Almost everything in GW2 that people are calling "endgame", isn't.

It's no different than like when I capped in WoW, went back and chose to finsih the content I missed or skipped.  (usually to be able to afford Epic Flight)

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

how so? it has more rewards/incentives than any other MMO out at release and actually more than many have now..

Yeah no, thats total BS. GW2 is half baked in that department. That's why its RvR is lacking. It has no yet implemented as many progression systems as the game it copied, DAoC. One there are realm ranks, relics, and a Darkness Falls style dungeon, then we'll talk.

wait what who said GW2 doesnt have endgame? it clearly does go level 1000-4000 times. My preference in endgame is open world pvp/WvW. I came here mainly and specifically for that content, having fun dont see the problem there.

All I care about is the pvp presence.

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

I agree !

Originally posted by MosesZD

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

how so? it has more rewards/incentives than any other MMO out at release and actually more than many have now.. just because your idea of rewards/incentives may only mean making you more powerful that doesn't discount GW2 has plenty of rewards and incentives to continue playing. Progression isn't only power..

One thing I do hope they add though is some sort of progression for weapon skills or a system that is like the utitlity skill system and you can select differn't weapon skills for the same weapon.

Nope it doesn't,up against a game like Vanguard at release,GW2 is lacking in incentives and content.Saying it has more incetives/rewards than any other MMO at release is just over zealous fan talk.

 

It's always boring when someone comes in pretends failure/niche MMO X, Y or Z was the pinnacle.    If it was, we'd have all played it.  But, in reality, it wasn't.   It was a pile of crap and. at best, a niche game.

 

Especially Vanguard which burned and died its first month.    Friggin' Toon Town Online did better.

It's always funny when someone doesn't  know what they are talking about.Vanguard died the first month you say, so Vanguard has not been played by anyone since the first month of release.

Strange you should say that,are you sure you know what you are talking about?

Originally posted by TobiasGrey

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

how so? it has more rewards/incentives than any other MMO out at release and actually more than many have now..

Yeah no, thats total BS. GW2 is half baked in that department. That's why its RvR is lacking. It has no yet implemented as many progression systems as the game it copied, DAoC. One there are realm ranks, relics, and a Darkness Falls style dungeon, then we'll talk.

I agree,they should of had a Darkness Falls type dungeon from the very start,imagine that.As for the comment quoted,i had to laugh at that myself.

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by TobiasGrey

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

how so? it has more rewards/incentives than any other MMO out at release and actually more than many have now..

Yeah no, thats total BS. GW2 is half baked in that department. That's why its RvR is lacking. It has no yet implemented as many progression systems as the game it copied, DAoC. One there are realm ranks, relics, and a Darkness Falls style dungeon, then we'll talk.

I agree,they should of had a Darkness Falls type dungeon from the very start,imagine that.As for the comment quoted,i had to laugh at that myself.

Funny because a game could have 100 differn't types of rewards/achievements/incentives yet if someone feels those aren't important to them they all of a sudden aren't there.. saying that GW2 has tons of stuff all around to strive for.. maybe not enough in a single department for some people but overall has a ton of stuff.. not stuff everyone wants or will feel is worth going for but that doesn't change the fact there is a lot of stuff to acomplish for a just released MMO.

Please describe what makes a good end game?

SImple enought, a good amount of people that want to pay a monthly subscription.

:-)

Originally posted by Sylvarii

Originally posted by TobiasGrey

Originally posted by Aerowyn

Originally posted by gbooster

A reward system / incentives to keep playing. Most people want to feel like they are progressing their character. The game is really lackign in that area.

how so? it has more rewards/incentives than any other MMO out at release and actually more than many have now..

Yeah no, thats total BS. GW2 is half baked in that department. That's why its RvR is lacking. It has no yet implemented as many progression systems as the game it copied, DAoC. One there are realm ranks, relics, and a Darkness Falls style dungeon, then we'll talk.

I agree,they should of had a Darkness Falls type dungeon from the very start,imagine that.As for the comment quoted,i had to laugh at that myself.

I'm kind of shocked there's no Darkness Falls. I think it must be because GW2 is going for a very... PvP and PvE should never cross over feel... But they copied almost everything from DAoC, but left out one of the features that people remember the most about DAoC. Boggles the mind.

I'll tell you what doesn't make a good endgame. Making the "best" items such a ridiculous grind that there is no way on earth you'd complete it without using the cash shop to purchase gold. Here's a quick run down of what you'll need for a legendary weapon:

1 million Karma

500+ Gold

100% map completion.

500 WvWvW Badges (good luck, takes 3 hours to get in)

400 skill in 2 specific professions.

300 skill points.

30+ of a single explorable dungeon completion.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for the best items being difficult to obtain. Theres a difference between difficult, and grinding 2 shot mobs for months on end to get the gold / karma needed though. Given the option between a raid heavy endgame, and one like this, I'll take the raids thanks.

There is one person close to getting the legendary. He ran out of gold however. He spent roughly 2,000 USD in the cash shop to buy gold / boosts.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
I could see arenanets take on darkness falls coming with an expansion. They will have more competition for rvr type pvp then with planetside2 and TESO.

