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The Pub at MMORPG.COM  » Rumours, misunderstandings and misleading

11 posts found
  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5526

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

 
OP  10/03/12 4:36:54 AM#1

I think we should all know that things gets polarized and blown out of proportions in the forums quite a bit. Thwarting misinformation and correcting misunderstanding is taxing at the best of times and it all fall on the fans because no-one else gives a shit. I remember how during GW1's early days it was called a "Diablo-clone", and I really didn't see any similarities so I started correcting some of the posters. After a few posts I just gave up, because I noticed I wasn't making any progress.

Years later I bumped into people in Eve who referred to GW1 as not only as a "Diablo-clone" but a "WoW-clone" to boot which was fairly surprising. Further discussion showed that the players in question hadn't played GW1, neither had their friends and none of them had ever played WoW either! For some, Eve was the only MMORPG they've played and yet they still adopted the mentality that Eve is the best and everything else is rubbish. I wonder how many people jump into the bandwagon like that.

Some of these rumours clearly start living a life of their own. But "the haters" are not the only ones to blame. Some of the fans spread some misinformation aswell. For instance, some DaoC fans insist that DaoC had great balance while more honest ones say it wasn't all that good. I trust more the latter because they gave some examples to show how horrible it was at times. I know I've been coaxed to try a game with false information. I've been quite pissed at times for falling for such a lie and having wasted my time. I think the fans I'm talking about are creating more enemies than friends.

I wonder how much being written on the forums is just, rumours, misinformation and misunderstandings? Do you think someone would do this deliberately? Have you ever been mislead to try a game?

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  User Deleted
10/03/12 4:44:11 AM#2

   I cringe when I read someone calling WAR a WOW clone even though I mentioned the same thing to my friend who got me to play it before ever playing.  The worst was someone telling everyone it wasn't WAR but WHO while correcting me for calling it WAR.  What can you do?  Some people know everything even if they haven't played a game.

(I just use this as an example to agree)

  Scalpless

Hard Core Member

Joined: 3/22/07
Posts: 1299

10/03/12 4:53:54 AM#3
Many are unable to dislike anything on forums without turning to petty trolling. "I don't like WAR, so it's a WoW clone", "I don't like GW2, so it's nothing new and requires no skill", "I don't like TSW, so it'll go F2P in a month and has loads of bugs", etc. It's sad, but what can you do. They're often the source of this stuff and the ones who believe them spread it.
  User Deleted
10/03/12 6:13:22 AM#4

I guess when I hear someone being very authoritative about a subject and I completely disagree with them I usually just let it go, and ignore it, even when I'm almost 100% sure that they're wrong like that guy who wanted everyone to know that War was abreviated Who. 

I've played a lot of GW2 lately and I read a lot of not quite true stuff written about it but I figure there is someone else who'd rather fight that fight.

TSW I really liked but only played for a couple months and never felt like defending it that much.

Then Swtor I wanted to defend for months while I played closed beta but the NDA, and I kept thinking they'd fix some things, but it turned out the trolls were mostly right.  So were they really trolls or just annoying people?

So sometimes I think I know something but I'm ignorant which is why I stay out of internet arguments if I can.  But at the same time I realize a whole bunch of people are FoS, or FuSh as that guy whould probably write it.

  Jemcrystal

Elite Member

Joined: 1/02/08
Posts: 1345

Let em put a slave ring thru u're nose u're prob not going to like where they're taking you. Think.

10/03/12 7:04:16 AM#5

Chaos!  Destruction!  Fun!

 

Sorry, it's what popped into my head after reading thread title.

http://s25.postimg.org/e4cys86xb/gw004.jpg

  Kyleran

Bitter Vet™

Joined: 9/13/06
Posts: 19065

Fools find no pleasure in understanding, but delight in airing their own opinions. Pvbs 18:2, NIV

10/03/12 7:05:52 AM#6
Originally posted by Quirhid

I wonder how much being written on the forums is just, rumours, misinformation and misunderstandings? Do you think someone would do this deliberately? Have you ever been mislead to try a game?

Can't say I've really heard much about the rumors in your specific examples, but then that wasn't really the point of your post.

IMO, some of the misinformation is due to NDA's that stay in place far too long, which results in rampant speculation and leads to many published falsehoods prior to release.

