epic flaw not letting you customers be PVP viable.

Originally posted by Keegar

Originally posted by corpusc

vertical char progression and PVP should NEVER be mixed.

 

its fine and good for single player/coop games,

 

but NEVER PVP

disagree strongly, its an mmorpg after all. nothing wrong with some difference in characters. If you dont want char progression and pvp in one game, play Call of Duty!

why would i play that piece of crap?

if you don't like my opinion, GO READ ANOTHER FORUM!

I loved the character progression in Darkfall its one of the things that kept me playing for so long...

Sadly as someone else said hacks and exploits made a massive gap between players and coursed a big inbalance..

I hope this time that the characer progression is still there and that it still takes a long time to master everything, but most of all i hope this time get get on top of hackers and expliters and either reset their characters or ban them...

I think the origional Darkfall would have been so much better without the exploiters and hackers.. shame really.

Im pretty sure theres is still going to be some leveling of the skills, they are just going to make it not take a year to get to endgame, probably a month or two to get pvp viable. But after that theres the crafting and the gear making, having to kill mobs, and harvest resources for you not so pvp oriented people. Every clan will need a crafter, gatherer, someone to make the best gear, the best ships, to help you guys progress through the game to get better and stronger. That is your progression.

No one wants to grind mobs for an hour to gain a measly skill point in a spell, it's because of this, and other various bugs and flawed game designs that most of the people quit DF in the first place. When you take a look at EVE (which we all know to be a sandbox), is the endgame not dominating that null sec space, and keeping control over the mob spawns/roid belts? Duking it out with other corps/alliances? This is what darkfall is, taking control of the cities, the hamlets, in hopes to keep control over the mob spawns and resources, to have access to the best farming, fighting with other clans over these is necessary and this is why characters need to take less than a year to be viable, so they aren't useless in the fight.