We can hope. More companies need to be like Anet... they need to look at what made the Golden Age MMOs so great and start bringing back the ideas. The MMO noobies that have been around since WoW will see them as new features, and us Vets will see a return of the mechanics that made those old games our favorites.

With TESO... man they really could have something special if they got rid of all the quest grinding and instance nonsense. The directors spoke of how important public dungeons are, and they're right. But that importance is lost as soon as you put phasing and instancing in. Public dungeons cannot coexist with heavily instanced ones.

Is it ok to have no good definition for that? Or just that endgame means its the end of the game for me?Like I'm bored with it now and want to move on etc, it is the end of the game for me :p

The problem I have with 'endgame' ,is that any activity that is only there for max lvl toons in a MMO (or any activity whatsoever), is just another feature for me. And imo no game has to be designed around any specific feature. It is no guarantee for a fun game I think.

I see myself as lucky in that I have a very broad taste in games and have no set of requirements for a MMO. I do have my preferences for certain features if they happen to be included in a MMO, but I don't demand those features to be included (except when I think that the ip requires it like with SWTOR and spacecombat). I'm happy to get surprised by innovative devs, but at the same time I like to see good implementations of excisting features too.

Originally posted by ShakyMo
I could see arenanets take on darkness falls coming with an expansion. They will have more competition for rvr type pvp then with planetside2 and TESO.

Wasn't that underground dungeon with traps and the chest in the middle in the Eternal Battlegrounds their version of DF?

Originally posted by Worfi

Originally posted by Kuinn

Originally posted by Worfi

You dn't need to do anything. That's the point. You just have more choices to do.

Let us see how GW2 offers end game:

- end game starts from level 1 - that can everyone say No

- explore all maps, vistas, skill points, hearts -  thats in every game No

- run alts, do all storys, all events, all crafting professions - thats in every game No

- you have dungeons in two mode - thats in every game Yes

- you can farm stones for epic (and in this game you have actually are encurage not to finish dungeon but to farm just first boss) - seen Miss

Only difference i saw is that you have less content here and you dont pay monthly fee. You grind repetitive hearts, all the same de, and other games just give you better rewards for your time and offer you all the same us here while you level but on last level they unlock arenas, rated BG, raids, heroic mode dungeons, challenges and here you don't unlock anything... No

 

1 win / 4 losses / 1 no contest!

 

Fail!

Than you didn't play other games or just delude yourself... yada yada

I've played most 3xA themepark mmorpgs ever released in western market. My answers is based on those experiences. I suggest taking a deep look into a mirror if you're going to talk about delusions.

Originally posted by MMOwanderer

Originally posted by ShakyMo
I could see arenanets take on darkness falls coming with an expansion. They will have more competition for rvr type pvp then with planetside2 and TESO.

Wasn't that underground dungeon with traps and the chest in the middle in the Eternal Battlegrounds their version of DF?

No, it's more their version of an RvR dungeon Mythic added sometime in 2005, I forget what its called... passage of conflict I believe.

Darkness Falls is primarily a PvE zone, only available to the realm who has the most keeps under control (after New Frontiers, the most towers under control). It's where a lot of the best money and gear came from so people were pretty fierce about controling it.

Here's how it worked.

Darkness Falls was a massive MASSIVE dungeon with about a dozen floors to it (think levels of hell) the deeper you went the harder the mobs. Each realm had their own side, and they met at the crossroads in the middle of the 9th level. The raid mobs were all under level 9.

So you have realms A B and C.

Realm A has the most keeps and thus controls Darkness Falls. Everyone from level 15 to level 50 is in their getting loot and killing things.

Suddenly, Realm B takes control of the dungeon. No more people from Realm A can enter Darkness Falls, but the people already inside it aren't booted out.

People from Realm B start to swarm the dungeon and form a huge group to "purge" all the Realm A peopel. They fight through the 9 levels, get to the crossroads, and work their way to Realm A's side, killing everyone they can. These battles were intense as Realm A would slowly lose numbers they couldn't replenish, while Realm B would just keep pushing.

Occasionally Realm A would form a warband and fight to Realm B's side and prevent the other realm from pushing out of their own entrance.

Some players would just log off as soon as the dungeon switched sides and play on an alt. Hours and hours later, they'd log back in when all the fighting has died down and start ganking enemy players who had been lulled into a false sense of security. A witch hunt would start with everyone running around trying to find the guy as he hid throughout the dungeon.

This is why people loved Darkness Falls, and GW2 desperately needs their own version of it.

for me these are enough  ^^

Originally posted by loulaki

 

 

for me these are enough  ^^

Wow, thats a pretty awful list. Really reaching in some areas...

"Find and use a vial of black dye.

Find a vial of black dye and give it to a friend"

Participate in World versus World

Help your world win in WvW"

Streching much? They should have cut out the BS and just made a shorter list.

Originally posted by TwoThreeFour

Originally posted by Cakeisyummeh

Originally posted by halflife25
For me personally perfect end game would be player generated content. Give players some tools so that they can make their own content.

That'd kill lore a little.

 

Fun is more important than lore and besides the lore can be adjusted to fit the new systems.

and how would this so called new system work? I dont even want to imagine the bugs and glitches and possible hacks.