But even after that come down, the misinformation continues.  Sometimes its because people are parroting what they've read, without taking time to research their facts. (I myself am guilty of this on occasion, who has the time these days)

Sometimes the disagreement occurs due to a matter of personal opinion or perception.  I call a MMO a WOW-Clone, and you just don't see it the same way from your viewpoint.  So we have a debate or disagreement. 

Whether a game is balanced or not is also a matter of opinion, in your DAOC example I know the classes weren't balanced against each other individually, in fact they were quite paper/scissors/rock, and some classes were never going to beat another if player skills were roughly equal.  Overall I feel DAOC was balanced from a group vs group and realm vs realm perspective.  Doesn't mean I'm trying to spread disinformation, just how I view the situation and others will certainly disagree with me.

But at the end of the day, this is forum PVP after all, and when trying to influence other peoples opinions, many folks are not above stooping to bullying, lying, and spreading false information to prove their point and try to "win" the discussion.

So yes, some folks do so deliberately, it's all part of their strategy to succeed.

Have I ever been misled? Sure, many times, people keep telling me the latest theme park MMO is really fun and different and I should give it a try.  So I go out and buy it, and while I do find them fun for a month or three, none of them have resulted in finding a title that I can enjoy for a longer period of time.   Heck, someone told me I'd really enjoy Xyson about a year ago, unfortunately I like a bit more "game" in my MMO's, that was a bit too basic for my tastes.

Was I mislead? Not really, most titles clearly make it known what they're about, I just keep choosing to keep doing the same thing hoping for different results.  Which is why I'm not going to play GW 2 because I'm no longer going to keep buying titles hoping they're something they're not.

 

 

 

"Someone once told me, there is always someone more powerful than you." - Nicola [Bunraku]
Kyleran - Bitter Vet ™ since 2006
"This is the most intelligent, well qualified and articulate response to a post I have ever seen on these forums. It's a shame most people here won't have the attention span to read past the second line." - Anon

  Quirhid

Elite Member

Joined: 1/28/05
Posts: 5526

Correcting wrongs on the Internet...

 
OP  10/03/12 7:28:57 AM#7
Originally posted by Kyleran
Originally posted by Quirhid

But at the end of the day, this is forum PVP after all, and when trying to influence other peoples opinions, many folks are not above stooping to bullying, lying, and spreading false information to prove their point and try to "win" the discussion.

So yes, some folks do so deliberately, it's all part of their strategy to succeed.

Lying to win an argument? -Ugh, now that's low.

 

 

When I recommended GW2 to some of my friends I said: "It is unlikely you'll find better value for your money even if you only moderately like it." It is always better to undersell than oversell, I think. But I guess recommending a game to a complete stranger doesn't have the same potential to backfire since they're strangers afterall - who gives a f***.

I skate to where the puck is going to be, not where it has been -Wayne Gretzky

  User Deleted
10/03/12 7:57:43 AM#8

You see a lot of people talking about specific games and (more often than not) their flaws, when it seems clear that said people have either never set foot in a said game, or they have spent such a limited amount of time in it that they really are not speaking from any kind of informed position.

 

Typically on this forum you have hot topics and hot point games. If you mention WoW, or EVE, or Darkfall then you will no doubt see countless posters spouting hyperbole and generally, out and out rubbish. The same goes for any mention of FFA pvp or looting, or sandbox vs themepark. Or when people bang out the classic "oh but x is the only "true" type of pve/pvp/skill etc, y is just bullshit for retards"

 

Often we also see people who think they are thwarting misinformation, are actually coming out with a load of old tosh themselves for the main part, especially when the debate pulls in their own little pet peeves and enjoyments.

 

At the end of the day, you just have to reconcile the fact that most of the people here are taking highly opinionated positions and trying to dress them up as fact. Whilst at the same time displaying zero interest in actually engaging in a debate which might change their opinion or make them at least reflect upon it.

