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Star Wars: The Old Republic

Star Wars: The Old Republic 

General Discussion  » Do you believe SWTOR is a failure for becoming "F2P"?

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80 posts found

Advanced Member

Joined: 7/16/09
Posts: 319

9/16/12 5:33:55 AM#61
Originally posted by matraque
Where does it says MMORPG's aren't suppose to tell you a story?  They ALL tell you a story... it's the way of delivering it that is different.


Take the flashpoints as example. The first few times you experience them they are all great with the cutscenes and dialogues. But sooner than later you'll have players spacebar through that "experience" to speed up the run. The same for the operations. And the PvP zones are every time introduced with a cutscene.


Other MMOs have tried to tell players a story as well. Either the quest NPCs give some pieces of lore or there are non-quest -giver NPCs that do the same. But to be honest with the inflation of quest numbers in today's MMOs and with all those integrated quest helpers who is really following the story? I suppose that the average player just collects the quests in his/her quest hub and then is led by the automap. After finishing the quests returns to the questhub to get the rewards. And then it's on to the next quest hub. Bioware didn't even think it is necessary to include non-quest-giver NPCs for the atmosphere which provide clues and pieces of lore. It's a difference if you interact with the environment or if you just click on items which update your compendium.


As it turned out the VO cutscenes and dialogues are only interrupting the game flow.


The VO and the quest system of "modern" MMOs act as a straight jacket for game concepts. The VO due to its cost and production process doesn't allow to quickly fix or change cutscenes later on. The quest system has so much standardized gameplay that it gets repetitive and boring fast (I wonder if there is already an ISO standard for this game aspect). I'd rather prefer they'd tone back the number of quests so that the quests which are included are noteworthy and memorable.



Novice Member

Joined: 4/04/07
Posts: 190

9/18/12 9:56:35 AM#62
Originally posted by bbbmmmlll
SWtOR is a failure because of it’s mediocre design, poor execution, squandering of the best intellectual property in the world and it’s huge budget.

There’s nothing wrong with F2P, but this is a Hail Mary play. The game was not conceived as F2P, huge numbers of players have already played it and formed an impression plus I don’t see much being done to address the core issues. The only upside, and it’s huge, is that it’s Star Wars. But we’ve already seen in two cases, that this brand alone isn’t sufficient to save a game. EA/BW thinking that going to F2P will turn the game around strikes me as the same sort of ignorance that got the game into the situation it’s currently in.

Pretty much my opinion also. It failed long before FTP was announced or thought of.


Novice Member

Joined: 6/23/09
Posts: 2728

9/18/12 10:02:01 AM#63

I'm sure it has been said in here but...


No, it is a failure because they invested a truly insane amount of money into the project expecting much higher initial sales and millions of concurrent players 6 months and even a year in. It was a massive failure on a business and planning scale. The result of this is the scramble to F2P to try and recoup anything they can.


Novice Member

Joined: 4/07/11
Posts: 128

9/18/12 10:09:07 AM#64
Originally posted by SuprGamerX

 Ok , I've said this a few times , and will re write it again.   Let's say for example your creating a MMO which costs money , and you notice that to get back your money and start making profit out of it , you'll need 8,000 to sub at 10$ a month for 3 years. Which is pretty reasonable.  But Devs only care about the $$$ , they want to be billionaires within the first 2 months of release , so they put the game F2P with a cash shop and catter millions.  By doing this , they just killed the soul of the MMO and it's community.    If CCP only cared about $$$ , EVE-Online would of been free YEARS Ago , but they are making enough millions to upgrade their servers yearly and releasing free expansions , last time I checked,  WoW's expansions weren't free.


  So yeah , pretty much every Dev team sucks now a days , besides a FEW.     SWTOR could of been something GREAT.  But it's just another WoW / GW2 or whatever type of game with chewbaccas and light sabres.


I think you misunderstand the inner workings of a software company, the DEVs have little or no say in the pricing / marketing model (about as much as a cook at McDonalds has in the making of thier TV ads)

That would be the job of the business folks or (suits) as some call them.






Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/12/05
Posts: 9

"Better 'em than me..."Han Solo

9/18/12 10:18:55 AM#65
SWTOR failed as a game but suceeded at making me realise Lucas doesn't deserve my money anymore


Novice Member

Joined: 12/27/03
Posts: 611

9/18/12 10:27:51 AM#66
Going F2P in and of itself isn't where SWTOR has failed. I think nothing sums up their failure quite like the current forced server merges going on. 

Elite Member

Joined: 11/12/07
Posts: 1966

Crosby P. Jenkins

9/18/12 10:36:59 AM#67

I believe SWTOR should have been F2P from the start, however with EA/Bioware knowing they had a lemon on their hands they ripped off the customers with releasing the game as buy + subscription.


Sad but EA Louse was right.


Still waiting for one forum to defend the customers.


Novice Member

Joined: 12/27/10
Posts: 30

9/18/12 10:53:43 AM#68
Originally posted by Ozmodan

It was a failure from the start.  Typical big company hired a bunch of people without a clue how to keep MMO players engaged in a game.  Making a technically superior game with lots of voice overs does not get it.   Too much hand holding quickly leads to boring gameplay.

I love Star Wars, but did not even attempt to purchase this game,  beta testing showed what a loser it was.  It was far inferior when it comes to gameplay than what was already on the market.