 

Personally I would never try a game based on a forum sentiment or a review. I take the opinions of the gamers I have known for a long time and look at the actual mechanics of the game myself before trying something. So that's not an issue for me per say, indeed most of the time it is obvious as hell when someone is selling a pile. From my own point, I never overly sell a game to someone here, if someone wants to try Darkfall or EVE I will, if anything, warn them about barriers and issues just as much as I mention the positives.

  kaiser3282

Tipster

Joined: 5/21/08
Posts: 2641

10/03/12 8:16:36 AM#9

Judging by what seems to have become the standard on this site lately, you can usually assume about 70-80% of the posts youre going to read about a game are either a) angry kids trolling b) people posting simply out of ignorance because they read something somewhere (likely posted by others in group a or b) but have no 1st hand experience themselves, or c) the skewed views of lunatics lacking an common sense / basis in reality and the theories of people who have a closet full of tinfoil hats.

Of the 20-30% remaining, you can actually get some useful information, but thats only if youre able to pick it out between the twits raging that anyone posting such information is "a blind drooling fanboi", even if theyre simply posting actual facts and mechanics and nothing regarding liking a game or not.

  Omnifish

Advanced Member

Joined: 2/16/11
Posts: 615

I'll kick your a**e so hard, you could build a swimming pool in the footprint!

10/03/12 10:24:37 AM#10

I think one needs to be careful about calling others, 'liars', or stating things as, 'facts', when it comes to others opinion.

A recent example would be GW2 on this forum.  When the DE/Hearts system was announced a lot of the fans on here thought it was a great idea and would revoluntionise themeparks.  When they actually played the game, the questing experience was different for the better, in their opinion,  and so were happy with that.  That is true for them.

However other people played this and found it to be a shallow experience, in a sense a reverse of the usual questing mechanic that covered up for the feeling that their wasn't a great variety in tasks.  That is true for them.

This is where the problem lies for those who really like the system.  They don't get why others don't like it as much as them, so start stating, 'facts', to prove how their opinion is the right one.  Honestly, who cares if you get shared kills or how many permetations an event has, if it's boring to a person it'll still be boring, no matter how many, 'facts', someone throws at them.

The other aspect is, 'lying', I generally think most people don't lie to win an argument they just get carried away because the internet allows all sorts of ranting without restrictions, or when speculation is all you have information wise, your wildest fantasies can be true. To use GW2 again, a year ago lots of the fans said one of the advantages was that once you bought the game, that was it, you needn't pay anything more expect expansions.  In the realms of possibility that sounded amazing for the consumer.  Anyone who pointed out, 'how are they going to pay for anything in the future?', was shouted down for not, 'getting it!'. Then they announced the cash shop and those fans backtracked, to a degree, or embraced the joys of cash shops.  Detractors called them, 'liars', for taking this position. Realisticly though those fans didn't have a clue about how ANET was going to be funded in the future, so their imaginations just went away with them. Were they lying? Of course not, they had no, 'facts', to think otherwise, they just took the more positive route and it backfired.

Personally I have been guilty of this in my defense of things or why I don't like something.  At the end of the day it really is just my, 'opinion', which ultimately only really matters to me.  Noone else is a liarer or fact blind because they don't agree.

 

This looks like a job for....The Riviera Kid!

  aesperus

Elite Member

Joined: 1/04/05
Posts: 4754

10/03/12 10:33:53 AM#11
Originally posted by Quirhid

I wonder how much being written on the forums is just, rumours, misinformation and misunderstandings? Do you think someone would do this deliberately? Have you ever been mislead to try a game?

A lot of it is, actually. These forums especially are kind of notorious for that.

That said, I do not think that the majority of these people do it willingly. Many legitimately think they are right, and never think twice to challenge their own opinions & views. In fact, this is extremely common outside of gaming as well. Most people naturally think they are correct, and a surprisingly small number of people ever truly challenge their own understandings of the world. Many pass off assumptions as fact, and many take here-say as truth. I know I've been guilty of both at one point or another.

There are people who do this sort of thing deliberately, and public forums are a very easy venue to do it on. Open access, widely viewed, and almost no checks for legitimacy or intent. There's a reason why people w/ low post counts tend to get called out on these forums for that sort of thing. It's not always right, but there have been pleanty of accounts that mysteriously show up just to bash & slander, and then dissappear once it's no longer relative. Too many for all to be coincidence.

Unfortunately, there's not much you can do about misinformation. Many try and minimize it by informing the public, and that does a lot of good, but it never fully stops it. And it never will. The best you can do is to make sure you don't fall for the same traps everyone else does. Do your research, fact-check, don't take anything at face value. It helps a lot if you find yourself constantly buying games only to get dissapointed in them.