Any company working with Lucas Arts has a huge handicap, they don't even know what a MMO is.  They think that it is just an extension of their single player games.   That is why I don't have great hopes that a Star Wars universe MMO will ever be successful unless LA gets new leadership.

Personally I don't see the gams as a failure for going f2p. I see the people playing them failing to keep the games alive, always looking for the next big thing and exciting content built right in without making the effort to make the game better buy telling big company what they think would keep it alive. Most people play GW2 because right out of the box it's a good game with little effort on their part to make it better and it's b2p with no sub. It doesn't count as f2p (haha yeah right)



Apprentice Member

Joined: 1/08/07
Posts: 1616

9/18/12 11:00:23 AM#69

As Forbes pretty much said yes it is a failure because it needed the subscription model to work and thats what they planned and based the business on.   Regardless free to play does not address the issues of the game and I do not believe it will help the business, besides it is too late their window for F2P has come and gone they cannot beat GW2 and with MOP round the corner I see that as a long hammer of a nail into the coffin.

The only reason this game is still open is because of legal contracts with Lucas Arts.  It will be skeleton crewed till that time line has perished.

If a game launches and intends to be free to play then that is different.


Novice Member

Joined: 7/16/11
Posts: 3548


9/19/12 8:01:42 PM#70
YES, even I didn't think it would go f2p so fast and I was consistently negative. People who said it would go f2p within a year were called delusional by many posters here who are now telling everyone their latest game is revolutionary.

Novice Member

Joined: 9/05/12
Posts: 334

SWG pre cu > all

9/20/12 7:50:17 AM#71
Originally posted by Kopogero
SWTOR is a failure because it didn't copy the SWG-Pre CU model.

Apprentice Member

Joined: 2/12/05
Posts: 9

"Better 'em than me..."Han Solo

9/20/12 8:10:42 AM#72
Anyone knows how much subscribers are left in SWTOR ?


Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/08
Posts: 76

9/21/12 1:34:11 AM#73
No, definitely not. I think that B2P and F2P without subscriptions is the way to go and that we will see a steady decline in games that actually are subscribed. I really liked Star Wars The Old Republic, and will come back when it is F2P. However, I am no pvp-er and I played it mostly as a single player rpg. But it was fun!

Apprentice Member

Joined: 7/09/12
Posts: 2704

9/21/12 1:52:39 AM#74
Originally posted by miramira2
No, definitely not. I think that B2P and F2P without subscriptions is the way to go and that we will see a steady decline in games that actually are subscribed. I really liked Star Wars The Old Republic, and will come back when it is F2P. However, I am no pvp-er and I played it mostly as a single player rpg. But it was fun!

Just wait till you see their Freemium plan .. lol, to do everything you used to do will cost you more than a monthly sub.

Want a nice understanding of life? Try Spirit Science: "The Human History"
Recognize the voice? Yep sounds like Penny Arcade's Extra Credits.

  User Deleted
9/21/12 2:01:41 AM#75

Failure is dependant on point of view; if the company set out to beat WoW, then going F2P is a failure in that respect. From a player's perspective, a game going F2P means it wasn't as popular as it should've been, meaning it's a failure in terms of "the market has spoken" - the game is not good enough.


On the other hand, for someone looking to have a good experience for as ittle money as possible, a MMO going F2P is a good thing.


Elite Member

Joined: 5/12/10
Posts: 2666

9/21/12 2:13:33 AM#76
Originally posted by Karteli
Originally posted by miramira2
No, definitely not. I think that B2P and F2P without subscriptions is the way to go and that we will see a steady decline in games that actually are subscribed. I really liked Star Wars The Old Republic, and will come back when it is F2P. However, I am no pvp-er and I played it mostly as a single player rpg. But it was fun!

Just wait till you see their Freemium plan .. lol, to do everything you used to do will cost you more than a monthly sub.

Everything I used to do was the quest lines, and that was awesome in ToR. It will cost nothing in f2p, at the current state :)


Novice Member

Joined: 6/22/10
Posts: 800

9/21/12 2:14:41 AM#77
It's not a failure for becoming F2P, it's becoming F2P because it is a failure.

Elite Member

Joined: 10/29/07
Posts: 17644

9/21/12 2:16:47 AM#78
Originally posted by SuperDonk
It's not a failure for becoming F2P, it's becoming F2P because it is a failure.

That makes more sense, yes.


Novice Member

Joined: 12/05/05
Posts: 2269

Who did wrong? The advertiser hired to sell the game or the consumer who put faith in advertising?

9/22/12 9:16:13 AM#79
Originally posted by Kopogero
SWTOR is a failure because it didn't copy the SWG-Pre CU model. Themeparks in generals been failure over the last 5 years with the exception of WOW.

Yeah, if they had done that they would have up to 250,000 that model had at its peak, prior to that same population free-falling which then created the conditions to create the mistake we call the cu and nge.

I think I'd be happier with SWToR's 2 million. They may be repeating history with the way they have screwed up a sw online game, but at least they are doing it with a lot more people than SWG ever attracted.


Apprentice Member

Joined: 9/22/08
Posts: 1

9/22/12 1:06:11 PM#80
Nah, it's a failure because it's a poorly made mmo ... period. The f2p is just a way for them to skeleton crew while making "some" money on the side. I went through so many sites being perma banned just for trying to tell the truth about how the game really was including the official forums. I take great joy in knowing this game tanked and all the fanbots are now eating crow.
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